The Election was Stolen!
Make your case
For all those who even today hold that Trump actually won the election and that the certified results provided by the secretaries of state for each of the 50 states falsely hands the presidency to Biden and that Biden will thus be an illegitimate president, the floor is open for you to ...
Make your case.
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Claims are worthless. Back them up.
On what factual grounds do you claim that there is sufficient fraud / error in our 2020 presidential election to falsely give Biden the victory?
I'd love to see some figures on how much money has been raised so far by republicans with this baseless political melodrama. hopefully this scam ruins more than a few political careers in the future.
They have shown that even republicans fundraising/campaigning for the Georgia election are putting the money in their own coffers (including Cruz).
Most of the money is in Trump's pockets to payoff campaign debts. Hey, why not get a bunch of clueless idiots to pay them off if you have little money of your own.
He never pays all of his bills completely, if at all.
That has been a well documented fact for years.
Since technically Trump is no longer a candidate for any office, can't he just keep all the money they're sending him now?
For many of his 'rallies' he and his supporters trash the town and leave the town holding the bill . . . . like usual. . .
He's been keeping the money - raping, looting, pillaging the treasury, for about four years now. . .
If you want to know where most of the donation money is (and has been) going...and yes, the article is a little long and a few weeks old, but worth the read. I advise taking a sedative or having a big-ass drink prior to reading.
Over the past few weeks, President Donald Trump has been imploring his supporters to donate to the "Georgia Election Fund" to support Republicans in the two upcoming Georgia Senate runoffs. The plea has been part of Trump's massive post-election fundraising effort, much of which has been going to Trump's new political action committee, Save America.
But none of the funds the president has brought into his new PAC appear to have gone to actually help the Republican Senate runoff campaigns, ad placement data and campaign disclosure records show.
"The Georgia Runoff Election is right around the corner and the fate of the Nation hangs in the balance," Trump's team wrote in a fundraising email sent to supporters this week. "So much is at stake and I need to know that you are on our team and ready to FIGHT for America."
"It is CRITICALLY important we have your support to secure the resources we need to deliver the Democrats a CRUSHING defeat," they wrote in another recent email.
In the fine print, the letter breaks down the distribution of funds as follows: 25% of each contribution goes to the RNC, and 75% of each contribution first goes to Save America, up to $5,000, with the rest of the 75% going to the Trump campaign, up to $2,800 for an individual donor and $5,000 for a PAC donor.
The RNC so far has spent roughly $3 million in independent expenditures supporting the Georgia GOP candidates, and has committed to spend more than $20 million in the runoffs overall.
"We currently have the largest team ever in Georgia, which includes 500 paid staffers and thousands of volunteers," RNC spokesperson Mike Reed told ABC News. "Our teams have knocked on millions of doors over the past few weeks."
Reed added that the RNC's focus is on the ground game and get out the vote efforts as they typically leave the ad buys and other electioneering activities to the campaigns and outside groups.
Indeed, since Election Day in November, hundreds of outside groups on both sides of the aisle have spent, or committed to spend, in support of the Georgia candidates. The television and radio ad spending alone is quickly approaching the $500 million mark, powered by the funds raised by the campaigns and political interest groups.
But Trump's new leadership PAC is not one of them. The PAC has not placed any television or radio buys in the race, according to media research company CMAG's analysis of ad-buy records, and it has not reported making any independent expenditures in support of Republican Sens. David Perdue or Kelly Loeffler, as required by the Federal Election Commission rules.
The full extent of the committee's fundraising and spending has yet to be disclosed, so it's unclear if any of the funds have been used to support Trump's recent political travels to Georgia or if the PAC has made any direct contribution to the campaigns. But even if it has, the maximum contribution a PAC can make is $5,000 -- which would appear to be a small fraction of the money coming in.
Officials with Save America did not respond to ABC News' request for comment.
A super PAC set up by Donald Trump Jr.'s advisers, which doesn't raise money with the Trump committees, did report spending more than $1 million on the races.
Michael Beckel, research director at the campaign transparency advocacy group Issue One, told ABC News that while it's common for candidates in a contentious race to try to leverage the celebrity appeal of higher-profile politicians, it is highly unusual for a sitting president to be using a contentious election as a hook to raise money for their own political operation.
"It is extremely uncommon for an outgoing president to be so aggressively soliciting contributions for a leadership PAC, let alone using high-profile races as a hook to entice donors to give without investing much of the money raised into said races," Beckel told ABC News. "President Trump's Save America PAC has, to date, raised an extraordinary amount of money, and President Trump faces few restrictions on how to spend the money he raises for his leadership PAC."
Some Republicans who are actively raising money to support the GOP candidates say Trump's leadership PAC is problematic.
"I think it's problematic if they're raising money and the implication is you are going to help Kelly Loeffler and David Perdue win, because really that is the most important thing right now," Martha Zoller, a former Georgia congressional candidate who now runs Georgia United Victory, a super PAC spending millions in support of the Republicans in the runoffs.
Source and more
Oh Trump has bilked the retards who still support him out of hundreds of millions so far. I am sorry but I find it hilarious that people are giving money to a supposed billionaire so that he can then use it to pay his legal fees and various debts.
This is a perfect example of why I have never and will never donate a single cent to a national political campaign.
I don't think you will get much TiG.
Platitudes are easily shot down.
I am confident I will not get any.
There is no evidence —with all the insane amount of digging— that even comes close to changing the results of this election.
That is why one wonders what sort of bizarre reasoning is at play in the minds of those claiming the election was stolen.
What sort of bizarre reasoning? Two reasons:
1. Maintain Trump's base
2. Support his rerun in 2024
Fools rush in where angels fear to tread.
Well Buzz, I predict that this ends very poorly for Trump and that his supporters will never see him win another presidential election. Engaging in an over-the-top-ridiculous attempted con job on the nation is a great way to commit political suicide.
Fools. Yes.
I don't believe he will actually live to usher in 2024
"I don't believe he will actually live to usher in 2024"
I can only hope . . . that he spends the rest of his miserable life, starting 1/21/21, behind bars along with the rest of his criminal enterprise of an administration and family . . .
He's not well, now. Even if he does get a prison term he will probably get compassionate leave or something where they let him out and he can spend the rest of his days on a hospitable bed at Mar-A-Lago with tubes snaking out of his arms...and feet
If the RNC even entertains the idea of putting him on the primary ticket in 2024, that will spell the end of the Republican party. Especially after his antics in recent months. I really believe that his phone call to the authorities in Georgia handed the Senate race to the Democrats. He did more harm than good for Republicans in that State, and around the country with his ridiculous "stolen election" campaign. Fucking idiot! I hope we never have to hear his moronic rambling incoherent 3rd grade vocabulary spewing cake hole again after Jan 20. I think that about covers it...
I feel like I candy coated it. Too sheepish? ...
My thoughts too. It certainly had to help the Ds win. Given the election was so close, Trump easily could be the reason for the loss.
My sentiments exactly. Well, I would change the word 'idiot' to 'lying sack of shit'.
Yeah, you should stop beating around the bush. Look around, there are all sorts of examples on how to deflect and engage in vague comments to avoid a losing argument.
That's all some seem to have.
How long have we been barking up that tree for now?
In a word, none!
They have had ample time. So I doubt it will happen now.
But lots of whining.
they couldn't find 1 crooked republican lawyer willing to lie to a judge in the last 2 months.
And lots of deflecting, and trolling and insulting those who prefer reality.
If they refused to lie to a judge, then maybe they weren't crooked. The reason they couldn't win is because they had no evidence to present. In Canada those are called trivial lawsuits and are dealt with harshly by the courts.
So long that the squirrel in the tree is getting restless
They saw the potential for disbarment if they did lie.
I just want you to find me 11,780 votes, nothing wrong with saying you re-calculated . . .
I'm getting so tired of hearing that!
Which, the endlessly repeated claim that Trump won and Biden stole the election or the resultant challenges to that claim?
Kind of hard to spin that one, huh?
*coffee spew - bilateral nostril involvement*
All of the above.
If the claims would stop, so would the rebuttals of the claims.
Very true.
Or if the claims were substantiated with evidence/proof.
True, but at this point it is clear that there is no evidence to support the claim that Trump won.
Quite true.
That is what I have told my dad and a few of my cousins. Prove it or shut the fuck up.
A bunch of drunks, Q Anons, ignorant crakens, and white grievers are living in an alternate reality.
And Candace Owens-Farmer. Add her and her Black representation to the list of "grievers" too!
Man, she is really in your head, isn't she?
Got anything to say about the topic, Texas1211?
Is Candace Owens the topic?
Why not ask who brought her up?
When I said the word "topic' I was referring to the topic of the article, and I replied to that comment of yours because it was the only comment you had made at the time: Here is what the word "topic" I used referred to:
I thought THAT was the "topic".
Ironically, there is a positive side to this.
Many Republicans actually believe the Election was "stolen"-- and that their votes don't count.
And on Tuesday-- at least in Georgia-- that's a good thing!
(Hehehe...)
I hope the republicans do not show up to vote this Tuesday, because Loeffler and Perdue are without moral righteousness. It's just raw politics with them, both. Let them politically rot.
And think about this: some may not show up to vote because Trump (and his evil minions) have convinced them that their votes don't count!
So why bother to even show up to vote if the Election is fixed & your vote doesn't count?
Friend Krishna, you are consistent. (Smile.)
The really sad part is that they will probably reelected. Their base is also Trump's base and those morons will vote them back in.
I can understand that it is hard to let go of "first loves" and the trend is to not jump off at the first disagreement; but, this stuff is piling up quick. Loeffler and Perdue are out of touch with the mood and temperament of a virus-laden, diseased, Georgia! Neither of the two pols are remedy for what is ailing Georgia (or this nation).
The nation is literally sick and tired. We need all around relief. Loeffler and Perdue promise more 'combat' for combat sake! "Put your dukes up!"
Considering what we found about KL, the only Duke she knows is David.
I really don't foresee that happening. Same with the general election, Trump just throws out a load of shit to try and keep the democratic voters home and get the republican voters to the poles in larger numbers.
Notice that the congress people that were elected or reelected this last election are not claiming that their elections were fraudulent, even though it was the same election, same machines, same votes counted as with Biden.
Not surprising perhaps-- just more of the typical MAGA-nut-cases typical hypocrisy.
that concept is beyond the mental grasp of the hard core base
Weird right? Their elections were performed and counted in EXACTLY the same way and yet somehow their results are completely legit but the results for the presidential election (counted on the exact same fucking ballots by the exact same fucking machines) where Biden won are somehow suspect.
I really want someone on air to ask one of the retards who won an election in a state where Trump is making these moronic claims to explain why we should consider their election valid. I mean shouldn't their claims be just as suspect as Biden's victory if they are in one of those states?
It's cognitive dissonance, a sickness that they can't seem to kick.
I think it is confirmation bias.
It's privilege and indulgence.and politics gone Wild! 'Katy' used to bar the door to keep this kind of thing out of reality.
There is NO PROOF of fraud or anything illegal, PERIOD.
The BS being perpetrated by the lunatic fringe including some republican politicians is doing damage our country.
And Ted Cruz who is supposed to be a constitutional expert is one or both of the following, a frickin' liar or a lackey of Trump.
Both.
and always has been a self-centered piece of shit whose only concern in his own political power. That is all the explanation you need in regards to what he is doing and saying.
Oh I'd like another explanation:
Since Cruz and Hawley both hang their hats on their legal background that includes clerking for Chief Justices, how the hell can either of them justify the unconstitutionality of what they intend to do?
Perhaps that experience has provided knowledge beyond your comprehension.
I doubt it.
BTFW, don't you think that it is incumbent of them to be able to justify their actions so that a layman can comprehend it?
I read and comprehended their press release and recognize it as the gaslighting bullshit that it is. They'll have to do MUCH better on the floor of the Senate if they want to rescue any semblance of credibility.
I'm sure you do. You know more than they. I forgot who I was addressing.............../s
Glad we agree.
I never made that claim so what makes you think so?
Short term memory loss?
BTW Jim, you didn't answer my question.
In answer to your question, no.
Donald Trump has opened their noses up to how to soullessly play power in politics!
It's all being done on the strength of raw ambition.
So no short term memory loss but no answer for my other two questions...
Doncha know that everyone in the government and the court system are "in" on all the "fraud" s/
Here is the audio of orange conman bordering on treason and sedition
Audio: Trump berates Ga. secretary of state, urges him to ‘find’ votes
NONE of that matters since Trump can do whateverthefuck he wants up until the second he signs his own pardon.
And his base will STILL support him, criminal or not.
Some of them will. I suspect the majority will not.
There are a few on this site who would not only support him, they would serve his sentence in jail for him.
They caught that 'orange' TROLL who golfs in December and GASLIGHTS in January trying to pull the GOOD OLD BOY ROUTINE behind the backs of voters, minorities, and women!
A-HA!
Tig,
I hate to point this out to you, but so far no takers.
I would say that Trump supporters who are in touch with reality should try to talk some sense into their fellow supports who still, inexplicably, claim this election was stolen. The election fraud supporters are making all Trump supporters and the R party itself look bad by association.
Until "they" say different, Trump supporters are all in on the Con, the Theft, the Abuse, and the Swindle. We have the Evidence and we present it before them and they continue supporting this fiendish cult of personality Donald Trump.
You may be in for a long wait.
Is that tacit acknowledgement that Trump supporters who continue to believe the election was stolen need sense to be talked into them?
There is no sense or reasoning with anyone so far disconnected from reality (or sanity) who believes the election was stolen.
Frankly, I like your approach to managing this topic.
This is a concerted effort (reminds me of MAGA too) by republicans and conservatives to disenfranchise liberals. Apparently, Trump supporters have no intention of being bested by liberals even in a fair fight. So they launch these political salvos into our camp repeatedly.
Those who can't win a fair fight might be quick to accuse others of cheating, much like Trump supporters do regarding the election results.
Quite true.
Which is why more and more prominent Republicans are trying to talk Trump out of his insanity! He's hurting the Republican party and many republicans know it.
(And let's hope that carries over into hurting the chances of the two Republicans in the Georgia runoff..this Tuesday!)
Thus is the case, where you have to continue to knock the political H out of said individuals. When someone won't respect us enough to get out of our way; politically flatten their asses or literally lay them out on the floor!
Donald Trump is a snake. That dirty bastard is going behind the curtain and pulling the "good old boy" card on republicans. Trump wants all republicans to accept him as their moral figure. The game: Win at any cost. He wants the republican party to have no more integrity than he: NONE.
Just wing it through life, doing what you can and dismissing the rest out of mind. Conscience-less.
Cult Of Personality Motto: Lie. Cheap. Steal.
TiG, don't you know the old saying, good for thee but not for me?
Trump supporters are special snowflakes who have deeply held individual beliefs and are only responsible for their own words and actions. So no matter what Trump or his sycophants say or do, though they lend their support, they aren't culpable.
Yet ironically, they insist that 'secular progressive liberals' with a hive mind and each one of them is individually responsible for every word spoken and every action by a perceived member of the 'hive'.
Maxine Waters says something, ALL Democrats are culpable.
Louis Gohmert says something, they insist that we should just view him as their crazy Uncle and leave them out of it.
It drips with hypocrisy.
There's no talking . . . sense or otherwise . . . to some folks . . . .
Maybe they think their dear leader will sign a blanket generic pardon for all of them.
As if I don't try?
It is a shame that rational Rs are not trying to talk sense into their fellow Rs. That would be more effective than an I trying to convince an R.
Well you try to do it all the time here every time you offer your opinion or present what you consider to be a fact. When you read comments with which you disagree, do you ever formulate a reply in disagreement? Rhetorical. You do it all the time (as do we all). Your recent comment is an example.
So when people are running about talking about Biden stealing the election and continuing the divisiveness in our nation, if you disagree with them you might give them some information to help set them straight.
You choose not to because you 'do not have time'.
Yet here you are.
arguing with people on line . . . .
Some of us understand and realize that Trump lost the election. I'm not necessarily happy about it, but I believe everything happens for a reason too. However, it's difficult to reason with the unreasonable and that includes a few on NT.
You are trying to convince others right now with your snark.
The tRump supporters
Oddly enough, I spent years as a flight attendant doing that same thing. Whooda thunk we had something in common?
Yes, of course, only women can conceive others.
I know that, and you know that, but...
Obviously not lol.
This one is going to take a little longer than normal to find a way to spin it. If not for the recording, they would just deny he said it.
The election was certainly not stolen but they keep trying :
Trump asked Georgia secretary of state to 'find' 11.7k ballots, 'recalculate' election result
trump should be charged with sedition and sent to Guantanamo.
I had thought that the call was from weeks ago....it's from yesterday. For all the yelling and screaming about voter fraud and coup attempts, it's trump that is pushing the coup attempt supported by a faction of people in congress. It truly is sedition and the 14th Amendment spells it out very clearly.
It should be noted that in these tapes, trump is literally asking to have over 11,000 votes, "created" to help him out. It's called extortion.
Trump won't leave Georgia's Secretary of State alone with his liberty. Here we have on full display the "some republican way" of jackin' the freedom of another republican! Donald gives a damn about liberty, freedom, and 'the American Way'!
Trump republicans are full shit and rhetoric.
I need you to find these votes
Nixon and Watergate ain't got nothin' on you!
LOCK HIM UP!
Is there a golf course in Guantanamo?
Ya, it's all sand trap and there's no carts or caddys.
... and there are landmines...
... oh, wait... IEDs...
The only hole in one will be Trump when he meets Bubba.
You have to wonder, just what the Hell does Trump have to do for the current republicans to act? He is openly trying to overturn a democratic election, striking at the heart of the Constitution.
He needs to be removed TODAY!
So very true, Kavika, and then there are those who are more of less begging to be manipulated by Trump that they are more then eager to sell their souls to the Devil just to be used by him. And he is so happy to accomodate them. Which proves that neither of them have any morals at all.
Is this how Rs would like themselves to be seen? Would the average R or Trump supporter see words like these as exemplifying their own views? Or would they disassociate themselves from this kind of rhetoric?
They probably do not even care how they're seen. It's attention seeking so they can sound off, regardless of how irrational they are.
Forgive me for being crude and to the point, but its a new year and for me it is time for the gloves to come off! MAGA commenter is an illustrator of the Trump view of Democratic Party and Liberals. Donald Trump examples: Never surrender - even in the face of facts and figures to the contrary. Charge ahead.
(Keep patting a big fat butt in the face of those "talkie" liberals as you eat their lunch!)
Trump supporters look up right in our 'avatars' and tell us they have no intention of respecting our worldviews, points, plans for the nation no matter the soundness, or sharing of figures or factual data.
Donald Trump is who they want to lead them-badly. No doubt. It is time to believe them and accept them. Let them respond differently when they dismount that cult of personality.
The Remedy: Shove plenty of get out the vote, facts, figures, logic, critical thinking, reason—all tinged with appropriate measured doses of discipline and love into Trump supporter cheeks!
It's called being a "sore-loser".
Politicians of both parties lose elections from time to time-- but most admit it gracefully and move on.
But Trump is acting like an immature child throwing temper tantrums!
Most American's (including many loyal, life-long Republicans) are beginning to get fed up with his childish behaviour.
Oh how I wish that I could see a glimmer of hope for your remedy CB. Alas, I do not.
As long as I have been here, I have attempted to present facts, figures, logic, and reason yet I have rarely if ever been met with the critical thinking required to embrace them. In fact, it's rare that any of it is even acknowledged and much more likely to be met with crickets.
If you listen to the audio of Trump's call to Georgia's SoS, he just blathers conspiracies and even though Raffensperger tell him that his information is false, he just rinses and repeats the bullshit. That seems to be inherent in Trump and his sycophants. Facts have no effect on their worldview.
Friend Dulay, my point is we can only (as Raffensperger) "stay the course" of facts, figures, logic, and reason. These will do their best work in due course of time. After all, look at Donald now - a panicky MESS stripped of all fanfare outside his so-called, "kingdom" —in the other realms where facts, figures, logic, and reason rule.
The courts can not digest Trump opinions. Thus some of Donald's chosen "favorites" took their offices and sat in judgement of what they allow across their professional thresholds. The mistake, Donald made, and I wondered about too, was that he thought "they" were modeling themselves after him. Men and women longing for dominance instead of what they were really after: Principle and long-servitude.
It should be clear to many of us after all this, that truth can be delivered fast, with expediency, or it drag to catch up; When it does-WHAM!
"Hello Reality!"
Excellent question.
Nothing I've seen indicates that the Rs give a damn that they look ridiculous. So... why??
I think they know they've definitively lost all voters other than TrumpTrueBelievers. So all their publicity is directed that way. And they know that TrumpTrueBelievers have no limit on their capacity to accept even the most absurd nonsense.
So we're watching a contest to see who can be loopiest.
There are only a few of the NT Rs actively making these ridiculous claims. I only know of one or two in my circle that buy into that crap. The others here, I suspect, are silently wishing those making these now truly stupid claims to just STFU. At least, I would hope that is what they are thinking.
IMNAAHO, a silent Republican is looking pretty ridiculous these days.
I tend to agree, but it is far better to be silent than to go full MAGA at this point. The Trump MAGA sycophants supporting this national election fraud con look far worse than those who are not engaging.
There is no case to make from the republican side. The case for stealing the election belongs to Trump and the nutcases that are supporting him. After the recorded conversation between Trump and Georgia Secretary of State, it is painfully obvious to anyone with a brain that it's Trump that is trying to steal the election and possibly committing a crime in the process.
The ASK!
I've got to hand it to all of you who are still able to interact with the seditious, treasonous, coup supporting, anti-republic 'Republican', die hard Trump supporters on this site. I haven't been able to do so for weeks. Makes my blood absolutely boil.
This shit is unforgivable. Never forget.
Shoot. I was hoping to find the answers on this article, but those arguing for Trump don’t even have an argument to bring to the table. I guess the reasoning will have to stay parked on “because that’s what I want”.
They're kinda quiet, hmmm?
I’m waiting for the inevitable argument (especially by one particular member here) that it is incumbent upon Joe Biden to prove that he didn’t cheat.
@15 gets pretty close.
Guilty until proven innocent, eh?
Not at present.
But give them a little time-- they will eventually come up with an argument.
Because that's their ingrained pattern of behaviour-- that's what they do-- at least the worst of the group (and unfortunately there are a few still active on this site...)
They never give up trying to con us.
(Of course the argument they come up with will be absolutely ridiculous...but they never give up hope they can find some mentally-challenged people to con)
We are supposed to ignore the Democratic primaries where the Democratic Party changed their own rules during the process. We're supposed to accept that beginning voting in September (supposedly because of the pandemic) resulted in a fair election. We're supposed to accept that a candidate who campaigned very little and received little press coverage won more votes than any other candidate in the history of the US. Biden has gotten more press coverage as President-elect than he did as a candidate. That has been explained as a referendum on Trump, yet we are to ignore that down ballot Republicans who aligned with Trump (some of whom even campaigned on Qanon conspiracy theories) actually did well during the election.
We are supposed to ignore three years of investigation which only resulted in a handful of convictions for lying to the FBI. We are supposed to ignore the press twisting everything the Trump administration did into the most cynical, pessimistic, conspiratorial type of reporting. We're supposed to ignore the House Democrats impeaching a President based upon a parody as evidence.
After what has transpired over the last four years, we're to accept that nothing was rigged? We are expected to believe the intensive and extensive effort to 'get' Trump was about pursuing truth and protecting democracy? Yes, Donald Trump is a liar and charlatan. But that isn't an excuse to avoid acknowledging that those opposed to Trump having been lying charlatans, too.
[deleted]
Both sides do it!
We're supposed to accept that a candidate who campaigned very little and received little press coverage won more votes than any other candidate in the history of the US.
When you are running against such a notoriously horrible candidate like Donald Trump, all you need to do is sit back and watch him lose. The fact is, the black vote did not show up for Hillary Clinton like they did for Obama, because she didn’t inspire them enough to leave the house. They personally witnessed the results of their error, and showed up in force this time around to correct it. Trump and his gang of thieves have spent every second since then trying to exclude those particular votes using every wildly disproven explanation they can come up with, no matter how embarrassing.
Please outline how the Trump Administration has been particularly hard on blacks.
Specifics, please.
Please show me where I said he was. Specifics, please.
We ALL have been witnessing the horrors of the Trump administration - black, white, brown and otherwise. It’s no secret that the black turnout for Hillary was not as high as it should have been. Had they turned out, we and the rest of the world wouldn’t have had to endure this abomination called Trump. More than likely all of these false claims of voter fraud would have occurred four years ago instead, as Trump suggested he would have done had he lost back then. It has nothing to do with “Trump’s treatment of blacks” as YOU have suggested. Although, nothing inspires the black vote more than an opponent who lavishes praise and acceptance on racist organizations, like Trump does.
Will quoting your own words back to you suffice as specific enough?
Also, why do you seem to think that blacks must be "inspired" enough to even leave the house? [deleted]
[deleted] You’ve just quoted back to me the same evidence that I pointed out which disproves your stupid allegation. [deleted]
Also, why do you seem to think that blacks must be "inspired" enough to even leave the house? [comment removed for context [ph]]
Oh, how cute. You think that my speaking out loud a plain truth about black turnout four years ago was a perfect opportunity to paint me as a racist. [deleted]
Mr. Farmer. Donald Trump. Mrs. Candace Owens-Farmer.
Candace decided to insult Black American liberals by branding them 'plantation negroes' (paraphrase) slaving away in the Democratic Party. Then, "Ms Thang" had the brass vagina to imagine she had strength and reach enough to start #Blexit and lead blacks to 'conservative-ville' a region somewhere inside either Donald's butt or head depending on orientation and time and space. Then, Candace wrote a book about it all: BlackOut . A thing so pathetic and hard to read that I who can read many opposing points of view could not even stand up to this challenge speed-reading.
Considering all the above, it was hard on me and many other Blacks. That is, Donald did not win the hearts and minds of the Black majority voters.
yeah, yeah, yeah.
Your opinion of a strong black woman who doesn't toe the Democratic Party line in just so freaking horrible.
Well, you asked.
Candace Owens-Farmer is mighty strong in ways that some conservatives approve. I suppose. Y'all got her. Y'all can keep her and her raging against Blacks commentary.
And you are free to remain in the Democratic Party fold--or is that plantation?
No, I actually did not ask.
Why would I ask about something so off topic--especially when your "view" on her is well known?
i do admire how you manage to work her in, though!
She must really have space in your head!
The Democrats of today whose ancestors were on those plantations were the slaves. The descendants of the Southern Democrats who owned those slaves have all become Republicans who defend their confederate flags and confederate monuments and call white supremacists and Nazi's marching in the streets "fine people" and are still the white conservative Christian majority controlling those former confederate States today.
That's her husband?
Whichever gives you cold comfort, Texan. I'm good like that.
Yes. He's British, conservative, and from a political dynasty there also.
still pushing the insane theory that all those Southern Democrats became Republicans, I see.
Cute!
Haha!
I am good knowing you just can't stop thinking of her!
This year I won't be giving a flying. . . anything for some conservative deflections. So they can have their way with the spaces in their heads. Words are words. Deal with them. And, if you have something more interesting to do rather than this 'see-saw' —don't bother will this 'lil-bit' —Just do it!
we know for certain that you do not have any empty head.
All those former Southern Democrats who wrapped themselves in their confederate ancestry and angrily protect the confederate monuments and march in the streets waving confederate flags along side swastika flags didn't just die off or move out of the South. The same conservative white Christians who ran those Southern States are still running them today, they simply changed parties over the last forty years. Trying to pretend they simply vanished or are still somehow the Democrats of today who despise the confederate flag and have been working to tear down the confederate monuments and have welcomed black Americans into their party with open arms is the truly insane theory.
my, my. such horrible things to say about Democrats.
Funny how much Democrats loved those racist Southerners when it gave control to the party!
Here is one very good example:
...Republicans can only deflect from the fact that they are now the political party that defends the confederate flag, confederate monuments and claims there is no systemic racism counter to all evidence. It's no wonder that 80%+ of black Americans choose to align themselves with Democrats even though Southern Democrats were the party of racism and segregation for the first 200 years of our nation. One would think that black Americans in the South would all lean Republican, the supposed party of Lincoln and emancipation, but they aren't stupid, they clearly see which party today actually values them and works towards a more perfect union by acknowledging and addressing the racial inequity that they experience on a daily basis and it certainly is not the Republican party in the South that has just picked up where the Dixiecrats left off. I find it truly hilarious that anyone actually believes the large white conservative Christian control of the South which has never really changed are somehow not the same folk or descendants of those who used to register as Southern Democrats (Dixiecrats) and fought the civil rights act and voting rights act that were passed and signed into law by the majority of Democrats and a Democrat President who rejected segregation and embraced equality. Those who continue this fantasy that white Christian conservative Republicans who now hold almost all the same seats of power in the South that the former white Christian conservative Dixiecrats held and continue to protect the monuments to white supremacist traitors their ancestors erected or the confederate flag their ancestors flew are in severe denial of reality.
You seem really hung up on that Confederate flag.
Democrats LOVED them some racist Southerners when it meant total control of Congress for decades. It is pointless to deny that.
Simple truth is that Southern Democrats continued to vote other Southern Democrats into office for decades after the Civil Rights Bill passed.
And now most of those racists are dead and buried.
It is a symbol of hate, racism and treason so those still clinging to it and defending it are obviously embracing the things it stands for.
Notice the "ED" on the end of that word? That denotes past tense. And for the record I have never denied the fact that Northern Democrats did use Southern Democrats to pass many laws early last century and really only split in the 1950's and '60's specifically over segregation.
The "Southern strategy" that Republicans at the time employed did not work overnight. It was an appeal to the disaffected Southern Democrats angered at Northern Democrats passing the civil rights act and voting rights act that Republicans knew would likely take decades to show results. By 1991 they had effectively completed their flip of the South from blue to red.
"From now on, the Republicans are never going to get more than 10 to 20 percent of the Negro vote and they don't need any more than that... but Republicans would be shortsighted if they weakened enforcement of the Voting Rights Act. The more Negroes who register as Democrats in the South, the sooner the Negrophobe whites will quit the Democrats and become Republicans. That's where the votes are. Without that prodding from the blacks, the whites will backslide into their old comfortable arrangement with the local Democrats" - Republican strategist Kevin Phillips in 1970 NY Times interview
Many are, many aren't, and the conservative racist apples that fell from their conservative racist trees are abundant in the South and now make up the vast majority of the Republican power structure there. Anyone denying that fact is either a deluded moron simply refusing to accept reality or a Republican determined to deflect and distract from the truth because the truth hurts.
That is certainly one opinion.
Did you think I typed that blindfolded or something?
Please do tell me how Northern Democrats split from Southern Democrats.
This should be really exciting!
(And no, I don't mean "split" as in how they may have differed in opinions on race--tell me how the Northern Democrats split from the Southern Democrats.)
Yeah, Southern Democrats fled to the Party that freed the slaves and voted overwhelmingly for the Civil Rights Act.
Man, doesn't THAT sound plausible!
Nerm, good grief, we are not expected to believe anything without convincing evidence.
Those propping up this election fraud bullshit are asking people to believe that the USA 2020 presidential election was replete with fraud sufficient to change the outcome. Yet they cannot seem to find the supporting evidence.
'Follow the evidence' is what is being asked, not that you believe something without evidence.
Good grief man, do you actually believe Trump's con??
What transpired over the last four years has shown how easily political evidence can be manufactured. And manufactured evidence takes precedent based upon whatever anyone wishes to believe.
The politics isn't any different than that used to justify investigating 'Russian collusion' and impeachment based upon political evidence. Now those who believe whatever they want to believe are questioning political evidence?
The evidence for election fraud is just as sound as was the evidence for 'Russian collusion'.
I believe Trump is engaged in the same type of politics as those opposed to Trump have used over the last four years. What is happening are the consequences of letting the 'resistance' run amok.
Nothing was manufactured against tRump.
Does that vague answer mean that you believe Biden stole the election from Trump?
If Trump has evidence of election fraud, what is he waiting for to produce it?
Let's see his witnesses undergo questioning so we can see for ourselves what their credibility is.
The sole witness they have produced, in Michigan , was widely disbelieved.
Evidence, evidence, evidence? Where is it? The video in Georgia concerning boxes of votes taken out from under tables has been completely debunked, yet Trump mentioned it repeatedly on the phone call Saturday.
No one has mistreated Trump. But he has sure as hell mistreated this country.
Neither Trump or his supporters have any evidence to offer. They might be thinking that if they whine and continue to make fraud allegations, someone might take them seriously or lend credibility to the claims. It's not likely to happen, at least not from any rational minded individual.
Trump is attempting to swindle the Georgia Secretary of State and the people of Georgia into ACTING on his request, while waiting on his mythical evidence that is like the old quip: "The check is in the mail!"
Trumphole is president of the United States, evidence that exist is handy to any and every president. Trumphole has tried 18 prior times to have this phone meeting with the Georgia Secretary of State. . .and when it hits. . . the President of the United States is still talking about the evidence is 'over there being prepared.'
Here the deal. Trump wants his phony CREATED votes -this week. And the 'Sec' can keep holding the empty bag of promises for evidence until the term ends.
The question of Biden stealing the election depends upon Joe Biden possessing enough influence (and competence) to accomplish the feat. Joe Biden hasn't shown either.
The question of Biden stealing the election is an example of how political goalposts are moved.
The question of Biden stealing the election is the predicate for this seed. Why try to pretend otherwise?
A perfect example of deflection.
To not have to face the reality that the emperor has no clothes?
He question of Biden stealing the election is best answered by evidence, or the lack thereof. So, do you assert Biden stole the election? If so, what is the basis of your allegation?
My first question is: Who are this 'we' you speak of?
Secondly, please explain why the DNC rule change is relevant.
NONE of the states that have early voting in September CHANGED their laws because of the pandemic. ALL of their early voting laws were on the books BEFORE this year.
I hope that dispenses with THAT bullshit and sets your mind at ease.
Whether you accept it or not, it is a FACT.
Point?
Where? Link?
NO ONE ignored that. It's been analyzed all over the media. It's a well known fact that voters will give 'Congress' a terrible rating while giving a thumbs up for THEIR local Representative. That's how this shit works.
First of all, WTF does THAT have to do with the 2020 election?
Secondly, there were multiple convictions for crimes other than lying to the FBI AND multiple plea agreements that cited crimes other than lying to the FBI.
Cry me a river. Trump gets what he gives.
You are?
WTF does any of that have to do with the Nov. 3 election? After over a month of litigation, 50 states and DC certified their electors. THAT is what you are to 'accept'.
What you 'believe' is immaterial. Either post some EVIDENCE to back up your whining, or get over it.
Yet AGAIN, that has NOTHING to do with the FACT that HUNDREDS of people all across the country did their due diligence and their duty and certified the vote counts in their states. Trump LOST.
I wonder..is it really a good idea to encourage him...????
THEY REFUSE TO ACCEPT/GET OVER IT!
The public is the 'we'. You know, the victims of spurious fact checking. I realize the political left cares little about the public but the public is the target for left's political propaganda.
Democrats have demonstrated repeatedly that political evidence need not be based on facts. Yes, Trump lost. But that fact ignores the political evidence that the election was rigged.
Politics is not about truth. Politicians are not truth tellers.
NO, the tRump criminal enterprise administration CARES NOTHING ABOUT THE PUBLIC BUT THE PUBLIC IS THE TARGET FOR THE 'RIGHT'S' POLITICAL PROPAGANDA.
tRump cares for no one or nothing but HIMSELF.
Prove that the election was rigged then! Present your evidence! All I see is a lot of allegations, but nothing of substance to support them.
POS/POTUS supposedly is going to lay it all out at his pending rally in georgia. sounds like the basis for a drinking game in the making. I can hardly wait for SNL and late night TV to humiliate the infinite shit out of the living monument of republican political embarrassment. after trump gets his final electoral rejection, he has 14 days left to throw every potential 2024 candidate under the bus. let the hilarity begin.
Yeah, that should be good.
You have to ask why he didn't "lay it all out" during one of his almost 60 court cases?
Yet the vast majority of 'we' are not pearl clutching.
No, I don't know about 'fake' fact checking. Link?
So 'the political left' isn't part of the public 'we'? Since when?
Here we go with the argle-garble again.
So the 'rigging' failed?
Revelatory. /s
Yep, there isn't enough mustard on the planet for that pretzel.
What a load of total horseshit!
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C'mon NermL-- give it a rest!!!
Nothing in your tirade would be even remotely considered evidence that you could take to a court. How do you explain that? How do you explain that anybody could ever pull off a conspiracy of that magnitude without any leaks and without leaving any evidence behind. I'm actually surprised that Trump and his crackhead team of highfalutin' lawyers has come up with absolutely nothing. Maybe, if he really wanted to find fraud, he should have looked for it in the states he won in?
No, buts allowed. Donald is a Trumphole. Some conservatives dropped this Trumphole into the thick of the 2016 campaign and the others 'hopped out' or got tossed out of the running. Said republicans aligned with the Trumphole for 'cause.' And four years later, truth and 'the Great American Way' has casted Donald J. Trump down and out.
A solution to what some of you can accept has a moral: Stop pushing authoritarian Trumphole on to the republican campaign ticket. This country wants a true leader who wants to lead in service to the people and not in-service to his or her affectations.
Do Not Run Grotesque Liars and Charlatans to Represent Our Shared Country!
Who cares? That is an internal party process, they set their own rules just like the GOP. Shit I am not even allowed to vote in either primary process. What a fucking dumb thing to bring up.
Um yes, why would it not? Explain to me how giving people a bigger window to vote somehow translates into that election not being fair. And before you try to say they have more time to commit voter fraud, provide the fucking evidence it happened or shut the fuck up.
Yes because THAT many people hate Donald Trump. He has NEVER had majority support and his presidency has been a fucking tire fire. He even lost the popular vote in the election that put him in office to begin with. Oh, and it isn't like no one knew who Joe Biden was. He has been in government since the dawn of time and was the VP for the nation's first black president for 8 goddamn years. It isn't like he just came out of nowhere.
So? Trump got more press coverage after he wont the election than before too, what's your point?
Yeah, which makes the whole election fraud conspiracy theory that much more retarded and difficult to explain for you. Now to a rational person the explanation is fairly easy, the house races are held in districts (many of which have been gerrymandered over the years) so it is easy to have a candidate from one party win a house district while that same party loses statewide elections. As for the Senate, well what seats were up for grabs? I bet with a few exceptions the senate seats went to the candidates from the same party as the candidate that was elected president. Not to mention some people probably, as I have in the past, split their ballot. Your statement is rather easily explained, it is only when you start pitching the election fraud shit that you start sounding like a homeless dude rambling on a street corner.
What the fuck does that have to do with the election? Or are you suggesting that investigation in some way ties into some sort of mass voter fraud? Please explain.
Happens to every president these days, what's your point?
Yawn, again this has what to do with the election or fraud or something? Running out of steam eh? I am beginning to suspect that you don't even know what point you are trying to make.
Provide the evidence motherfucker, until you do are you are doing is bitching and whining that your team didn't win. God watching sports with you would fucking suck.
Of course politics was a part of it, always is, but Trump has no doubt damaged our democracy and I know congress doesn't have the political strength to make the changes to the executive that desperately need to be made, or separate the JoD from the executive branch, or impose term limits on SCOTUS justices, or reform our election process, or get rid of the electoral college. And because our politicians are cowards the damage from Trump will be lasting and my guess is within 20 years someone who isn't a complete fucking moron will come along and finish what he started.
Of legendary proportions and his supporters have completely sold out their moral and ethical principles in supporting him. I love how acknowledge that he is a liar and yet you believe him on this bullshit in spit of zero supporting evidence. The evidence is so thin that in an arena where there are actual consequences for being full of shit (court) his attorney's don't even try to repeat his claims. Even the judges HE appointed have thrown out his cases as total bullshit. Even the SCOTUS, where he appointed 1/3 of the members, want nothing to do with this. I will never understand why you would believe this asshole.
No, both sides do not do it in this case. Fuck off with that shit. Trump has taking lying to an entirely different level and has proven beyond any doubt that he is willing to do as much damage as he needs to to our governing norms to perpetuate those lies.
Is "conspiracy to overthrow the government" a valid definition of "treason"?
Is "conspiracy to overthrow the results of a Presidential election" the same thing?
Treason definition, according to the United States Constitution:
Please do take note of the use of the word "only".
Treason is a word be much-bandied about now.
It is taking on all the effectiveness as calling someone a racist or a misogynist--two terms so overused, and used inappropriately, as to be virtually meaningless.
Just a new buzzword to rile up very fine folks.
Feel free to use that definition if you choose.
I will stick with the U.S. Constitution--especially as seeing how any charges of treason in THIS country must conform to it.
But you may find some prosecutor somewhere who doesn't use the Constitution.
Good luck!
Do you believe that "war" is only fought with guns? When he told the Proud Boys to stand by, that sounds like something a commander would tell his troops. AND the Proud Boys are using it as a rallying cry.
Are you claiming his rhetoric is NOT causing violence amongst his ultra right wing followers?
With all the violence and threats against state officials (including a planned kidnapping attempt), can you show me any instances of Trump rebuking them for those threats of violence?
lol.
changing the topic, are you?
No, but you are desperately trying to.
If the definition of treason in the Constitution is too narrow, there are other crimes:
sedition
noun: sedition; plural noun: seditions
conduct or speech inciting people to rebel against the authority of a state or monarch.
18 U.S. Code § 2384 - Seditious conspiracy
If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; July 24, 1956, ch. 678, § 1, 70 Stat. 623; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(N), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2148.)
You chose to use the word treason.
Maybe you should have used one of the other words you have now posted.
Do you agree that Trump's behavior constitutes "sedition"?
What I specifically argued was your use of the word treason.
I feel you have presented a very weak case for a charge of treason, based on law.
No. Even if the Georgia results were reversed (no chance of it actually happening), it would still leave Trump well short of the 270 electoral votes necessary to win, and Biden would still have over that 270 so the results of the election--Biden winning--would still be the same
it doesn't meet the legal standards you gave for sedition.
On to the next word.
In case this hasn't already been posted, the entire tape can be heard here .
It's... stunning...
It is indeed.
That is an hour of my life I will never get back.
Trump is batshit crazy.
Ah... but!
Donald Trump has enriched your existence...
Not by a long shot...
I don't know if it enriched me or not, but Trump actually made me care about politics and elections.
Yes... in the same way that getting shot makes one care about gun control...
Say what?
It hurts really, really bad, and you don't want it to happen again!
I find it ironic that the magats in the picture are saying STOP THE STEAL. I bet some of them sent money to Trump's fund and he probably put that money into his own pockets, essentially stealing it.
Biden hasn't even taken office yet and he has a higher approval rating than Trump did during the past four years.
I've got pocket lint with a higher approval rating than Trump had during the past 4 years.