Good morning

And congrats to last night's winner.

I think Trump would have lost the debate even if YOU had been the moderator.  I agreed with his criticism of Harris for not attending Netanyahu's speech to Congress, and don't bother giving me bullshit that her speaking to a sorority could not be postponed.

When he was right on questions, he managed to give the wrong answers. For instance, instead of talking about how an Ohio small town was overwhelmed by Haitians, whom the Biden/Harris administration granted legal status to, he talked about the unproven story that Haitian's were eating pets. Harris was near perfect. So, yes, even without the ABC intervention, Harris would have won.

not attending Netanyahu's speech to Congress

harris' VP duties don't require her to appear at political stunts put on by autocrats, traitors, or criminals. I wonder if bibi has noticed the 130 day countdown clock that just went up on his autocratic regime, if he even lasts that long...

The people of Israel were speaking through their representative.  By intentionally skipping that speech Harris has insulted the whole of the people of Israel, and every Jew in the USA and in fact every Jew in the world.  What did the people of Israel say through their representative that you feel justifies the insult that Harris and the other lawmakers who intentionally skipped attending have bestowed?  Here is the speech - please read it, because if you do not, then you have insulted every Israeli and every Jew in the world.  But if you surprise me and you DO read it, then tell me why you feel what was said was not important, not only to Israel, but to the USA.

The following is the full text of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s speech before a joint session of Congress on July 25, 2024, as issued by his office.

Speaker of the House Mike Johnson,
Senator Ben Cardin,
Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries,
Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer,
Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell,
Senators,
Members of Congress,
Distinguished guests,

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank you for giving me the profound honor of addressing this great citadel of democracy for the fourth time.

We meet today at a crossroads of history. Our world is in upheaval. In the Middle East, Iran’s axis of terror confronts America, Israel and our Arab friends. This is not a clash of civilizations. It’s a clash between barbarism and civilization. It’s a clash between those who glorify death and those who sanctify life.

For the forces of civilization to triumph, America and Israel must stand together. Because when we stand together, something very simple happens. We win. They lose.

And my friends, I came to assure you today of one thing: we will win.

Ladies and gentlemen,
Like December 7th, 1941, and September 11th, 2001, October 7th is a day that will forever live in infamy.

It was the Jewish holiday of Simchat Torah. It began as a perfect day. Not a cloud in the sky. Thousands of young Israelis were celebrating at an outdoor music festival. And suddenly, at 6:29 a.m., as children were still sleeping soundly in their beds in the towns and kibbutzim next to Gaza, suddenly heaven turned into hell. Three thousand Hamas terrorists stormed into Israel. They butchered 1,200 people from 41 countries, including 39 Americans. Proportionately, compared to our population size, that’s like 20 9/11s in one day. And these monsters, they raped women, they beheaded men, they burnt babies alive, they killed parents in front of their children and children in front of their parents. They dragged 255 people, both living in dead, into the dark dungeons of Gaza.

Israel has already brought home 135 of these hostages, including seven who were freed in daring rescue operations. One of those freed hostages, Noa Argamani, is here in the gallery sitting near my wife Sara.

On the morning of October 7th, the entire world saw Noa’s look of desperation as she was violently abducted to Gaza on the back of a motorcycle. I met Noa’s mother Liora a few months ago. She was dying of cancer. She said to me, “Prime Minister, I have one final wish. I wish to hug my daughter Noa one last time before I die.”

Two months ago, I authorized a breathtaking commando rescue operation. Our Special Forces, including a heroic officer named Arnon Zmora, who fell in this battle, rescued Noa and three other hostages.

I think it’s one of the most moving things, when Noa was reunited with her mother, Liora, and her mother’s last wish came true.

Noa, we’re so thrilled to have you with us today. Thank you.

Many hostage families are also here with us today, including Eliyahu Bibas. Eliyahu Bibas is the grandfather of those two beautiful red-headed boys, the Bibas boys, toddlers. And they were taken hostage with their mother and Eliyahu’s son. The entire family was taken hostage. Two beautiful red-haired children taken hostage. What monsters.

And with us also is Iris Haim, whose son Yotam bravely escaped Hamas captivity with two other Israelis, and tragically they were killed making their way back to our lines.

We have with us also the families of American hostages. They’re here.

The pain these families have endured is beyond words. I met with them again yesterday and I promised them this. I will not rest until all their loved ones are home. All of them.

As we speak, we’re actively engaged in intensive efforts to secure their release, and I’m confident that these efforts can succeed. Some of them are taking place right now.

I want to thank President Biden for his tireless efforts on behalf of the hostages and for his efforts to the hostage families as well.

I thank President Biden for his heartful support for Israel after the savage attack on October 7th. He rightly called Hamas “sheer evil.” He dispatched two aircraft carriers to the Middle East to deter a wider war. And he came to Israel to stand with us during our darkest hour, a visit that will never be forgotten.

President Biden and I have known each other for over forty years. I want to thank him for half a century of friendship to Israel and for being, as he says, a proud Zionist. Actually, he says, a proud Irish American Zionist.

My friends, for more than nine months, Israel’s soldiers have shown boundless courage.

With us today is Lieutenant Avichail Reuven. Avichail is an officer in the Israeli paratroopers. His family immigrated to Israel from Ethiopia. In the early hours of October 7th, Avichail heard the news of Hamas’ bloody rampage. He put on his uniform, grabbed his rifle, but he didn’t have a car. So he ran eight miles to the frontlines of Gaza to defend his people. You heard that right. He ran eight miles, came to the frontlines, killed many terrorists and saved many, many lives. Avichail, we all honor your remarkable heroism.

Another Israeli is with us here today. He’s standing right next to Avichail. This is Master Sergeant Ashraf al Bahiri. Ashraf is a Bedouin soldier from the Israeli Muslim community of Rahat. On October 7th, Ashraf too killed many terrorists. First, he defended his comrades in the military base, and he then rushed to defend the neighboring communities, including the devastated community of Kibbutz Be’eri.

Like Ashraf, the Muslim soldiers of the IDF fought alongside their Jewish, Druze, Christian and other comrades in arms with tremendous bravery.

A third hero, Lieutenant Asa Sofer is also here with us. Asa fought as an officer in the tank corps, and he was wounded in battle. He was wounded in battle while protecting his fellow soldiers from a grenade. He lost his right arm and the vision in his left eye. He’s recovering, and incredibly, within a short time, Asa will soon return to active duty as a commander of a tank company.

I just learned there’s a fourth hero here – Lieutenant Yonatan, Jonathan Ben Hamo who lost a leg in Gaza and continued to fight.

My friends, these are the soldiers of Israel—unbowed, undaunted, unafraid.

As the Bible says, “עם כלביא יקום” —they shall rise like lions. They’ve risen like lions, the lions of Judah, the lions of Israel.

Ladies and Gentlemen,
The men and women of the IDF come from every corner of Israeli society, every ethnicity, every color, every creed, left and right, religious and secular. All are imbued with the indomitable spirit of the Maccabees, the legendary Jewish warriors of antiquity.

With us today is Yechiel Leiter, the father of one of those Maccabees. Yehiel’s father escaped the Holocaust and found refuge in America. As a young man, Yechiel moved to Israel and raised a family of eight children. He named his eldest son Moshe after his late father. Moshe became an exemplary officer in one of our elite commando units. He served with distinction for two decades while raising six beautiful children of his own.

On October 7th, Moshe volunteered to return to combat. Four weeks later, he was killed when a booby-trap mine exploded in a tunnel shaft right next to a Mosque. At his son’s funeral Yechiel said this: “If the State of Israel had not been established after the Holocaust, the image engraved in our collective memory would have been the photograph of that helpless Jewish boy in the Warsaw Ghetto holding his hands up in the air with Nazi riffles pointed at him. But because of the birth of Israel,” Yechiel continued, “because of the courage of soldiers like my son Moshe, the Jewish people are no longer helpless in the face of our enemies.”

Yechiel, please rise so we can honor your son’s sacrifice. And I pledge to you and to all the bereaved families of Israel, some of whom are in this hall today, the sacrifice of your loved ones will not be in vain. It will not be in vain because for Israel, “never again” must never be an empty promise. It must always remain a sacred vow. And after October 7th, “never again” is now.

My friends,
Defeating our brutal enemies requires both courage and clarity. Clarity begins by knowing the difference between good and evil. Yet incredibly many anti-Israel protesters, many choose to stand with evil. They stand with Hamas. They stand with rapists and murderers. They stand with people who came into the kibbutzim, into a home, the parents hid the children, the two babies, in the attic, in a secret attic. They murdered the family, the parents, they found the secret latch to the hidden attic and then they murdered the babies. These protesters stand with them. They should be ashamed of themselves.

They refuse to make the simple distinction between those who target terrorists and those who target civilians, between the democratic State of Israel and the terrorist thugs of Hamas. We recently learned from the U.S. Director of National Intelligence, that Iran is funding and promoting anti-Israel protests in America. They want to disrupt America. So these protesters burned American flags even on the 4th of July. And I wish to salute the fraternity brothers at the University of North Carolina who protected the American flag, protected the American flag against these anti-Israel protesters.

For all we know, Iran is funding the anti-Israel protests that are going on right now outside this building—not that many, but they’re there—and throughout the city. Well, I have a message for these protesters: When the Tyrants of Tehran, who hang gays from cranes and murder women for not covering their hair, are praising, promoting and funding you, you have officially become Iran’s useful idiots.

It’s amazing, absolutely amazing. Some of these protesters hold up signs proclaiming “Gays for Gaza.” They might as well hold up signs saying “Chickens for KFC.”

These protesters chant “From the river to the sea.” But many don’t have a clue what river and what sea they’re talking about. They not only get an F in geography, they get an F in history. They call Israel a colonialist state. Don’t they know that the Land of Israel is where Abraham, Isaac and Jacob prayed, where Isaiah and Jeremiah preached and where David and Solomon ruled?

For nearly four thousand years, the land of Israel has been the homeland of the Jewish people. It’s always been our home; it will always be our home.

It’s not only the campus protesters who get it wrong. It’s also the people who run those campuses. Eighty years after the Holocaust, the presidents of Harvard, Penn, and I’m ashamed to say my alma mater MIT couldn’t bring themselves to condemn the calls for the genocide of Jews. Remember what they said? They said, it depends on the context. Well, let me give these befuddled academics a little context.

Antisemitism is the world’s oldest hatred. For centuries, the massacre of Jews was always preceded by wild accusations. We were accused of everything from poisoning wells to spreading plagues to using the blood of slaughtered children to bake Passover matzos. These preposterous antisemitic lies led to persecution, mass murder and ultimately to history’s worst genocide, the Holocaust.

Now, just as malicious lies were levelled for centuries at the Jewish people, malicious lies are now being levelled at the Jewish state. No, no. Don’t applaud. Listen. The outrageous slanders that paint Israel as racist and genocidal are meant to delegitimize Israel, to demonize the Jewish State and to demonize Jews everywhere. And no wonder, no wonder we’ve witnessed an appalling rise of antisemitism in America and around the world.

My friends,
Whenever and wherever we see the scourge of antisemitism, we must unequivocally condemn it and resolutely fight it, without exception.

And don’t be fooled when the blood libels against the Jewish State come from people who wear fancy silk robes and speak in lofty tones about law and Justice.

Here’s a case in point: The prosecutor of the International Criminal Court has shamefully accused Israel of deliberately starving the people of Gaza. This is utter complete nonsense. It’s a complete fabrication. Israel has enabled more than 40,000 aid trucks to enter Gaza. That’s half a million tons of food, and that’s more than 3,000 calories for every man, woman and child in Gaza. If there are Palestinians in Gaza who aren’t getting enough food, it’s not because Israel is blocking it, it’s because Hamas is stealing it.

So much for that lie, but here’s another: The ICC prosecutor accuses Israel of deliberately targeting civilians. What in God’s green earth is he talking about? The IDF has dropped millions of flyers, sent millions of text messages, made hundreds of thousands of phone calls to get Palestinian civilians out of harm’s way. But at the same time, Hamas does everything in its power to put Palestinian civilians in harm’s way. They fire rockets from schools, from hospitals, from mosques. They even shoot their own people when they try to leave the war zone. A senior Hamas official Fathi Hamad boasted – Listen to this – He boasted that Palestinian women and children excel at being human shields. His words: “excel at being human shields.” What monstrous evil.

For Israel, every civilian death is a tragedy. For Hamas, it’s a strategy. They actually want Palestinian civilians to die, so that Israel will be smeared in the international media and be pressured to end the war before it’s won.

This would enable Hamas to survive another day, and as they vowed, to carry out October 7th again and again and again. Well, I want to assure you, no matter what pressure is brought to bear, I will never allow that to happen.

The vast majority of Americans have not fallen for this Hamas propaganda. They continue to support Israel, and I want to say: Thank you America, and thank you, senators and house members who continue to support us, continue to support Israel, continue to support the truth and see through the lies.

But as for the minority that may have fallen for Hamas’s con job, I suggest you listen to Colonel John Spencer. John Spencer is head of urban warfare studies at West Point. He studied every major urban conflict, I was going to say in modern history, he corrected me. No. In history.

Israel, he said, has implemented more precautions to prevent civilian harm than any military in history and beyond what international law requires.

That’s why despite all the lies you’ve heard, the war in Gaza has one of the lowest ratios of combatants to non-combatant casualties in the history of urban warfare. And you want to know where it’s lowest in Gaza? It’s lowest in Rafah. In Rafah. Remember what so many people said? If Israel goes into Rafah, there’ll be thousands, maybe even tens of thousands of civilians killed. Well, last week I went into Rafah. I visited our troops as they finished fighting Hamas’ remaining terrorist battalions. I asked the commander there, “How many terrorists did you take out in Rafah?” He gave me an exact number: 1,203. I asked him, “How many civilians were killed?” He said, “Prime Minister, practically none. With the exception of a single incident, where shrapnel from a bomb hit a Hamas weapons depot and unintentionally killed two dozen people, the answer is practically none.” You want to know why? Because Israel got the civilians out of harm’s way, something people said we could never do, but we did it.

These heroes here today, the heroic soldiers of Israel, should not be condemned for how they’re conducting the war in Gaza. They should be commended for it.

I want to thank all of you here today who have forcefully opposed the false accusations of the ICC and stood up for the truth. These lies are not only libelous. They’re downright dangerous. The ICC is trying to shackle Israel’s hands and prevent us from defending ourselves. And if Israel’s hands are tied, America is next. I’ll tell you what else is next. The ability of all democracies to fight terrorism will be imperiled. That’s what’s on the line. So let me assure you, the hands of the Jewish state will never be shackled. Israel will always defend itself.

My friends,
In the Middle East, Iran is virtually behind all the terrorism, all the turmoil, all the chaos, all the killing. And that should come as no surprise. When he founded the Islamic Republic, Ayatollah Khomeini pledged, “We will export our revolution to the entire world. We will export the Islamic revolution to the entire world.” Now, ask yourself, which country ultimately stands in the way of Iran’s maniacal plans to impose radical Islam on the world? And the answer is clear: It’s America, the guardian of Western civilization and the world’s greatest power. That’s why Iran sees America as its greatest enemy.

Last month, I heard a revealing comment, ostensibly about the war in Gaza, but about something else. It came from the foreign minister of Iran’s proxy, Hezbollah, and he said this: “This is not a war with Israel. Israel,” he said, “is merely a tool. The main war, the real war, is with America.”

Iran’s regime has been fighting America from the moment it came to power. In 1979, it stormed the American embassy, it held scores of Americans hostage for 444 days. Since then, Iran’s terrorist proxies have targeted America in the Middle East and beyond. In Beirut, they killed 241 U.S. servicemen. In Africa, they bombed American embassies. In Iraq, they supplied explosives to maim and kill thousands of American soldiers. In America, they actually sent death squads. They sent death squads here to murder a former secretary of state and a former national security adviser. And as we recently learned, they even brazenly threatened to assassinate President Trump.

But Iran understands that to truly challenge America, it must first conquer the Middle East. And for this it uses its many proxies, including the Houthis, Hezbollah and Hamas. Yet in the heart of the Middle East, standing in Iran’s way, is one proud pro-American democracy—my country, the State of Israel.

That’s why the mobs in Tehran chant “Death to Israel” before they chant “Death to America.” For Iran Israel is first, America is next. So, when Israel fights Hamas, we’re fighting Iran. When we fight Hezbollah, we’re fighting Iran. When we fight the Houthis, we’re fighting Iran. And when we fight Iran, we’re fighting the most radical and murderous enemy of the United States of America.

And one more thing. When Israel acts to prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, nuclear weapons that could destroy Israel and threaten every American city, every city that you come from, we’re not only protecting ourselves. We’re protecting you.

My friends,
If you remember one thing, one thing from this speech, remember this: Our enemies are your enemies, our fight is your fight, and our victory will be your victory.

Ladies and gentlemen,
That victory is in sight. Israel’s defeat of Hamas will be a powerful blow to Iran’s axis of terror. Another part of that axis, Hezbollah, attacked Israel on October 8th, a day after the Hamas attack. It has launched thousands of missiles and drones against us. 80,000 of our citizens in northern Israel evacuated their homes, becoming effectively refugees in their own land. We are committed to returning them home. We prefer to achieve this diplomatically. But let me be clear: Israel will do whatever it must do to restore security to our northern border and return our people safely to their homes.

Last Friday, a third Iranian proxy, the Houthis, attacked Tel Aviv with a deadly drone. It exploded a few hundred feet from the American consulate, killing one person and injuring nine. On Saturday, I authorized a swift response to that attack.

All our enemies should know this. Those who attack Israel will pay a very heavy price.

And as we defend ourselves on all fronts, I know that America has our back. And I thank you for it. All sides of the aisle. Thank you.

My friends,
For decades, America has provided Israel with generous military assistance, and a grateful Israel has provided America with critical intelligence that saved many lives. We’ve jointly developed some of the most sophisticated weapons on Earth. I choose my words carefully: we’ve jointly developed some of the most sophisticated weapons on Earth, that help protect both our countries. And we also help keep American boots off the ground while protecting our shared interests in the Middle East.

I deeply appreciate America’s support, including in this current war. But this is an exceptional moment. Fast tracking US military aid can dramatically expedite an end to the war in Gaza and help prevent a broader war in the Middle East.

In World War II, as Britain fought on the frontlines of civilization, Winston Churchill appealed to Americans with these famous words: “Give us the tools and we’ll finish the job.” Today, as Israel fights on the frontline of civilization, I too appeal to America: “Give us the tools faster, and we’ll finish the job faster.”

My dear friends,
The war in Gaza could end tomorrow if Hamas surrenders, disarms and returns all the hostages. But if they don’t, Israel will fight until we destroy Hamas’ military capabilities and its rule in Gaza and bring all our hostages home.

That’s what total victory means, and we will settle for nothing less.

The day after we defeat Hamas, a new Gaza can emerge. My vision for that day is of a demilitarized and deradicalized Gaza. Israel does not seek to resettle Gaza. But for the foreseeable future, we must retain overriding security control there to prevent the resurgence of terror, to ensure that Gaza never again poses a threat to Israel.

Gaza should have a civilian administration run by Palestinians who do not seek to destroy Israel. That’s not too much to ask. It’s a fundamental thing that we have a right to demand and to receive.

A new generation of Palestinians must no longer be taught to hate Jews but rather to live in peace with us. Those twin words, demilitarization and deradicalization, those two concepts were applied to Germany and Japan after World War II, and that led to decades of peace, prosperity and security.

Following our victory, with the help of regional partners, the demilitarization and deradicalization of Gaza can also lead to a future of security, prosperity and peace. That’s my vision for Gaza.

Now, here’s my vision for the broader Middle East. It’s also shaped in part by what we saw in the aftermath of World War II. After that war, America forged a security alliance in Europe to counter the growing Soviet threat. Likewise, America and Israel today can forge a security alliance in the Middle East to counter the growing Iranian theat.

All countries that are in peace with Israel and all those countries who will make peace with Israel should be invited to join this alliance. We saw a glimpse of that potential alliance on April 14th. Led by the United States, more than half a dozen nations worked alongside Israel to help neutralize hundreds of missiles and drones launched by Iran against us.

Thank you, President Biden, for bringing that coalition together.

The new alliance I envision would be a natural extension of the groundbreaking Abraham Accords. Those Accords saw peace forged between Israel and four Arab countries, and they were supported by Republican and Democrats alike.

I have a name for this new alliance. I think we should call it: The Abraham Alliance.

I want to thank President Trump for his leadership in brokering the historic Abraham Accords. Like Americans, Israelis were relieved that President Trump emerged safe and sound from that dastardly attack on him, dastardly attack on American democracy. There is no room for political violence in democracies.

I also want to thank President Trump for all the things he did for Israel, from recognizing Israel’s sovereignty over the Golan Heights, to confronting Iran’s aggression, to recognizing Jerusalem as our capital and moving the American embassy there. That’s Jerusalem, our eternal capital never to be divided again.

My dear friends, Democrats and Republicans,
Despite these times of upheaval, I’m hopeful about the future. I’m hopeful about Israel because my people, the Jewish people, emerged from the depths of hell, from dispossession and genocide, and against all odds we restored our sovereignty in our ancient homeland, we built a powerful and vibrant democracy, a democracy that pushes the boundaries of innovation for the betterment of all humanity.

I’m hopeful about America because I’m hopeful about Americans. I know how much the people of this country have sacrificed to defend freedom. America will continue to be a force for light and good in a dark and dangerous world. For free peoples everywhere, America remains the beacon of liberty its extraordinary founders envisioned back in 1776.

Working together, I’m confident that our two nations will vanquish the tyrants and terrorists who threaten us both. As Israel’s prime minister, I promise you this: no matter how long it takes, no matter how difficult the road ahead, Israel will not relent. Israel will not bend. We will defend our land. We will defend our people. We will fight until we achieve victory. Victory of liberty over tyranny, victory of life over death, victory of good over evil. That’s our solemn commitment.

And we will continue to work with the United States and our Arab partners to transform a troubled region, from a backwater of oppression, poverty and war into a thriving oasis of dignity, prosperity and peace. In this noble mission, as in many others, Israel will always remain America’s indispensable ally. Through thick and thin, in good times and in bad, Israel will always be your loyal friend and your steadfast partner.

On behalf of the people of Israel, I came here today to say: Thank you, America. Thank you for your support and solidarity. Thank you for standing with Israel in our hour of need. Together, we shall defend our common civilization. Together, we shall secure a brilliant future for both our nations.

May God bless Israel.
May God bless America.
And may God bless the great alliance between Israel and America forever.

The people of Israel were speaking through their representative

obviously your news sources are restricted. from what I've seen on TV, bibi doesn't represent all israelis.

justifies the insult that Harris and the other lawmakers who intentionally skipped attending have bestowed

since when do elected american officials dance when a criminal autocrat calls the tune with a last minute political stunt? I wouldn't postpone a car wash for that POS war criminal.

Here is the speech - please read it, because if you do not, then you have insulted every Israeli and every Jew in the world

bullshit, but nice broad brush stroke. fuck bibi, he's sacrificing innocent lives on both sides to stay in power and out of prison. he doesn't want peace or a 2 state solution. I have no interest in reading the patronizing drivel written to his autocratic maga brethren in congress, and the only word I want to hear that criminal say is guilty in an israeli court.

he can let the radical religious ultra nationalists in israel run the show there, he's not doing it here. contrary to unpopular beliefs, our constitution forbids a religion to interfere with our government. we aren't a quasi theocracy and we shouldn't be influenced by any leader of a country that is. bibi isn't israel and doesn't represent israel, he represents himself and the ultra religious parasites of israel. bibi is gambling it all on maga to save him, and hopefully kamala and the sane israelis that want peace will be collecting shortly after trump loses.

bibi is much like the former 'president' convicted felon and traitor - I wouldn't read the speech either

from what I've seen on TV, bibi doesn't represent all israelis.

I don't know what you have seen, but Netanyahu represents the people of Israel like Biden represents the people of the United States.

of course everyone knows that people hold different opinions.

harris' VP duties don't require her to appear at political stunts put on by autocrats, traitors, or criminals. 

Gee, heads of state usually get more respect.

But I get it, the Palestinians are so sympathetic after 50 years of victimhood and terrorizing Israel.

I was wondering why there aren't any protests and marches happening in support of, the almost 15,000 Ukrainian casualties or how about Sudan, or Afghanistan, or Yemen, or Myanmar?  Oh, I know, it's those JOOZ!!!  But it would be considered antisemitism to say that out loud wouldn't it, so let's aim our vitriol at the Prime Minister of the country that was invaded and that is attempting to eradicate the source of the attacks that have been occurring for years and will continue, BUT FOR SURE nobody will say anything about the terrorists' UNhumanitarian method of hiding among its civilians and using them as human shields, hiding themselves, their control centres and their weapons in and under hospitals, schools, mosques and refugee centres (with the assistance of UNRWA) and placing their missile-launchers in schoolyards, while Israel has been lauded by persons such as Col, Richard Kemp for being more humanitarian and careful about not harming civilians than any army in history.  You won't get an admission of guilt from the UN and the ICJ won't admit Hamas' wrongdoings, but there are members here who would rather BLAME THE JOOZ.  Yep, blame Netanyahu for doing what has to be done to eradicate the terrorists, because it's either that or weather having missiles and rockets and repeats of Oct 7 over and over again, but I know you don't give a shit about that.

Thank you, Tex.  And why is Israel different?  I know why, and I've said it over and over, it's those JOOZ.

Seems like Russian terrorists still draw the ire of those supporting Palestinian terrorists.

I know, those Russians aren't JEWISH.  Antisemites know how to hide their feelings, but they sure support those whose life's desire is to kill the Jews and destroy Israel.  Know that song "The Bible Tells Me So"?  THEIR bible tells them so and I can prove it. 

It is to America's everlasting shame that we have folks here supporting terrorists.

One would think that the most obvious time for Americans to NOT snub those who are having to defend their nation from terrorists, AND their leader who is leading the battle, it would be on this very sad anniversary.

One would think so. but there are crazies everywhere.

trump got to flap his yap for 5 minutes longer than kamala. ABC did a shit job of turning his mic off when his time was up, or when he couldn't answer a direct question and started rambling into nonsense. fortunately both lapses in the rules by ABC probably helped kamala by letting trump talk his way out of being qualified for the job. trump performed exactly how his campaign feared most.

What we witnessed last night was what William F Buckley once said he feared most: An evil individual armed with a college degree and well prepped for a national debate. 

An evil individual armed with a college degree and well prepped for a national debate. 

trump wasn't well prepped, and then he carried the yoke of an old, tired, incoherent, and confused participant.

Btw I just discovered this:

An moderator (Lindsy Davis) claimed there’s nowhere where a baby born live from a botched abortion can be killed, In Minnesota, home to Harris’ veep nominee, eight babies born alive were allowed to die without lifesaving care.

Tim Walz Repealed MN Law Protecting Babies Born After Failed Abortions | Across Minnesota, MN Patch

trump wasn't well prepped,

I don't think he went into it knowing he would be going against Harris and 2 "moderators".

Megyn Kelly agrees:

anti-choicers can yell and scream all they want about full term and post term abortions, but when it comes to providing any proof, the statistics tell a different story. you can't provide the names of the doctors that would violate their hippocratic oaths and harm a healthy fetus in the 3rd trimester or the illegality of killing any child after it has been born healthy. you obviously don't know the family's anguish of delivering a child with a terminal health issue and having to make the heart breaking decisions involved with sustaining that life for the few minutes or hours it may have left. the nonsensical selectivity of which lives are or aren't important by rwnj pro-lifers is appalling.

luckily, trump's thumper SCOTUS destroying roe v wade will be the death of the republican party, for good reasons. it's based upon non-secular dogma and it removes individual equality and freedom of bodily autonomy from women, half the voters. the abortion issue is just another example of the total unwillingness of republicans to compromise and an absolute lack of comprehension of the US constitution.

luckily, trump's thumper SCOTUS destroying roe v wade will be the death of the republican party, for good reasons.

Roe was wrongly decided. There is no mention of abortion in the Constitution. The states now have a right to vote on it and restrictions to it

Kamala wants a federal law governing abortion. If she wins, she'll need congress to go along.

Roe was wrongly decided.

I vehemently disagree.

There is no mention of abortion in the Constitution.

There are many mentions of privacy in the Constitution. There is no explicit mention of parental rights in the Constitution either, but Roe was predicated on the same privacy rights used to give parents rights over schools.

The states now have a right to vote on it and restrictions to it

Red states politicians now have the right to insert themselves in private personal business. Many of these states have gone far out of their way to block votes on abortion and/or use misleading text in state ballot measures. 

you can't provide the names of the doctors that would violate their hippocratic oaths and harm a healthy fetus in the 3rd trimester or the illegality of killing any child after it has been born healthy

Abortion doctor Kermit Gosnell convicted of first-degree murder (nbcnews.com)

Anguish, gratitude and fear of violence at a Colorado clinic for late abortions (nbcnews.com)

Late-term abortions explained | CNN

many mentions of privacy in the Constitution

No, there aren't. And even if there were how could that possibly matter? 

This isn't horseshoe or handgrenades. Context and specificity  is king.  

but Roe was predicated on the same privacy rights used to give parents rights over schools.

That's not true at all. 

No, there aren't.

We've already had this discussion and I'm not having it again. I disagree and I have decades of legal precedent on my side. You have one rouge court that will could be overturned in the future.

That's not true at all. 

It's right in the Roe ruling for anyone that wants to read it.

We've already had this discussion and I'm not having it again. I disagree and I have decades of legal precedent on my side. You have one rouge court that will could be overturned in the future.

Ah, so the Court that decided that abortion was a right was right because you agreed with them, but now the Court has ruled another way so that makes them a rogue court.

All makes sense now.

Rogue courts rule how I don't want them to.

The bastards!

e've already had this discussion and I'm not having it again.

Because you can't show "many mentions of privacy in the Constitution" You made a completely, verifiably false claim. . 

ecades of legal precedent on my side. You have one rouge court that will could be overturned in the future.

Lol. I have entire history of our legal system stretching back to the beginnings of the common law on my side. You have a handful of activist justices who decided to impose their moral vision on the country. 

s right in the Roe ruling for anyone that wants to read it

There is no claim of a right to privacy in the cases that gave parents rights over schools in the cases cited in the Roe ruling. 

and impotent

She didn't say that.  Why do you always put words in other people's mouths.

The only way the 'right' can win -  by cheating.

Yes she did. Did you watch the debate?

One of the ABC News debate moderators on Tuesday fact-checked former President Donald Trump on babies who survive botched abortions, saying that they aren't killed. But Minnesota records show eight babies in recent years have in fact survived botched procedures but then died after being denied life-saving care.   (empahsis mine)

justthenews

You should really pay attention.  Not only was the "fact check" wrong, look closely at where this happened. 

Red states politicians now have the right to insert themselves in private personal business. Many of these states have gone far out of their way to block votes on abortion and/or use misleading text in state ballot measures. 

 But Minnesota records show eight babies in recent years have in fact survived botched procedures but then died after being denied life-saving care. 

lieve that life-saving care would be a decision reserved to the progenitors in all cases. 

That's fine. But that also makes Trump correct.

When Trump  said Democrats support murdering babies who survive abortions, the honest thing would be to say "yes we do."  They shouldn't lie and say it never happens. 

[✘]

Davis clearly said:

"There is no state in this country where it is legal to kill a baby after it's born."

There are many mentions of privacy in the Constitution.

Show us.


Red states politicians now have the right to insert themselves in private personal business. Many of these states have gone far out of their way to block votes on abortion and/or use misleading text in state ballot measures. 

Anyone gets to put abortion on the ballot.

That's not what you said at 1.2.3 so you put words in her mouth

Isn't there something about being secure in their persons, houses, papers and effects?

  Amendment IV?

Look a bit closer at your link, Vic.

In one instance, fetal anomalies were reported resulting in death shortly after delivery. No measures taken to preserve life were reported and the infant did not survive.

In two instance, comfort care measures were provided as planned and the infant did not survive. •

In two instances, the infant was previable. No measures taken to preserve life were reported and the infant did not survive.

In the first (of five) reported instance, there were fetal anomalies that resulted in death.  Survival was never an option.

In the second two instances reported, comfort care was provided as planned.  The reasons for the abortions are not specified, and neither was the likelihood of survival.  Was there a pregnancy complication that damaged the fetus?  Premature rupture of the membranes?  Preeclampsia?  We don't know.

In the last two instances, viability had not been reached.  Survival was never an option.  The fetus was too undeveloped.

But that also makes Trump correct.

Not really.

If it is removed from the uterus and has no chance of survival, the choice is to provide life support and keep it alive for an indefinite time, adding much more to the cost in terms of care, time, money, and stress, or to let it die a natural death. In no case is this considered "execution" as Trump characterized it. 

The Facts on the Born-Alive Debate

"Kamala is facing a sympathetic network and moderator. She probably has been fed the questions which will very likely be tilted to favor her and against Trump. Another rigged debate, in other words."

Just as I predicted yesterday. Those moderators out did Cathy Crowley at being totally biased and in the tank for Harris, but I don't think in the long term that it will make any difference It's unlikely that a majority of freedom loving patriotic Americans, in their collective wisdom, will vote for an avowed hard left progressive POS.

For her to fulfil all her wild promises she would need a democratic House and Senate, which is not likely to happen.

Greg, I am praying that you are right.

And congrats to last night's winner.

Excellent

[deleted]

Duck is tastier.

Harris, an ex criminal prosecutor, was very well prepared.  Trump, a lifelong con man and huckster, wasnt. 

That explains 95% of what happened last night.  I dont know whether he actually believed his own bullshit and the overall bullshit from the right that Kamala Harris is nothing but a stupid giggler, but that misconception helped destroy him last night. 

This was the top of the Drudge Report DURING the last third of the debate

Drudge has been left wing media for about a decade at this point. Of course it was hostile to trump, dailykos was too, I imagine. 

Harris, an ex criminal prosecutor, was very well prepared.  Trump, a lifelong con man and huckster, wasnt. 

trump was as prepared for the debate as he is to be POTUS again... ... with the same pathetic results.

Trump remains his own worst enemy. Hopefully it won't move the needle.

These debates don't general move the needle much. I'd assume Swift's endorsement of Harris will effect polling slightly more. Most people are entrenched in their choices by this point.

I think you are right on that. I kind of think Hillary won the 2016 debate and look what happened.

Per cnn polling, Clinton won the first debate between them by a larger margin than Harris  did last night. So did Biden in 2020.  

They have about a 72 hour window of relevance and then something else takes over the news-cycle. Nobody Joe Bidened themselves.

Thank you for the verification. I'm hoping it remains true. A Harris win is unacceptable.

Trump remains his own worst enemy. Hopefully it won't move the needle.

Remember that statement on election day

Harris, an ex criminal prosecutor, was very well prepared.  Trump, a lifelong con man and huckster, wasnt. 

True that, but she isn't prepared to the president of the United States, a job she is totally unqualified nor fit for. Trump on the other hand, has four years of experience that largely successful and will very likely do so again.

As expected. It was all character assassination at its worst. No policy discussions whatsoever except for pie in the sky gimmee's. No details on her proposed "policies" nor where the money would come from for the handouts. $25K for a home and $50K tax credit for small business startups? Well as AOC says, "you just pay for it".

Trump gave no policy specifics either. Its not what is done during debates. They always talk more or less in generalities. 

Trump embarrassed our country last night, as we know that people around the world were paying attention to this.

  He looked old, bitter, at times at a loss for a rational answer, and  for the most part looked like someone who was a cartoon presidential candidate from Mad magazine or something like that. 

The MAGAs , of which there are tens of millions , will pretend all is good with him and there was "nothing to see" last night. The rest of us hope that this disaster will wake "undecided voters" the hell up. 

Why didn't the ABC mods fact check Harris?

Because Harris was not telling us lousy debunked lies about people eating cats and doctors killing babies after birth!

She told the lie about Trump favoring the 2025 Project twice and went unscathed by the ABC mods.

You should pay closer attention.  Just a few debunked lies Harris spit out there:

Blaming Trump for Biden’s Botched Afghanistan Withdrawal

Harris   attempted   to pin the Biden-Harris administration’s botched Afghanistan withdrawal, which got 13 U.S.service members killed, on Trump.

“Donald Trump, when he was president, negotiated one of the weakest deals you can imagine,” Harris claimed.

That isn’t true. According to a   report   recently released by Republicans on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, “The evidence proves President Biden’s decision to withdraw all U.S. troops was not based on the security situation, the Doha Agreement, or the advice of his senior national security advisors or our allies. Rather, it was premised on his longstanding and unyielding opinion that the United States should no longer be in Afghanistan.”

Minnesota Rioters Bail Fund

Harris seemingly   denied   that she undertook efforts to   bail out   left-wing rioters following the 2020 death of George Floyd. “She went out in Minnesota and wanted to let criminals that killed people, that burned down Minneapolis — she went out and raised money to get them out of jail,” Trump said, as Harris shook her head.

"Middle-Class Kid' Harris   claimed   that she grew up a “middle-class kid.” That is not true. As previously  noted  by journalist Megyn Kelly, Harris’ father was a professor at Stanford University, while her mother was a biomedical scientist at UC Berkley.

Harris   claimed   that she grew up a “middle-class kid.” That is not true. As previously  noted  by journalist Megyn Kelly, Harris’ father was a professor at Stanford University, while her mother was a biomedical scientist at UC Berkley.

But wait!!! There's more!!!!!

thefederalist

Why didn't the ABC mods fact check Harris?

gee, I guess the fact checkers quickly fell behind after trump started speaking ...

It is the facts that will win out and get Trump elected.

That was no lie - the former 'president' convicted felon and rapist and traitor is well aware of Project 2025 - 'I know nothing about it - but there are good things and bad things about it'

As it turns out, they should have very obviously have done so.............

D uring Tuesday’s presidential debate between   Vice President Kamala Harris and former President Donald Trump , Harris inaccurately made it sound as though there are no U.S. soldiers deployed in overseas conflict zones.

"And as of today, there is not one member of the United States military who is in active duty in a combat zone, in any war zone around the world, the first time this century," Harris said.

The U.S. maintains just under 1,000 troops on bases in Syria and a further 2,500 in Iraq, according to the U.S. Department of Defense. In Syria, U.S. troops are stationed to help prevent a resurgence of the Islamic State group. They play a similar role in Iraq, where they also help disrupt Iran's influence and supply lines to various militias.

Major civil war hostilities in both Syria and Iraq have gradually eased but both places are mired in low-level conflict.

One example of how U.S. troops are in harm's way overseas: On the last day of August, a   U.S. military-led raid   in western Iraq killed at least 15 Islamic State group "operatives" who fought back with numerous weapons including grenades and explosive "suicide" belts. Seven U.S. soldiers were injured during the operation.

msn

As VPotUS, would one not think she should know that?

gee, I guess the fact checkers quickly fell behind after trump started speaking ...

More likely that they were just in the tank for Kamala all along.

not one member of the United States military who is in active duty in a combat zone, in any war zone around the world, the first time this century," Harris said.

Embarrassing. 

Outright lie, but where are all the libs who have cried over Trump's lies for years?

Outright lie, but where are all the libs who have cried over Trump's lies for years?

She can just tell the most incredible lies and they just don't care. It's just ... But Trump...

The Projection Party

todays' gop/gqp

Are you saying Harris did NOT lie?

Is that what you are claiming?

It isn't very reassuring for the American people.

Can you show us where he said he would use it?

What?????????????????

Project 2025/. Please read the comment he replied to.................

Don't Forget 3.3.5

No details on her proposed "policies" nor where the money would come from for the handouts.

She doesn't have any details.  Although it is hard to have details when you don't have a plan.  She is just spitting out what Democrats think the people want to hear instead of anything that can be done to fix the problems.

Trump's statement prompted one moderator, Davis, to clarify that “there is no state in this country where it is legal to kill a baby after it’s born.” Of course, Trump NEVER SAID that any state had such a law.

What a stupid assertion.  No amount of Trumpsplaining is going to make his comments on executing babies after they are born anything other that fear mongering egregious lies.

Trump never said there was.

Davis was way out of line.

Agree with the summary. Trump was inconsistent in his answers and missed some easy points.  The moderators were so over the top it may actually help him.  Losing a rigged game won’t be considered much of a loss by many, 

Harris better than Biden so she she checked that box.   the mods treated like a special needs kid, letting her lie and avoid answering the easy questions while going after trump for her, 

Trump has a talking point about "after birth abortions". He has been saying, for months if not years, that the Democrats want to be able to abort a baby after its born.  His evidence for this is ALWAYS a statement from the ex governor of Virginia having to do with the survival of unviable births.  Even if the governor of Virginia meant what Trump says he meant, which is entirely disputable ,  the governor of Virginia is not all Democrats , most Democrats, or anything but one Democrat. But Trump keeps hammering away at this because he hears it in right wing media, which frankly is where almost all of his thoughts on anything originate. 

The moderators fact checked him three times, about the "dog eating", about abortion, and I think the third was on his election denial claims.  All three of them were totally legitimate fact checks . The moderators did not make him look like a lunatic, he, and his reliance on right wing media for his talking points, did. 

le ,  the governor of Virginia is not all Democrats , most Democrats, or anything but one Democrat

Lol.  That's Democrats favorite game. But yes, when Democrats oppose laws that mandate medical assistance be offered to babies that survive abortions, they favor post birth abortions.

  All three of them were totally legitimate fact checks . 

No, they aren't.  Moderators are moderators.  They ask questions and enforce the rules.  It's the debaters jobs to expose the flaws in their opponents arguments. Harris lied too.  The moderators ignored those. They acted as participants, not moderators. 

Even if the governor of Virginia meant what Trump says he meant, which is entirely disputable ,  the governor of Virginia is not all Democrats , most Democrats, or anything but one Democrat. But Trump keeps hammering away at this because he hears it in right wing media, which frankly is where almost all of his thoughts on anything originate.

He keeps hammering away because most democrats refuse to say what restrictions they believe in.

Trumps lies were not confined to those three incidents , not by a longshot. Those may have been the three most obvious ones. 

Dp you think Trump should be allowed to say that he won the 2020 election without the questioner (which after all is the person he is responding to) pushing back? 

Dp you think Trump should be allowed to say that he won the 2020 election without the questioner (which after all is the person he is responding to) pushing back

yes, that’s Harris’s job to show how bizarre it is. Muir ignored Harris's lies. 

The restrictions in Roe v Wade

Those restrictions are what?

Don't you know?

Since at least 2019

ABC live fact checking:

Fact-checks on Trump

1. Abortion

Trump was asked about his stance on abortion, as ABC’s Davis pointed out that the former president has boasted about  killing Roe v. Wade  and has called himself "the most pro-life President in American history" but has since declared he would be great for women’s reproductive rights. Trump also recently said Florida's six-week abortion ban "is too short," but said he would vote against a ballot initiative that would overturn the six-week ban on abortions in the state. 

"The reason why I’m doing that vote is because… they have abortion in the ninth month. They even have, and you can look at the governor of West Virginia [Viriginia], the previous governor… not the current governor, whose doing an excellent job, but the governor before, he said, ‘The baby will be born, and we will decide what to do with the baby,’ in other words we’ll execute the baby. And that’s why I did that," Trump said.

Davis raised eyebrows with the first fact-check of the evening.

2. Pets

Trump said illegal immigrants are eating people’s pets

"In Springfield, they're eating the dogs. The people that came in. They're eating the cats. They're eating -- they're eating the pets of the people that live there. And this is what's happening in our country. And it's a shame," Trump said. 

Muir shot back, "I just want to clarify here, you bring up Springfield, Ohio. And ABC News did reach out to the city manager there. He told us there have been no credible reports of specific claims of pets being harmed, injured or abused by individuals within the immigrant community."

Trump said he’s seen it on television, but the ABC anchor wasn’t amused. 

"The people on television say my dog was taken and used for food. So maybe he said that and maybe that's a good thing to say for a city manager," Trump responded. 

"I’m not taking this from television. I'm taking it from the city manager," Muir said. 

"But the people on television say their dog was eaten by the people that went there," Trump said. 

"Again, the Springfield city manager says there's no evidence of that," Muir responded. 

3. Crime

At one point, Trump said, "Crime in this country is through the roof," but Muir quickly objected. 

"President Trump, as you know, the FBI says overall violent crime is coming down in this country," the ABC anchor responded.  

"The FBI -- they were defrauding statements. They didn't include the worst cities. They didn't include the cities with the worst crime. It was a fraud. Just like their number of 818,000 jobs that they said they created turned out to be a fraud," Trump responded. 

4. Sarcasm 

Trump said he was being sarcastic when he recently said he lost the 2020 election to President Biden. 

"I said that sarcastically. You know that. It was said, ‘Oh we lost by a whisker.’ That was said sarcastically. Look, there's so much proof. All you have to do is look at it. And they should have sent it back to the legislatures for approval. I got almost 75 million votes. The most votes any sitting president has ever gotten. I was told if I got 63, which was what I got in 2016, you can't be beaten."

Muir shot back, "I did watch all of these pieces of video. I didn't detect the sarcasm."

Muir then told viewers that judges have said there was "no widespread fraud" and immediately asked Harris is she felt Trump was trying to intimidate voters with claims he would prosecute anyone who helped cheat an election. 

5. Pelosi

There were other moments that weren’t full-blown fact-checks, but were seen as hostile moments against Trump, such as when Muir snarked that a question was not about former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi when Trump evoked Pelosi during an answer.

"I showed up for a speech. I said, I think it's going to be big. I went to Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington, D.C. And the mayor put it back in writing, as you know. I said, ‘You know, this is going to be a very big rally or whatever you want to call it.’ And again, it wasn't done by me. It was done by others. I said I'd like to give you 10,000 National Guard or soldiers. They rejected me. Nancy Pelosi rejected me," Trump said. 

"It would have never happened if Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington did their jobs. I wasn't responsible for security," he continued. "Nancy Pelosi was responsible. She didn't do her job."

Muir responded, "The question was about you as president, not about Former Speaker Pelosi."

Fact-checks on Harris

There weren’t any. 

Many have pointed out that Muir and Davis failed to correct Harris for saying that Trump once said there were "very fine people" on both sides of the Charlottesville "Unite the Right" rally in 2017.’’

Critics of Trump have claimed for years that he called neo-Nazis "very fine people" when he was actually talking about people protesting over a Robert E. Lee statue, with President Biden and his allies in the mainstream media regularly pushing the notion.  

But earlier this year, left-leaning fact-checking website Snopes acknowledged that Trump never called neo-Nazis "very fine people" during his press conference following the Charlottesville "Unite the Right" rally in 2017.

"In a news conference after the rally protesting the planned removal of a Confederate statue, Trump did say there were 'very fine people on both sides,' referring to the protesters and the counterprotesters. He said in the same statement he wasn't talking about neo-Nazis and white nationalists, who he said should be 'condemned totally,'" Snopes  wrote .
Trump helped out ABC moderators by informing viewers that the claim by Harris has been "debunked." 

Harris said we need to stop disparaging people and called Trump a "disgrace" minutes later, but ABC moderators failed to point that out. Harris also tied Trump to Project 2025, but moderators failed to point out that Trump has completely distanced himself from the polarizing plan. 

Harris also mischaracterized Trump’s "bloodbath" comment and Trump’s stance on IVF without being checked, and ABC moderators failed to question Harris on  gun bans and mandatory buybacks  and that no active military were in a combat zone. 

ABC Presidential Debate: Moderators David Muir and Linsey Davis fact-check Trump 5 times, 0 for Harris | Fox News

Umpires shouldn’t play for a team.

Not fact-checking Harris for her lies about Charlottesville and "fine people" is unforgivable.

[deleted]

[✘] The very first thing Trump said about the violence there was that it was coming from "all sides". It was , specifically, a white supremacist rally. It was intended to be a white supremacist rally. As President of the United States Trump should have known that (its not like it was a secret, the event had been national news for days prior). There were no "good people on both sides" in attendance. It was a white supremacist rally.

And you know the truth as well:

"In a news conference after the rally protesting the planned removal of a Confederate statue, Trump did say there were "very fine people on both sides," referring to the protesters and the counter protesters. He said in the same statement he wasn't talking about neo-Nazis and white nationalists, who he said should be "condemned totally."

No, Trump Did Not Call Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists 'Very Fine People' | Snopes.com

There were no "very fine people" on the white supremacist side. There was a pretense that there would be a protest at the Lee statue. Nobody but white supremacists showed up.  Would non-racists show up at a racist rally ? 

Not fact checker her on the multiple videos where she says she will confiscate peoples guns was also telling. And the reason why people think fact checkers are a joke. they rate this as mostly false. Why you ask?

Because Kamala said she would demand a mandatory, (you know what mandatory means right?) buyback program, so they rate this mostly false because while she is confiscating your weapons she will give you a gift card. that is laughable at best and down right dishonest at worst.

The moderators of this debate should get the Angel Hernadez award for journalism. 

It was debunked by a leftwing fact checker and that is what Trump should have used as the reference point instead of using 3 Fox news hosts.

That is what happens when one refuses to prepare.

What concerns me most is that Harris has never said she has changed her positions. It is always a Harris campaign spokesperson who says it.

Should she win, she could implement all that radical shit and simply say "I never said that I changed my position."

That is why it was so important for the ABC mods to drill down on that. They never did.

There were no "very fine people" on the white supremacist side

And he never said there was. Why do you refer to it as a racist rally?

Because thats what it was.

The  Unite the Right rally  was a  white supremacist  rally that took place in  Charlottesville, Virginia , from August 11 to 12, 2017.  Marchers included members of the  alt-right ,   neo-Confederates ,   neo-fascists ,   white nationalists ,   neo-Nazis ,   Klansmen ,  and  far-right   militias .  Some groups chanted  racist  and  antisemitic  slogans and carried weapons,  Nazi and neo-Nazi symbols , the  Valknut ,  Confederate battle flags ,  Deus vult  crosses, flags, and other symbols of various past and present  antisemitic  and  anti-Islamic  groups.  The organizers' stated goals included the unification of the American  white nationalist movement  and opposing the proposed removal of the  statue of General Robert E. Lee  from Charlottesville's former  Lee Park .

Those were not the only ones there.

Who else was there, John?

Plus an equal number of counter-protestors. You conveniently forget to mention them.

The counter-protestors had no permit.

President Trump  addressed the violence  in televised remarks from New Jersey, condemning an “egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides” and calling for the “swift restoration of law and order.”

Charlottesville: 'Unite the Right' Rally, State of Emergency (time.com)

What part of  neo-Nazis and white nationalists, should be "condemned totally" are you struggling with?

Plus an equal number of counter-protestors. You conveniently forget to mention them.

Well, gee, that wouldn't fit the narrative, and God knows that Trump-bashing is like a religion.

The evidence shows there were no quiet protesters against removing the statue that weekend. That’s just a figment of the president’s imagination. The militia groups were not spurred on by the Confederate statue controversy. They arrived in Charlottesville heavily armed and, by their own account, were prepared to use deadly force — because of a desire to insert themselves in a dangerous situation that, in effect, pitted them against the foes of white supremacists.

What part of  neo-Nazis and white nationalists, should be "condemned totally" are you struggling with?

Every part that goes against the narrative being passed around for years now.

I find it very interesting how Trump is still more important to some folks than the Chosen One is.

Trump made four statements about the events over the course of three days, each of them an attempt to clean up the last one. 

On Sunday morning , the day after the violence, there was considerable bi-partisan condemnation of Trump's reluctance to condemn the white supremacists. 

Everyone is well aware of what Trump ACTUALLY said.

Just some of us choose to read the entire statement and go by it instead of cherry-picking the parts we want.

[deleted][✘]

The cherry picking occurs by those who only acknowledge the isolated / infrequent use of words like 'peaceful' and ignore the vast 9x% incendiary language used by Trump.   

The cherry picking occurs by those who only acknowledge the isolated / infrequent use of words like 'peaceful' and ignore the vast 9x% incendiary language used by Trump.   

And also by the Trump-haters who simply refuse to look at all his statements to score some mythical points.

Nonsense.   Viewing ALL of Trump's statements with a rational, objective mind would reveal that Trump's modus operandi is to promote negativity, distrust, etc. to incite his supporters to act in a way that is favorable to him.

One would have to be in severe confirmation bias to not recognize this.

Nonsense.   

As expected.

I just wish people would stop pretending to be objective about Trump.

Explain the girl who was killed?

‘What part of  neo-Nazis and white nationalists, should be "condemned totally" are you struggling with?’

The same part where he said ‘peacefully and patriotically’ in yet another lefty triggering speech.

[✘]

5. Pelosi

There were other moments that weren’t full-blown fact-checks, but were seen as hostile moments against Trump, such as when Muir snarked that a question was not about former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi when Trump evoked Pelosi during an answer.

"I showed up for a speech. I said, I think it's going to be big. I went to Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington, D.C. And the mayor put it back in writing, as you know. I said, ‘You know, this is going to be a very big rally or whatever you want to call it.’ And again, it wasn't done by me. It was done by others. I said I'd like to give you 10,000 National Guard or soldiers. They rejected me. Nancy Pelosi rejected me," Trump said. 

"It would have never happened if Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington did their jobs. I wasn't responsible for security," he continued. "Nancy Pelosi was responsible. She didn't do her job."

Muir responded, "The question was about you as president, not about Former Speaker Pelosi."

This is unbelievable.  Trump was asked about his behavior in the Oval Office WHILE the riot was taking place, (where he did absolutely nothing to stop it)  and his reply to that specific question was that Nancy Pelosi refused 10,000 National Guard. 

Now you are complaining that the moderator didnt buy it.  What the hell is wrong with our "conservatives" ? 

Was Muir supposed to let Trump gaslight America about this for the umpteenth time ? 

The fact is that it was all preventable.

Yes it was preventable. Trump should never have invited a mob to Washington and promise them "it will be wild". 

Show me where those groups were invited by Trump.

He did nothing to incite them, the riot was spontaneously started by a few hotheads.

The traitor incited them for months after he lost and at the 'rally' that day - fight like hell or we won't have a country anymore

I believe those were his parting words for them to keep up the good fight and not let the dems have their way with everyday life since he wouldn't be there to lead.

Obviously many of the white supremacists were invited by trump the traitor.  Some of the scum were wearing shirts with 1/6 printed on them the day of the former 'president' convicted felon rapist and traitor's further incitement of the scum at his 'rally' of non-stop lies

[✘]

Obviously many of the white supremacists were invited by trump the traitor.

Just as obviously, you failed to provide any proof for your accusations.

Some of the scum were wearing shirts with 1/6 printed on them the day of the former 'president' convicted felon rapist and traitor's further incitement of the scum at his 'rally' of non-stop lies

Where did you get that nonsense?  Even the J6 shitshow couldn't prove that.

There were a lot of impotent incels there.  Many support the former 'president' impotent traitor.

There were a lot of impotent incels there.  Many support the former 'president' impotent traitor.

So you keep claiming.

Any proof for your theory?

Where did you get that nonsense?  Even the J6 shitshow couldn't prove that.

It isn't what they can prove. We've seen the 'proof'.

It's what they can invent and get sheeple to believe.

It's what they can invent and get sheeple to believe.

They are pretty knowledgeable in the information that they made up.

They are pretty knowledgeable in the information that they made up.

Precisely.

Some are good at debating the things they make up and claim you think or said.

think the latter happens because they will follow the conversation in their head instead of what was actually said.  I see it a lot with one particular person.  

I guess you missed where Pelosi FINALLY admitted that SHE failed on that day.  

cha.house

cha.house

newsweek

nypost

cnn

Funny that she NEVER took responsibility during their "investigation".  Now the J6 committee is exposed for exactly what it was - a shitshow.

But I get it.  You all have a narrative to uphold regardless of how false it is.

Trumps line: "I took a bullet to the head because of the lefts rhetoric" was definitely a winner. I don't think we will see the main stream media play that one again.

That was a good one!

4. Sarcasm 

Trump said he was being sarcastic when he recently said he lost the 2020 election to President Biden. 

"I said that sarcastically. You know that. It was said, ‘Oh we lost by a whisker.’ That was said sarcastically. Look, there's so much proof. All you have to do is look at it. And they should have sent it back to the legislatures for approval. I got almost 75 million votes. The most votes any sitting president has ever gotten. I was told if I got 63, which was what I got in 2016, you can't be beaten."

Muir shot back, "I did watch all of these pieces of video. I didn't detect the sarcasm."

Muir then told viewers that judges have said there was "no widespread fraud" and immediately asked Harris is she felt Trump was trying to intimidate voters with claims he would prosecute anyone who helped cheat an election. 

If it helped him in any way, he will say anything about the election. He was putting his toe in the water when he said he had lost, to see if it might push his numbers a little bit. He wasnt being sarcastic, he was trying to be opportunistic.  Whether you like it or not his election denial, for almost FOUR YEARS is an issue in this new election. 

They should have asked him if he's going to accept the results of THIS election if he loses (spoiler - he won't) , but they didnt, so I guess they were doing him a favor. 

That was a question that never should have been asked.

Trump is entitled to have an opinion on the 2020 election.

And rational people are entitled to mock him for it every day.  The election was almost 4 years ago. Are we still going to be hearing this shit 14 years from now?  If Trump is alive then we will be. 

The democrats shouldn't have been able to change state voting laws.

Screw with the election and that is what happens.

Are we still going to be hearing this shit 14 years from now?  If Trump is alive then we will be

I am positive some will try and keep Trump front and center for decades if possible (always good to deflect to Trump!), and folks will still be seeding articles talking about how bad he is long after the election.

Question of the day:

Although Kamala Harris exceeded expectations, was she really able to land a major blow to Trump's chances?

Donald Trump -  "I could make myself look like a total fool in the middle of a national debate stage and not lose a single vote" /s

Donald Trump

Donald Trump- "I can shoot myself in the foot twice a day and still win." /s

[✘]

Does anybody know if Kamala feels there should be any restrictions on abortion? any at all? she managed to avoid answering and strangely the moderators were silent in requiring a response from her.

Last night she did say that she stands by the restrictions from the Roe ruling. That was an easily anticipated question and the way she answered seemed to be like she was waiting for it.

Then again, how did Kamala vote on partial birth abortions?

Roe, which hasn’t been relevant since 1991, offers no meaningful restriction on abortion before birth. 

Good point. I guess the ABC mods didn't know that.

Trump still doesn't know how to say Roe was overturned because it was wrongly decided.

Why haven't you let him know?

A good point on debate moderators:

Again, what bothers me isn’t that the “moderators” did this to Trump. It’s that they do it to every single person who challenges a Democrat. They did it to Romney. And they’ll do it to the next Republican you like. They’re not anti-Trump. They’re pro-Democrat. Always.

x

Donald Trump , Bloomberg, Biden, and Kamala this morning at the 9/11 ceremony in New York

Well, they certainly know how to pack a clown car.  On several occasions Harris became Trump and Trump became Harris.  None of the nonsense drifted very far from the stale talking points we've heard many, many times over the last eight years.

Trump was the rambling old guy.  Harris was the empty suit.  And Muir tried to live up to the standards of Chris Wallace.  Lindsey Davis was just a pretty face at the table and really didn't contribute anything to the circus.

I tuned out when Haitians began eating pets.  Muir really cited a city administrator as the ultimate authority?  Really?  That one exchange only highlighted that the debate was certainly not a serious affair intended to inform the electorate.  In the words of Ed Sullivan, it was a really big shew.  

And the election goes on as if nothing happened.

Muir really cited a city administrator as the ultimate authority?

Like the guy is going to diss his own community FFS. That would be like the mayor of San Fransisco coming out and admitting "Yes my city is a shithole".