Thinking the unthinkable on a Second Civil War

Thinking the unthinkable on a Second Civil War
Via:   heartland-american
Created:   3 months ago
Comments:   178

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Mass psychosis has gripped a significant fraction of the progressive regressive elites in the wake of their shock at the election and presidency of Donald Trump. The open embrace by California and some other jurisdictions of nullification – the doctrine that states can ignore or obstruct federal law – is recapitulating the run-up to our 19th-century Civil War. Serious publications are taking seriously the possibility of an actual armed conflict.

The notion some on the left have that they would gain from such a conflict is insane on every level. It would be a catastrophe of world historical dimensions, unleashing every bad actor in the world to enact its dream aggressions: China attacking Taiwan, Iran attacking Israel, and Russia restoring the old USSR borders, for starters.

But how about the question of who would win? Kurt Schlichter on Town Hall takes a cold, hard look at the question and concludes (correctly) that the blue-staters would get their posteriors handed to them. His article, titled "Why Democrats Would Lose the Second Civil War, Too," is must-reading, albeit unpleasant to contemplate. I think he is highly realistic:

Do I think there will be a civil war? No, but there could be. This is the Age of Black Swans, and anything is possible – we could easily see the country split into red and blue. Civil war is unlikely, but never underestimate Democrat stupidity and hatred.

If you can read Schlichter's article with the same amused frame of mind you might take while playing a violent videogame, there are a lot of payoffs in it. The Dems have no clue how stupid they are.

There are two Civil War II scenarios, and the left is poorly positioned to prevail in either one. The first scenario is that the Democrats take power and violate the Constitution in order to use the apparatus of the federal government to suppress and oppress Normal Americans. In that scenario, red Americans are the insurgents. In the second scenario, which we can even now see the stirrings of in California's campaign to nullify federal immigration law, it is the blue states that are the insurgents.

The Democrats lose both wars. Big time.

Let's talk terrain and numbers. Remember the famous red v. blue voting map? There is a lot of red, and in the interior the few blue splotches are all cities like Las Vegas or Denver. That is a lot of territory for a counter-insurgent force to control, and this is critical. The red is where the food is grown, the oil pumped, and through which everything is transported. And that red space is filled with millions of American citizens with small arms, a fairly large percentage of whom have military training.

Remember what two untrained idiots did in Boston with a couple of pistols? They shut a city down. Now multiply that by several million, with better weapons and training.

He does not ignore the fact that Dems are the party of disarmed civilians, and consider how law enforcement, the military, and the National Guard might handle the conflicting calls that would be made on their loyalties.

This article really should be read by progs. But it won't be. They like living in their fantasy world, where human nature can be changed, tax hikes increase prosperity, and racial agitation is the means to produce a just society.    https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2018/03/thinking_the_unthinkable_on_a_second_civil_war.html

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Heartland American
1  Heartland American    3 months ago

“The Democrats lose both wars. Big time.

Let's talk terrain and numbers. Remember the famous red v. blue voting map? There is a lot of red, and in the interior the few blue splotches are all cities like Las Vegas or Denver. That is a lot of territory for a counter-insurgent force to control, and this is critical. The red is where the food is grown, the oil pumped, and through which everything is transported. And that red space is filled with millions of American citizens with small arms, a fairly large percentage of whom have military training.

He does not ignore the fact that Dems are the party of disarmed civilians, and consider how law enforcement, the military, and the National Guard might handle the conflicting calls that would be made on their loyalties.

This article really should be read by progs. But it won't be. They like living in their fantasy world”

 
 
Randy
1.1  Randy  replied to  Heartland American @1    3 months ago

Yyyyaaaawwwnnnnn...........

 
 
devangelical
1.2  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @1    3 months ago

At my age, I won't care who wins, but I will be taking advantage of an open season on dominionists.

 
 
epistte
1.3  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1    3 months ago
Let's talk terrain and numbers. Remember the famous red v. blue voting map? There is a lot of red,

Did you ever discover that the vast majority of that red land is uninhabited, or does that fact still escape you and other TEAparty faithful?

 
 
MUVA
1.3.1  MUVA  replied to  epistte @1.3    3 months ago

Being hateful is not a virtue I live in VA the northern part of the state is leftist shit whole paradise.

 
 
Heartland American
1.3.2  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @1.3    3 months ago

It might be lightly populated compared to a concentrated population center like a city but it would be much more difficult to occupy in military terms.  

 
 
devangelical
1.3.3  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.2    3 months ago

Those red areas are actually the prime locations for revitalization of American soil deleted, skirting the CoC ..[SP].

 
 
epistte
1.3.4  epistte  replied to  MUVA @1.3.1    3 months ago
Being hateful is not a virtue I live in VA the northern part of the state is leftist shit whole paradise.

You are a bundle of love and puppies.

 
 
DocPhil
1.3.5  DocPhil  replied to  epistte @1.3    3 months ago

Actually, when I read tripe like this article by good old heartland, I think that not only is the majority of land that is red uninhabited but the majority of the red brain is equally barren. Conservatives and we liberals have been on opposite sides of the political spectrum for centuries. Our nation has swayed back and forth, but we have survived all of our differences. The biggest difference is that we now have instant media to argue over. Most minds, on both sides of the aisle argue, but recognize that we come to our differences with the same goal in mind.....the best interests of this nation. It is only a radical few who talk about coming civil wars and scenarios that will entail. These are radicals that go beyond left and right and into the realm of insanity.

 
 
Landshark
1.3.6  Landshark  replied to  DocPhil @1.3.5    3 months ago

 Could’ve argued that before but not anymore 

 
 
Rmando
1.3.7  Rmando  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.2    3 months ago

Somebody should break out a copy of Red Dawn to show the left what happens when totalitarians try to take over middle America.

 
 
lady in black
1.3.8  lady in black  replied to  Rmando @1.3.7    3 months ago

It's a movie not real life.

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.9  Trout Giggles  replied to  Rmando @1.3.7    3 months ago

You don't scare, me, either

 
 
Rmando
1.3.10  Rmando  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.3.9    3 months ago

But your odd use of punctuation does scare me.

 
 
Heartland American
1.3.11  Heartland American  replied to  Rmando @1.3.7    3 months ago

Exactly.  It’s the way Americans act if their freedom and liberty are threatened.  

 
 
epistte
1.3.12  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.11    3 months ago
It’s the way Americans act if their freedom and liberty are threatened.

It is Republicans who have threatened our freedom and liberty. We don't want your brand of Christian dominionism, xenophobia, and corporate worship.

 
 
devangelical
1.3.13  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.11    3 months ago

Teavangelicals should bear that in mind if they value their family members.

 
 
devangelical
1.3.14  devangelical  replied to  Rmando @1.3.7    3 months ago

The Walking Dead is really a tutorial on how to deal with white supremacists, xenophobes, homophobes, and dominionists.

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.15  Trout Giggles  replied to  Rmando @1.3.10    3 months ago

It should because it scares me, too.

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.16  Trout Giggles  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.11    3 months ago

What war did you fight in again?

 
 
badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη
1.3.17  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.3.16    3 months ago

He fought in the War on Christmas.....winking

 
 
96WS6
1.3.18  96WS6  replied to  epistte @1.3    3 months ago

Did you ever discover that the vast majority of that red land is uninhabited, or does that fact still escape you and other TEAparty faithful?

Did the fact that the Democratic party is the party of gun control cross your mind?   The only way Democrats could win is if they are all a bunch of lying hypocrites......  Oh shit we really COULD be in serious trouble...laughing dude

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.19  Trout Giggles  replied to  96WS6 @1.3.18    3 months ago

I'm a democrat and I own a gun. I know how to shoot it, too. 

 
 
badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη
1.3.20  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.3.19    3 months ago

I'm a Non Binary, Politically Fluid SJW with a slingshot.

 
 
96WS6
1.3.21  96WS6  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.3.19    3 months ago

Careful there, you may unintentionally jump the fence!

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.22  Trout Giggles  replied to  96WS6 @1.3.21    3 months ago

I can't jump. I've been hobbled

So....you don't think democrats can be pro-gun, fiscally conservative, and want smaller government? You might want to trade that broad brush you've been painting with and get one with a finer point.

 
 
Old School Marine
1.3.23  Old School Marine  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.3.19    3 months ago
I'm a democrat and I own a gun. I know how to shoot it, too.

You're an Arkansas girl, who would expect anything less, hehehehehe

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.24  Trout Giggles  replied to  Old School Marine @1.3.23    3 months ago

I wasn't born here or grew up here, tho. I grew up in the "liberal" Northeast but always wanted to shoot my mom's rifle (she wouldn't let anybody touch it). I learned to shoot in the Air Force and then finally got a .380 a few years ago for Christmas.

But I chose to live in Arkansas because my other choice was North Dakota.

 
 
PJ
1.3.25  PJ  replied to  lady in black @1.3.8    3 months ago

Funny how msm is touted as "fake" but movies depicting rebels winning in is elevated as a proven strategy and an example of truth ...... devil  

 
 
lady in black
1.3.26  lady in black  replied to  96WS6 @1.3.18    3 months ago

I am an East Coast democrat and I own and know how to shoot a gun and no, I don't live rural, I live in the suburbs.

 
 
Heartland American
1.3.27  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @1.3.13    3 months ago

So, what’s going to happen to families of evangelical Christians who suport the TEA Party?  

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.28  Trout Giggles  replied to  lady in black @1.3.26    3 months ago

Don't you love it when the cons pigeon hole us democrats?

 
 
96WS6
1.3.29  96WS6  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.3.22    3 months ago

I have met people that call themselves Democrats that are pro gun but not many, I have met Democrats that are conservative though not many, I have even met a Democrat that wanted smaller government but I must admit I have never met a Democrat that was all of these things before.  You sound more like a Libertarian than Democrat.

 
 
Trout Giggles
1.3.30  Trout Giggles  replied to  96WS6 @1.3.29    3 months ago

Not one of them, either. Thought I was once, but turns out I'm not an every man for himself kind of person. We still need to take care of the least of us. Taxes should be collected for infrastructure and schools. We need clean water and air. Libertarians think that the free market is the end all and be all and it's not. You can't trust large corporations to do the right thing because all they care about is money.

 
 
devangelical
1.3.31  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.27    3 months ago

Who cares.

 
 
Heartland American
1.3.32  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @1.3.31    3 months ago

So what are teavangelicals supposed to bear in mind regarding your veiled threat against their/our families in 1.3.13?

 
 
sixpick
1.3.33  sixpick  replied to  devangelical @1.3.14    3 months ago
The Walking Dead is really a tutorial on how to deal with white supremacists, xenophobes, homophobes, and dominionists.

Walking Dead Liberals attacking sheriff Trump Supporter edited 001.jpg

 
 
devangelical
1.3.34  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.32    3 months ago

"the way Americans act if their freedom and liberty are threatened."

 
 
epistte
1.3.35  epistte  replied to  96WS6 @1.3.18    3 months ago
The only way Democrats could win is if they are all a bunch of lying hypocrites......

Reasonable gun control is not same as repealing the 2nd and confiscation, despite your apparent delusions. I'm a lefty progressive and I learned to shoot on the farms in north central Ohio when I was a teen. Shooting rats and pop cans was a common way to waste time. 

 
 
Skrekk
1.3.36  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @1.3.27    3 months ago
So, what’s going to happen to families of evangelical Christians who suport the TEA Party?

Where do you think Soylent Green comes from?

 
 
Tessylo
1.4  Tessylo  replied to  Heartland American @1    3 months ago

More shit from the American Stinker!

 
 
badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη
1.4.1  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη  replied to  Tessylo @1.4    3 months ago

It seems to attract you every time.....

graphicsflies254732.gif

 
 
Heartland American
1.4.2  Heartland American  replied to  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη @1.4.1    3 months ago

💩 💩 

 
 
Tessylo
1.5  Tessylo  replied to  Heartland American @1    3 months ago

'Let's talk terrain and numbers. Remember the famous red v. blue voting map? There is a lot of red, and in the interior the few blue splotches are all cities like Las Vegas or Denver. That is a lot of territory for a counter-insurgent force to control, and this is critical. The red is where the food is grown, the oil pumped, and through which everything is transported. And that red space is filled with millions of American citizens with small arms, a fairly large percentage of whom have military training.'

What the fuck?

 
 
Randy
1.5.1  Randy  replied to  Tessylo @1.5    3 months ago

Let's not forget phony "heartland" Red is not where you live.

 
 
1stwarrior
1.5.2  1stwarrior  replied to  Tessylo @1.5    3 months ago

Typical Tissy - you still don't know how to discuss a thread - just one-line it.

Sad

 
 
Heartland American
1.5.3  Heartland American  replied to  Randy @1.5.1    3 months ago

What’s phony is denying that the part of Californication that I live in is very much fly over territory, flights to and from Seattle and Portland from LA/Bay Area and flights to Europe from SF taking the sub arctic route.  It’s also phony to deny that the culture here is much more compatible with the plains and mountain west populations than with our urban coastal regime.  I was born in heartland America, Nashville, Tn. and spent four college years in heartland Lincoln, Ne.  Go Big Red!  

 
 
pat wilson
1.5.4  pat wilson  replied to  Heartland American @1.5.3    3 months ago

So according to your logic if you don't live in or near a city with a major airline hub then you are in fly-over country.

What's wrong with living in fly-over country ? Frankly I think fly-over areas have a lot of appeal.

 
 
Heartland American
1.5.5  Heartland American  replied to  pat wilson @1.5.4    3 months ago

I’m just saying that Redding, Ca. and the region around it is both literally and figuratively flyover country.  There is nothing wrong with flyover country.  I love it.  We do have three commuter/connector flights to and from San Francisco and one to and from Portland each day.  

 
 
devangelical
1.5.6  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @1.5.5    3 months ago

...and a Greyhound station.

 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
1.5.7  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Tessylo @1.5    3 months ago
And that red space is filled with millions of American citizens with small arms, a fairly large percentage of whom have military training.'

And you can't rule out that those large red spaces contain virtually all US military bases that are stateside.  In a staggering number, those votes counted for those states.  

 
 
Heartland American
1.5.8  Heartland American  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.5.7    3 months ago

Hopefully the left will never seriously consider such an option.  They shouldn’t be rethinking the unthinkable.  

 
 
Jeremy Retired in NC
1.5.9  Jeremy Retired in NC  replied to  Heartland American @1.5.8    3 months ago
Hopefully the left will never seriously consider such an option.  

In their fairytale land, they think they will come out victorious.  Now keep in mind, many of them are the same people eating Tide Pods and smoking bath salts.

They shouldn’t be rethinking the unthinkable.

Collectively they couldn't blink and breath without instruction.

 
 
Heartland American
1.5.10  Heartland American  replied to  Jeremy Retired in NC @1.5.9    3 months ago

that's a scary thought. 

 
 
devangelical
2  devangelical    3 months ago

I'll start my recon for times and places where unamerican domestic terrorists gather. Like on Sundays, around 10 am. Because of articles like this, I've personally waived my restrictions on age and gender when it comes to the Violation of ToS,  [SP]

 
 
Heartland American
2.1  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @2    3 months ago

You don’t even know what a so called dominionist is or how few of them actually exist.  

 
 
devangelical
2.1.1  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @2.1    3 months ago

There's buildings full of them on every 10th street corner, every Sunday morning. Easy peasy.

 
 
epistte
2.1.2  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @2.1    3 months ago
You don’t even know what a so called dominionist is or how few of them actually exist.

Dominionists are the religious extremists who want the secular US government to enforce conservative Christian religious law. They are people like you and other conservative Christians who think that the US is a Christian country and the US Constitution was based on the Bible.  They often claim that only Christians have full religious rights in the US and that the Establishment clause is a one-way street that keeps the government out of religion but lets religion play in the government. 

These people are jealous of the Taliban because they also want to enforce their mythical religious idiocy with the power of the state like they do in Saudi, Afghanistan and Iran.

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.3  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @2.1.1    3 months ago

So you think that virtually the entire Protestant evangelical movement is dominionist?  It’s not.  

 
 
devangelical
2.1.4  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.3    3 months ago

No. It's their spin-off cult of born again scum that's most dangerous to America.

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.5  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @2.1.4    3 months ago

One can’t be saved without being born again. That’s no spin off but the core belief of all Christianity.  Based on what Jesus Himself said to Nicodemus.  

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.6  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @2.1.2    3 months ago

Quite the straw man you created. 

 
 
Trout Giggles
2.1.7  Trout Giggles  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.3    3 months ago

Not Mainstream Protestants like Presbyterians and Methodists but Pentecostals are big time Dominionists. They're infiltrating the Air Force Academy at all levels.

Then you got them so-called "nondenominational". I call them bullshitters because they're for sure hooking up with the Pentecostals on the side.

 
 
devangelical
2.1.8  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.5    3 months ago

So basically what your saying is, every person on the planet that isn't a born again POS is going to hell. Total bullshit that supports the white supremacist foundation of the most extreme xtian cults. I got news for you. Teavangelical heaven is hell.

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.9  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @2.1.8    3 months ago

Jesus said that no one can come to the Father except through Him.  He said we must be born again to be saved.  I’m not about to sit in judgement about any Christian denomination and say they are or aren’t right.  Any member of any denomination can be born again.  God will save anyone anywhere, from any time that had no contact with His people and lived by the best that was shown to them.  Those who have heard the gospel message of Jesus and salvation by faith through grace and then reject that message in disbelief, demanding proof,  or adapt to some alternative value system there after are the only people on earth who can not possibly be saved.  

 
 
epistte
2.1.10  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.6    3 months ago
Quite the straw man you created.

Please identify where I created a Christian strawman. 

 
 
epistte
2.1.11  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.9    3 months ago
Those who have heard the gospel message of Jesus and salvation by faith through grace and then reject that message in disbelief, demanding proof,

That idea is not constant through all Christian denominations. The idea of being born again is a fairly recent evangelical protestant idea.

 
 
charger 383
2.1.12  charger 383  replied to  epistte @2.1.11    3 months ago

I don't remember being born again is part of Lutheran teaching and that was one of the first to break away from Catholic Church

 
 
epistte
2.1.13  epistte  replied to  charger 383 @2.1.12    3 months ago
I don't remember being born again is part of Lutheran teaching and that was one of the first to break away from Catholic Church

I had never heard about it as a Catholic. Catholics have the sacrament of baptism when you are born or join the church and then confirmation that is typically in the early teens.

Being born again is a Baptist idea that I first heard about in the early 1980s.  

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.14  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @2.1.11    3 months ago

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.biblegateway.com/passage/%3fsearch=John+3:1-21&version=NIV&interface=amp     

3 Now there was a Pharisee, a man named Nicodemus who was a member of the Jewish ruling council. 2 He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs you are doing if God were not with him.”

3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.[a]”

4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”

5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit[b] gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You[c] must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”[d]

9 “How can this be?” Nicodemus asked.

10 “You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things? 11 Very truly I tell you, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. 12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? 13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.[e] 14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,[f] 15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”[g]

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 1

 
 
epistte
2.1.15  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.14    3 months ago
5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.

This is the act of baptism. There is no mention of being born again.

Why do you like your own posts? It is assumed that you agree with them because you wrote, them but why do you also like them?

 
 
TiG
2.1.16  TiG  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.14    3 months ago
16 For God so loved the world that [1] he gave his one and only Son, that whoever [2] believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to [3] save the world through him

One of my all time least favorite passages:

  1. God could have as many 'Sons' as God wishes.   This one and only one Son qualification is nonsense - if omnipotent God wants more 'Sons' He will have more 'Sons'.
  2. Belief is the big divider.   One can be the worst human being but if one believes one has eternal bliss.   But a caring, loving soul who is not convinced there is a God shall burn in Hell for all of eternity.
  3. God engineers a human sacrifice (his 'Son') to save the world.   But God is omnipotent.  God can save the world any way He wishes.  Yet God chooses to send His 'Son' to be crucified so that God can then forgive sin?   This is beyond nonsense yet people simply nod their heads in acceptance as if this makes sense.  Go ahead, explain why omnipotent God needs to sacrifice his 'Son' before He can offer forgiveness to the creatures He created.

This is oft repeated in Church services.   Chanted even.  People mouth these words as if they actually make logical sense.   More than anything else, this illustrates the mind-numbing power of faith and religious indoctrination.

 
 
epistte
2.1.17  epistte  replied to  TiG @2.1.16    3 months ago
Go ahead, explain why omnipotent God needs to sacrifice his 'Son' before He can offer forgiveness to the creatures He created.

How was his supposed only son sacrificed for our supposed sin when he rose from the dead less than 72 hours later?  I've slept for almost that long after college exams.

Why do protestant religions that support predestination also believe in prayer?

 
 
TiG
2.1.18  TiG  replied to  epistte @2.1.17    3 months ago
How was his supposed only son sacrificed for our supposed sin when he rose from the dead less than 72 hours later?  I've slept for almost that long after college exams.

It was the suffering on the cross.

The most grand possible entity - the supreme being - demanded horrific human torture before He could offer forgiveness.   How does this make any sense to anyone??

 
 
TiG
2.1.19  TiG  replied to  epistte @2.1.17    3 months ago
Why do protestant religions that support predestination also believe in prayer?

Absence of critical thinking.

 
 
lennylynx
2.1.20  lennylynx  replied to  TiG @2.1.18    3 months ago

I've long wondered how any decent person can honor Biblegod, if this savage, cruel, angry being really DOES exist.

 
 
epistte
2.1.21  epistte  replied to  TiG @2.1.18    3 months ago
The most grand possible entity - the supreme being - demanded horrific human torture before He could offer forgiveness.

It doesn't make any sense to me. It never did and I got in trouble for asking. The longer you think about it the more logical constituencies that appear.

 I was shocked and sickened when I learned that the Catholic church believes that the host and wine become the literal body and blood of Jesus. I always thought that it was symbolic.

 
 
epistte
2.1.22  epistte  replied to  lennylynx @2.1.20    3 months ago
I've long wondered how any decent person can honor Biblegod, if this savage, cruel, angry being really DOES exist.

So much of the Abrahamic religions reek of the Stockholm Syndrome.

 
 
devangelical
2.1.23  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.9    3 months ago

These seeds need to be moved to the religious section of NT as soon as the bible thumping starts.

 
 
TiG
2.1.24  TiG  replied to  epistte @2.1.17    3 months ago
How was his supposed only son sacrificed for our supposed sin when he rose from the dead less than 72 hours later?

Even worse, the supreme entity - the grandest sentient force in existence - the omnipotent, loving, perfect creator of everything demands sacrifices - the deliberate killing of creatures (including humans)???

 
 
devangelical
2.1.25  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.9    3 months ago

I know of a teavangelical church whose members won't be sharing the gospel in my condo complex after last week.

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.26  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @2.1.21    3 months ago

It is symbolic.  

 
 
epistte
2.1.27  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.26    3 months ago
It is symbolic.

A symbolic strawman? How does that work?

 
 
TiG
2.1.28  TiG  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.26    3 months ago
It is symbolic.  

You believe God put Jesus through crucifixion as a symbolic gesture?   

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.29  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @2.1.27    3 months ago

Go back and read the last sentence of yours in 2.1.21 that I was responding to and then figure it out.  

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.30  Heartland American  replied to  TiG @2.1.28    3 months ago

No.  The unleavened bread and unfirmented wine are symbolic remembrances of His very real death on the cross.  

 
 
TiG
2.1.31  TiG  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.30    3 months ago
No.  The unleavened bread and unfirmented wine are symbolic remembrances of His very real death on the cross.

Okay.   Note that the context was this statement from me:

TiG:  The most grand possible entity - the supreme being - demanded horrific human torture before He could offer forgiveness.

Your unqualified comment about symbolism applied to a sentence in epistte's reply rather than to the topic of the reply.  Ergo the miscommunication.  A quote from you would have cleared things up.

Now, that said, Catholics hold that Holy Communion is not symbolic.  Did you know that?

Here is one (of many) articles on this interesting belief.    Here is an operative excerpt:

How does this change take place? It happens during the eucharistic prayer of the Mass. At that time, the bread and wine are changed into the Body and Blood of Christ, as the Church has always taught. Although they still look like bread and wine, they have, by divine power, actually changed into His Body and Blood. How can we know this? It requires faith. It is a mystery which, like love, we will never fully understand. The Trinity, the divinity of Jesus, His death and Resurrection are other mysteries which, along with the Eucharist, we will never fully comprehend in this life.

Are Catholics wrong?   

 
 
Heartland American
2.1.32  Heartland American  replied to  TiG @2.1.31    3 months ago

My mom and grand mother were raised Catholic and converted to Protestant when my mom was in high school.  

 
 
TiG
2.1.33  TiG  replied to  Heartland American @2.1.32    3 months ago

Okay?   thinking

Are Catholics wrong to believe they are consuming the actual body and blood of Christ during Holy Communion?  (See transubstantiation.)

 
 
Trout Giggles
2.1.34  Trout Giggles  replied to  TiG @2.1.33    3 months ago

No, they are not wrong, because that is their doctrine.

Very few Christian sects are permitted to accept the Eucharist during mass. I believe all Protestant sects are because they do not believe in transubstantiation. The Greek, and all the Eastern Orthodoxies are permitted to accept the Eucharist.

 
 
luther28
3  luther28    3 months ago

I am at a loss for words. Tales from the dark side?

 
 
epistte
3.1  epistte  replied to  luther28 @3    3 months ago

They need to lay off the tequila and LSD before they write this partisan idiocy.

 
 
luther28
3.1.1  luther28  replied to  epistte @3.1    3 months ago

Either that or share it.

 
 
Rmando
4  Rmando    3 months ago

There shouldn't be any need for a civil war. I'm all for just giving the Left Coast the push it needs to break off from the rest of the county and keep out their insanity. 

 
 
Heartland American
5  Heartland American    3 months ago

The article clearly states that a second civil war would be an overwhelmingly bad catastrophe for the entire free world.  It is to be avoided. Regressives though are likely to start one in a vain attempt to force their will upon the rest of us as nothing short of their winning such a thing will ever lead to that result.  One hopes that they would step back from the edge of one and preserve domestic tranquillity.  

 
 
devangelical
5.1  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @5    3 months ago

No worries. If the religious regressives try to force their will on the US, l can be counted on to hit triple digits. I shot lots of rats at the dump when I was younger. Same thing.

 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
5.1.1  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  devangelical @5.1    3 months ago

Rats don't shoot first or shoot back. If that is your sole claim to prowess under such a scenario as a Civil War, better have a Medic handy.

 
 
devangelical
5.1.2  devangelical  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @5.1.1    3 months ago

If you can hit a running rat, headshots are easy.

 
 
Heartland American
5.1.3  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @5.1.2    3 months ago

Why are you always talking about shooting things and equating that with shooting people?  You are an unpleasant addition to this seed.   

 
 
Trout Giggles
5.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Heartland American @5    3 months ago

I think you would welcome it. Then you would have all the power to force others to bow down to your will and worship your god in the image you've made him to be

 
 
Heartland American
5.2.1  Heartland American  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2    3 months ago

Worship of God by force is worthless and an affront to God who gave us free will to freely choose.  What the church did for around 1,000 years or so was wrong and why the Protestant Reformation began and developed over time starting in the time of Martin Luther and other reformers. 

 
 
Trout Giggles
5.2.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Heartland American @5.2.1    3 months ago
Worship of God by force is worthless and an affront to God who gave us free will to freely choose

I really do believe you are just mouthing words to make it look as if you really are a First Amendment supporter.

Why do I say that? Because your other words in other articles/seeds contradict this. If you really believe that people have free will to choose, then you wouldn't constantly tell us "heathens" that we need Jesus. I know that you're supposed to spread the good news, but the problem is you won't stop there. You harass and harangue people who don't follow your faith so you really don't believe in free will at all. Or I should say, you don't believe in free will for others, only yourself.

 
 
devangelical
5.2.3  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.2    3 months ago

Funny, I don't recall anyone ever knocking on my door trying to convert me into being gay. 

 
 
Trout Giggles
5.2.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  devangelical @5.2.3    3 months ago

Yeah, me neither.....

Do you think it's us?

 
 
badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη
5.2.5  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη  replied to  devangelical @5.2.3    3 months ago

I am approached often by gay men. Then again I dress really well as my father was a fashion icon.

 
 
devangelical
5.2.6  devangelical  replied to  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη @5.2.5    3 months ago

You're supposed to wear jeans under those leather chaps.

 
 
devangelical
5.2.7  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.4    3 months ago

No. It's the people so offended by the lifestyles of others that they feel the need to impose their lifestyles on everyone else.

 
 
Tessylo
5.2.8  Tessylo  replied to  devangelical @5.2.6    3 months ago
You're supposed to wear jeans under those leather chaps.

Under those ass - less leather chaps

 
 
Peter Loves the Real Tea Party.
5.2.9  Peter Loves the Real Tea Party.  replied to  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη @5.2.5    3 months ago

 
 
Heartland American
5.2.10  Heartland American  replied to  Trout Giggles @5.2.2    3 months ago

People may need Jesus but are free to believe in Him or not.  Presenting the good news of the gospel for people to see, hear, read, is not the same as forcing belief.  I am very much into advocating for Christianity and belief in God and it being presented anywhere all over the world but compelling or coercion to force belief is not our/ my objective.  When I and others do reach out locally and one is clearly disinterested or has a no soliciting sign we note the address for future reference and move on to the next place. We are to present the gospel to all the world to let all hear it and make their own choice.  Religion that compels people to join it or follow it is not acceptable.  

 
 
Skrekk
5.2.11  Skrekk  replied to  Heartland American @5.2.10    3 months ago
I am very much into advocating for Christianity and belief in God and it being presented anywhere all over the world but compelling or coercion to force belief is not our/ my objective.

Actually you've made it clear that you want the state to enforce Christian sharia law particularly in regards to same-sex marriage.   You're an opponent of secular government and an opponent of religious liberty.

 
 
cjcold
5.3  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @5    3 months ago

Says the secessionist who promotes nothing but discord around here.

 
 
Heartland American
5.3.1  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @5.3    3 months ago

I do not advocate secession from the United State of America.  

 
 
cjcold
5.3.2  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @5.3.1    3 months ago

Just California? Last I heard California was part of the U.S. of A.

 
 
Heartland American
5.3.3  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @5.3.2    3 months ago

And so would be Jefferson or New California as America’s 51st State.  Your point?  

 
 
cjcold
5.3.4  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @5.3.3    3 months ago

Never happen. Northern Cali. pot growers are crazy, but not that crazy.

 
 
Heartland American
5.3.6  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @5.3.4    3 months ago

Many pot growers up here are illegal Mexican nationals who could not care less if we are part of Californication or are Jefferson.  

 
 
cjcold
5.3.7  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @5.3.6    3 months ago

So Jefferson would be a sanctuary state full of imported pot pickers?

 
 
Heartland American
5.3.8  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @5.3.7    3 months ago

No, Jefferson is where most of the non sanctuary counties are located.  There are plenty of citizen growers of that crap that we can be rid of the illegals who grow it in our national forests.  

 
 
Landshark
6  Landshark    3 months ago

We're already in a civil war.  Think of it as a cold war.

 
 
epistte
6.1  epistte  replied to  Landshark @6    3 months ago
We're already in a civil war.

Is this what your secret TEAparty decoder ring told you this morning?

 
 
Landshark
6.1.1  Landshark  replied to  epistte @6.1    3 months ago

 You told me at least on more than one occasion. 

 
 
epistte
6.1.2  epistte  replied to  Landshark @6.1.1    3 months ago
You told me at least on more than one occasion.

When exactly did I tell you this?

 
 
Heartland American
6.2  Heartland American  replied to  Landshark @6    3 months ago

The goal is to make sure it stays cold....

 
 
epistte
6.2.1  epistte  replied to  Heartland American @6.2    3 months ago
The goal is to make sure it stays cold....

What does this mean? The conservatives have stirred up this fight and now they want to back away from the hornet's nest that they created when they tried to force their regressive partisan extremism on others?

 
 
Heartland American
6.2.2  Heartland American  replied to  epistte @6.2.1    3 months ago

Conservatives stirred up nothing.  We are simply defending our exceptional nation and it’s great culture from the perversion that is the secular progressive left.  

 
 
Trout Giggles
6.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  Landshark @6    3 months ago

You I'm not worried about. I doubt if you can actually shoot a gun because then you would have to put your comb down

 
 
devangelical
6.3.1  devangelical  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.3    3 months ago

...and turn his back to the mirror.

 
 
Trout Giggles
6.3.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  devangelical @6.3.1    3 months ago

LOL! I like being your side kick.

 
 
badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη
6.3.3  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη  replied to  Trout Giggles @6.3.2    3 months ago

Do you have an invisible Jet? Wonder woman had one.

 
 
Trout Giggles
6.3.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  badfish hαηd ⊕ƒ †hε Ωuεεη @6.3.3    3 months ago

Should I get one?

 
 
JBB
7  JBB    3 months ago

This sort of Krazy Klan Krapola is why all righties must be crushed at the ballot box on November 6th...

 
 
XDm9mm
7.1  XDm9mm  replied to  JBB @7    3 months ago

Comment removed for CoC violation [ph]


 
 
Landshark
7.2  Landshark  replied to  JBB @7    3 months ago

Comment removed for CoC violation [ph]

 
 
Landshark
7.2  Landshark  replied to  JBB @7    3 months ago

 I believe they have a similar type of crushing in mind (Deleted CoC [SP] )

 
 
Landshark
7.3  Landshark  replied to  JBB @7    3 months ago

Comment removed for CoC violation [SP]

 
 
bbl-1
8  bbl-1    3 months ago

Off topic [ph]

 
 
Paula Bartholomew
9  Paula Bartholomew    3 months ago

Isn't the term "civil war" an oxymoron?

 
 
Kavika
9.1  Kavika   replied to  Paula Bartholomew @9    3 months ago

The author of the article is a moron for sure.

 
 
JohnRussell
9.1.1  JohnRussell  replied to  Kavika @9.1    3 months ago

This is the same guy that wants to invade San Francisco and Los Angeles. 

 
 
Kavika
9.1.2  Kavika   replied to  JohnRussell @9.1.1    3 months ago

LOL, he is....Well like I said on another article I'm sure that the Longies (longshoremen) in Long Beach/San Pedro/Wilmington will explain to him how the world works on the waterfront...LOL

 
 
Raven Wing
9.1.3  Raven Wing  replied to  Kavika @9.1.2    3 months ago

Indeed!  It should be something to watch. (grin)

 
 
Heartland American
9.1.4  Heartland American  replied to  JohnRussell @9.1.1    3 months ago

No one wants to invade the sewers you named above.  

 
 
Raven Wing
9.1.5  Raven Wing  replied to  Heartland American @9.1.4    3 months ago

Nor the one where you live either. Only God knows what they might find. eek

 
 
Paula Bartholomew
9.1.6  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Raven Wing @9.1.5    3 months ago

I think he is part of the great swamp that his orange hero perpetuates.

 
 
Larry Hampton
10  Larry Hampton    3 months ago

Whitehood masturbation fantasy.

 
 
Heartland American
10.1  Heartland American  replied to  Larry Hampton @10    3 months ago

The thoughts of never Trump RINO’s who actually voted for Hillary?  

 
 
lib50
11  lib50    3 months ago

What the fuck is a progressive recessive elite? 

 
 
Heartland American
11.1  Heartland American  replied to  lib50 @11    3 months ago

Look 👀 in the mirror.  

 
 
Raven Wing
11.1.1  Raven Wing  replied to  Heartland American @11.1    3 months ago

It takes one to know one. So obviously your mirror must give you that kind of reflection as well. 

 
 
Heartland American
11.1.2  Heartland American  replied to  Raven Wing @11.1.1    3 months ago

I’m a progressive elitist?  Well that’s a first for me that I’ve been accused of that.  

 
 
Randy
12  Randy    3 months ago

The truth that the right wing has to face is that, while they are very mouthy and noisy, when you come right down to who is willing to fight in an actual war I mean willing to really got shot at and really die, they are very, very tiny and impotent. If they called all of their members to action I would bet they wouldn't fill the parking lot of a medium sized mid-west Walmart. They talk a good game and if a revolution could be accomplished via talking on social media they may have a chance. However if they all have to get out of their Lazy Boy's and miss the next episode of Dancing With The Stars or the coming  opening of the baseball season, well then their revolution is pretty much fucked.

 
 
Raven Wing
12.1  Raven Wing  replied to  Randy @12    3 months ago

They do talk a good story about their revolution, however, I wonder when they will have the revelation that their fantasy is not reality.  

See.... I can fantasize that certain people would move of the state of California as they seem to hate it so much, however, I am smart enough to know that it is merely a fantasy and won't happen, at least, not very soon. 

Funny thing...reality. Some people hate it and so try to avoid it as much as possible, preferring to live in their fantasy world. So of like mental Prozac.  

$%^)@%(^

 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
13  The Magic Eight Ball    3 months ago

civil war can only start via state govts - (and will start in the courts with said states suing the feds for breaking the social contract.)

if hillary had won the idea of a civil war might have been plausible.  now... not so much.

selling us out into a world govt would have started a civil war, but thanks to trump the globalists have been neutered.. meaning?

there will be no civil war, you can not have one :)

 
 
cjcold
13.1  cjcold  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @13    3 months ago

So how is it that Trump selling us out to the Russians and multinational corporations doesn't bother you?

 
 
Heartland American
13.1.1  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @13.1    3 months ago

Trump stopped Obama and Hillary from selling off our great nation to Putin and Russia 🇷🇺.  

 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
13.1.2  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  cjcold @13.1    3 months ago
So how is it that Trump selling us out to the Russians and multinational corporations

because that is all liberal BS and nothing more.

unless you would like to explain how the USA having secure borders, fair trade deals, less regulations, lower taxes and a sovereign country is in russia's best interest?

 
 
Heartland American
13.1.3  Heartland American  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @13.1.2    3 months ago

Not not to mention rebuilding our military and selling coal and natural gas to countries formerly dependent on Russia for most of their energy needs.  

 
 
epistte
13.2  epistte  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @13    3 months ago
- (and will start in the courts with said states suing the feds for breaking the social contract.)

The last time the southern conservatives started a civil war over their claimed right to own slaves it didn't end well for them.   Those bigots are still threatening to refight that bigoted idea because other people have equal rights.

What social contract did the federal government violate, if you understand what the concept of a social contract means? 

 
 
96WS6
13.2.1  96WS6  replied to  epistte @13.2    3 months ago

I love how Democrats interpret history.  The Democratic party was into slavery then and still are by designing Social programs that keep people in them and poor instead of giving them a hand up.   If you disagree please explain why people are better off staying on welfare than getting a job, all in the name of growing a constituent base at the cost of the entire country.   It is this way by design.

https://nypost.com/2013/08/19/when-welfare-pays-better-than-work/

Here’s an offer for you: $38,004 per year, tax free.No work required.Apply at your local welfare office.

The federal government funds 126 separate programs targeted towards low-income people, 72 of which provide either cash or in-kind benefits to individuals. (The rest fund community-wide programs for low-income neighborhoods, with no direct benefits to individuals.) State and local governments operate more welfare programs.Of course, no individual or family gets benefits from all 72 programs, but many do get aid from a number of them at any point in time.

Today, the Cato institute is releasing a new study looking at the state-by-state value of welfare for a mother with two children. In the Empire State, a family receiving Temporary Assistance for Needy Families, Medicaid, food stamps, WIC, public housing, utility assistance and free commodities (like milk and cheese) would have a package of benefits worth $38,004, the seventh-highest in the nation.

While that might not sound overly generous, remember that welfare benefits aren’t taxed, while wages are. So someone in New York would have to earn more than $21 per hour to be better off than they would be on welfare.That’s more than the average statewide entry-level salary for a teacher.

Plus, going to work means added costs such as paying for child care, transportation and clothing.Not to mention that, even if it’s not a money-loser, a person moving from welfare to work will see some form of loss — namely, less time for leisure as opposed to work.

FAMOUS RACIST QUOTES:

Margaret Sanger, founder of planned parenthood:

"We do not want word to get out that we want to extinguish the Negro population, if it ever occurs to some of their more rebellious members"

Lindon Johnson:

"I'll have those N**** voting Democratic for the next 200 years."   

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.2  Heartland American  replied to  96WS6 @13.2.1    3 months ago

thumbs up

 
 
96WS6
13.2.3  96WS6  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.2    3 months ago

I have never gotten an answer to that one.  Logic combined with facts always baffles them.  

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.4  Heartland American  replied to  96WS6 @13.2.3    3 months ago

They have nothing to say because they can’t defend their anti American hate and their contempt for our Constitution.  They hate that it tells government what it can’t do to us when they want a document outlining what the government will give us if only we meekly obey. 

 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
13.2.5  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.4    3 months ago
if only we meekly obey.

resistance is never futile and always makes a great hobby :)

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.6  Heartland American  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @13.2.5    3 months ago

True because we will never meekly obey the dictates of any government we are not a part of.  We are sovereign citizens, not subjects.  

 
 
cjcold
13.2.7  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.6    3 months ago

Hopefully, far right wing fascists will never be a part of any democratic government.

 
 
cjcold
13.2.8  cjcold  replied to  cjcold @13.2.7    3 months ago

OOps! Too Late!

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.9  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @13.2.7    3 months ago

There are no far right fascists and there are no fascists in our elected government. 

 
 
MrFrost
13.2.10  MrFrost  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.9    3 months ago
There are no far right fascists

Fascists believe that liberal democracy is obsolete and they regard the complete mobilization of society under a totalitarian one-party state as necessary to prepare a nation for armed conflict and to respond effectively to economic difficulties.[12] Such a state is led by a strong leader—such as a dictator and a martial government composed of the members of the governing fascist party—to forge national unity and maintain a stable and orderly society.[12] Fascism rejects assertions that violence is automatically negative in nature and views political violence, war and imperialism as means that can achieve national rejuvenation.[13][14][15][16] Fascists advocate a mixed economy, with the principal goal of achieving autarky through protectionist and interventionist economic policies.[17]

Fascism is a right wing political ideology. It's literally the opposite of liberalism. 

 
 
cjcold
13.2.11  cjcold  replied to  MrFrost @13.2.10    3 months ago

Yep, that describes the Heartland Institute to a T.

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.12  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @13.2.11    3 months ago

You have no clue as to the Heartland Institute.      

ABOUT US

The Heartland Institute is one of the world’s leading free-market think tanks. It is a national nonprofit research and education organization based in Arlington Heights, Illinois. Its mission is to discover, develop, and promote free-market solutions to social and economic problems.

We are an “action tank” as well as a “think tank,” and we measure our success by the impact we have in the real world. The Heartland Institute plays an essential role in the national (and increasingly in the international) movement for personal liberty and limited government. We are the pipeline between the freedom movement’s leading writers and thinkers and the nation’s 8,400 national and state elected officials.

Because we are effective, we have been the subject of unfair criticism and even libel by various liberal advocacy groups, elected officials, and even Wikipedia. Please see the “Reply to Our Critics” page where we answer our critics and set the record straight. We hope you will defend us, when you can, in the comments fields of websites that defame us and in conversations with friends and colleagues.

Who We Are

A full-time staff of 39 works with a 12-member Board of Directors, some 5,500 donors, some 500 academics and professional economists who serve as Policy Advisors, 33 senior fellows, and 275 elected officials who pay dues to serve on our Legislative Forum.  

What We Do

The Heartland Institute is a nonprofit organization recognized as a tax-exempt charity under Section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code. We are nonpartisan and most of our work is strictly educational. We very rarely lobby, and when we do, we follow strict guidelines.

We focus on issues in education, environmental protection, health care, budgets and taxes, and constitutional reform. Heartland sends three monthly policy newspapers – Budget & Tax News, Environment & Climate News, and School Reform News – to every national and state elected officials in the United States and thousands of civic and business leaders. We also produce books, policy studies, booklets, podcasts, and videos.

In 2017, Heartland spokespersons appeared in print and on television or radio 4,700 times with a combined print circulation of 103 million readers. We hosted 15 websites generating more than 1.4 million pages views, and our podcasts were downloaded 2.4 million times in 2017.

Heartland hosts an online database and search engine called PolicyBot containing the complete text of (not just links to) more than 32,000 reports and commentaries from some 300 free-market think tanks and advocacy groups.

Heartland hosted 43 events in 2017, attended by 2,208 people, total viewers online 32,671. We have hosted 12 International Conferences on Climate Change since 2008 attended by more than 5,000 people.

Endorsements

The Heartland Institute is endorsed by some of the top scholars, thinkers, and politicians in the world – including many members of congress and state elected officials and the leaders of other conservative and libertarian think tanks such as Americans for Tax Reform’s Grover Norquist, The Leadership Institute’s Morton Blackwell, The Heritage Foundation’s Jim DeMint, and many more.  https://www.heartland.org/about-us/

 
 
devangelical
13.2.13  devangelical  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.12    3 months ago

Christo-fascism advanced through a tax exempt money laundering organization.

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.14  Heartland American  replied to  devangelical @13.2.13    3 months ago

REPLY TO CRITICS

The Heartland Institute often is the target of misinformation and even outright lies about its mission, funding and donors, and members and staff. These attacks come overwhelming from left-wing advocates who object to our principled stand in defense of individual liberty and limited government.

This page rebuts some of the most widely spread attacks on our reputation. The Heartland Institute welcomes alerts from allies about other attacks that should be confronted with facts. Please contact Jim Lakely, communications director, at jlakely@heartland.org.

Additional information about The Heartland Institute's programs, people, and funding is available in our 2018 annual report.

Above: Environmental radicals burn torches on the front lawn of an executive at Enbridge Energy Management, a company that works on oil pipelines, in February 2014.

"There have been numerous false and malicious claims that The Heartland Institute is a front for the energy industry and is funded by 'the Koch brothers.' These statements are often made with full knowledge they are untrue; in some cases they are made without such knowledge. With this notice, the reader is informed he/she will have no defense of "innocent mistake" made because of lack of knowledge and may have legal liability for defamation."

— Legal Counsel, The Heartland Institute, June 2014
(Last reviewed and approved on January 2, 2018)

FAQ About The Heartland Institute

WHAT IS THE HEARTLAND INSTITUTE?
WHY DOESN'T HEARTLAND REVEAL THE IDENTITIES OF ITS DONORS?
IS THE HEARTLAND INSTITUTE FUNDED BY THE KOCH BROTHERS?
IS HEARTLAND A "FRONT GROUP"?
CAN YOU REPLY TO INSIDE CLIMATE NEWS?
CAN YOU REPLY TO SPECIFIC ACCUSATIONS MADE BY DESMOGBLOG?
WHAT IS 'FAKEGATE' AND WHO IS PETER GLEICK?
IS HEARTLAND'S POSITION ON TOBACCO CONTROL 'EXTREMIST' OR OUTSIDE THE SCIENTIFIC MAINSTREAM?
CAN YOU REPLY TO SPECIFIC ACCUSATIONS MADE BY THE UNION OF CONCERNED SCIENTISTS?
CAN YOU REPLY TO SPECIFIC ACCUSATIONS MADE BY MEDIATRANSPARENCY?
CAN YOU REPLY TO SPECIFIC ACCUSATIONS MADE BY SOURCEWATCH?
CAN YOU REPLY TO SPECIFIC ACCUSATIONS MADE BY EXXONSECRETS?
HAVE YOU REPLIED TO OTHER FALSE AND MISLEADING CLAIMS?
IS HEARTLAND'S POSITION ON GLOBAL WARMING 'EXTREMIST' OR OUTSIDE THE SCIENTIFIC MAINSTREAM?
2016 BY THE NUMBERS

See what sets Heartland apart:
82% of state elected officials read Heartland publications
82%
of state elected officials read one or more Heartland newspapers "sometimes" or "always."
45% of elected officials say Heartland led to a change in policy
45%
of state elected officials say a Heartland publication influenced their opinions or led to a change in public policy.
“The Heartland Institute [is] the world’s most prominent thinktank supporting skepticism about man-made climate change.”
The Economist
May 26, 2012.  https://www.heartland.org/about-us/reply-to-critics/index.html

 
 
cjcold
13.2.15  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.14    3 months ago

I know exactly what the Heartland Institute is. I've been fighting against their oil/coal/tobacco-soaked anti-science propaganda for many years now.

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.16  Heartland American  replied to  MrFrost @13.2.10    3 months ago

Let’s see. Off the top of my head, in the first six months of Obama’s presidency we’ve seen corporatism and “state capitalism” run amok, in the government takeover of two car companies and numerous banks. Labor unions have become increasingly indistinguishable from the government and the party that controls it. Herbert Croly and the Progressives have once again been rehabilitated as founding fathers of the New Age. The entire liberal intellectual class is convinced that this the time for a new New Deal. Critics of statism are vilified by liberal elites as racists and fascists. (And those who refuse to get with the Gorian program are guilty of “treason against the planet“). When out of power, liberals lionized free speech and celebrated dissent as the highest form of patriotism. Now, they label dissent “un-American” and the president insists he doesn’t want to hear a lot of talking from anyone who disagrees with him. While the stench of eugenics and euthanasia do not quite sting the nostrils yet, the odor is detectable and the liberal impulse for controlling the lives of others has been re-exposed.

Indeed, our own messianic president, who insists that we can create a Kingdom of Heaven on Earth, also apparently believes that “we are God’s partners in matters of life and death” and that religious organizations that are true to their calling should rally behind a united front to expand the scope and role of government. When the head of state says such things, it is hard not to be reminded of the Progressive concept of the God State, a major theme of Liberal Fascism. The “State is the actually existing, realized moral life . . . The divine idea as it exists on earth,” Hegel declared in The Philosophy of History. The State, according to Hegel, was the “march of God on earth.” The progressives agreed. Richard Ely, the founding father of progressive economics, proclaimed “God works through the State in carrying out His purposes more universally than through any other institution.”

It’s revealing, to me at least, that I wrote the book with Hillary Clinton as the stand-in for the fascistic ideas lurking inside contemporary liberalism. Here’s how I put it in the new afterword for the paperback edition:

….And then something funny happened. A self-proclaimed “transformative” leader formed a self-declared “movement,” powered in large measure by a sense of historical destiny (“This is the moment!”), yearning for national restoration (“We will make this nation great!”), demanding national unity at all costs, and glorifying itself for its own youthful energy. At times his most conspicuous followers were blindly devoted to a cult of personality with deeply racial undertones and often explicit appeals to messianic fervor. This new leader of men—who earned his credibility from his work as a street organizer and disciple of Saul Alinsky—vowed to restore the promise of American life in a vast new collaborative effort between business, government, churches, and labor. His platform included mandatory youth service, a new civilian security force, and spreading the wealth around.   https://www.nationalreview.com/blog/liberal-fascism/closing-time-jonah-goldberg/

 
 
Heartland American
13.2.17  Heartland American  replied to  cjcold @13.2.15    3 months ago

IS HEARTLAND'S POSITION ON GLOBAL WARMING 'EXTREMIST' OR OUTSIDE THE SCIENTIFIC MAINSTREAM?
No. See our statement here. Opinion polls in the U.S. show large majorities do not believe climate change is either man-made or a serious problem. Surveys of climate scientists repeatedly find acknowledgement of great uncertainty about the scientific basis of our understanding of how the climate works and therefore of forecasts of future warming. Surveys and article-counting exercises that claim to find a scientific “consensus” invariably ask only if there is a human impact on climate, which we readily admit there could be, and not whether that effect is large relative to natural variability or likely to pose a serious problem.

More than 31,000 scientists have signed the Oregon Petition saying "there is no convincing scientific evidence that human release of carbon dioxide, methane, or other greenhouse gases is causing, or will in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating of the Earth's atmosphere and disruption of the Earth's climate." There is no similar petition in support of the alarmist position that has been signed by anywhere near 31,000 scientists.

Nearly 300 of the world's leading scientists spoke at one or more of Heartland’s ten International Conferences on Climate Change, These include scientists from NASA and NOAA, official state climatologists, professors from prestigious universities all over the world (including Harvard, Yale, and MIT) and officials at the Department of Energy and the Department of the Interior.

Our conferences have been described by friend and foe alike as the most important and influential gatherings of global warming "skeptics" ever assembled. These conferences were covered by CNN, Fox News, ABC News, the BBC, The New York Times, The Washington Post, La Monde, The Wall Street Journal, and many other media outlets.

Heartland's spokespersons have been invited to testify on global warming issues before Congress and in state legislatures and official government meetings in Ohio, Kentucky, Connecticut, Minnesota, Illinois, Indiana, West Virginia, Utah, New Mexico, Oregon, Washington, Montana, Colorado, Arkansas, and more.These are not the activities of a group on the "extreme margin of the discourse" on global warming.

In fact, the positions on global warming expressed by spokespersons for The Heartland Institute are closer to where most scientists and economists stand than are the views of well-known alarmists such as Al Gore and James Hansen and many environmental advocacy groups. The American public understands this: A majority of the public does not believe global warming is man-made or that it is a major problem.

In short, The Heartland Institute is firmly within the "mainstream" of expert opinion on global warming. Its spokespersons are credible and respected in the national and international debate. Those who claim otherwise should be asked to document the existence of the alleged "consensus" in favor of their alarmist visions of future global warming.    https://www.heartland.org/about-us/reply-to-critics/index.html

 
 
cjcold
13.2.18  cjcold  replied to  Heartland American @13.2.17    3 months ago
More than 31,000 scientists have signed the Oregon Petition

I believe a Spice Girl signed it along with numerous fictional characters and votes from the grave. There was absolutely no attempt to verify the credentials of any signatory. The Oregon petition has been long debunked as a lame attempt at anti-science propaganda funded by the Heartland Institute.

 
 
sixpick
14  sixpick    3 months ago

Aw, there's nothing to see here....

There's no such thing as black racism. Oh, OK.

 
 

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