Four killed in shooting at Georgia high school, suspect is in custody
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
Sept. 4, 2024, 4:06 PM UTC / Updated Sept. 4, 2024, 6:24 PM UTCBy David K. Li, Tom Winter, Jonathan Dienst and Melissa Chan
At least four people were killed and nine others were wounded in a school shootingan hour outside of Atlanta on Wednesday, authorities said.
One suspect was alive and taken into custody following the gunfire at Apalachee High School, according to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation.
Barrow County Sheriff Jud Smith confirmed there were "multiple injuries" at a news conference. He declined to provide more information, saying it would take "multiple days" to determine what happened.
"Every minute, it's developing on what we're finding," he said.
Smith said authorities were working to reunite students with their parents after an "evil thing" occurred at the school.
Follow along for live coverage
The first call reporting an "active shooter" at Apalachee High School came around 9:30 a.m., Smith said. Deputies and emergency medical personnel rushed to the school at about 10:23 a.m., the Barrow County Sheriff's Office said in a statement.
All campuses of Barrow County Schools, based in Winder, Georgia, went into a "soft lockdown" with most of the activity centered around Apalachee H.S. where police cars, fire trucks and ambulances had all converged.
Students could be seen being directed to the school's football stadium.
Apalachee High School in Barrow County, Ga., is placed on lockdown with police on the campus after gunfire was reported on Wednesday.WXIA
"I have directed all available state resources to respond to the incident at Apalachee High School and urge all Georgians to join my family in praying for the safety of those in our classrooms, both in Barrow County and across the state," Gov. Brian Kemp said in statement.
In a statement, President Joe Biden said he was mourning those who were killed, as he pushed Congress to pass gun safety legislation.
"What should have been a joyous back-to-school season in Winder, Georgia, has now turned into another horrific reminder of how gun violence continues to tear our communities apart," Biden said.
"Students across the country are learning how to duck and cover instead of how to read and write," he added. "We cannot continue to accept this as normal."
U.S. Attorney General Merrick Garland said he was "devastated" for the affected families and said the Justice Department was ready to provide support.
Grady Memorial Hospital in Atlanta confirmed that it was treating one gunshot victim.
School has been in session at Apalachee H.S. since Aug. 1.
The school is Barrow County's second high school, according to its website, and opened in 2000.
FBI agents from Atlanta were dispatched to the scene to assist local authorities, officials said.
David K. Li Senior Breaking News Reporter 
Tom Winter Tom Winter is a New York-based correspondent covering crime, courts, terrorism and financial fraud on the East Coast for the NBC News Investigative Unit.
Jonathan Dienst Jonathan Dienst is chief justice contributor for NBC News and chief investigative reporter for WNBC-TV in New York.
Melissa Chan Melissa Chan is a reporter for NBC News Digital with a focus on veterans' issues, mental health in the military and gun violence.
Jay Varela and Elizabeth Maline contributed.
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"Your Honor, jury officials, and members of the audience: I am a gun. I am a tool meant for defense in our country. I do not have any CONSCIENCE" :
What's humanity's 'EXCUSE'?!
Power without conscience is a savage weapon of destruction!
America! Where is our national conscience for our dead citizens 'picked off' in the prime of life? Where is proper, timely, and accurate leadership (when it is needed by all)?
Let me make this as simple as possible for the moronic hoplophobes, a gun is inanimate object. no gun in the history of mankind has gone out and shot anyone.
Yes, we have made note (See 1 above) that a gun does not have a conscience. Humans do have individual consciences, generally-speaking. One more thing: Do not attempt to belittle other commenters with superfluous and taunting words: "moronic' - while you visit with us. Thank you.
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so is a rock. Last I heard no one is worried about folks being stoned to death
Yes John, i'm not worried about getting hit in the head by a rock unless it is in some killers hand. just like i'm not worried about getting killed by a car unless a drunk get's behind the wheel.
sorry, people get shot by the tens of thousands. Being stoned to death is unheard of in America.
in other words all "inanimate objects" are not created equally dangerous.
Sure, because guns and cars are designed to do the exact same thing. /eye roll/
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Correction-- it would be more accurate to say:
so is a rock. Last I heard no one (outside of certain countries in the Middle East and parts of North Africa) is worried about folks being stoned to death
How about guns?
Maybe not in history , but now with advances in AI and robotics...who knows?
And of course the same applies to other weapons as well-- even up to and including atomic bombs!
Donald Trump about a school shooting last January - "we have to get over it"
Prove he said that.
Lol, msnbc plays the clip pretty regularly. Maybe you need to change the channel once in a while.
Here it is. Right after “thoughts and prayers, can’t believe it happened here, some bullshit about Jesus, yada yada …”
Atlanta Mayor Andre Dickens said his “prayers are with the high school students, staff and families affected by the senseless act of violence.”
How nice. Is there a point to your comment?
Yes, I'm sure you aren't going to criticize Mayor Dickens for thoughts & prayers,
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Why can't we use that to protect the border? A lot cheaper and if they are good enough to protect our kids, they are good enough to protect our Southern border. Right Vic?
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Removed for context - sandy
Maybe Joe and Kamala never tried that.
Why wouldn’t I? Anyone who thinks thoughts and prayers is a respectful response to violent mass shooting gun deaths is a douche.
BTW, Donald is shown there reading from TELEPROMPTERS!!! It's small for me to point that out at this time. . . but, since we have other petty individuals who suggest as the spirit moves them that democrats use teleprompters, I want to take this moment to point them to Donald giving his teleprompters
That said, it was a post 'day' of sorrow for another shooting!
Thank you: Share a link, please.
I understand the sentiment. . . as I stated prior to this comment (see timestamp) 5.2, my group prays for school violence to end, because the evidence confirms that some conservative "leaders" are beholden to their ideology and will not be moved by anybody. . . or the threat of wholesale slaughter itself. What I will not do is pray over this shooting. . . for the grave deed is done and is already on its way to receding into the past. Nothing we can do for those who are sure of dying and the dead: That 'moment' has gone bye-bye.
So the dead and those that might die aren't worth your prayers cause their "moment" has passed?
Is it possible that some shootings are a result of school officials and parents not acting on warning signs to avoid stereotyping the kid ‘prematurely’? If so, is that likely from conservative or liberal adults?
We can accept 'thoughts and prayers' -which delineate empathy and compassion for the suffering. But, we can condemn and question 'thoughts and prayers' that standalone and do nothing of the work involved to reduce our children's 'burden' to injure, maim, and murder themselves.
Mayor Andre Dickens: "[S]o we’re doing all we can to get guns off of the street."
Seeing how this individual was flagged and talked to by the local police last year, it would definitely seem that there were red flags that were evident and the adults dropped the ball. How many times do we find out after the fact when someone comes forth to describe the issues they had seen before the event yet it never goes anywhere. How many of these acts could be prevented if people took responsibility?
I think bullet-proof vests for the students would have been of more benefit.
Those who are beyond due to their injuries (sure of dying) and the dead can't be brought back from the approach of the grave or its swallowing them up. Best to take a course of action that will aid the child/ren that remain. My prayers are for the living. It's my opinion. It does not have to be any held by the collective "you/yours."
A counternarrative. I leave it up to the 'experts' to critically access the issues involved with gun violence. What is not open for argument is "help!" is needed. This is not our best look/start to a school year. Now, that school's spirit is tainted and jaded from the outset.
I don’t think that they have come up with much to date.
No doubt, the question is of what kind of help.
I think Hal was replying to John's comment at
"get over it"
That is some world class meaningless babbling right there.
I'm sure that makes all the parents, friends, and relatives of all those who were murdered ..feel much better now!
I saw that on the news as well.
Here's what actually occurred:
A day after a gunman killed a sixth grade student and wounded five other people at Perry High School northwest of Des Moines, Donald Trump returned to the state at a campaign event and told residents that they “have to get over it.”
During his speech at Sioux Center, Iowa , the former president gave his thoughts and prayers to the victims and their families, emphasizing that “we’re really with you as much as anybody can be.” After stating the tragedy was “terrible” and “horrible,” Trump insisted: “We have to get over it. We have to move forward. We have to move forward.”
"as he pushed Congress to pass gun safety legislation."
SOP
Thoughts and prayers I guess.
Morning...I think a lot of people must be running out of both..
Here it's just gone 8am a lovely Spring morning after the last week of crap weather..
Within half a kilometre of my home are 4 schools..the kids actually walk or ride their bikes past my house..my neighbours kids go to the secondary school just down the road...
No one thinks about school mass shootings, there is no security, no metal detectors, no police and no candle light vigils..
I for one hope it stays that way..
The last thing we need are school mass shootings with such ominous regularity as what occurs in the States...
How you stop it, fix it, prevent it, no idea and that is continually detrimental to the country..
Sadly shona, America doesn't look at it that way to our detriment and the ones killed.
I've had 4 happen around me that were way too close. columbine HS, aurora, south platte HS, and boulder king soopers.
Exactly, what’s it about with Colorado? I think it’s been 25 years since Georgia has had a school shooting.
Geez...that is staggering..and also dreadfully sad...
It was such a lovely day. . . and then a dark force rolled in uninvited. I feel for Georgia, . . .actually, I damn near want to cry for the loss of life and innocence: A fourteen-year old is going to be tried as an adult I heard the 'police press officer' announce. My mind reels at that thought (alone) and then there is the deaths and injuries inflicted to ingest!
Oh, how the adults have failed the youth of tomorrow in the United States. Stifled and paralyzed by the Constitution. . .made for people. . . yet not affected by the needs of the electorate because of some conservatives' and their resistance to change (improvement).
Another school season. . .another failure to lead by some conservative adults - kids must rely on to make change that will not be coming. And so we rush headlong into the school term. . . each family household with school-age (college even) child/ren holding our collective breath!
That's the easy part. We could make laws that protect us, save, and guard us from the tools we make and which have come to RULE over us . Yes, we are being suppressed by gun violence in the land of freedom. We're stuck as a nation in an ideological cuppy-hole of conservative intent, deliberation, and 'endurance.'
Bill Withers - Lovely day (1978) (Remastered)
As I listen to this song. . . I am grievously reminded that tomorrow morning several families will wake to empty beds and rooms in their homes. . . and it. . .breaks my strong exterior. They're gone. They're done. Our nation failed them.
I don't have a full 'accounting' of what stirred a fourteen-years old to murder his peers, but it seems that "we," the adults have failed him. . .being made impotent by some conservative ideology 'coursing' through the blood of our shared nation.
Morning CB...
Yes the families and friends of the lost souls will never be the same again..
But as we have seen nothing will change...the Government won't, the laws won't, the people won't...
They will hold the usual vigils, the President will mumble the usual pacifications, there will be the usual flower tributes and the usual signs asking "why"...
But unfortunately there will be someone sitting there thinking and acting "why not" and the same process is repeated time after time..
It's all to late to change from the Government down as it is ingrained in the brain and you will never change that now...and that is truly sad for the country...
I am sad for you, and I mean that devangelical. These incidents have serious repercussions to their surrounding communities because they are part of the whole. I can easily remember the first time I became aware that all around me at any given moment there are men, women, even boys and girls who have guns on their persons. It was 'chilling' to think about that.
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Don't give up on us. As President Biden routinely ends his speeches: 'We're America. . . and if/when we put our minds to it. . .there is nothing we can't do!' (Thereabouts.) I smile when he says that as I agree with the sentiment.
Americans, we're. . . 'something else' - when we get it together as One!
Lyrics:
Can't understandWhy we treat each other in this way Taking up time With the silly silly games we play We've got our love And no matter how it's said or done We are one no matter what we do We are one love will see us through We are one and that's the way it is Sometimes I feel That we try and make each other sad The things we do How we make each other feel so bad We've got so much We could all be having so much fun We are one from the very start We are one deep down in your heart We are one And that's the way it is I Can't understand Why we treat each other in this way Taking up time With the silly silly games we play We've got our love And no matter how it's said or done We are one no matter what we do We are one love will see us through We are one and that's the way it is.
We Are One.
I actually teared up during the second stanza. My heart is with those we have lost and even this fourteen years old kid (no quotes around it) whom life is now ruined before it even properly 'launches.' Enjoy the song*, it's from my heart.
* Frankie Beverly and MAZE.
Please stay on topic. I know we should feel and probably discuss "13 years old and 15 years old beating a sick, disabled old man to death with their feet and hands" - being plummeted to death must be awful, but we're tied up with this tragedy for now!
To me, the topic is what provokes youngsters to kill with no apparent motive.
Completely concur.
I think that we can see the results of PTSD in survivors, not of just the schools but of the communities
And don't forget all the people talking about about "their thoughts and prayers"-- that should make everyone feel much better!
Perhaps all those talking about their thoughts and prayers shouldn't bother? Maybe that would make everyone feel much better?...
My group prays for the start of each school year and doing the year. . . and the best we can aspire to is a reduction in the larger scheme of things. It's all we can do since some conservatives won't help change to come on the use of this dangerous tool by 'angry' and delusional users.
When it comes to this sort of thing the childless cat ladies care more about kids than JD Vance does.
Kids in most cases have been back in school for about a week and we already see something like this. An unknown percentage of kids will be permanently traumatized by this stuff. Is making gun nuts confident they can go to battle against the US military worth all this ?
What do you suggest, registration followed by confiscation?
How long, O' sky above, shall our nation ignore the cries from the grave of the unjustly murdered. . . for the sake of an ideology?
It does appear so. For the sake of an ideology of gun proliferation: The people perish!
I have heard four or five kids that were in the room and watched their classmates get shot describe it on tv. The depressing thing is that they are so matter of fact about it. None of them sounded surprised.
In GA you aren’t even required to lock your guns up. Who is even surprised about this? They’re practically begging for it to happen.
The shooter is a 14 year old kid. Good chance its his momma or daddys gun.
I just heard he will be tried as an adult.
We still know very little about him.
Unless he is a born sociopath, it is highly probable our society has failed this fourteen years old in some sustained way. "We" potentially as the adults surrounding him failed him through omission, commission, or inaction.
Or he could be mentally ill.
(Sheepishly.) Well, I kinda meant "sociopath" as a form of mental illness for our purposes.
There are other forms of mental illness that can make a person commit violent actions. The system for treating these types of illness is neither complete nor robust. There is a good podcast about some of the difficulties faced by the mentally ill and their families. KUOW
I agree that society, starting with the child's parents, likely failed to identify whatever condition he has and subsequently failed to provide help. The problems in the US are systemic in nature and aggravated by the stochastic nature of the illnesses.
My friend, keep in mind, the story of this fourteen years old is developing. I stipulate a conditional: "Unless he is a born sociopath. . . " - I don't know for sure that is the case as his motivation/s for shooting and murdering others is not known to me (yet). That is, he may not be mentally ill at all. There is some mention that he had a 'prior' run-in and 'review' with law enforcement in 2023 thereabouts. But even so it did not ascertain his mental state. Indeed, he 'passed' the authorities initial look and see at the time.
(Your link looks interesting. It will take some time to go through, nevertheless.)
Okay, friend Thomas, more information is coming out (and is evidence of your point/concern):
Why do parents/adults ('everybody') hear the 'cries' of their children? This is not the first time we have heard this of this type of omission in a case of gun violence! Adults ('everybody') listen up to the children gathered near and by you! Please be attentive to the cries of a child/ren in desperate need with mental health requests.
Because, even if a child is successful in passing through mental health challenges - s/he could REVISIT those unhealed, unhealthy, and unSAFE 'passages' through life as an adult!
Pssst-- I'll let you in on a little secret-- its also a form of mental illness for some other people as well!
Well, since we;re using fancy words here, consider this: isn't all life "stochastic".
Nope.
New just in: the father gave it to the kid as a present!
The father of the 14-year-old suspected of fatally shooting four people at Apalachee High School had given his son an AR-15 style rifle as a gift, two law enforcement sources said.
Stochastic is usually used to indicate the seemingly unpredictable timing of a negative situation, so hopefully all life is not stochastic.
Gov. Mike Lee in 2022: "We don't need more gun laws, we need God."
Seems to be working pretty well. /s
we need teabag geezus holding an AR...
Anyone remember this?:
I dont care if it rains or freezes
As long as I've got my plastic Jesus
Riding on the dashboard of my car
Through my trials and tribulations, and my travels through the nations
With my plastic Jesus I'll go far
So where is God?
Pretty sure he wasn't in Georgia this week
I think you're right.
But let's be reasonable-- you can't expect God to be everywhere at once!
Let's be reasonable-- there are things that God actually can not do!
(After all, he's only human!!!)
He's supposed to be omnipotent
And while we're on the subject of stochastics ... let'sremeber that all this could've been much worse-- if we didn't have all those extremely helpful "thoughts and prayers!
Another day starts here and another mass school shooting in the US..
You don't need God, you need help!!..
In what way, shape or form even I am at a loss with this insane mentality..
the maga folks are going to require all public school classrooms to have the 10 commandments posted on real large stone tablets that the children can hide behind when the shooting starts... /s
Maybe if they put the commandments on steel doors leading into the classrooms that maybe more beneficial than stone..
I get what you mean but the stupidity of people at times is really quite staggering..
I blame democrats for creating gov't safety measures to keep maga morons from darwin-izing themselves...
... and encouraging them to reproduce is borderline criminal.
Hi shona1.
By any chance are you familiar with the NRA?
Not Real Americans
Meta cleaned up @8.1
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Really?..
Really.
We rode on horses made of sticks
He wore black and I wore white
He would always win the fight
Bang bang, I hit the ground
Bang bang, that awful sound
Bang bang, my baby shot me down
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Meh, screw it
HOW TO BECOME AN OVERNIGHT MULTIMILLIONAIRE IN AMERICA
Manufacture bullet-proof vests in children's sizes and promote them to the American public - an absolute necessity. It won't need a lot of promotion, the shooters advertise the necessity far and wide. Any parent who loves their kids would be a surefire customer. If my son in Milwaukee didn't buy them, I'd squeeze what I could from my pension to supply them to my grandkids.
It was long ago, so I don't remeber the details. But after a major mass shooting, some company made bulltet proff vests for kids. IIRC, they also made bullet proof back packs for kids.
I'll bet those who sell them will see sales increase every time there's another school shooting.
The Blast Effect
This is how bullets from an AR-15 blow the body apart
For those of us who want to see what an AR-15 does to the human body (Important: internally) do:
1. Follow the link above.
2. The page may appear STATIC - it is not it is INTERACTIVE. That is, use your mouse stroller to continuously strode down the page and the angles and degrees of information and interactivity will 'execute.
REMEMBER: The interactivity on the page is due to your downward 'movement' on the page until you get to its end. (You can pause and then resume as you wish too!)
Increase you understanding of what kind of weapon an AR-15 is and why it should not be used on any child!
By all means, come back here and discuss what you see and learn from the interactive materials!
I learned that the AR15 doesn't cause the damage as people want to believe it causes. There are far more damaging weapons out there now for civilians to purchase. For example a Glock 9mm or Smith and Wesson .357. Or a Mossberg 590. I first used the Mossberg in Afghanistan. (Yes, the US Army has them in their inventory.) You can also purchase one from places like Academy Sports. Mine cost me about $800 with everything I had in Afghanistan and it's 100% legal, just like the AR 15.
One interesting thing is that these weapons, really are harmless. It takes somebody to hold them and manipulate them for them to operate. So when are people going to be ready to deal with the actual problem?
See 1 that begins the comments, please. Also, this 'kid-shooter used an AR-15 we are being told by those authorities on the scene. We should deal with this-not other guns.
I am more interested in the kids motive than what firearm he used .
All firearms can be deadly no matter what the type or action .
and how deadly depends on the person and their mind set .
I didn't reply to 1. I replied to 14.
See 1., please.
If I wanted to reply to 1, I would have. I didn't. I replied to 14.
Okay.
Somebody dropped the ball and it cost people their lives.
I read they notified local police who interviewed the father and son. Father said son had no access to guns used for hunting. Wondering what you think FBI/local police should have done? He was on their watch list, but what exactly does that mean, constant watching of the boy? Lock the boy up, put him in a mental institution? Wouldn't that be construed as "police state".
Wonder how many tips the FBI gets in a day, probably hundreds, how to follow up? Again, if the FBI did follow up on these tips, perhaps lock down all the schools, go after anyone who was on their watch list in the area...and then nothing happened, people would be complaining about overreach, harassment. Tell us what you would have FBI/local police do whenever they receive tips.
More than what was done. But are we really surprised over an FBI failure? That seems to be their thing for the past few years.
The complexities of fourteen years olds running around states murdering people can not be the fault of officials who have never interacted with 'locals.' And no, the FBI can not go about their profession monitoring a child/ren or adults without probable cause. Doing so would be unprofessional and invite 'judgement,' in my opinion.
So no ideas, just complaining.
How about every time they get a tip about possible gun violence, they take away the person/family guns. That would go over well, don't you think?
For once I agree. But the parents play a very large role in all of that. Their friends, neighbors, acquaintances and, yes, even law enforcement play a role. EVERY ONE OF THEM failed.
I cant say they could have done much more , some would like to think they could have , but there are a lot of factors to consider .
This would run afoul of the Second Amendment right to own a gun/s. . .by even some of the worst of humanity. Apparently, the nation has not reached its 'saturation point' or the 'right type' of gun violence killings to spur change. Perhaps we can get some official changes to the Constitution related to guns. . . when we get more 'sophisticated' guns. . . that can take out something (NOTE: this is rhetorical/effect only) on the scale of an entire classroom or public sitting area at once!
There are too many moving 'parts' to this. It is impossible to outsmart a smart person who has time on his/her side as to when to speak about their intentions to act and when to just act unsolicited. As everyone knows, parents (and authorities) can only do so much before it rubs up against a constitutional set of 'arguments' for which nowadays a conservative majority on the SCOTUS gets the last word. (So maybe SCOTUS failed this fourteen years old, his parents,neighbors, acquaintances, and law enforcement.)
See 8.1.10 it partially agrees that the parents had a role to play in their child's mental health 'state' and failed this fourteen years old!
Thankfully the SRO got to him quickly before he could shoot other victims.
It appears that Kamala doesn't approve of the idea of having cops in schools.
Flashback: Kamala Harris Called for Removing Police from Schools (townhall.com)
The last paragraph - "Harris has yet to release he political platform" tells us that she still stands by the idea she doesn't want to protect the country's children. Kind of against what is normally called common sense. That whole quote, she's pandering to the criminal element. Which, sadly, is not the least bit surprising.
That happens all too often.
The shooters father was arrested on murder charges today. He bought the gun as a present for the kid after the FBI talked to him over the threats.
How dense is that?! I agree: Arrest him. This boy's aunt states that her nephew, the shooter/murder, had been "begging for months" for mental health help (see 8.1.10). What kind of parent could hear the question and be so vain or callous or both to not take their child for evaluation. It is not the kind of thing that a child would joke or play around with requesting.
I am glad this father is arrested. He has some explaining to do in a court of law, that is.
By the way, a mentally disturbed child in a house with guns. . . could have just as easily 'dispensed' with his father and other in-house family members. It was in the interest of the household to get. the. fourteen years old. help!
I remember. some time ago, the perp was a kid who lived with his parents-- and the gun(s) were appropriately locked up!
So how did he get access?
Simple-- his father wasn't home and he threated his mother with violence if she didn't open the lock!
Voila!
He should be charged. Knowing his child has mental problems and FBI contacts him and he buys him a gun. Some people should not have kids
It's child abuse. Where is the mom? I don't know 'where' she is in this. It would be appropriate to ask if she has a role in this 'abuse.'
Arvo CB..
She is tangled up in drugs and seems to be a rather vicious divorce..cops being called on to each other, she keyed his truck and also failed a drug test..the family sounds feral..evicted from homes etc etc..
The grandfather said he is a good kid and this was caused by his home life... wouldn't have helped but no excuse...
Know plenty of kids over the years that came from crappy homes but they never took a gun and shot innocent people..they made the best of what they had and have done very well for themselves....
that always leads to a restful 8 hours of sack time...
The 'sweetest revenge' —go make something good (even relatively great) out of yourself! Not die in infamy or behind 'rusty, smelly, bars' of prisons and mental institutions (if you can help it on the latter).
I won't criticize the mother then. . . I won't say anything good regarding her at this point either!
you got that right
And adults SMH
Some unknown issue is really wrong with some of us in this country. I don't know if it is all the freedom 'excesses' or any number of mental illnesses coursing through the nation's 'blood-stream' - but, as a nation we, collectively, have a gun ("tool") sickness!
This fourteen years old, who shot and killed four in Georgia, is in court today, and he sits there seemingly unaffected by the heinous and grave violence he has done. . . and the consequences he faces from the law. (His back is to the camera so we don't get to see his face, nevertheless!)
No we don't we have a soft on crime issue and bad parenting.
Well, you know, it's self-defeating to keep an ideology in place that is incrementally killing this nation's children/adults. It's not a 'best practice.' Moreover, you can't keep putting youths and now kid's parents into institutions and 'holding' facilities for decades. . . that is a sign of a failure of insight and new ideas.
If you get a chance, google the rates of gun violence in several other "advanced countries"...then compare to the rae of gun violence in the U.S,
Posted without additional commentary. Just let it speak for itself.