Bill Maher calls out AOC for dismissing 'wokeness' critics, challenges her to appear on his show

  

Category:  Op/Ed

Via:  vic-eldred  •  2 weeks ago  •  123 comments

By:   By Joseph A. Wulfsohn

Bill Maher calls out AOC for dismissing 'wokeness' critics, challenges her to appear on his show
"I keep saying this to the Democratic Party. The reason why you're so toxic is because you've become the party of no common sense.

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



"Real Time" host  Bill Maher  ended his final show of the year by challenging Rep.  Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez , D-N.Y., to appear on a future telecast. 

During his closing monologue, Maher attempted to point Democrats in the "right direction" following their devastating defeats in the November elections ahead of the 2022 midterms. 

He cited commentary from veteran Democratic strategist James Carville, who blamed his party's losses on "stupid wokeness," a view that Ocasio-Cortez rejected, claiming the term is "almost exclusively used by older people these days … so that should tell you all you need to know."

"What?!" Maher reacted. "This is a term folks like you brought out very recently, had been proudly displaying it every march since. Just last year, The Guardian declared ‘woke’ the ‘word of our era.’ I guess they didn't get the memo from the Mean Girls Club.

"What a great strategy, never missing an opportunity to remind voters how lame and clueless and hopelessly cool they are, especially since those are the ones who actually vote," Maher scolded Ocasio-Cortez. "But OK, fine. What word would you like us to use for the plainly insane excesses of the left that are not liberalism but something completely different? Because you can't have that word ‘liberal' from us and think it should cover things like canceling Lincoln. And teaching third-graders they're oppressors. That's all your new-think."
The HBO star suggested the "more pertinent question" to ask is why the term "woke" went from being a "rallying cry to a pejorative." 
If the word only made you think of rational, deserved causes like teaching a less whitewashed version of American history, AOC would still want to own it. But it's a joke because it makes you think of people who wake up offended and take orders from Twitter. And their oversensitivity has grown tiresome," Maher said. 
Maher went on to say that he'd "love" to have the congresswoman on his show since there's "so much to admire" about her, expressing gratitude toward her for spearheading the  Green New Deal
"But that will probably never happen because Democrats don't go anywhere these days where they're not being adored," Maher said. "And that's my last bit of advice to them. Go where the ‘amen corner’ isn't. Do Fox News. Be brave. Come here. Go everywhere. Winning is about expanding the electorate."

Earlier in the week, Maher railed against Democrats for becoming "completely toxic" to ordinary Americans, particularly in the age of wokeism. 

"Woke -- I don't remember the day the term was born, although I hear AOC says, ‘Only old people use it now.’ Well, you gave it to us. Like five years ago. So sorry we didn't get the memo," Maher told CNN anchor Chris Cuomo on Wednesday. "In its best sense, if we're talking about being aware of things we should have always been aware of more, reckonings that we've had … but there's a reason why the term ‘woke’ has come to signify going too far. And doing things that don't make sense."

"I keep saying this to the Democratic Party. The reason why you're so toxic is because you've become the party of no common sense. And people see this on their newsfeeds," Maher said. "They see things on their phone or on their Facebook page, people pass things around and it's a constant drip, drip, drip of ‘Oh, these people are nuts' in a way -- they're not oblivious to the fact that Trump is nuts. When he ran, one of his big selling points was ‘You’ve got no choice.' He was saying, ‘Yes, I know I’m nuts. You know I'm nuts. But they're nuts in a very different way that's closer to home to you.'"


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Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
1  seeder  Vic Eldred    2 weeks ago

Even Bill Maher is trying to tell them!

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
2  JohnRussell    2 weeks ago

I dont think Bill Maher is a conservative or right winger. He is just full of himself and for publicity sake is turning himself into a "useful idiot". 

 
 
 
Gazoo
Sophomore Silent
2.1  Gazoo  replied to  JohnRussell @2    2 weeks ago

No, he simply has common sense, something sorely lacking in most of the left these days.

 
 
 
Greg Jones
PhD Expert
2.2  Greg Jones  replied to  JohnRussell @2    2 weeks ago

Maher, Carville, and many others are trying to wake up and educate brain dead lefties about political reality..

Why the obstinate resistance?  I wonder what George Carlin would say if he were still with us.

 
 
 
Jasper2529
Masters Participates
2.3  Jasper2529  replied to  JohnRussell @2    2 weeks ago
I dont think Bill Maher is a conservative or right winger.

Correct. Over the years, he has identified himself as a libertarian, a liberal, and a progressive.

  In his words, "The difference is that liberals protect people, and P.C. people protect feelings." [61] In the past, he has also described himself as a   libertarian , and has also referred to himself "as a progressive, as a sane person". [62] [63]

(Citations from NY Times Magazine, NY Times, and CNN)

He is just full of himself and for publicity sake is turning himself into a "useful idiot". 

I find your thought process intriguing. Is Maher "full of himself", because he doesn't meet your political standards? Is he a defector, because his views differ from yours? Why is he "a useful idiot"?

It seems to me that Maher is a reasonable man, because he recognizes the radical threat of the Marxist Left - people like AOC - and speaks out. I doubt she has the courage to accept his invitation.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3  seeder  Vic Eldred    2 weeks ago

Are there any moderate democrats on NT who are ashamed of where the democratic party has gone?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.1  JohnRussell  replied to  Vic Eldred @3    2 weeks ago

I dont consider "wokeness" to be America's greatest problem, as you do. Therefore I have no reason to be ashamed. 

You, to this minute, praise and support someone who wanted to and planned to overthrow the government of the United States. You want someone to be ashamed? Look in the mirror. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @3.1    2 weeks ago
Therefore I have no reason to be ashamed. 

That question wasn't even directed at you. I even added emphasis to moderate democrat. I don't even know if we have any here.


You, to this minute, praise and support someone who wanted to and planned to overthrow the government of the United States.

I continue to support Donald Trump and NO he did not plan to overthrow the democrat's corrupt regime.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.1.2  JohnRussell  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.1.1    2 weeks ago
I continue to support Donald Trump and NO he did not plan to overthrow the democrat's corrupt regime.

LOL. He planned to overthrow the election certification process and have himself declared president. This is not even in realistic dispute. 

THE DAY OF Jan 6, at his rally both Trump and the plans author John Eastman said there was still time for Pence to do the right thing. Trump even mentions Eastmans plan in his remarks.  

[deleted]

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.1.3  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @3.1.2    2 weeks ago
You are a political extremist

I feel the same about you, so I guess we're even.

 
 
 
Ronin2
PhD Quiet
3.1.4  Ronin2  replied to  JohnRussell @3.1    2 weeks ago

You first. After voting in this incestuous pedophile to the White House.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3    2 weeks ago
Are there any moderate democrats on NT who are ashamed of where the democratic party has gone?

Vic, I'm an independent and I find that question very funny. When I look at the parties, I think that they both have elements that should be ashamed of where their party has gone. When a Democrat like Maher is being honest about his party extremist, you use it as a weapon, but when Liz Chaney does it, you call her names. 

Frankly, if I was a dem, I would be highly insulted by that question.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2    2 weeks ago
When I look at the parties, I think that they both have elements that should be ashamed of where their party has gone. When a Democrat like Maher is being honest about his party extremist, you use it as a weapon, but when Liz Chaney does it, you call her names. 

I think it's reasonable to view both Maher and Chaney as standing on principle. I think Maher is trying to save his party. I think Chaney hates Trump and cares little about what she does to her party. That's the difference,


Frankly, if I was a dem, I would be highly insulted by that question.

I think a lot of moderate democrats agree with me and they are showing it in recent elections.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.2  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.1    2 weeks ago
I think it's reasonable to view both Maher and Chaney as standing on principle. I think Maher is trying to save his party. I think Chaney hates Trump and cares little about what she does to her party. That's the difference,

I think that Chaney is no different than Maher. You like Trump so you don't see the damage he has done to your party, which is no different than AOC, accept that he wants to run again. That will hurt you with independents.

I think a lot of moderate democrats agree with me and they are showing it in recent elections.

I can't speak for moderate Dems. I don't see Manchin changing parties and I don't see him liking Trump either. You won the elections from the indie vote mostly. And if I may point out to you, that there were a lot of Dems voted in, in local elections and all the elections ran very tight races. No one won by a landslide, and most had really poor turnouts. I think that shows that the American public is pretty sick and tired of all negativism. 

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.3  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.2    2 weeks ago
That will hurt you with independents.

Polling has shown that many independents are not happy with Biden.



I interpret that as voter remorse.


And if I may point out to you, that there were a lot of Dems voted in, in local elections and all the elections ran a very tight race. No one won by a landslide, and most had really poor turnouts. I think that shows that the American public is pretty sick and tired of all negativism. 

I'd like to point out that Virginia just went red, democrat machine governor Phil Murphy, who was favored by 8 points barely hung on and solid blue Columbia, South Carolina, just elected a Republican. A Texas democrat just swithced partys. 14 democrat House members have decided not to run next year. That means that moderate democrats and Independents have had enough of radical left policies.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.4  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.3    2 weeks ago
Polling has shown that many independents are not happy with Biden.

For now. But you have to remember that most indies voted in Biden to get rid of Trump. That has not changed. 

I'd like to point out that Virginia just went red, democrat machine governor Phil Murphy, who was favored by 8 points barely hung on and solid blue Columbia, South Carolina, just elected a Republican. A Texas democrat just swithced partys.14 democrat House members have decided not to run next year. That means that moderate democrats and Independents have had enough of radical left policies.

Yes, but Virginia was hardly a landslide, and Phil Murphy won a second term, which hasn't been done in a very long time in NJ. The decision not to run could have nothing to do with anything, since they were never polled as to why. You feel it is radical left policy as an indie, I think that the infrastructure bill was a huge win that will pay off in the long run. I don't see the Build Back America bill passing without some major changes to it, but it does have some stuff in it that I totally agree with, it just needs to be cleaned up, which it will or it will not pass the senate.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.5  Texan1211  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.4    2 weeks ago
Yes, but Virginia was hardly a landslide,

Perhaps not a landslide, but surely a HUGE upset. The GOP hadn't won a statewide race in VA since 2009, and took the Governor, Lt. Gov., AG, and one House.

Phil Murphy won a second term, which hasn't been done in a very long time in NJ.

True. But the State Senate Leader lost to an unknown who spent a ridiculously low amount.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.6  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.4    2 weeks ago
For now. But you have to remember that most indies voted in Biden to get rid of Trump. That has not changed. 

I believe it has. If that same election were held tomorrow Trump would win handily.  


Yes, but Virginia was hardly a landslide,

It was a major upset and a clean sweep for Republicans. We all agreed before that election that it was a true bellwether.


and Phil Murphy won a second term

He was favored by 8. It wasn't even supposed to be a contest.


You feel it is radical left policy

Policies Perrie - Everything from open borders to DOJ misconduct!


as an indie, I think that the infrastructure bill was a huge win that will pay off in the long run.

Even those who liked it initially will soon realize that most of that wasn't for "infrastructure" and the Trillion dollar bills have only led to rising inflation.


I don't see the Build Back America bill passing without some major changes to it, but it does have some stuff in it that I totally agree with, it just needs to be cleaned up, which it will or it will not pass the senate.

I really hope it dies when it gets back to the House. Stripping out all the leftist programs should kill it in the House.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.7  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.5    2 weeks ago
Perhaps not a landslide, but surely a HUGE upset.

Well, losing a state is never not huge, but the only people who were energized where those who lost Trump in the last election.

True. But the State Senate Leader lost to an unknown who spent a ridiculously low amount.

You are only proving my point. Most people are sick and tired of the bitterness that is going on within the party system. This win was again, nothing more than those who were energized by the Trump loss.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.8  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.7    2 weeks ago
This win was again, nothing more than those who were energized by the Trump loss.

They were energized by 10 months of very radical policy that most never voted for.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.9  Texan1211  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.7    2 weeks ago
Well, losing a state is never not huge, but the only people who were energized where those who lost Trump in the last election.

Virginia had a huge turnout. Couldn't have been just from people upset that Trump lost. Just not enough of them to flip a state that Biden carried big time just a year ago. We both know independents are what pushed the GOP over the line, which would seem to be a rebuke for Democrats.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.10  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.6    2 weeks ago
I believe it has. If that same election were held tomorrow Trump would win handily.  

Not sure about that. And I think most indies would prefer another choice other than Trump.

It was a major upset and a clean sweep for Republicans. We all agreed before that election that it was a true bellwether.

The midterms will be the bellwether.

He was favored by 8. It wasn't even supposed to be a contest.

A win is a win. It was close in Virginia, too.

PoliciesPerrie - Everything from open borders to DOJ misconduct!

Open Boarders will never pass. The DOJ has a long history of misconduct that goes beyond one administration.

Even those who liked it initially will soon realize that most of that wasn't for "infrastructure" and the Trillion dollar bills have only led to rising inflation.

Our current rising inflation has to do with being in lockdown and now supply line issues. The infrastructure bill will add jobs and fix our decaying infrastructure, which has to be fixed. And may I remind you, that the bill costs $1.2 trillion, while Trump spent 1.9 trillion dollars on Covid relief. That was nothing but a stop-gap and actually IMHO caused many people not to join the workforce for a longer period, which does affect inflation.

I really hope it dies when it gets back to the House. Stripping out all the leftist programs should kill it in the House.

I don't think so... but we will have to see.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.11  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.8    2 weeks ago
They were energized by 10 months of very radical policy that most never voted for.

That is not what the polls said. The turnout was a whole lot of Trump voters and the Dems and indies were not very stimulated to vote.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.12  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.9    2 weeks ago

It has become a blue state, largely because northern Virginia has become a suburb of DC with lot's of federal employees, beltway bandits and at least one dentist living there.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.13  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.9    2 weeks ago

52% of voters is not great, IMO.

Also, and ironically, the republicans benefited from early voting and mail-in, which was passed under Ralph Northam. When a republican wins, I don't hear any complaints about those policies, right?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.14  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.10    2 weeks ago
And I think most indies would prefer another choice other than Trump.

You don't think that Biden has become far more toxic than Trump was?  Do you think the dems will nominate Biden or Harris in 2024???


The midterms will be the bellwether.

Lol, no the midterms are the end result or as Shakespear might say "Act 4."


A win is a win. It was close in Virginia, too.

Oh, come on Perrie, the democrats are getting their heads handed to them!


Open Boarders will never pass. 

Pass? It's currently in effect!


The DOJ has a long history of misconduct that goes beyond one administration.

Everyone does it?


Our current rising inflation has to do with being in lockdown and now supply line issues. 

Perrie, I think you are testing me. That happens to be all that Jen Psaki could think of when she was confronted by the alluring Jacqui Heinrich.


The infrastructure bill will add jobs and fix our decaying infrastructure, which has to be fixed. And may I remind you, that the bill costs $1.2 trillion

A straight infrastucture would have been defensible. The cost would have been less that half what that thing costs.


while Trump spent 1.9 trillion dollars on Covid relief. 

I spoke about whataboutism in my weekly report.


That was nothing but a stop-gap and actually IMHO caused many people not to join the workforce for a longer period, which does affect inflation.

That would be Biden's over generous unemployment benefits which created another crisis.


I don't think so... but we will have to see.

You bet!

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.15  Texan1211  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.13    2 weeks ago
52% of voters is not great, IMO.

Over 700,000 votes more than last election for governor seems significant to me.

Democrats always claim they win with high turnout, which turned out to be untrue.

When a republican wins, I don't hear any complaints about those policies, right?

Nice deflection.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.16  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.11    2 weeks ago
That is not what the polls said.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.17  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.11    2 weeks ago
at is not what the polls said. The turnout was a whole lot of Trump voters and the Dems and indies were not very stimulated to vote.

Where are you getting this? Turnout was the highest for governor in over 20 years.  McAuliffe got more Democratic votes than Northam did and the independents (who favored Younkin by 9) were his margin of victory. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.18  sandy-2021492  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.7    2 weeks ago

The thing is, this wasn't the huge change some folks like to think it was.  Virginia was never as blue as imagined.  2019 was the first time the Dems had a majority in the House of Delegates since 2000, and it was a slim margin.  The current margin Republicans hold over Democrats in the House is also slim.  The Senate is still controlled by Dems, but also by a slim margin.  That majority was gained in 2019, after Republican control of the Senate since 1993.

Virginia is purple.  Has been for decades.  It takes only a very slight swing to turn it a bit redder or bluer, not the sea change some would like to think the election signalled.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.19  Sean Treacy  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.13    2 weeks ago
ly, the republicans benefited from early voting and mail-in

How? McAuliffe tanked as the election went on.  He was leading in every poll I know of when voting started.  Younkin didn't "pull ahead" in polls until the week before the election. 

If he had won, it would have been because he banked votes before his meltdown over the last few weeks of the election.  

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.20  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.18    2 weeks ago

Virginia is purple

Biden won Virginia by 10 points. A 12 point switch in a year is massive.  Try and downplay it all you want. 

Trump won South Carolina by about the same margin.  Do you think it's purple?

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.21  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.18    2 weeks ago

The GOP had not won a statewide race in VA since 2009.

Seems sort of significant.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.22  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.20    2 weeks ago

Ignore the numbers all you want, Sean.  Virginia is not solidly red.  Nor was it ever solidly blue.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.23  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.21    2 weeks ago

That's really the time that federal workers, employees and officials took a significant pay hike. Those Obama programs benefitted them the most and it is they who prefer northern Virginia to DC. 

This can be added to the mix:

"The influx of immigrants and their U.S.-born children, the spread of high-density suburbia and the growth of higher education all tilt the field toward the Democrats. Still, that doesn’t give them a lock on the state, said Larry Sabato, director of the University of Virginia’s Center for Politics."




 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.24  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.16    2 weeks ago

I can't open the link to read the whole report.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.25  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.21    2 weeks ago

But they had held majorities in legislature.  There are 3 branches in our government, you know.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.26  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.24    2 weeks ago

Would you accept Breitbart?

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.27  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.23    2 weeks ago

Vic,

You can't use the NYT, if most of the time you are saying that they are not accurate.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.28  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.25    2 weeks ago

Yes I do know. Did you notice I clearly stated that the GOP had not won a statewide race since 2009?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.29  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.27    2 weeks ago

Most of the time they aren't, but you accept their analysis, don't you?

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Quiet
3.2.30  charger 383  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.12    2 weeks ago

I know that the best Dentist in Virginia lives west of the Blue Ridge

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.31  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  charger 383 @3.2.30    2 weeks ago

Yup, the very one!

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.32  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.28    2 weeks ago

I noticed.  I also notice that you're trying to attach a great deal of significance to that, while ignoring the fact that Virginia is still purple overall.  This wasn't likely the blowout that you want it to be.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.33  sandy-2021492  replied to  charger 383 @3.2.30    2 weeks ago

Thanks, charger!

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.34  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.22    2 weeks ago
all you want, Sean.  Virginia is not solidly red.  Nor was it ever solidly blue.

I never said it it was solidly red. Since the Republicans haven't won a state wide race there in over a decade and Biden won it by 10 points, that would be idiotic.  It's certainly not solidly red now.

But it was real damn blue as recently as November 2020. 

 
 
 
Hallux
Sophomore Principal
3.2.35  Hallux  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.26    2 weeks ago
Would you accept Breitbart?

Only if Andrew was still alive and running it, Steve turned it into a shitshow.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.36  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Hallux @3.2.35    2 weeks ago

When did you become Perrie?

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.37  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.34    2 weeks ago

Not all that blue.  If it were "real damn" blue, the Dems would have had commanding majorities in the state legislature.  They didn't.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.38  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.29    2 weeks ago

It doesn't work that way. You can't say that they are not accurate and then use them to prove a point. That is cherry-picking.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.2.39  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.38    2 weeks ago

You mean it's like a secularist quoting the Bible?

Ok, How about this one:

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.40  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.32    2 weeks ago

Gee, some folks would consider it significant that the GOP swept the top offices.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.41  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.40    2 weeks ago

Consider it so, if you like.  You yourself were touting history - Virginia generally elects a governor of the opposite political party from the most recent winner of the Presidential election.  Is it significant that the vote went as expected? 

Or is is significant that a state with rural counties that overwhelmingly vote for GOP presidential candidates still somehow has a nearly evenly split legislature?

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.42  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.41    2 weeks ago

The vote did not go as expected. Did you ever look at any polls??

 
 
 
Drinker of the Wry
Freshman Silent
3.2.43  Drinker of the Wry  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.13    2 weeks ago
EARLY IN PERSON   VOTES
McAuliffe  54%  Youngkin  46%
EARLY BY MAIL   VOTES
McAuliffe  75%  Youngkin  24%
 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.44  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.41    2 weeks ago
.  Is it significant that the vote went as expected? 

This gets crazier by the minute. The democrats have won every statewide election for a dozen years and you believe the Republicans were "expected" to win? 

You must be incredibly rich given the odds in the betting markets overwhelmingly favored McAuliffe.   Even as recently as a week before the election Youngkin was being given a less than 40 percent chance to win. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.45  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.42    2 weeks ago

It went as you expected it to.  Can't have it both ways, Tex.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.46  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.45    2 weeks ago
It went as you expected it to.

No, the polls showed the GOP trailing badly in a state that Biden won by 10 points a year ago. Based on that, it made sense to think the GOP would lose.

What is this nonsense about having it both ways?

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.47  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.44    2 weeks ago

Polls had Hillary winning in 2016, too.

And, as many pointed out, this followed the same pattern as gubernatorial elections here for decades.

Virginia and New Jersey are the only two states that elect a governor the year after a presidential election. In Virginia, those off-year contests have tended to favor the party that does not hold the presidency. Since 1977, the state has voted with the current president’s political party only once.

I saw this touted for weeks heading up to the election as a predictor of how it would go, but now we're supposed to be amazed that this is how it went?  I'm underwhelmed.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.48  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.46    2 weeks ago

Not really trailing badly.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.49  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.39    2 weeks ago

LOL on that bible joke. 

I'll accept that one, but you seemed to miss this:

Biden's favorable/unfavorable rating (40% positive, 48% negative) in the poll is nearly comparable to Trump's in the same poll (38% positive, 50% negative).

So really what does any of this means not even 1 year into a presidency? 

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
3.2.50  Gordy327  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.49    2 weeks ago
So really what does any of this means not even 1 year into a presidency?

I'd say not much. People have short memories or attention spans. It's the last year of the presidency which will probably be make or break. The same happened to Trump.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.51  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.47    2 weeks ago
Polls had Hillary winning in 2016, too.

What does that mean? Because Hillary lost somehow McAullife shouldn't have been the overwhelming favorite by oddsmakers?  

nd, as many pointed out, this followed the same pattern as gubernatorial elections here for decade

Here's the relevant history:

2012 Virginia voted Obama, Kaine

2013 Virginia voted McAuliffe

2014 Virginia voted Warner

2016 Virginia voted Clinton

2017 Virginia voted Northam

2018 Virginia voted Kaine

2020 Virginia voted Biden, Warner

2021 Virginia voted Younkin

Which of these is not like the other?

 
 
 
Jasper2529
Masters Participates
3.2.52  Jasper2529  replied to  Gordy327 @3.2.50    2 weeks ago
It's the last year of the presidency which will probably be make or break. The same happened to Trump.

Oh, another pandemic so soon? At age 83, will Biden be cognitively capable of putting together Operation Warp Speed 2?

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.53  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.51    2 weeks ago
What does that mean?

It means polls aren't always accurate, and it's not all an amazing win for your side when one gets it wrong.

Also, you're missing the relevant history.  It's not just about how Virginia voted.  It's about how Virginia voted, in relation to how the nation voted.  Virginia has voted against the party holding the White House since 1977, with the exception of one election.  Even if Virginia voted for that party in the preceding Presidential elections.  This election follows a pattern that's been set for 44 years.

Which supports that Virginia is purple, not red.  But prior to Youngkin's election, it wasn't all that blue, either.  We're basically going back and forth between magenta and violet.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.54  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.53    2 weeks ago
eans polls aren't always accurate, and it's not all an amazing win for your side when one gets it wrong.

The polls had Younkin winning on election day, they were pretty accurate. How are you trying to turn this into a debate about polls?.

Again, in July, no one thought Younkin was winning this election. IF you knew he was going to, than you should have made millions given the odds against him winning set by people who make their living predicting elections.  

Also, you're missing the relevant histo

No, I'm not. I just showed you the relevant history of the state voting straight democratic for a decade.   

 It 's about how Virginia voted, in relation to how the nation voted

Lol do you understand the difference between correlation and causatio? . Do you imagine Virginia voted for Northam in 2017 after voting for Hillary in 2016 was because Trump won?  Virginia voted for Democrats in every state wide election for a decade because it's a blue state. Not because of how people voted in Florida the year before.

This rule held in 17 of 19 elections: " If the Redskins win their last  home game  before the election, the party that won the previous election wins the next election and that if the Redskins lose, the challenging party's candidate win." Do you think that rule actually helps figure out elections?  When the election was over, do you recall a candidate saying, "it's no surprise we lost, the Redskins lost too, so we had no chance."

 
 
 
charger 383
Professor Quiet
3.2.55  charger 383  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.53    2 weeks ago

In 2013 Va Republicans ran Ken Cuccinelli and Bishop E W Jackson, which gift wrapped the Governor's race for MaCuliffe's first term.  Those two did a lot to push Virginia blue.  The Va Republican party is still recovering from that self inflicted injury

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
3.2.56  Sparty On  replied to  Gordy327 @3.2.50    2 weeks ago

COVID happened to Trump.

He’d very likely be POTUS right now had it not.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
3.2.57  Gordy327  replied to  Sparty On @3.2.56    2 weeks ago
He’d very likely be POTUS right now had it not.

Yep, probably. He was in a good position for reelection too.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
3.2.58  Gordy327  replied to  Jasper2529 @3.2.52    2 weeks ago
Oh, another pandemic so soon?

We're still dealing with the current pandemic.

 
 
 
Jasper2529
Masters Participates
3.2.59  Jasper2529  replied to  Gordy327 @3.2.58    2 weeks ago

If left to the "science" of Fauci, Biden, and other autocrats, Covid-19 will be a "pandemic" for at least another 30 years.

 
 
 
TᵢG
Professor Principal
3.2.60  TᵢG  replied to  Jasper2529 @3.2.59    2 weeks ago

What is your reasoning for such a proclamation?

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.61  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.54    2 weeks ago
The polls had Younkin winning on election day, they were pretty accurate. How are you trying to turn this into a debate about polls?.

You might want to let Texan know.  And check your own words about poll results a week before the election.  You've gone on about how pre-election polling favored McAuliffe, and now you say they were accurate, since Youngkin won?  Ok.

I didn't know Youngkin was going to win.  I didn't think a victory for McAuliffe was a foregone conclusion, either.  You apparently did, until those accurate polls were shown to be inaccurate.

You've shown me what you consider to be relevant since 2012 - how Virginia voted for governor in relation to how Virginia voted for POTUS.  I've shown you the pattern of how Virginia voted for governor in relation to how the nation voted for POTUS since 1977.  They have generally voted for the party which didn't win the White House, regardless of which presidential candidate they voted for in the preceding general election.

Lol do you understand the difference between correlation and causatio?

Where did I mention causation?  Can you disprove the correlation?

If it were a blue state, it wouldn't have had a Republican legislature for decades.  It's silly to assert that a state with decades of a Republican-led legislature that only ended recently, and only by a tiny margin, is a blue state.

But that would put the Republican win into a reasonable perspective.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.62  sandy-2021492  replied to  charger 383 @3.2.55    2 weeks ago

Between those two and Bob McDonnell taking gifts from Star Scientific (slimy but not illegal) and throwing his wife under the bus, yeah, the Dems didn't have to try hard for a while.

The thought of Cuccinelli in any public office turns my stomach.  How much taxpayer money did he waste in his prudish censoring of the state seal?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.63  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.61    2 weeks ago
 And check your own words about poll results a week before the election.  You've gone on about how pre-election polling favored McAuliffe, and now you say they were accurate, since Youngkin won?  Ok.

You understand how polls work, right? They capture a moment in time.  A poll in April shows the situation in April, not November.  If you check my words, you'd see I'm consistent. McAuliffe was leading until the end of the campaign. Younkin made his gains close to the election date. Hence, his polling improved as it closer to the election. 

You apparently did, until those accurate polls were shown to be inaccurate.

What are you talking about? I never claimed I thought he'd win. Nor were the polls inaccurate.   You understand the electorate shifts it's preferences over time right? 

Where did I mention causation?  Can you disprove the correlation?

If you admit there's no causation, why do you keep talking about this. Correlation without causation gives you the Washington Redskins football team controls elections theory.

 It's silly to assert that a state with decades of a Republican-led legislature that only ended recent

It would be silly to make a claim about what happened decades ago when no one is talking about it. Virginia has voted for Democrats in every single state wide election for THE LAST DECADE prior to November. That's what makes it a blue state.  In purple states, both parties consistently win statewide elections. It's not that difficult to tell the difference.  For instance, Missouri used to be a purple state. It's a red state now. Democrats winning statewide elections in Missouri would signal problems for the Republicans, even though it was the quintessential toss up state just a few election cycles ago.

But that would put the Republican win into a reasonable perspectiv

A double digit shift towards Republicans in two blue states is the reasonable perspective to take from what happened this month.  Pretending Virginia is the same as it was in 2004 is not.  That's reality.

Claiming a state won by Biden by 10 points is really purple is as absurd as claiming South Carolina is purple.  We both know you wouldn't be making that argument if Democrats won a Senate seat or the Governorship.  So why bother making it about Virginia. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.64  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.63    2 weeks ago
It would be silly to make a claim about what happened decades ago when no one is talking about it.

Not decades ago.  Several years ago - 2019.  In 2018, Virginia had a legislature in which both houses had been controlled by Republicans for 18 years (the House of Delegates) and 25 years (the Senate).  When did 2 years become a decade?

That's what makes it a blue state.

Your assertion.  One which incidentally sets a pretty low bar to allow you to spin this into a bigger victory than it is.  It's also an assertion which ignores the existence of the legislative branch and those who voted its members into office.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.65  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.64    2 weeks ago

When did 2 years become a decade?

You were citing election results from decades ago.

The State Legislature is not decided by statewide elections, You understand that, right? Geographic concentration of voters matters in state legislative elections. They don't in statewide elections which  reflect  the state as a whole. 

One which incidentally sets a pretty low bar to allow you to spin this into a bigger victory than it is

Okay.   Name one other "purple state"  that Biden or Trump won by 10 plus points in 2020 and his  party has won every statewide election since 2009.   I can't wait for that list. 

But you are missing the point, the "victory" doesn't really matter. If he had lost by half a point, it would be just as big a deal. What matters is the massive swing in votes from 2020, which is why the New Jersey results are just as impressive and important as Virginia, even though the incumbent Democrat won in New Jersey.  

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.66  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.65    2 weeks ago
You were citing election results from decades ago.

And from 3 weeks ago.  And from 4 years ago.

I'm aware of how the state legislature is chosen.  I'm also aware that statewide elections are not the only elections held, nor are they the only elections to decide a state's political leanings.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.67  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.66    2 weeks ago

Let's make this simple. Just name one other "purple state"  that Biden or Trump won by 10 plus points in 2020 and whose  party has won every statewide election since 2009. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.68  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.67    2 weeks ago

A pretty narrow set of parameters, there, Sean.

If you won't accept a state that has generally had a divided government, and has almost equal representation within its legislature as purple, your definition of "purple state" is so narrow as to be meaningless.  In Virginia, neither party has had overwhelming support over the other for decades.  That sounds pretty purple to me.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.69  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.48    2 weeks ago

Real Clear Politics had the Democrat ahead by 5 points on October 1, and that number was the average of all polls.

5 points is a large margin to overcome in just one month, and especially with the high turnout.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
3.2.70  Gordy327  replied to  TᵢG @3.2.60    2 weeks ago
What is your reasoning for such a proclamation?

Partisan bias?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.71  Sean Treacy  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.68    2 weeks ago

Lol. Of course you won't accept the definition that exposes how silly your argument is . If you list the states that   that Biden or Trump won by 10 plus points in 2020 and  whose  party has won every statewide election since 2009 you'll find only states that everyone identifies as either red or blue.  

States that vote exclusively for one party in statewide elections  aren't purple.  That's the entire point of labeling a state red, blue or purple. You know which way it currently  leans in statewide elections. 

n Virginia, neither party has had overwhelming support over the other for decades.

. Again, the fact that you need to go back decades to find Republican support. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.72  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.71    2 weeks ago

Of course you won't accept the definition that exposes how this wasn't a great victory.  Your preferred candidate won an election by a small margin in a state that wasn't solidly against his party, and hasn't ever been.

The results of elections since 2009 haven't exactly been blowouts recently.  In 2013, McAuliffe won by by about 2.5% over Cuccinelli, whom pretty much everyone thought was a twit (check out charger's comments above).  If Virginia was solidly blue in 2013, that should have been a blowout, considering the dislike for Cuccinelle and Jackson even among Republicans, but it wasn't.  Because Virginia wasn't solidly blue in 2013.  The 2017 election had a much wider margin - 9%.  But since then, Ralph Northam has been a bit of a mixed bag.  A history of racist actions, resentment of his response to the pandemic, and a dishonest but successful campaign by anti-choicers in which he was said to have been in favor of post-natal "abortion" put serious dents into his support (and therefore his party's) statewide.

So, that's one gubernatorial election that was a solid victory for Dems, with support lost since then.  That doesn't really make for a "real damn" blue state.

Again, the fact that you need to go back decades to find Republican support. 

Not true.  I only need to go back 2 years to find Republican support.  It's just not Republican support to which you want to pay attention.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.73  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.72    2 weeks ago
Of course you won't accept the definition that exposes how this wasn't a great victory.  Your preferred candidate won an election by a small margin in a state that wasn't solidly against his party, and hasn't ever been.

Biden just won the state last year by 10 points, and no Republican had won a statewide election in over a decade.

Pretty damn fine win, and one I am sure Democrats are unhappy about. Sure was a lot of commenting on how Democrats SHOULD have campaigned and SHOULD have passed the infrastructure bill BEFORE the election.

A swing of over 10 points in one year is pretty significant.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.74  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.73    2 weeks ago

Oh, I forgot we were voting for POTUS a few weeks ago.

Believe it or not, Virginians can actually have different party preferences for governor as opposed to POTUS.  Rather like Marylanders, who voted for Biden, but have a popular Republican governor.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.75  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.74    2 weeks ago
Oh, I forgot we were voting for POTUS a few weeks ago.

That is probably a great thing for you to forget, as we didn't.

Believe it or not, Virginians can actually have different party preferences for governor as opposed to POTUS. 

No kidding? Wow. I bet you are the only person to have ever thought of that! Wow!

Choosing to disregard pertinent information is your choice, and far be it from me to change your mind.

Rather like Marylanders, who voted for Biden, but have a popular Republican governor.

All things which should inform Democrats that they have no mandate from the public, so why do they legislate as if they do?

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.2.76  XXJefferson51  replied to  Vic Eldred @3.2.26    2 weeks ago

A great news and opinion source.  One of the best there is.  

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
3.2.77  XXJefferson51  replied to  Hallux @3.2.35    2 weeks ago

He hasn’t been there in a long time.  

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.78  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.75    2 weeks ago
That is probably a great thing for you to forget, as we didn't.

Some people recognize sarcasm when they see it.

No kidding? Wow. I bet you are the only person to have ever thought of that! Wow!

Possibly so.  Some people equate the results of a gubernatorial election with those of a presidential election.  Not me, but some people do.

All things which should inform Democrats that they have no mandate from the public, so why do they legislate as if they do?

Well, that's politics for ya.  Elections, majorities, and all that jazz.  Don't you like democracy?

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.79  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.78    2 weeks ago
Some people recognize sarcasm when they see it

You obviously missed it!

Possibly so.  Some people equate the results of a gubernatorial election with those of a presidential election.  Not me, but some people do.

And some folks can look and analyze election results and draw sane conclusions, while others seem to struggle with the concept. I can, but others can't.

Love democracy, and the elections results were quite promising in that regard!

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.80  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.79    2 weeks ago
You obviously missed it!

So, you were being sarcastic when you equated support for a gubernatorial candidate with support for POTUS?  Sure, sure.

And some folks can look and analyze election results and draw sane conclusions

Like declaring a state to be definitely blue, despite evidence to the contrary?  Not very sane.

Love democracy

Then why do you object to the winners of elections governing like they won elections?

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.81  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.80    2 weeks ago
So, you were being sarcastic when you equated support for a gubernatorial candidate with support for POTUS?  Sure, sure.

I didn't equate the two, stop making stuff up.

Like declaring a state to be definitely blue, despite evidence to the contrary?  Not very sane.

Gee, I would have loved to see you quote me doing that, but since we both know you can't, I won't bother asking for it.

Then why do you object to the winners of elections governing like they won elections?

Mere ridiculous fluff from you.  I don't object at all, just wish that one party didn't act as if they had some sweeping mandate from the electorate.

I prefer if you actually attempt to debate what I have claimed rather than the stuff you seem to have invented for me.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.82  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.81    2 weeks ago
I don't object at all

Bullshit.

All things which should inform Democrats that they have no mandate from the public, so why do they legislate as if they do?

Those are your words.  Why do you question the winners of elections acting like they won elections?  Why do you need to ask why winners govern?  It's obvious to people who support democracy.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.83  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.82    2 weeks ago

bullshit? so now you are telling me what I think??

like I stated, argue what I wrote not invented crap

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.84  sandy-2021492  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.83    2 weeks ago

You questioned democracy, Tex.  It's all there in black and white.  As is typical, you now wish to disown your words, but they're all there, in black and white.  Their meaning and implications are clear.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.85  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.84    2 weeks ago

omg please stop inventing and then trying to argue what you invented.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
3.2.86  Sparty On  replied to  Texan1211 @3.2.85    2 weeks ago

It's all they got .....  lies, deflection, redirection, gaslighting, etc ..... they have no truth.   They only have what they want you to believe the truth is.

Which is usually just a blatant lie or at best a disingenuous half truth.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
Professor Principal
3.2.87  sandy-2021492  replied to  Sparty On @3.2.86    2 weeks ago

Nope.  All can read Texan's words. He just doesn't want to own them.

There's gaslighting going on here, but not by me.  It's the typical "I didn't say that.  Or if I did, it was taken out of context" defense.  Texan is questioning why Dems are acting like they won elections the did, in fact, win.  He's questioning democracy.

He's also conflating a state's support for a gubernatorial candidate with support for the President - that 10% swing he keeps bringing up.  We can all read that, too, but he also doesn't want to own those words.  Virginians realize that Biden wasn't on the ballot this month.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
3.2.88  Sparty On  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.87    2 weeks ago

Keep telling the lie.  

I'm sure you'll convince some useful idiots but that's about it.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.89  Texan1211  replied to  sandy-2021492 @3.2.87    2 weeks ago
Nope.  All can read Texan's words. He just doesn't want to own them.

FFS, PLEASE stop telling tales about my posts.

I own everything I write and please don't deny  that. I have retracted NOTHING. I have denied NOTHING except the crap you MADE UP about me.

either at least be honest with me or stop posting to me.

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Expert
3.3  Tacos!  replied to  Vic Eldred @3    2 weeks ago

It might not be all that bad. Each party always has its extreme elements and though they tend to be louder than their colleagues, I’m not sure that equates to real political impact.

Still, the party has moved further Left, in my opinion. The once robust moderate Blue Dog Coalition is about a third of the size it was just 15 years ago. But there are some signs they might be starting to turn that around. I think some of the gains the Democrats have seen in the last few years have included moderate Democrats, whether they are members of that coalition or not. Additionally, Democrats like Manchin and Sinema are showing the influence that one or two stubborn moderates can have - so all is not lost.

I try to have faith in the people. I always sort of hope that the voting public will recognize insanity when they hear it and not vote for it. But then Maxine Waters has been in Congress for 30 years, so what do I know?

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
3.3.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Tacos! @3.3    2 weeks ago
I always sort of hope that the voting public will recognize insanity when they hear it and not vote for it.

We all can hope. When I was just a kid I can remember adults talking about what kind of people were teaching at Harvard and elswhere. I would wonder why they didn't do anything about it. It's only when things get so far out of hand that people go to the polls and make a change. Then after things return to normal for a while they forget and get complacent again. On the other hand the left never lets up. If you doubt that just take a look at the thread above. They take a ridiculous position and defend it until the other person logs off, then issue the last word. That maybe the Berkeley style of debate, but it demonstrates their resolve. Let's face it, they now are deeply inbedded in most of our institutions. It is going to take a lot of commitment for the American people to rid our society of this curse.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
4  Sparty On    2 weeks ago

She doesn’t have the guts to do it.    
Maher would destroy her face to face.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
4.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Sparty On @4    2 weeks ago

I have to agree. She dosen't venture far from her fawning admirers. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
4.1.1  Sparty On  replied to  Vic Eldred @4.1    2 weeks ago

She is much better at interrupting speakers who have the floor of the House with snarky cat-calls

 
 
 
Hallux
Sophomore Principal
5  Hallux    2 weeks ago

Hated the 'word' the first time I heard it and for a number of reasons but mostly that it was immediately obvious that hordes of pundits on the right would successfully weaponize it much as they did with Hillary's foolish "deplorables"; there is rarely a right wing opinion piece that does not incorporate 'woke' at least several times.

Note to Bill, The left has stopped using 'woke' for well over a year now, find another quixotic windmill to tilt at.

As to A.O.C., I will be surprised if she does not accept the invitation, and Bill, do a 'balanced' show with M.T.G. included ... I'll watch that!

 
 
 
zuksam
Junior Silent
5.1  zuksam  replied to  Hallux @5    2 weeks ago
The left has stopped using 'woke' for well over a year now, find another quixotic windmill to tilt at.

But they're still pushing the idiocy of Wokeism. The Left came up with the Ideology and named it Woke so as long as the Ideology persists they're stuck with the Word.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
5.1.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  zuksam @5.1    2 weeks ago

They create Newspeak, frame the narratives and choose the news. Progressivism prevails in nearly every sphere of American public life: the news media, the universities, K-12 education, the entertainment industry, corporate boardrooms, mainline religious organizations, college and professional sports (excluding the fans), much of U.S. military bureaucracy, and state and federal agencies. Now they regret a word that they created. It's only a testament to their power that they find it so difficult to remove it from the national lexicon.

 
 
 
Hallux
Sophomore Principal
5.1.2  Hallux  replied to  zuksam @5.1    2 weeks ago
But they're still pushing the idiocy of Wokeism.

Where might that be? I don't see it being pushed here by anyone on the left. Cut the crispy crap, you are being too cute by half.

 
 
 
Hallux
Sophomore Principal
5.1.3  Hallux  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.1    2 weeks ago
Now they regret a word that they created.

I know you have a penchant for pluralizing pronouns but do try and take heed, I am not 'they' just as you are not 'we'.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
5.1.4  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Hallux @5.1.3    2 weeks ago

I never got the message on that. I'm not one to worry about pronouns.

 
 
 
Hallux
Sophomore Principal
5.1.5  Hallux  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.4    2 weeks ago
I'm not one to worry about pronouns.

'We've' noticed.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
5.1.6  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Hallux @5.1.5    2 weeks ago

I never expected a fan club.

 
 
 
Hallux
Sophomore Principal
5.1.7  Hallux  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.6    2 weeks ago

Is that why you gave them a name?

Moving on ...

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
5.1.8  Sparty On  replied to  Vic Eldred @5.1.6    2 weeks ago

Oh but you do have one, it’s just a bizarro world fan club. 
jrSmiley_82_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
5.1.9  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Sparty On @5.1.8    2 weeks ago

I wouldn't have it any other way.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
6  Sean Treacy    2 weeks ago

The Democrats have become the party of moral scourges, the Tipper Gores of the 2020s. Maher, to his credit, recognizes that.  The zealots running the party have gone all in on the working class white people are evil messaging and they are paying the price.  

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
6.1  seeder  Vic Eldred  replied to  Sean Treacy @6    2 weeks ago

Is that the reason for the need to undermine the status and reputation of straight white conservative males?

 
 
 
Tacos!
Professor Expert
7  Tacos!    2 weeks ago

Maher wants the Democratic Party to do well, and offers them some good advice here. Will they listen? The extreme progressives might not, but some of the more moderate members - who still have some control - might listen.

AOC’s comments about woke-ism seem like some next level gaslighting. I don’t know if AOC knows this, but “stay woke” actually is a very old term when used to refer to racial injustice (especially anti-black police brutality), although I think we can credit BLM for its recent surge in popularity.

So in that respect, I guess you could say old people use it, but if we’re talking about modern politics, not really. Being “woke” is now either virtue signaling or a weapon depending on which side you sit.

I suspect she can see that “woke” is now being appropriated by so many people - on both the Left and the Right - that it has lost whatever more specific meaning it used to have. “Stay Woke” has now become more of a distraction than anything else.

 
 
 
bbl-1
Professor Quiet
8  bbl-1    2 weeks ago

Mr. Mahr, AOC will show up and state her case the best she can.  She is not afraid.  Will McCarthy, Gosar, lil' Tucker or any of the other Trumpian boot polishers?

 
 
 
Ronin2
PhD Quiet
8.1  Ronin2  replied to  bbl-1 @8    2 weeks ago

Maher will shred her to pieces; he is punching well below his weight class in this exchange. AOC is nothing more than a political internet content maker.

Why would a Republican ever go on a liberal leftists show?

That would be like AOC, or any other high ranking Democrat, showing up on any of Fox news talk shows. Let us know when that happens.

 
 
 
Nowhere Man
Junior Participates
8.1.1  Nowhere Man  replied to  Ronin2 @8.1    2 weeks ago

Maher vs AOC? she doesn't make it past the first minute of the first round.... 

I still remember when Maher took on the Housing crash and the causes of it, absolutely destroyed all the sychophants excuses for it and laid it squarely at the feet of Bill and his cronies... The media gladly broadcast it gleefully thinking it would help them, afterwards it disappeared from the screens and internet... The entire democrat political hierarchy was not very happy with him...

He's definitely a liberal but he's nobody's bootlicker...

 
 
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