Don’t need a select committee, don’t need to add staffers or increase the budget … oh, yeah, Republicans are all over this one.
But there are a few people in the Senate who are still trying to bring attention to the little fact that a foreign power interred in our election with the express intent of making Donald Trump president.
Now that the intelligence committees are supposedly on the case—and with the FBI not discussing whatever inquiries it may be holding on this front—the controversy (or scandal!) has been nudged to the back burner. This often happens in Washington: a secret investigation is launched, the story goes dark.
Helping cast those shadows is a press that seems to have instant amnesia about anything Russia related, to the extent that Russian forces attacking towns in Ukraine just one day after Trump and Putin had their contents unknown chat, wasn’t enough to push aside Trump’s latest tweets on television ratings. The connections between Putin and Trump, Manafort, Flynn, Page, and others in the regime seldom merits a mention.
Enter Wyden. For the public, at this point, there is no way to tell if the intelligence committee is doing a good job investigating these dicey issues. Republicans on the committee certainly have an interest in not embarrassing, inconveniencing, or delegitimizing Trump. So it's up to Wyden and the other Democrats on the committee to monitor the probe and inform the citizenry if it ends up being a whitewash.
Sooner or later, IMO, President Trump will cross a line precipitating LEAK(S) that will generate articles of impeachment and raise questions like … "What did the FBI (et al) know and when did it (they) know it?"
Given the recent information regarding General Flynn's dealings with Russia, his lying about those dealings to Vice President Pence … AND THE FAILURE TO DATE FOR TRUMP TO FIRE FLYNN …
I will speculate on why Flynn will either not be fired, or, for the delay to continue:
IMO … if Flynn is fired, he will cover his ass by claiming the "Trump not only knew all along regarding the interactions with Russia … but Trump essentially directed him to do so BEFORE THE ELECTION."
This, IMO, was all part of a collusion between the Trump campaign and Putin in a quid-pro-quo pact in violation of the Logan Act.
My two cents.
Counter-arguments or concurrences appreciated.
This is neither a counter-argument or a concurrence, but Flynn was not fired by Trump nor was he NOT fired by Trump. Flynn resigned.
"Flynn resigned."
This is true. For further irony you can find a post by jwcblue insinuating Trump fired Flynn. I am not sure if the left would be happy if he was fired or not. It doesn't look like they know either.
From what I read today, Flynn was asked by Trump to resign. So, it sounds as if he resigned at Trump's request. I think all that matters is that he is gone.
" A new report by CNN indicates that important parts of the infamous spy dossier that professed to shed light on President Trump’s shady Moscow ties have been corroborated by communications intercepts. In other words, SIGINT strikes again, providing key evidence that backs up some of the claims made in that 35-page report compiled by Christopher Steele, a former British intelligence official with extensive Russia experience.
As I’ve previously explained , that salacious dossier is raw intelligence, an explosive amalgam of fact and fantasy, including some disinformation planted by the Kremlin to obscure this already murky case. Now SIGINT confirms that some of the non-salacious parts of what Steele reported, in particular how senior Russian officials conspired to assist Trump in last year’s election, are substantially based in fact. This is bad news for the White House, which has already lashed out in angry panic, with Press Secretary Sean Spicer stating, “We continue to be disgusted by CNN’s fake news reporting.”
That is hardly a denial, of course, and I can confirm from my friends still serving in the IC that the SIGINT, which corroborates some of the Steele dossier, is damning for the administration. Our spies have had enough of these shady Russian connections—and they are starting to push back."
The shit-storm cometh …
Time to subpoena Trump's Tax Returns and release the FBI classified report on the Russian involvement in the 2016 POTUS election.
More from Washington Post (United States) :
Justice Department warned White House that Flynn could be vulnerable to Russian blackmail, officials say ,
"In the waning days of the Obama administration, James R. Clapper Jr., who was the director of national intelligence, and John Brennan, the CIA director at the time, shared Yates’s concerns and concurred with her recommendation to inform the Trump White House. They feared that “Flynn had put himself in a compromising position” and thought that Pence had a right to know that he had been misled, according to one of the officials, who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss intelligence matters."
Bring it on. Pence would be better as president anyhow. You both do understand that is what you will end up with if Trump goes right?
Bring it on. Pence would be better as president anyhow. You both do understand that is what you will end up with if Trump goes right?
Don't be naive … Pence was either a dupe, or, he knew; either way, he'll be vulnerable.
LOL OK who do you suppose we will end up with? Don't tell me....in another fit of rage and unbelievable shortsightedness liberals will demand the results of the election are overturned....am I getting warm?
LOL OK who do you suppose we will end up with? Don't tell me....in another fit of rage and unbelievable shortsightedness liberals will demand the results of the election are overturned....am I getting warm?
Dismissive comments might make you feel better, but, all they do is reveal your trepidations.
It is a question. (albeit with the expected answer given the past short sighted actions of the left, I think it is realistic) Who do you think will be President? Sounds like you are already implicating the entire Republican party.
It is a question. (albeit with the expected answer given the past short sighted actions of the left) Who do you think will be President?
I have no idea … depending on where this goes, it could be Paul Ryan, who, as Speaker, would be next in line; but Ryan too has questions to answer.
What if the POTUS election is de-certified based on collusion between Trump and Putin?
One step at a time, my friend.
"What if the POTUS election is de-certified based on collusion between Trump and Putin?"
There's the moon bat crazy shit I was looking for! The election results must be overturned because the one I voted for lost! No matter how and what the consequences! I would hope for the good of the entire country that liberals wouldn't think this way, and would certainly foresee the future implications of these actions, but I know better.
Or perhaps they DO understand the implications and just don't care. You know, like with the newfound powers they gave BO. (and now Trump) It seems more and more what I want now is much more important than what damage my actions now will cause in the future. I have a real hard time believing this is ongoing ignorance.
So you are OK with Russia's influence in our elections? I ask this because just as you accuse Democrats of being more concerned about losing the election than the welfare of the country, it certainly seems that Republicans are more concerned with winning the election than the welfare of the country. It's sorta like callin' out the splinter in your neighbors eye, while having a railroad tie sticking out of one's own.
In what universe are Republicans in cahoots with pinko-commies?!
There's the moon bat crazy shit I was looking for! The election results must be overturned because the one I voted for lost! No matter how and what the consequences! I would hope for the good of the entire country that liberals wouldn't think this way, and would certainly foresee the future implications of these actions, but I know better.
Don't play "gotcha" with me … if it turns out that this election outcome was tainted by collusion with a foreign power, what will be "bat shit crazy" is if comments like yours are not seen for what they are …
If you are sincere about the "good of the country," the law must prevail.
Generally …
A recall election (also called a recall referendum or representative recall) is a procedure by which voters can remove an elected official from office through a direct vote before their term has ended.
Specifically …
A POTUS can only be "recalled" by IMPEACHMENT AND DISMISSAL …
But I hasten to add that a POTUS ELECTION compromised by collusion and espionage is a different animal. If the RNC is ultimately implicated along with the Trump Administration, I don't know if a Republican Speaker, who ordinarily would be next in line after a sitting V.P. … would be viewed legally as "disqualified".
My answer to you is I DON'T KNOW WHERE THIS COULD GO … AND YOU DON'T EITHER.
Feel free to ask me what I think or what I know, but don't play partisan gotcha with me.
This is about America … not either party … can we agree on that?
There's the moon bat crazy shit I was looking for! The election results must be overturned because the one I voted for lost! No matter how and what the consequences! I would hope for the good of the entire country that liberals wouldn't think this way
Only extreme leftists want the election results overturned in some radical manner. And I don't like Pence's world view at all but he would be way better as president. Face it we have a 70 year old toddler with a loaded gun (nukes) who seems to be totally buffaloed by the position he in which he finds himself. Everyday the stability of the world is on edge.
Now tell me about that "moon bat crazy shit" again.
Who do you think will be President? Sounds like you are already implicating the entire Republican party.
No, not the Entire Republican party but there are signs that gangrene has started to set in to the Executive branch and we really could use a good scraping.
I'd say that if we could just cut away the top 3 layers of the dead rotting, flesh currently in charge, we might get down to a healthier level of leadership that America might be able to recover from. ( smirk )
Without digging, my "off the cuff" impression of Hatch is that he's not into hating minorities and women as much as Pence or wanting to gut the safety net and harm the poor as much a Ryan.
Yea, Hatch might help America the most but everyone of the other top 7 wouldn't be much better than Trump, just wrong in different ways than he is proving to be.
At least you seem to have the sense to go down the line instead of trying to overturn the election. Kudos!
At least you seem to have the sense to go down the line instead of trying to overturn the election. Kudos!
A shot from the hip at me.
This is unprecedented … the normal succession protocol may not be applicable. WE DON'T KNOW.
Donald Trump was aware of every move Flynn was making. Wasn't it Trump that claimed he knows more than the Generals?
If Trump hadn't told a press conference last fall that it would be great if Russia hacked Hillary's emails and found some dirt on her , he wouldn't be in the trouble he is in today. He made his bed and now he will lie in it, emphasis on "lie".
Flynn "resigned" … not exactly …
I placed that in quotation marks because, as I posted earlier, all such staff, under all such elected officials for whom they work, sign a "Letter of Resignation" when hired, which, is kept on file as a "boss's ass-covering" vehicle if/when scandal hits and the boss needs a patsy to take the hit.
Flynn's resignation is just the beginning … at some point, the FBI report will be leaked or released, and, I speculate, Flynn himself will tell all rather than take the big hit and face Logan Act fallout (which has only been used once and went nowhere -- but that was then, this is now).
Trump will throw Flynn to the wolves, and Flynn, being the hothead he's known to be, will plea bargain (likely behind closed doors).
And again, I speculate that Flynn and other Trump whipping boys will plead the Nuremberg standard …
"I was just following orders."
I believe the Trump Administration will collapse from within as those who fear being made Trump scapegoats, tell all before they take the blame for what is likely to be made known.
Take it from a Philly boy who designed political campaigns and defeated popular incumbents 4 different times … (much of what you've heard about my fair city is true … what goes around comes around).
Well perhaps you are correct and the Trump crew are not up to speed on cleanup, intimidation and disappearing witnesses. No way in hell this would have brought the Clinton house down.
Donald Trump Says “Illegal Leaks” More Important Than Michael Flynn
______________________________________________
President Trump Tweets on Flynn Resignation: The ‘Real Story’ is Media Leaks
REMEMBER WHEN our righties were justifying Wikileaks and Russian hacking because they declared shit like …
"What's the difference where the truth comes from … as long as it's the truth?"
__________________________________________________
IIIIIIIIIIII'MMMMMMM Back!
LOL, I'm sure that the leaks are much more important than Flynn.
He can't cover up the fuck up's with all those damn leaks.
LOL, I'm sure that the leaks are much more important than Flynn.
He can't cover up the fuck up's with all those damn leaks.
But wait … there's more to come … after which, official information will have to follow lest the agencies withholding them come under scrutiny!
But there are a few people in the Senate who are still trying to bring attention to the little fact that a foreign power interred in our election with the express intent of making Donald Trump president.
Still asking for the proof, and without it I consider it a huge lie....
Been asking for weeks have yet to see any....
No matter the people that want to tear this nation apart cause they do not like who was elected will accomplish exactly that lying their asses off as they go.
Tell a lie often enough you will eventually convince yourself of it's truths....
And Hillary made the claim/accusation to coverup and deflect from her (and the democrats) major scandal in the election, and the mindless sheep are running with it....
No proof, just an accusation and a lot of speculation for what going on 6-7 weeks now?
And we are called the stupid ones.....
Yes sir, the Russians did it, Hillary said so. So it has to be true.....
I agree.
That is what it will wind up in the end, the Russians did do it, not that they actually had any hand in it, one side claims they did. Hows that for a nuclear option.......
The day after Flynn's phone call, if you remember, Trump praised Putin via a tweet for (Putin) saying "there'd be no retaliation for the Obama sanctions against Russia (for having interfered with the POTUS election) …
Trump was not the President at the time! And the Flynn conversation with the Russian envoy came virtually simultaneously as Obama announced the sanctions!
SO HOW THE FUCK DID TRUMP KNOW THAT PUTIN WOULD NOT RETALIATE UNLESS FLYNN TOLD HIM?
Come on, my friend …
You're one of the brightest people I know … I could make this case easily.
And why did it weeks after the Justice Department notified the White House that "Flynn was vulnerable to being blackmailed by the Russians," before the White House discussed it?
ANSWER: Because the press found out and the country now knows.
Flynn's Trump's patsy, and, Republicans in Congress should get ahead of the possibility that Flynn will tell all rather than take the fall for Trump. If Flynn were in Russia at this moment, I believe he would mysteriously disappear (yes, I am a life-long cynic).
Pence is either complicit or duped (I smell a Bannon) … and the ticker on this time bomb has just begun.
If a special counsel gets this, Flynn, rather than face prison, will, under oath, plead the Nuremberg defense … "I was just following orders."
My 20 cents!
One big hole in your logic.
Your assuming the two are interconnected.
As a result, your making the statement, relying on that assumption, that they are connected claiming a "quid pro quo" between Trump and Putin with Flynn being the fall guy if it is discovered.
The lie by Flynn to Pence made Flynn expendable and the holding/maintaining his position untenable.
But it doesn't prove the underlying assumption.
For that we would need the actual contents of what was discussed, not an assumption of what was discussed.
As Flynn's firing was a result of the lie he told, we probably will never know will we?
I once told a former US Attorney General, (acting as a senior campaign advisor) to take his campaign ideals and shoe them up his ass in front of a sitting president, everyone laughed heartily, but the next morning I came to work, found my desk completely empty with an envelope sitting on the top. (it was my severance pay) I was warned later by a few of my friends to watch my back given the way politics are played in the nations capital. Yes that was a warning about losing my life. I wondered why? I had told the truth. Which was borne out in the election results.
The whole history of how that election was lost has never came to the surface even though many many people knew all about it.
Trust me, in WA D.C., if it makes the news there is a lie underlying it.
The lie by Flynn to Pence made Flynn expendable and the holding/maintaining his position untenable.
I don't believe that; rather, I see it as part of an ass-covering ploy that ultimately won't fly.
in WA D.C., if it makes the news there is a lie underlying it.
And sometimes the lie ironically leads to the truth … particularly if the patsy saves his ass by revealing it.
True.... BUT,
Flynn, if he knows what is good for him, will never remember.
True.... BUT,
Flynn, if he knows what is good for him, will never remember.
And now, my friend, we are just about on the same page!
Again, I see him using, in one way shape or form, the Nuremberg defense … "I was just following orders."
And that will bring down the house.
There is no comfort zone between a rock and a hard place … he will likely have to hope that the truth will set him free.
You do know who sank Richard Nixon don't you? Rose Mary Woods his personal secretary.
She is the one who actually erased the tapes that incriminated Nixon. It took a lot of courage to admit that to the investigators bu to the end she refused to reveal exactly what it was that she erased.
But the admission proved beyond any doubt the accusation of obstruction of justice. (causing Nixon's resignation)
Loyalty to the end.
That is the road Flynn will take, why? Cause he has no choice, otherwise he will go to prison along side Trump if they did discuss a "quid pro quo". (which is illegal if proven)
It is better for him to take ignominious retirement than risk jail and possible retribution.
It is better for him to take ignominious retirement than risk jail and possible retribution.
But, if Republicans begin to feel that an angry electorate, one comprised of Trump-voters who now feel suckered and betrayed, and Hillary and Bernie voters who, for their own reasons, feel fucked over … will IRONY-OF-IRONIES, COME TOGETHER and REALLY DRAIN THE SWAMP BY KICKING OUT INCUMBENTS WHO CONTINUED TO LOOK THE OTHER WAY when the handwriting hit the wall … justice will be served, perhaps for the wrong reasons … but it will be justice nevertheless!
And Flynn may then both retire, and, be jailed (possibly with a plea-bargained sentence).
I think we have found a place to co-exist, NWM.
I have a very strong abiding faith in the American people, much like the founders had.
The fact that they came together to elect someone despite his shortcomings over a heavily established political regular speaks a lot of praise to the wisdom of establishing for the citizenry the rights they did. (and their faith in such wisdom)
Personally I would have voted for Bernie as the best democrat over Trump on the Republican side I would have voted first for Paul, and failing him Cruz over Hillary.
All outsiders to the duopoly establishment parties.
Trumps biggest mistake is not cleaning house.
But the American people will win in the end, understanding that they will not easily give up their freedoms won at the point of a gun.
That understanding has to be in the back of every politicians mind, the electorate within the constitutional framework, will not be reined in and corralled to a single ideology. Sometimes the process gets messy, like now when one side begins to think it is being ignored.
The system gives the minority the right to stop the majority in their tracks when required. which is just what happened this last cycle on a popular level, simple vote totals don't cut it.
I see a future where these divisive questions will be decided eventually, and a stronger America will surface.
But we have to suffer now for the future. It can't be the liberal progressive way, and it can't be the ultra conservative way either.
Somehow, as we both demonstrate when we discuss things seriously, we all come together and reach common ground.
Hopefully for the nation it happens sooner rather than later, and before it comes to the application of hot lead and cold steel, no matter who holds the offices.
But I have my doubts...
The fact that they came together to elect someone despite his shortcomings over a heavily established political regular speaks a lot of praise to the wisdom of establishing for the citizenry the rights they did. (and their faith in such wisdom)
They were justifiably angry regarding a constipated federal government … to a great extent because of outright partisanship tactics; but in desperation and stupidity, they elected a con man who promised everything without ever explaining logistically how he'd deliver.
And he pandered to bigots, anti-semites and all the gullible dolts who fell for 20 years of anti-MSM propaganda.
And the Democrats ran a flawed campaign with a flawed candidate … I make no excused for that.
Add the Russian hacking, the Comey letter released as early voting began, and, we had the PERFECT BULLSHIT STORM … yielding the most imperfect bullshit winner.
Fiat justitia ruat cælum …
Let the protests become the demand of a unified America … investigate independently, put it all out there … toss out those the investigation puts in a questionable, if not, indictable light …
… and let us hope there is anyone left (relatively) "clean" and qualified to serve!
.....but in desperation and stupidity,....
I agree with the desperation, not the stupidity. The electorate wanted a different direction.
If they were not going to be allowed to do it from within the two party structure, (ref: the screwing of Ron Paul) they went outside it.
Completely understandable. Extreme, but understandable.
"Let justice be done though the heavens fall." (Fiat justitia ruat cælum)
I agree 100% It is way past time for the criminals running this government (on both sides) to get their just due.
Trump isn't the answer, but it's more important to understand the lesson the electorate is giving rather than double down on the partisanship in the vain pursuit of power.
Let the protests become the demand of a unified America
Just like the 60's we marched and protested, we did no violence, the violence came to us and was revealed for what it was. I agree with the protests but not the violence. If they were right, there is no need for violence, Dr King was right.
Even a small section of unruly people causing great violence in the name of right aligned with your position, damages and taints the whole. Don't bring the violence allow the violence to come to you.
Violence is unjust, even in defense of a just cause.
You want to illustrate the unjustness of the other side, not exemplify the unjustness of what your protesting for.
Someday the people protesting will come to understand what Dr King was saying and why his movement worked and theirs isn't.
BREAKING NEWS … JUST NOW.
Trump Campaign Aides recorded having contact with Russian Intelligence!
During the CAMPAIGN!
Linkage?
Update: I cant find anything about any breaking news or supposed revelations currently online.
WHERE, WHEN AND HOW?
Linkage?
Here's one.
Oh, and don't forget about Donald Trump Jr. having closed-door meetings with key Russian operatives in Paris while his father was campaigning.
Right, the first paragraph deal with unconfirmed reports from sources in the FBI from last year and currently they are saying..
The officials interviewed in recent weeks said that, so far, they had seen no evidence of such cooperation.
Other than that it's a rehash of what is already our there mostly claims by the british operative which we have already heard.
Again no proof, just more mud at the wall.
I know, I know, point enough fingers, even without any actual proof or evidence, and you can convict someone of anything.
What is surprising is people that I thought were fair and just with reasonable integrity put their politics over their honesty and integrity and think that will solve their problem...
That surprises the hell outta me.
It's a witch hunt i will no longer participate in.
To you guys he is already convicted, no, he was convicted before he was ever elected.
And I cannot associate with that.
Linkage?
New York Times, leaked wire tapped conversations between Trump Aides and Russian Intelligence; the leaks will become a deluge as the agencies that have not released this kind of information become more-and-more under scrutiny and the focus of public anger.
I believe the story will be tomorrow's front page.
We shall see.
I think I'm done my friend....
Enjoy your hunt....
Like me, you'll be back.
Does anyone even want to consider that for the dozens of officials and former officials supposedly being the sources of all this unverifiable information, not a single one of them is known to the public?
I mean not one has the balls to say this in public openly?
If they actually exist it is for two reasons,
One: they do not want to become the objects of ridicule and the microscope that comes with such, especially if they are not of the slant the media wants to portray.
Two: Once they are revealed they will be forced to reveal the evidence they claim exist.
AS long as they stay undercover and unrevealed they are subject to the reporter shield laws and do not have to be revealed.
Eventually, someone is going to have to be revealed otherwise they risk revealing that they do not exist in the first place.
That is where I'm at at this point.
With the dozens of reports that majically appear out of nowhere, and timed for maximum effectiveness at stirring up hate against the president, one reasonable person has to question the source.
Historically this is unprecedented in American journalism after months of this a source is usually revealed.
Does the media lie? Does the media go on witch hunts to discredit a president? Obama thought so with Fox.
And I'm beginning to think so with the rest. one of the dangers of having such a broad spanning reporter shield law. It can be used to trash someone without consequence.
Which I believe is going on here.
Another interesting thing, these new reports are about Trump during the election, what? the Obama administration was using the FBI to spy on Trumps campaign by having Trumps phones bugged?
This inundation of unproven accusations does smack of more Democrat party duplicitous actions doesn't it?
It's now sufficient to question it with at least as much validity as the claims that Trump was doing something wrong.
False allegations are a double edged sword. and right now, it is looking like that sword should start swinging back towards the media.
Does anyone even want to consider that for the dozens of officials and former officials supposedly being the sources of all this unverifiable information, not a single one of them is known to the public?
The latest leaked information is in conjunction with FBI wiretaps of Russian Intelligence … something the U.S. does routinely; recorded conversations and phone records of Trump campaign individuals talking to Russian Intelligence officers reveal CONVERSATIONS THAT TOOK PLACE DURING THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN!
The leaks come apparently from individuals who believe the only likely way a LEGITIMATE Congressional investigation, or, better yet, a bi-partisan investigatory body with subpoena powers … will occur, is to raise the red flags (literally and figuratively).
Trump-lovers/Clinton-haters LAUDED WIKILEAKS during the campaign "AS SOURCES OF TRUTH (regardless of where they originate); TOUCHE!
Taped conversations and phone records are not likely "false information".
Bring on a bi-partisan panel similar to the 9-11 Commission … subpoena Trump's tax returns … the FBI Director with regard to the related investigation … and let's stop f'n around with Republicans looking the other way. If Russia is invading America and there's collusion … LET'S GET REAL AND STOP THE PARTISAN EQUIVOCATING!
Anyone have a problem with that?