Minneapolis ICE Shooting – New Videos
Finally, here's something showing the moments before the other videos begin.
Thoughts...
- I had previously speculated she might have just been turning around, but this seems to show Good's vehicle sideways in the road, blowing whistles and honking the horn, well before the agent who shoots her had pulled in on her right side.
- Most of the other vehicles seem to be unmarked ICE vehicles, and Good does appear to be intentionally blocking traffic.
***
Everyone has probably seen this one by now, but I'll post it again for reference.
Thoughts...
- I keep seeing reports that Good said "I'm not mad at you" to the agent, but it sounds to me like there's more there, something like "I'm not mad at your wife" or "I'm not mad at your life", but those don't make sense. Maybe it was "I'm not mad at you, alright", but that still doesn't really make sense. Why would she be saying she wasn't mad at him in the first place? I can't figure that out.
- The woman outside Good's vehicle (identified as her wife) was talking shit to the agent. I'm sorry to say it, but honestly, she sounded like a fool.
- I had previously speculated that Good might not have known the agent had walked in front of her vehicle, but this shows her face well enough that it appears she was facing forward and not completely focused on the agent to her side.
- As the agent to her side began trying to extricate her from the vehicle, Good's wife shouts "Drive, baby, drive! Drive!", which may have actually been the reason Good tried to pull away. She had begun to back out of the roadway immediately prior to that.
- It still seems obvious to me that she was NOT trying to hit the agent. She was obviously turning to her right, and the agent was on her left. If you want to drive into something you turn toward it, not away from it.
- The agent was only a couple of feet from the vehicle when it began to move forward from a stop. She couldn't have accelerated to more than a couple miles per hour in those couple of feet. And as shown in other videos, whatever amount of glancing contact occurred couldn't have been much, and was not a threat to his life. She certainly did not run him over and put him in the hospital as Trump claimed.
- Something I'm still unclear about – why did he draw his weapon in the first place? None of the other agents did. Not even the one ordering her out of the vehicle.
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I expect Patel's FBI to find the agent acted according to procedure or something and clear him of wrongdoing, but I still think the shooting was completely unwarranted and completely wrong.
There is no evidence that I have seen that he was actually hit, and there is a fair amount of evidence that he wasnt. What she said to the cop or what her wife said to the cop is irrelevant.
For that matter whether or not she was blocking traffic is irrelevant.
It may be that he was glancingly bumped or pushed a little, as close as he was to her fender, but other videos show his feet out of the way and she was definitely not trying to run him over. She was turning away from him, not toward him.
I am still looking for the ICE agents stuck in a show bank. Not one video shows that... Weird because we know Noem would never lie to us....
/s
In the list of "thoughts" where is the lawful order she was given to get out of the car?
That's been known since the beginning.
Yet we seldom hear it mentioned. Why do you suppose they gave her that order?
Non rabid cops walk up to someone in a traffic situation and calmly ask them to show ID or step out. They dont begin by terrifying the motorist. There are countless you tube videos that show this. The cop that grabbed at the door should be fired.
“Non rabid cops walk up to someone in a traffic situation and calmly ask them to show ID or step out.”
Non-idiot citizens follow cops orders. They tell you to get out of the car, you get out of the car.
”They dont begin by terrifying the motorist.”
lmfao, watch the videos again. Those idiots weren’t terrified. They were mocking the LEO’s. That dumbass played with fire and got burned
She was blocking traffic at a time when ICE was about to leave. I've heard reports that she had been doing it the whole day.
She didn't appear terrified. She was grinning & taunting.
She was not free to leave.
As I recall you seem to think protestors have no restrictions, nor do they have to follow instructions of the police.
Why are they dressed in camouflage? Does it make them brave?
Really?
You can't see it on the original video that the media used to spin their narrative, but on the agent's video her "wife" was about to get in on the other side at the same time the agent had his hand on the door, when she gunned it.
There is no video of her grinning after the ICE grabbed at her drivers side door. I dont know what you are hallucinating.
It is irrelevant.
What is relevant are facts regarding the killing of a human being.
There is no excuse for people attempting to blame this woman and defend the actions of this agent. It is despicable.
It happens to be their uniform, just like the Minneapolis cops who should have been out there keeping the road open have a uniform.
what the fuck does that have to do with anything?
This comment is a demonstration of pure emotion that (outrageously) ignores the facts.
I don't know that he gave her a reason. I haven't seen a video where he can be heard giving her one, which is something I'm pretty sure cops are supposed to do. I've also read that witnesses said she was given conflicting orders (though I haven't personally heard that on video myself).
Regardless, none of that was a reason to shoot her. It isn't even the reason given for the shooting.
I know that. Why? is the question. I guess it makes them feel badass.
“Why are they dressed in camouflage?”[✘]
You need to watch the video.
I have watched dozens of videos, researched the law, wrote plenty about this and provided several logical, factual arguments as to why the agent was tragically wrong.
You are the one who is denying reality, not me.
You cannot defend this with facts, all you have is bullshit like "watch the video".
Wrong. Any law enforcement officer has the right to defend themselves.
2. The time it takes for an ICE agent to (while holding his cellphone in his left hand) pull out his firearm, ready his aim, fire a shot into the corner of the windshield, reposition, fire into the driver's window is far greater than what he should have done: step aside if he felt he was in the path of the car.
Wrong. He was facing a deadly weapon, which was that vehicle. He has every right to defend himself. What took place happened within seconds.
3. Even with all that he did, this agent ALSO stepped clear of the car and was unharmed. He is shown walking down to inspect his kill and then walking back. So clearly, he had plenty of time to follow protocol and simply step clear of the vehicle.
Wrong. There are two subsequent videos which question if he was brushed etc. Even the mayor who is worse than anyone here acknowledged that he might have been brushed by the van.
4. The vehicle moved back and then moved forward with the tires pointing to the road and thus not pointing at the agent. Even after she was shot, the momentum of the vehicle continued down the street. It did not directly move onto the curb (which is what it would have done if she was trying to run over the agent).
Wrong. I'm not sure when the wheels turned, but the shot lined up directly from agent to activist.
5. We can all verify these facts with video and with supporting sources. NT has provided many comments with videos and links to authoritative sources backing up the above.
Wrong. You can't verify what was in the mind of agent or activist. The agent's video was most important. It shows her backing up and gunning it forward and the agent losing the cell phone. NT members can debate it, but they don't conduct the investigation, neither does the state of Minnesota which has fought against federal law.
I will wait for the results of the investigation, and I will stand by whatever the outcome is.
Cut the shit John. She was doing it all day.
I'm sure the smile faded after the bullet went through it. You know what they say ... "when you play with fire ...
I’ve watched multiple videos and in each video the libs were taunting and mocking the LEO’s.
this may come as a surprise but i 100% disagree with your bullshit opinion.
Discerning people are not concerned with happened "all day", they are concerned with what happened at the scene.
You are arguing from pure fantasy. You have invented an alternate reality.
Wrong. Absolutely absurdly wrong. Officers and agents have rules of engagement. Protocol. I have shown to you many times now that ICE rules state that an agent should not fire on a moving vehicle except when he has reasonable (i.e. factual, not unreasonable) fear of imminent death. That is clearly NOT the case.
Bullshit. He had time to kill the driver (as I described) AND also step aside. It is sickening that you refuse to acknowledge that he thus had plenty of time to follow protocol and step aside. Just sickening.
Even if he was brushed, those videos also show he positioned himself in front of the vehicle and then drew his weapon. Again, you ignore the facts.
You are flat out refusing to accept reality. This is just bizarre.
Again with this dishonest crap. I have not stated what is the driver's mind. I have stated that her wheels were turned toward the road. Pay attention.
And I have not stated what is in the agent's mind. I have instead noted protocol and the timing involved that allowed him (obviously) to have followed protocol and step aside.
You have no honest argument so you put forth bullshit (above) and then fall back on the cliche 'we will just have to wait and see' excuse.
You don't get away with when a cell phone video starts rolling. There is enough on that video to indicate to me that she was about to be arrested.
She interfered with law enforcement, and she ignored a lawful order and in the end, she got herself killed.
Interference / ignoring is not a capital offense. Focus. This woman was killed by an ICE agent. There is no argument that you have made based on actual facts and reality to justify the killing of this woman.
I see no argument from you, no facts. Just 'nuh-uh'. You have nothing.
Policy never takes precedent over self defense.
It is sickening that you refuse to acknowledge that he thus had plenty of time to follow protocol and step aside. Just sickening.
What is sickening is that anyone would politicize the death of some misguided soul.
Even if he was brushed, those videos also show he positioned himself in front of the vehicle and then drew his weapon.
She WAS ORDERED TO GET OUT OF THE VEHICLE. She was not free to just take off. If a cop stands in front of your vehicle, what do you do?
Again with this dishonest crap. I have not stated what is the driver's mind.
Very good. So, if he says that in that split second, I feared for my life, I'm sure you will accept it.
You have no honest argument so you put forth bullshit (above) and then fall back on the cliche 'we will just have to wait and see' excuse.
I'm simply waiting for the results of an investigation. Remember, when you said you wanted to wait on the facts of the Wuhan lab leak. I'm doing what you taught me.
You know who else always hides their faces? Terrorists.
No she didn't, they drove up to HER... Not the other way around Vic.
That is the one thing you got right. Once the investigation is over, I might just make that very argument, but until then it's all conversation.
Literally nothing you said is even remotely true.
You could always watch the fuckin' video.
Which of those things is punishable by death?
Let’s see, were the libs parked perpendicular in the street, blocking it? Yes
Were the libs acting in a defiant, mocking, taunting way? Yes
did the lib defy LEO orders to exit the vehicle? Yes
Did the lib hit the LEO with her car? Yes
did she play with fire? Yes, and she got burned. Was it legal? I don’t know. I’m not an attorney and won’t pretend to be one like so many others. Let the court system decide that.
those are facts, i see nothing from you
Good advice. You should heed it because nothing you are saying is consistent with the video.
Typical reactionary propaganda intended to dehumanize anyone who isn't a fascist.
Thanks for adding some non-partisan opinions to the discussion.
Prove she was a liberal? Did you check her card? ID? Do you have some video of her, "being a lib"? Grow the fuck up.
More invented bullshit from you. Here is a real simple case to get you to think through the utter nonsense you just posted.
A completely different scenario: Imagine a woman yells at an officer and then attempts to slap him with her hand. He then declares self-defense and kills her. Now you tell me if policy takes precedence over self-defense.
Officers and agents (and soldiers) operate within a framework of rules. There is no rule that says 'if you feel someone is attacking you, you can kill them'
Now read the legal framework:
I included the vehicular pursuit part because it is the proper protocol in this situation. It is not protocol to fire on a moving vehicle, the protocol is to pursue it.
Exactly what you are doing. The pathetic projection is staggering. I am (properly based on facts and reason) defending this woman, and you are trying to blame her. Against the facts and irrationally. For obvious partisan/ideological reasons (i.e. parroting Trump).
No, again you flat-out ignore what you do not want to hear. I have repeatedly stated that he must have reasonable fear of imminent death. The irrational fantasies of someone do not give the license to kill. Just amazing I have to spell this shit out for people.
The major difference is that the facts are known. With Wuhan we did not know the facts. More dishonesty from you.
Swing and a miss. She is turning the wheel AWAY from terrorist Ross. What else ya got?
Interference / ignoring is not a capital offens
No shit. She wasn't executed.
She was killed after she put a law enforcement officer in reasonable fear of being hurt.
She literally drove her SUV into him. To claim that having an SUV on a path to hit you (inarguable since it did) doesn't create a reasonable fear of being hurt defies all notions of rational thought. It's just pure partisanship.
A stupid comment. She was killed and there is no justification for it.
A flat out demonstrable lie. You keep repeating the same blatant lies no matter what facts emerge. It is disgusting to watch.
[✘] Even the most partisans of Democrats stopped saying she didn't hit him after the cell phone video came out. Even they couldn't keep up the lie at that point. .
[✘] He was standing in front of her. She hit him with your SUV. That is acknowledged reality by all but the most crazed progressives at this point. Follow your crowd and justify hitting him or claiming it's not that big of deal to strike an LEO with your car. The lie that she didn't hit him is untenable. It's pitiful.
Perfect. I have posted volumes on this yet you see nothing.
A perfect example of confirmation bias.
Your 'argument' is pathetic but I will still address it:
Irrelevant. Blocking traffic does not warrant death.
Irrelevant. Mocking ICE agents does not warrant death.
Irrelevant. Refusal to leave her vehicle does not warrant death.
False. The agent clearly stepped in front of car, driver corner, pulled his weapon before the car even started moving. The driver turned her wheels to the street and was moving toward the street (not directly at the agent). You are denying reality.
What she did was minor. Playing with fire would be something like brandishing a weapon, charging an officer, etc. Being obnoxious is pretty normal in circumstances like these. For you to think this justifies being killed is truly disgusting.
Then do some fucking research and find out. Stop spewing bullshit to defend the administration and deal with the facts.
By the way, does it even occur to you that you referred to this woman as 'the lib' rather than as a woman, a civilian, a citizen? No, to you she is a 'lib'. Just broadcasts a bias in clear terms.
“Thanks for adding some non-partisan opinions to the discussion”
Lmao, that comment is dripping with irony.
”Prove she was a liberal? Did you check her card? ID? Do you have some video of her, "being a lib"?”
I’ve no doubt that some would be confused by this but conservatives aren’t out there protesting the roundup of illegals, acting like total f’ing morons, blocking streets, defying LEO orders etc.
”Grow the fuck up.”
you first.
I know someone else that those rules should apply to, right now ...
He had to lean in to make the shot through the windshield. Other videos show this, and also show that his feet were off to the side. If he hadn't leaned in to shoot her, whatever brushing contact occurred with the vehicle might not have even occurred.
Except, they are. Constantly. Like no one's ever seen before.
More lies from you.
You said she literally drove her SUV into him. That is a lie; she drove her vehicle toward the road. Her tires were taking the vehicle away from the agent, not toward the agent.
Some fuzzy, distant videos make it look as though the car hit the guy. Others show that he remained clear of the vehicle. At the worst, the driver's front might have brushed against him. But even that does not seem to be true when we look at the clear videos.
Any rational review would realize that she did not literally drive her car into him.
Watch this very clear video:
Not only does this show her wheels toward the road and that even after being shot her car continued down the road (and was clearly NOT directed at the agent).
No one said it did. But it's a crime and rules out the idea that she was there by mistake or not trying to obstruct ICE operations.
Mocking ICE agents does not warrant death.
No said it did but it demonstrates a hostile attitude towards the LEO/
sal to leave her vehicle does not warrant death.
No one said it did. but It's a crime and again, signals to the LEO that she is hostile, criminal and will not comply with orders.
All of these things are very relevant to what the LEO has to process when she decides to ignore the LEOs and drive into the LEO who shot her.
I
My argument has been that there was no justification for killing this woman. Focus.
Again with this sick lie.
She hit him. Period.
me fuzzy, distant videos make it look as though the car hit the guy.
Great, you are going to go with the "I deny reality" approach. Nothing more needs to be said.
“Perfect. I have posted volumes on this yet you see nothing.
A perfect example of confirmation bias.”
yes, i’ve seen the volumes of opinion you have posted. Your opinions have not swayed, nor impressed.
” Irrelevant. Blocking traffic does not warrant death.”
“ Irrelevant. Mocking ICE agents does not warrant death.”
” Irrelevant. Refusal to leave her vehicle does not warrant death.”
show me where i said it does? I did say i’m not a lawyer, or legal expert and won’t pretend to be one like some others do.
” False. The agent clearly stepped in front of car, driver corner, pulled his weapon before the car even started moving. The driver turned her wheels to the street and was moving toward the street (not directly at the agent). You are denying reality.”
none of the videos show this part clearly, his phone did get a good jolt, suggesting she brushed or hit him.
” What she did was minor. Playing with fire would be something like brandishing a weapon, charging an officer, etc.”
we have a different opinion, surprise
of playing with fire.
” Stop spewing bullshit to defend the administration and deal with the facts.”
lmfao, that’s funny as hell right there.
” By the way, does it even occur to you that you referred to this woman as 'the lib' rather than as a woman, a civilian, a citizen?”
yep
” No, to you she is a 'lib'.”
yep, because that’s what she is.
“ Just broadcasts a bias in clear terms.”
No, just broadcast the truth in clear terms.
What is the nature of your proof that the car hit him? And dont say "reality".
So you ignored the video.
What do you hope to accomplish by putting forth this utter bullshit that is shown to be false by actual footage?
You are floundering. You continue to have no rebuttal. Every time you just post more bullshit. Not even clever bullshit, just the kind of crap one would expect from someone who does not have the facts and does not care to secure the facts.
No, i’m not floundering, i’m doing great, thanks for the concern though.
Like every time we converse, we hit a dead end. You disagree with my opinion, i disagree with your opinion. Have a great day, tig.
YOui think think that video show the car missing him? Good lord.
Just remember you denied the vehicle struck him despite any number videos showing otherwise. It's your credibility you are destroying. When your own team has stopped with pushing a lie you should probably pay attention. Even they are too embarrassed to push that lie anymore.
Your comments have zero credibility at this point. You keep repeating the same lies. It is exactly what Trump does.
Another lie. Read my words:
Bottom line, there is no justification for this agent to kill this woman.
You offer no argument. You ignore the facts. But you insist you are right. Of course it will end this way.
[✘]
I offered an argument, you just didn’t agree with it. I put up facts that YOU ignored. And yes, i think i am right, and you are wrong. And that’s fine it ends this way. Why keep going back and forth when it’s obvious we will never agree?
What you offered was quips, not an argument. You provided no facts and offered no logical structure that supported a conclusion.
You offered what I stated, nothing but bullshit.
What about the due process you argued emotionally for when it came to the "Maryland man?"
Don't you believe in due process anymore.
Instead of calling people liars and dishonest, I suggest you wait for the findings of the investigation.
I take it you prefer your bullshit to my bullshit?
My argument was not emotional, it was based on cold hard facts.
I have not suggested that the agent not be afforded due process. You are yet again making shit up.
I have not called anyone a liar. I have noted lies penned in posts. I have noted that lies are dishonest.
Don't lie. Follow the facts. Trump is a horrible role model, do not follow his lead.
You have no argument so now you are resorting to feeble gotcha attempts.
whose findings? state LE or the known liars, criminals, and unamerican sycophants in trump's circle of scum?
I posted this screenshot in another discussion, but I'll post it here, too. Look how far he has to lean to make that first shot through the windshield. He's almost lying on her hood. That's why whatever contact that was made occurred. If he hadn't been trying so hard to shoot her in the face he might not have been touched.
It's as if his decision to shoot is what caused the glancing contact in the first place. In other words, the justification for the shooting – purportedly that she hit him with her vehicle – wouldn't even have happened if he hadn't leaned in so far to shoot. It's like putting the cart before the horse.
It doesn’t make a lot of sense to simultaneously say that law enforcement wanted her to leave, and that also she was not free to leave. You gotta pick one. And if law enforcement isn’t clear about what they want, it’s not reasonable to expect perfect compliance. And even if they were clear, that doesn’t justify shooting her.
They were very clear. She was ordered to get out of the car.
It's on tape.
They just dropped their 6 year old off at school at 9:35. Two minutes later she was dead.
maybe you should depend on more reliable news sources?
Why would they do that? On what authority? Were they or were they not also trying to get her to move her car? If not, why not?
The guy trying to open her door isn't even the one that shot her. The shooter was clearly not in the way of the vehicle. Even if he did get bumped, it was slight. I got bumped by a car in a parking lot and it was going slightly faster than this car. I didn't even suffer a bruise
Why don't you be the first to rest your fingers if you're not getting anywhere?
Some (probably most) Trump supporters do not care about the obvious facts. Anyone who is still supporting Trump by now is likely to support him no matter what he does. Look at the feeble, ridiculous, desperate attempts to defend the Trump administration in this killing of a woman by an ICE officer.
My spouse just posted the stupidest post he posted on facebook about this shooting. I told him he makes me want to exit this world
My condolences. Happily, my wife is rational and objective and does not buy bullshit from talking heads.
he changed in the 36 years we've been married
what fucking moron would risk pissing you off knowing that you know where he sleeps? ... never mind, maga ...
obviously the one I'm married to
Why? What crime had she committed that warranted such an order? There has to be a clear articulable crime for them to even ask for her ID.
Is It Illegal for Protesters to Block Roads? - LegalClarity
Irrelevant. There is no point in identifying what she did wrong because she is dead and cannot be prosecuted.
The only concern at this point is what she did to warrant being killed.
What, specifically, do you think she did to warrant being killed?
( Waiting now for Trump administration propaganda to be parroted. )
What I think isn't important. I wasn't standing in front of a 4,000-ton vehicle with an ideologue behind the wheel who decided to gun it out of there when told to exit the vehicle. You see, TiG, only the person whose life is on the line gets to decide what is warranted.
What I will do is to stand by the results of the investigation. How about you?
No, what is important are the facts and the evidence illustrates clearly what happened. Pay attention to it.
WRONG. That is the whole point of the protocol. The use of lethal force is a function of a reasonable belief, not just a belief, not just a feeling. It is the investigation (and criminal trial) that would determine if a professed belief was reasonable based on the circumstances.
If that were not the case then any officer could kill at any time and simply claim they had a fear of imminent death.
I would accept a state investigation and the verdict from a legitimate jury trial. I do not have any trust in the corrupt Trump administration (or its DoJ). Nobody should given the obvious lies the administration has and continues to tell about the circumstances. Starting with the liar in chief who claims that the officer was viciously run over by a domestic terrorist and that he is recovering in the hospital. Or by his henchwoman, Noem, who insists that Good was a domestic terrorist who weaponized a vehicle and attacked officers who were trying to free a vehicle stuck in snow.
Do these demonstrable, extreme lies not bother you Vic? What justifies you or anyone in trusting anything these people claim at this point?
It's only a lawful order if the officer identifies themselves as a police officer or as an immigration officer. Someone who is not a police officer or immigration officer cannot issue lawful orders. Was the individual harassing Good an officer with authority to issue lawful orders? Did they identify themselves?
Or was the individual only harassing Good so that Ross could take an easy head shot. Ross was in the perfect place at the perfect time, wasn't he? Ross wasn't where he was by accident.
Exactly, he positioned himself for a shot.
Shot one, premeditated.
Shots two and three, hopefully, career ending.
True. It’s also only lawful if they have the legal authority to give the order. Police are empowered to enforce traffic laws, for example, but ICE agents are not. They only have authority to enforce federal immigration law. Unless they had some kind of reasonable suspicion that she was an alien, or engaged in alien trafficking or something, or actively interfering with their jobs, they would not have had the authority to order her out of the car.
That last option is their best one, but it’s hard to see even that argument working when other vehicles could clearly go around her. And it’s not clear what, if anything, ICE was even doing there.
never happen. He will go merrily on his way looking for his next victim
With a corrupt DoJ as we have now, you are likely correct.
Morning...
I was more concerned about the dog in the back seat of the car... hopefully it survived the crash and wasn't injured...
To be honest I am over stupid bloody human beings and their stupid bloody actions they then find themselves in...
From people walking around with their mobile phones stuck in people's faces, (stick a mobile phone in my face and see what happens), from yabbering away like brain dead morons, to trigger happy officials shooting others...not just in this case either..
Give me a dog and cat any day over humans, at least they are more intelligent and respectful than our so called "human race"..🐾🐾
Now what's for brekkie?...
I am more concerned with this poor woman's 3 children who now have no mother.
Yes that is true but at least there is still family there for them..those two little words..."if only"..
My empathy for my fellow humans has been waning in the last few years not sure why...I actually mentioned it to my doctor maybe the chemo fried some brain cells or something, stuffed if I know..
I now just find the human races stupidity and circumstances mind boggling at times and just shake my head and keep going....
trump will give her 3 kids $8 million each. that seems to be the going rate for the survivors of unarmed females that get shot by LE, thanks to that protester (insurrectionist) ashli babbit ...
You left out, "terrorist".
I saw a picture or video somewhere of the other woman sitting with the dog a little while after the incident, so I suppose it's okay. I'd show it, but with so much media out there I'm not sure where I saw it.
Lot's of distractions for Renee, an ICE officer trying to open her door or grab her arm.
Her wife tried the passenger door but it was locked and the dog was agitated, pacing back and forth between Renee and the open right rear door window.
Renee was incapacitated by the windshield shot. If she had accelerated, Ross would never had gotten off two shotts through the open window.
ICE lied again, shocker. They did not "have their own Medic". They had to wait for the County ambulance. They removed Good from the car to work on her on the side walk.
Ice lied again, reporting shots fired by locals.
The Minneapolis Fire Department responded to 911 calls from the ICE employees.