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Citing losses and destruction, Hamas figures in Gaza urge leaders to strike deal

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  krishna  •  3 days ago  •  68 comments

By:   By AP and TOI STAFF

Citing losses and destruction, Hamas figures in Gaza urge leaders to strike deal
Internal communications show senior officials in Strip wrote to group’s chiefs in Qatar urging ceasefire despite reluctance of Yahya Sinwar, who may not be aware of war’s toll

Photo: Hamas leaders Ismail Haniyeh and Yahya Sinwar in Gaza City, June 26, 2019. (Hassan Jedi/Flash90)

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S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


Several senior Hamas figures in Gaza have urged the terror group’s exiled political leadership to accept the   ceasefire and hostage deal proposal   championed by US President Joe Biden, according to internal communications seen by The Associated Press.

The messages, shared by a Middle East official familiar with the ongoing negotiations, described the heavy losses Hamas has suffered on the battlefield and the dire conditions in the war-ravaged territory. The official spoke on condition of anonymity to share the contents of internal Hamas communications.

The official shared two internal Hamas communications, both written by senior officials inside Gaza to the group’s leadership in Qatar, where Hamas’s political leader Ismail Haniyeh is based.

The communications, from May and June, suggested that the war had taken a toll on Hamas fighters, with the senior figures urging the group’s political wing abroad to accept the deal despite the reluctance of Yahya Sinwar, the group’s leader in Gaza.

The messages suggest that Sinwar, who has been in hiding since the war erupted and is believed to be holed up in a tunnel deep underground, either isn’t fully aware of the toll of the fighting or isn’t fully communicating it to those negotiating outside of the territory.


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Krishna
Professor Expert
1  seeder  Krishna    3 days ago

Several senior Hamas figures in Gaza have urged the terror group’s exiled political leadership to accept the   ceasefire and hostage deal proposal   championed by US President Joe Biden, according to internal communications seen by The Associated Press.

The messages, shared by a Middle East official familiar with the ongoing negotiations, described the heavy losses Hamas has suffered on the battlefield and the dire conditions in the war-ravaged territory.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
1.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @1    3 days ago

And what is the attitude of all the anti-Israel pro-Hamas protesters on college campuses and outside institutions for whom 'From the river to the sea' meaning to destroy Israel, concerning that?  Do they agree with the on-the-ground Hamas military leaders who want a ceasefire?  

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
1.1.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @1.1    2 days ago
And what is the attitude of all the anti-Israel pro-Hamas protesters on college campuses and outside institutions for whom 'From the river to the sea' meaning to destroy Israel, concerning that?

Several of them were asked what that meant. And what river does that refer two.

Not one of them knew what river that was.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
1.1.2  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @1.1.1    2 days ago

Which PROVES that they have no idea what the realities of the conflict are, but it merely gives them an opportunity to openly expose their actual patent or even latent "good old-fashioned Jew hatred" (as said by a Nazi general to Oscar Schindler in Schindler's List).

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
2  seeder  Krishna    3 days ago

The official shared two internal Hamas communications, both written by senior officials inside Gaza to the group’s leadership in Qatar, where Hamas’s political leader Ismail Haniyeh is based.

The communications, from May and June, suggested that the war had taken a toll on Hamas fighters, with the senior figures urging the group’s political wing abroad to accept the deal despite the reluctance of Yahya Sinwar, the group’s leader in Gaza

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @2    3 days ago

I'm a bit surprised about that.  I was always of the opinion that the Hamas militants would continue fighting to the last man because if they die in a battle with the Jews they would get to deflower their 72 virgins and enjoy them forever in the Garden of Allah.  

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
2.1.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1    3 days ago
I was always of the opinion that the Hamas militants would continue fighting to the last man

True of Hamas.

But not everyone in Gaza supports Hamas. True, almost no one there has put up significant resistance.

And I'm sure there are folks there who, while not supporting Hamas (and perhaps not even believe they will go to a marvelous Heaven if they kill Jews or any other "non-believers" ... people who just want to live in peace but know if they oppose Hamas openly they and their family will be killed (after being tortured).

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.2  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @2.1.1    3 days ago

At first the Gazan citizens cheered Hamas about Oct 7, danced in the streets and shared candies and sweets, just like they did for 9/11 (I guess the US college protesters would also cheer for the terrorist pilots who caused that).  But the Gazans have been educated to hate the Jews (thanks to UNRWA) and call for the destruction of Israel so it's quite a shock for them to see that their heroes have not been able to prevent their lives from being made miserable in this war - it's been somewhat of a wake-up call for them.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
2.1.3  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.2    3 days ago

I hold the general Palestinian population equally guilty as Hamas because of their tacit approval and support of it.

They don't garner my sympathy just because they are getting their ass kicked in a war they started.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.4  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @2.1.3    3 days ago

They voted Hamas in, have supported them throughout, joined in their sending incendiary balloons and kites into Israel, celebrated 9/11 and Oct 7, allowed Hamas militants to hide among them, kept Hamas' secrets such as where the Hamas facilities and weapons were hidden, and have been helping to hide and imprison the hostages, and allowed themselves to be used as human shields, so I really don't give a shit how many civilians are collateral damage, no matter how many times and how loudly they announce how many children and women have been killed, and how many are starving.  Fuck All of them. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
2.1.5  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.4    3 days ago
Fuck All of them. 

Exactly.

If and when Palestinians reject terrorism, then I will be glad to feel SOME sympathy for their self-induced plight.

Until then, they are to be considered enemy combatants, IMO.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
2.1.6  Gsquared  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.4    3 days ago
I really don't give a shit how many civilians are collateral damage, no matter how many times and how loudly they announce how many children and women have been killed, and how many are starving.  Fuck All of them.

Is that what your relatives (our people) who were killed by the Nazis would want?  

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.7  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.6    3 days ago

You are comparing a situation in which the victims were INNOCENT with a situation in which the victims are COMPLICIT?

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
2.1.8  Gsquared  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.7    3 days ago

That's a distortion and you know I am doing no such thing.  Come on.  You of all people should know better.  Tell me how many young children who have died in Gaza are "complicit".   

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
2.1.9  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.7    3 days ago

Sooner or later Palestinians will decide to be used by Hamas or to reject them.

Right now they are completely at ease being used as shields.

Fuck them.

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Senior Expert
2.1.10  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.8    3 days ago
Tell me how many young children who have died in Gaza are "complicit". 

How many in Sudan are complicit, in Ukraine…

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.11  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.8    3 days ago

Okay, babies and children who have not yet been taught by their UNRWA teachers to hate the Jews or have not been taught by their Imams to fight and kill the Jews (which the Koran tells them to do) are innocent and unfortunate casualties of war.

I wonder how many children were "casualties of war" in Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Tokyo and Dresden that people feel sorry for. 

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
2.1.12  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.11    3 days ago
I wonder how many children were "casualties of war" in Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Tokyo and Dresden that people feel sorry for. 

IIRC, there weren't huge tent encampments on college campuses and demonstrations in sympathy for those people ....???

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
2.1.13  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Drinker of the Wry @2.1.10    3 days ago
How many in Sudan are complicit, in Ukraine

That's strange-- they never seem to mention that.

And no encampments on college campuses-- or tying up traffic.

Why?

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
2.1.14  charger 383  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.11    3 days ago

I don't feel sorry for any "Casualties of war" from the Axis side in WWII or now in Gaza

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
2.1.15  Gsquared  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.11    3 days ago

That people may not feel sorry for innocent children, or adults for that matter, killed in Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Tokyo and Dresden says something about humanity, doesn't it?  As does war itself.  You are certainly aware that the innocents killed in Hiroshima (and probably the other locations, although I don't know to what extent) are memorialized and mourned.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Professor Principal
2.1.16  Gsquared  replied to  Krishna @2.1.13    3 days ago
Sudan... Ukraine

no encampments... or tying up traffic

Why?

Double standards.  The fact that Jews have been despised and made the scapegoat in many societies for several millenia.

Frankly, it outrages me.  The Russians just bombed a hospital in Kyiv.  Where are the protests?

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
2.1.17  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @2.1.2    2 days ago
so it's quite a shock for them to see that their heroes have not been able to prevent their lives from being made miserable in this war - it's been somewhat of a wake-up call for them.

Well, some of the more intelligent ones are beginning to realize...

But some still think that the attacks on October 7 were a good thing...

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
2.1.18  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.6    2 days ago
s that what your relatives (our people) who were killed by the Nazis would want?

Were those people killed by the Nazis terrorists-- and mass murderers?

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.19  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.8    2 days ago

Actually I've rethought what I said about the women and children.  Since the husbands and fathers (and mothers) do NOT take a stand against Hamas for whatever reason, and even support Hamas, and even support the attacks on Israel and its citizens, then THEY are the ones responsible for the deaths of the innocent, NOT ISRAEL.  What could they do?  They WAY outnumber the militants, they can swarm them (Did the French and Russian revolutionaries have the kind of weapons the armies did?), they can rat on the location where Hamas are hiding themselves and their weapons, they can expose where the hostages are hidden.  Don't bother telling me they are not complicit, they are just as responsible for what is happening, including the deaths and maiming of their own. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.20  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @2.1.17    2 days ago

Even if their mindset is starting to see the light, the biggest most antisemitic organization in the world, the United Nations isn't, still denying the complicity of their own agency, UNRWA.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
2.1.21  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Gsquared @2.1.8    yesterday

Interestingly, I just read in the Jerusalem Post that the Hamas militants are now sending Gazan CHILDREN out to fight the IDF.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
3  seeder  Krishna    3 days ago

.If all goes well, this may lead to the end of this horrendous war! jrSmiley_2_smiley_image.png

I wouldn't be surprised if, upon hearing about the possibility of peace, the "Free Palestine" college students resume their demonstrations-- urging the people in Gaza not to give in to any Israeli conditions!

(Although if they do, my guess is that their protests will once again be totally ineffective).

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @3    3 days ago

Ah, maybe that answers my question about their attitude, above.  How will they be able to express their antisemitism if they have nothing to protest?  What makes me really happy is that their identity is being recorded and as has already been happening, they might find a lot of employment possibilities closed to them - their ignorance deserves that kind of punishment.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
3.1.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @3.1    3 days ago
How will they be able to express their antisemitism if they have nothing to protest? 

Well if there's a "permanent" cease-fire-- I'm sure the more extreme "Free Palestine" types will find something to complain about!

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
3.1.2  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @3.1.1    3 days ago
Well if there's a "permanent" cease-fire-- I'm sure the more extreme "Free Palestine" types will find something to complain about!

Oh of course! How could I not see it-- they will freak out because there's no "Palestinian" state"!

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.1.3  Texan1211  replied to  Krishna @3.1.1    3 days ago
Well if there's a "permanent" cease-fire

There won't ever be a permanent ceasefire as long as Hamas exists.

Has there ever been a ceasefire that Hamas didn't break?

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
3.1.4  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Texan1211 @3.1.3    3 days ago
Has there ever been a ceasefire that Hamas didn't break?

No.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.1.5  Texan1211  replied to  Krishna @3.1.4    3 days ago

Which is a good reason to never negotiate with terrorists pledged to end your very existence on the planet.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.6  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @3.1.1    3 days ago

As Tex pointed out, there will not be a "permanent" cease-fire.  It might go on for a while, but Netanyahu is determined to totally extinguish Hamas.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
3.1.7  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Texan1211 @3.1.5    3 days ago
Which is a good reason to never negotiate with terrorists pledged to end your very existence on the planet.

Golda Meir*

You cannot negotiate peace with someone who has come to kill you

____________

*Israeli politician who served as the fourth prime minister of Israel from 1969 to 1974. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
3.1.8  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @3.1.7    2 days ago

Another truism attributed to her:

"If the Palestinians were to lay down their arms, there would be peace. If the Israelis were to lay down their arms, there would no longer be an Israel."
 
 
 
Greg Jones
Professor Participates
4  Greg Jones    3 days ago

Thankfully, Netanyahu ignored Biden's pleas to not go into Rafah.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
4.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Greg Jones @4    3 days ago

I'm sure he will find that pandering to the antisemites and Hamas supporters might really cost him.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @4.1    3 days ago

I'm sure he will find that pandering to the antisemites and Hamas supporters might really cost him.

Who-- Biden?

Actually the more extreme "free Palestine" crowd mostly sees him as too pro-Israel!

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
4.1.2  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @4.1.1    3 days ago

LOL.  Well, what he did was put himself into a "lose-lose" situation.  

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.3  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @4.1.2    3 days ago
LOL.  Well, what he did was put himself into a "lose-lose" situation.

The "palestinians" seem to have this unique skill of turning any situation into a "lose-lose" situation-- often for all parties involved.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.4  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @4.1.3    3 days ago
The "palestinians" seem to have this unique skill of turning any situation into a "lose-lose" situation-- often for all parties involved.

I had resisted the urge to post this quote:

The "palestinians" seem to have this unique skill of turning any situation into a "lose-lose" situation-- often for all parties involved.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.5  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @4.1.4    3 days ago

The "palestinians" seem to have this unique skill of turning any situation into a "lose-lose" situation-- often for all parties involved.

I had resisted the urge to post this quote:

that Arabs "never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity"

because you and I (and possibly one or two other people here) have any idea who said it.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.6  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @4.1.5    3 days ago

The "palestinians" seem to have this unique skill of turning any situation into a "lose-lose" situation-- often for all parties involved.

I had resisted the urge to post this quote:

that Arabs "never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity"

because you and I (and possibly one or two other people here) have any idea who said it.

(Hint: its not those notoriously evil  "Neo-Liberals"  jrSmiley_50_smiley_image.gif of incredible malfeasance fame!)

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
4.1.7  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @4.1.6    3 days ago

No, but I believe his initials are A.E.  But if I'm wrong, although I don't think I was, my best guess would be someone famed for such quotations, G.M. 

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.8  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @4.1.7    3 days ago

his initials are A.E

Correct.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
4.1.9  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @4.1.8    3 days ago

Okay, we both know who he was, and maybe others can figure it out if we give them the hint that his first name could make them think of a singing group. 

Anyway, see you later.  It's movie watching time.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
4.1.10  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @4.1.9    2 days ago
the hint that his first name could make them think of a singing group.

Doubtful-- most of them have already met their "Waterloo".

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
5  seeder  Krishna    3 days ago

This video is one of the better explanations I've seen about the current Hamas war to exterminate the Jews. .I'm not always a big fan of Bill Maher -- he's said a lot of things I agree with, and a lot of things I disagree with. But this old video explains a lot about the Hamas war to exterminate the Jews. (In fact I was surprised about how well informed he is)::

NEW RULE - FROM THE RIVER TO THE SEA

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
5.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @5    3 days ago
But this old video explains a lot about the Hamas war to exterminate the Jews

Apologies to Buzz-- I know you can't see YouTube videos. So I will post more about it later-- I have to run out now  to do an errand.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
5.1.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @5.1    3 days ago

Since the Chinese government, and therefore the media here, are biased in favour of the Palestinians (as you might know it has invested much to win favour with the Arab/Muslim States) I don't think I'll be able to watch it.

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Silent
6  charger 383    3 days ago

No reason for Israel to stop now, 

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
6.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  charger 383 @6    3 days ago
No reason for Israel to stop now,

You may have a point there--- if Israel stop fighting-- and even withdraws from Gaza-- there are elements of Hamas who will start fighting again. (For example, firing rockets at civilian targets in Israel).

But there is one reason -- every so often an Israeli soldier is killed-- or severely wounded. If there's a "permanent" cease fire most of the fighting ends. 

(Well, unless Hamas again breaks a long-standing  cease-fire as they did on October 7th.)

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
6.2  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  charger 383 @6    3 days ago
"No reason for Israel to stop now," 

Temporarily okay, but not permanently until Hamas is eradicated.

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
6.2.1  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @6.2    2 days ago
Temporarily okay, but not permanently until Hamas is eradicated.

Maybe it could be re-stated to say : until their ability to attack Israel is quashed...most of Hamas eliminated.

After all, in WWII the power of The Nazi Party was eliminated. Unconditional surrender. (But there were still surviving Nazi sympathizers-- they were just rendered ineffective.)

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
6.2.2  seeder  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @6.2.1    2 days ago
After all, in WWII the power of The Nazi Party was eliminated. Unconditional surrender. (But there were still surviving Nazi sympathizers-- they were just rendered ineffective.)

Ditto Japan:

The bodies of some 2,600 Japanese soldiers were never found. In a stunning twist, a group of 35 soldiers survived within the caves of Peleliu , hiding out for some 18 months after the war ended before finally surrendering in April 1947.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
6.2.3  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @6.2.1    2 days ago

Antisemitism and antiIsraelism and the command in the Koran for the Muslims to fight and kill the Jews will NEVER be changed.  What I have sadly started to believe are the scattered opinions I've been seeing is that the world will eventually be taken over by the Muslims.  

 
 
 
Krishna
Professor Expert
7  seeder  Krishna    2 days ago

Even in the U.S.-- at one time there were things like this:

1939 Nazi rally at Madison Square Garden

256

On February 20, 1939, Nazi  rally took place at  Madison Square Garden , organized by the  German American Bund . More than 20,000 people attended, and  Fritz Julius Kuhn  was a featured speaker. The Bund billed the event, which took place two days before  George Washington's Birthday , as a pro-"Americanism" rally; the stage at the event featured a huge Washington portrait with  swastikas  on each side. [1]

That couldn't happen today!

(But American Nazis have not been totally eliminated. There are still a few American Nazi. 

(But as a significant force in the U.S.they are now powerless).

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
7.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @7    2 days ago

Instead of the Nazis, now there is MAGA.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
7.1.1  Vic Eldred  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1    2 days ago

To be able to see your enemies, you'll have to learn how to look left.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.1.2  Tessylo  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1    2 days ago

Same thing

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
7.1.3  Tessylo  replied to  Vic Eldred @7.1.1    2 days ago

Nyet.  To the right.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
7.1.4  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Vic Eldred @7.1.1    2 days ago

It's necessary to look both ways because there are enemies everywhere - but there are just too many on the right.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
7.1.5  Vic Eldred  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.4    2 days ago

Today your enemies are on the left.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
7.1.6  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Vic Eldred @7.1.5    2 days ago

Vic, my enemies are everywhere, not just right or left, but fortunately none have the ability to reach me, or to stop me from doing what I choose to do or say what I choose to say.  However, I do have friends everywhere as well.  By now it should be clear to see that I don't take sides, because each just might have some good with their bad, or some bad with their good.  I said "might", because in some situations....... 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
7.1.7  Vic Eldred  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.6    2 days ago
However, I do have friends everywhere as well.

Yes. Let us think of all the innocent people in the world and let us never let genocide happen ever again.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Expert
7.1.8  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Vic Eldred @7.1.7    yesterday

Or wrongly accuse a nation of genocide when it is not true.

 
 

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