Trump Names Whistleblower
Yep. Trump treats the whistleblower's name like classified information - he releases it.
Butt, although it's unethical, outing a whistleblower is NOT a crime.
Can Trump Legally Out The Whistleblower? Experts Say It Would Not Violate Any Laws
November 6, 20195:00 AM ET
BOBBY ALLYN
In recent days, President Trump and his allies have amplified their calls for the whistleblower who sparked the impeachment inquiry to be identified, presenting the question of whether it would be a crime for the president to unmask the anonymous whistleblower.
According to four former top federal government officials who worked in intelligence and national security, the answer is no.
______________
John McLaughlin, the former acting director of the CIA, said part of the reason why federal laws do not prohibit the president from outing a whistleblower is that the concept was never considered within the realm of possibility before Trump took office.
McLaughlin said there is a longstanding deference to the protection of whistleblowers who risk their jobs to expose corruption, waste and abuse that has largely prevented federal government officials from naming them.
"But as with so many of our supposed laws, compliance depends largely on a sense of integrity and voluntary compliance," McLaughlin said. "You just have to expect people to obey the law and the established practices, which of course in this administration has not always been the case."
Former Defense Secretary and CIA Director Leon Panetta said a presidential unmasking of the whistleblower would mark a historic event.
"The whole purpose of that law was to allow people to be able to speak to fraud or crimes they see within their jobs and without having to pay a price for vengeance and retribution," said Panetta, adding that having a president publicly reveal a whistleblower's name would be "unprecedented in history."
https://www.npr.org/2019/11/06/776481504/can-trump-legally-out-the-whistleblower-experts-say-it-would-not-violate-any-law
Since "compliance depends largely on a sense of integrity" and The Donald has NO integrity, the whistleblower is screwed.
Ukraine whistleblower driven to work by armed security officers when Trump tweets about him
by Caitlin Yilek
December 26, 2019 03:55 PM
The CIA analyst who sparked the impeachment investigation is being protected by armed security officers.
The analyst, whose identity has not been confirmed, continues to work on issues relating to Russia and Ukraine and is driven to and from work by the armed officers when threats against him increase, the Washington Post reported. The threats tend to increase when President Trump tweets about the whistleblower.
The whistleblower submitted a complaint about Trump’s interactions with the leader of Ukraine, including concerns about Trump urging Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky to investigate his political rival Joe Biden in a July 25 phone call.
Some Republican lawmakers have alleged that CIA analyst Eric Ciaramella filed the complaint and have demanded that he testify in Trump’s impeachment proceedings.
Ciaramella, 33, was Ukraine director on the National Security Council at the end of the Obama administration and was briefly the acting senior director for European and Russian affairs in the early months of the Trump administration. He is now a deputy national intelligence officer for Russia and Eurasia on the National Intelligence Council.
Lawyers for the whistleblower, who have not confirmed or denied whether they are representing Ciaramella, said any attempt to out their client would be the "pinnacle of irresponsibility."
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/ukraine-whistleblower-driven-to-work-by-armed-security-officers-when-trump-tweets-about-him
Trump has repeatedly called the whistleblower a spy and a traitor. And Trump says "you know what we used to do to traitors" and makes the throat cut sign.
TRUMP'S ALARMING ATTACKS THREATEN THE WHISTLEBLOWER—AND OUR FOUNDING VALUES
ANGUS KING , SENATOR OF MAINE
ON 11/8/19 AT 6:15 AM EST
From the moment news broke that President Donald Trump was accused of misusing his office for political gain, the president and elected officials who support him have sought to discredit the whistleblower as everything from a partisan hack peddling hearsay to a treasonous enemy of the state with an ax to grind.
To be sure, the president has every right to defend himself, but this is a misguided and dangerous approach that betrays his ignorance of America's history, threatens the whistleblower's safety and makes it less likely that future abuses of power by any federal official will be discovered and corrected. These statements cannot be allowed to continue in defiance of historical context or present facts. So, as the very idea of whistleblowing comes under attack, I think we would benefit from revisiting our nation's history of protecting those who speak truth to the highest levels of power—protections that date back to our nation's founding.
That's right. Whistleblower protections are not a recent creation; they were first put into place in 1778, as the ink of the Declaration of Independence was still drying and more than a decade before the Constitution would enshrine a healthy skepticism of concentrated power into our current system of government.
_______________
The most immediate concern must be the safety of the whistleblower. The president has roused his supporters into a furor over the identity of this anonymous official, which creates a serious danger to this person. In fact, press reports indicate that the FBI has already investigated death threats against the whistleblower, even though we do not know their name.
The entire situation raises the question: If this is how America treats whistleblowers, who will come forward next time? A chilling effect that prevents the next official who witnesses misconduct anywhere in the government from stepping forward could linger for generations, inflicting untold damage to our democracy.
Throughout our history, we have defended those patriots who call out corruption so that we may follow the light they shine toward a more perfect union. We believe that sunlight is the best disinfectant and salute those whose conscience guides them toward ethical behavior. If we are to continue to benefit from their courage, we must reassert, here and now, that centuries-old American value that speaking truth to power is not a right; it is a duty.
https://www.newsweek.com/trumps-alarming-attacks-threaten-whistleblower-our-founding-values-opinion-1470522
The whistleblower has to have the protection of armed guards because The Donald is an unethical SOB. And because many Trump supporters are gun toting psychos.
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Q: Why did The Donald out the whistleblower?
A: Because he is a fucking unethical asshole.
Now, now, al. Let's not rush to judgment. Maybe it's because he can manipulate his supporters (because he's always counted on their ignorance and inability to think for themselves) into making threats against the whistleblower, so his/her family can be threatened, then trump can tweet that he doesn't encourage that behavior. Of course, he's knowing they won't question why he doxxed the whistleblower at all unless he had every intention of making that patriot feeling threatened. He can feign ignorance and innocence, but he will feel emboldened because he manipulated his supporters without saying a word.
The whistleblower is a fuckin' hero and history will reflect that very thing. Another morally rudderless thing to do, who will undoubtedly be defended by those who don't mind one bit being morally rudderless since they don't have a moral compass anyway.
He should be awarded a medal.
Unfortunately, I don't think a medal can be pinned on kevlar.
We should Trump (and his Chief of Staff, Secretary of State and his former National Security Advisor) under oath.
I think we should put trump under oath and have him testify.
Because Trump can't speak the truth.
He would never testify and the republicans wouldn't let him.
They all know he can't tell the truth about anything. He would perjure himself in under a minute.
He does not know how to tell the truth. And at some point not long after he takes the oath, he will veer off into a tirade about how he is being unfairly wronged, or a confession of how he would like to screw Ivanka.
The truth is not in his genes, and never has been.
The Donald has devalued the value of truth.
Trump has make truth worthless.
I respectfully disagree. His supporters have devalued truth. They no longer know what truth is or understand it's importance. The supporters are the problem not Trump. Trump is nothing without his supporters.
An oath is a "perjury trap" for Trump.
If he can testify without slurring his words, suffering from aphasia
or just making up new words...
I think many Republicans see asking Trump to tell the truth as a "perjury trap" because they all know he's guilty as sin, they just don't care. They don't want him to testify because they know he'll have to lie his ass off in order to not confirm the majorities worst fears about him. After spouting nearly 15,000 lies so far, even his sycophants know he can't be trusted to testify without ruining the narrative they've all been pushing of Donald being some innocent little victim under attack by the "deep state". The next few decades are going to be interesting watching the Trump fans eat crow as the Nixon fans did as more and more facts come out about how criminal his administration really was. There simply is no way this ends well for them whether Trump testifies or not.
Actually he has surpassed the 15,000 lie plateau.
I agree, and have said so here in other articles. Trump is not, and never was, Presidential material. His actions and his mouth have shamed our country and the majority of the American people. He has alienated all of our true allies and engaged in treasonous and criminal activities while in the WH, which is nothing new for him, as that is how he has been most all of his life.
That the Repubs continue to avidly support him knowing his history and current behavior is, I think, more a matter of not being willing to admit the truth, so they further shame themselves, and our country, by continuing to avidly support him. It also demonstrates that they have set the bar so low for their own party that it no longer matters what kind of human being their candidate is, only if they can win.
However......when it gets to the point where McConnell's re-election is threatened due to his shameful kiss-a$$ support for Trump, McConnell will quickly throw Trump under the bus.
Like Trump, the only loyalty McConnell has is to himself and his rich Chinese in-laws, and his constituents can pound rocks where he is concerned.
JMOO
And if the candidate is a white nationalist. That's important to them also.
McConnell is a traitor to the country. I pray he is not re-elected but I don't have much hope left. This lot of voters has really damaged my optimism that good will overcome evil.
You're right as usual, I should have said "over 15,000".
As long as his rich Chinese in-laws can buy his re-election for him he will continue to be re-elected. And until McConnell is out of Congress there is little hope that any real progress can be made that will be good for all the American people, and our country. Pelosi is a problem as well, but, no where near the same level as McConnell.
And I agree that he is a traitor to America and its people. And his undying loyalty to Trump is truly detrimental to our country.
Yet, the time will come when he will reap what he has sown, and that is more than any punishment he could receive here on earth.
I'm sure you're right but I'd still like to see him experience some pain for his actions against this country.
Me too! And like most all politicians, there is likely a lot of stuff hiding in his closet that he does not want made public.
I find it curious that he continues to be re-elected when most of the people of Kentucky can't stand him. And despite what many say about the people of Kentucky being back-woods idiots, they are very intelligent and realize that all McConnell supports that is supposed to be for the benefit of his constituents, it mostly benefits his big donors and their cohorts.
They voted for a Democratic governor to replaced the asshole who was running as a pro-Trump anti-impeachment candidate (which was hilarious because governors have nothing to do with impeachment).
I hope there are a lot of voters in Kentucky that are sick of Moscow Mitch.
That is one of my biggest wishes as well. He is like a stage 5 cancer that is will seriously bring far worse disaster to our Congress and country and its people unless he is cut out very soon.
Well put.
Trump is a festering sore on the ass of the Republican Party.
If he isn't removed the infection may kill the party.
Sounds a lot like narcissism.
Here's a photo of the great White hunter, Donald Trump, Jr., proudly displaying the severed elephant penis, oops, I mean the severed elephant tail from his latest kill.
I'm opposed to killing elephants for fun, butt I appreciate the optics. The Elephant is the symbol of the Republican Party. Junior managed to kill an elephant before his daddy killed the GOP.
Doesn't surprise me what you consider competence...
He would just lie.
Trump and his rabid supporters have already killed the Republican party. What remains of what was once a decent political party is nothing but ignorance and hate.
I was a Republican for most of my life, but, it is nothing like the party that I was once proud to be a part of. It is now nothing but a party of shame and corruption, just like its now leader, Trump. It has become a personification of Trump.
They first sold themselves to the Tea Party, and now to Trump. They may as well use a 'For Sale To Highest Bidder' sign to designate their party instead of an R. And they have no one but themselves to blame. No one.
Independents are you reading ANY of this?!!
Nothing about the honor in finding out if what the true and proper transcript of the Ukraine-US call says? Do you want it released? Or should we just designate Donald Trump as holy right here and now?
Conservatives are weirding this country out! Where are the independents when moments like this happen?
We simply must get people to vote President Trump out of office, so proper law can get at him. Given four more years and the real danger is he might mesmerize nearly all of us. Remember, we are not used to see our presidents on television every single day or in the news or on social media. Already, he is patterned after a "dear leader." Everywhere you go—everywhere you are his name or personage is cocooning you.
The Republican Party itself is already dead. What we are seeing now is the rising of a new political machine that uses the Republican Party as their own moniker.
The neo-Nazis, White Supremacists and rabid, unofficial militias are what is now representing the Republicans. It is a party of hate and divisiveness. And McConnell has become the unofficial leader of the new Republican party. As even if Trump was ousted tomorrow, if McConnell remains the Republican party will continue to devour itself.
Trump is the good that overcame evil Hillary
Texan, what is this rumor I am hearing about Steven Miller, a senior advisor to Trump, being a white nationalists? What do you know about it? And, do you care to share it?
Perrie and Tig are libertarians, you say? Good heavens on odd voting cycles I can be an Independent and I have never considered being a libertarian!!!
???
@1.1.38.
In real-time Perrie and Tig are Independents. I don't get any hint from either of the two about libertarianism, however.
Good thing sHillary didn't get elected. She would have doubled that number easily!
Rewrite?
And look who you got instead.
He filed a Whistleblower complaint that both the IG and the DNI said followed the law to the letter. The IG found the complaint to be credible and of 'urgent concern'. EVERYTHING in the complaint has been confirmed by witness testimony or admissions by Trump.
What further proof do you think is necessary for him to be 'real'?
ALL of that has been proven to be true FW.
The WB complaint, the IG's report have been released. The DNI testified to Congress in an open hearing.
Who are you trying to kid? I doubt that you believe a word of the testimony that's already documented.
I find it hilarious that most of you have whined about 'hearsay' but now insist that you need to hear a 'hearsay' witness.
Well, far be it for me to speak for Tig, but I am an independent.
And yet you're still here hurling insults. Seems pretty free to me.
Yep.
He shows up on all of my articles and "hurls insults".
I love that shit.
WTF?
Are you calling her a liar?
I think she knows her own political affiliation better than you do.
If she says she's an independent, I believe her and I don't understand why anyone would think she's lying.
She didn't say that comment was an insult.
Butt she has probably seen lots of the other insults you have posted.
I've seen plenty of them.
You said (comment #1.1.53):
She said she's an "independent". That's a "political affiliation". You said you "haven't bought that independent nonsense from the get-go." That's means you called her a liar.
It's YOUR comment you should OWN it.
I'm an expert on "independence". I served on the USS Independence (in VF-102).
You had a point?
You can get on the ballot in some states as an independent. Ross Perot is the best example of an independent.
He rarely has a point.
You were discussing independence.
I was merely trying to help you understand it.
Don't you know about Ross Perot?
Who has "freaked out"?
Trollish comments don't bother me, it's just part of the Internet experience.
Ross Perot ran as an Independent in 1992. He got on the ballot in every state and got almost 19% of the popular vote.
He formed the Reform Party and ran again in 1996.
I only play with myself.
It can be very satisfying.
Sometimes I Google myself until I Twitter in my pants.
What does Captain Obvious do when you play with him?
Unless you're a football player. Then the act of peaceful protest means you should be fired. Right?
Prove it. Prove that was said. Provide a credible link that states that.
I can't help but laugh every time. They're defending Trump by imitating his churlish behavior, by refusing to acknowledge the obvious, and their defense of the indefensible. I don't believe most of his supporters here are stupid. Most can see that Trump is disastrous and I'm sure most would wish Trump would stop tweeting. I believe most republicans wish he would stop tweeting since it only works against him. However, few are as truthful as Wally. Wally has owned it, and for that, he's shown more courage than most. Wally admits he just likes "seeing demmies cry." That's it. Fuck how we appear on the world stage. Fuck how ridiculous we look. Fuck all the indictments. Fuck the ignoring subpoenas and fuck turning over documents. Fuck how he's destroyed the republican party. Fuck that he handed us Congress. Fuck the immoral behavior in his personal life. Fuck the provable falsehoods. Fuck personal integrity. Fuck self-respect. Fuck that they support someone who disparages dead heroes. Fuck that he called a prisoner of war, an American hero, a loser because he was captured and tortured. They will hold onto the fact that trump is perceived as a person that makes demmies cry. They're still pissed that we elected, popularly and electorally, an educated, classy, well-received black man.
I like watching the insults fly from people don't realize that having a civil response will get some attention, not elicit laughter. Really, really hard laughter.
I've been looking ... have you found one yet?
As al cited, trolling seems to be his point.
Cobaltblue, to illustrate your point take a look at this link and share it widely:
The operative wording: "wiretapping a political opponent is an impeachable offense," demonstrates the depravity of the republican party mind as a unit.
These fools, for there is no other proper word for it, are sending up this forewarning their backbiting will not end with Trump who cried out, "impeach me" and "I can do whatever I want as president." They are planning to drag the former black president down into the cesspool of Trump . . .if they are allowed control of the House again.
The operative word: again. Can anything be more vindictive? More illustrative of what why republicans can not cope with positions of power?
It won't work for them either. As, the wiretapping is their 'stupe.' But, once more it will be a gross evidentiary case of fraud, waste, and abuse of taxpayers dollars on frivolous investigations and losses of official government time. To the tune of what? Millions of dollars.
And these republican fools say we don't have money to help the poor? There will be (as is happening now) these expenditures on f hit that won't work because it can't work! —Already being cued up by one Rep. Matt Gaetz.
It's sick. It's Trump sick. And I for one am fed up with this republican version of revenge-porn!
How many MAGA fools in blue collar or rural Ohio or Michigan or Appalachia have bought new boats?
Trump disgraces America every day, and you want four more years of this travesty?
I'm a supposed snowflake, and I have a message to all Trumpsters - shove it up your ass.
How's that for being a snowflake?
And the nation should give a fhit about your "captain" and your supposed boat why? You should listen to what is happening around you because people are being attacked, injured, and killed from all the hate circulating in the present "bully" culture that is partially funding your alleged escapades!
A lot of good having a hot "babe" at the marina will do you if hate crashes your party!
That may be the most intelligent thing you've said.
actually... didn't we shove trump up your ass in 2016?
I am fairly certain that is how it went down and trust me when I say, we are going to repack that gift in 2020
cheers
The operative word was left out of their stupid premise, please allow me to amend the statement:
The idiotic Republican kangaroos led by Moscow Mitch as quite capable of trying to destroy the reputations of Obama, Clinton and JFK. Unfortunately, I doubt if they can conduct a fair trial for the actual criminal - Donald John Trump.
Trump used to own a boat.
Can you say "bankrupt"?
Did she give The Donald a golden shower?
Do you want one too?
Yes, and Trump loves it up there (it's an "all you can eat" place).
You always do.
The more they say the left has operated in criminal manner and that some democratic politicians have committed obvious crimes, what they're really saying is that republicans are a do-nothing, inept, Keystone Kops bunch of fools. Not one indictment. Not one subpoena issued. The repubs let them run roughshod over them and never did a thing about it. Poor poor republicans. Inept. Amateurish. Ineffective. Impotent. The only thing Mitch can do is leave bills to die. When people here that are citing that the democrats are as crooked, if not more, as trumplethinskin, they are in essence pointing out the weakness of their party. All talk. No action.
I can't count how many times I have asked 'Where are the indictments'?
BUTT Hillary, BUTT Obama, BUTT Biden, BUTT Comey, BUTT McCabe.
Trump's DOJ has had THREE YEARS to present evidence to a Grand Jury and not one indictment has been forthcoming.
Then I was told to wait until the Horowitz report comes out.
They're ALL going to JAIL!
Now that that ship has sailed, their hopes are all on Durham. Barr just said that Durham won't be done with his investigation in the near future so it looks like 4 YEARS and still no indictments for stuff they all alleged is glaringly obvious to them.
But ask them why they don't decry the incompetence of the Trump DOJ and they bail. Nary a peep...
Mueller sent some of Trump campaign officials to jail butt could NOT indite nor could he exonerate Trump.
UPDATE: Stone and Gates have also been sentenced.
BUTT Hillary!
She's killed more people than viruses!
Surely Barr could get a Grand Jury to indict her for something, ANYTHING!
Killed more people than viruses!!! Fucckin' HILARIOUS1111
I actually voted for Perot in 92 so by your criteria i guess that makes me an "uber" independent.
Never do that again in our current system. All it did was help elect the guy who won who was my last choice that year.
Thx for your service by the way.
I never said that. Please don't try to put your words in my mouth. They taste like shit.
I just pointed out that being an "independent" can be a political affiliation.
I used Ross Perot '92 as an example.
I did NOT vote for Perot.
I think it's funny that so many people wasted their vote in '92.
Never said you did so i guess you already have a familiarity for that taste from somewhere else.
Glad you finally made the connection. Good job!
Good for you. You get a cookie.
Good for you. You get another cookie
A swing and a miss. Work on your insults [deleted] .... you're slipping
Thanx for providing such an outstanding example of a trollish comment.
The Mods love shit like that.
That's what intelligent voters do.
HA!
You misspelled "misspelled". That is ironic.
No wonder you can't spell "intelligent".
Please continue to proof read my comments. It's fucking hilarious!
That comment is dripping with ignorance.
Coming from you, that's high praise.
Thx jizzer .... you're the best
who was running as a pro-Trump anti-impeachment candidate
Isn't MM both of these also?
Matt Bevin appeared on stage with The Donald the night before he lost the election for governor of Kentucky. Bevin publicly announced his opposition to impeachment (governors have NO role in the impeachment process).
Moscow Mitch, the Russian incumbent Senator will probably publicly suck Trump's dick (if he can find it) when he campaigns for re-election in 2020.
Obama played 306 rounds of golf during his entire two terms in office.
Trump has played 2.6 times more golf than Obama in his first 2 years and 91 days and has cost the tax payer an estimated $74 million more than Obama.
Even if Trump own many of the courses, the cost of travel, added security and golf cart rental is on the backs of the American taxpayers, who, apparently, are his bottomless pocket book.
And damn the poor. Who cares. There will always be poor people. Right? So why worry about helping any of them. Right? And if you help one you have to help them all. Right? His golf games are far more important. Right?
You can get away with it here on earth as a CINO, and the people will soon forget. But, the Creator will never forget.
My opinion.
Emoluments (foreign and domestic)!
That should have been another article of impeachment.
True...however, that would only open a large argument for ....."But Obama"...."But Clinton"......"But Eisenhower", etc.
What would be another article is the amount of time he spends on Twitter divulging classified information, and wasting time he should be spending on far more important matters that need to be addressed.
And the amount of time he wastes on Twitter and playing golf leads me to believe that someone else is taking care of those far more important matters.
And who is that? Ivanka? Nah...she has her business in other countries to take care of to worry about issues here at home.
Perhaps her hubby Jarred. Nah....he is far too busy promoting his own business deals with foreign governments to worry about what happens here in America.
Maybe one of his Sons? Nah....they are too busy making a$$es of themselves to worry about anything that might help the America. After all, what could be more important than killing an elephant and cutting off its tail for the world to see?
So, it seems that there is only the lower staff, maybe Guiliani, to worry about the important matters of our country. But, then......he is busy hiding from Trump to save is own skin.
Sooo.......just who IS running the country? Curious minds want to know.
Happy New Year RAVEN WING!!!
Thank you for understanding how important @1.1.82 means to me. Republicans must not regain the House in 2020, only to harangue and be abusive to the former president who sat, brooded through, and played a major role in ending this nation's great recession on his watch!
Happy New Year to you as well, CB.
Even is Trump is re-elected, he will leave a poop stain on America that will be impossible to remove for the life of our country.
However....his legal Impeachment is still yet to be settled. We are waiting for his trial, which of course, the Repubs in the Senate, led by Americas well known puppet master McConnell, to try and make sure Trump is not removed from office.
Whether or not he is removed, he can never remove the fact that he is the 3rd US President to be Impeached. That will live with him and his family forever.
The one I truly feel sorry for is his young Son, Barron. Bad enough he is Trumps Son, but he will have that fact hanging over his head for the rest of his own life.
That's something to celebrate.
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Happy New Year to you and yours as well, al.
That is something that is a matter of history, and Trump nor the puppet master McConnell can wash it away, paint over it, or bury it. Ever. And that IS something to celebrate. Just like the Repubs celebrated wildly when they Impeached Bill Clinton.
And as Clinton had his trial in the Senate, so should Trump. He does not deserve any special treatment any more than Clinton did. The rule of law MUST be followed, no matter WHO the Impeached party is. If it was a MUST for Clinton, it is a MUST for Trump. If the Senate does not do so, they are in contempt of our Constitution. And should be held accountable as such.
Intelligent rational people will vote for Democrats.
Idiots and bigots will vote Republican.
If there is a huge turnout Democrats will win.
If the Democrat that wins is intelligent, has read the US Constitution, and understands it, and gives a damn about our country and its people, and can re-establish our much needed relationship with out allies, then they would be a reasonable President. But...if not, then we would be no better off than with Trump.
So I truly hope that those who vote Democratic will use their heads and make sure their vote really counts.
Which Democratic candidates are dumb asses who don't understand the Constitution, don't give a shit about the citizens and want to destroy NATO?
I have no idea. There are a couple that I would not vote for. But, I really don't think they have a chance to be nominated anyway.
The other important matter is who they pick as their running mate. Their VP must be capable of picking up the reins and moving forward should anything happen to the President.
Our current VP is far too unqualified and unfit to be able to do that if need be. So picking a VP is also a very important step.
Agreed.
Most of the Dems are fine with me although I think an avowed socialist would be an easy target for Trump.
And I wouldn't vote for Putin's girl, Tulsi Gabbard. She might destroy NATO. She refused to answer a simple question: Should the U.S. stay in NATO?
Looks like she is taking the cowards way out all around. If she can't answer a simple question like that straight up then she is not fit to be President, or even VP.
Too bad there are no Repubs willing to take the chance to run against Trump. I guess they a re too scared for themselves and their family being threatened by Trumps goons and rabid supporters. So they don't dare to run against him. That does not say much for our electoral process. But, speaks volumes of the Repubs and how they lack any respect for our Constitution or laws of our country.
William Weld, Joe Walsh and Mark Sanford are supposedly running against Trump.
Butt they never receive any press coverage, so I'm not even sure they're still in the race.
Trump has made sure there will not be any Republican primaries so it's a moot point.
That should not be allowed. But, that is what Trump is all about. He does not know the real meaning of 'fair', only his own definition that is all about him only.
The decent Repubs who can think for themselves, and there are many out there, should protest it, not that it would do any good. And I guess they don't want to be in the middle of a white Nationals and supremacists attack on the protesters if they do.
Trump is a plague that has deeply infected our country, and it will not be cured easily. But, there also has to be a desire to cure it, and so far that is not the case. However, Americans have seen many serious situations in our country since its inception and survived and grew even better, and I feel sure that will happen with the Trump plague.
Wrong. Trump re tweeted an existing article that names Eric Ciaramella as the Whistleblower. It’s about time!
I agree!
That was very wrong of The Donald.
Model leadership? What going on here?
he shoos have done it a long time ago.
So let's get this straight you just want Trump to be a ghetto street thug president. Is that correct? Be the brawler in the "classy" White House? Tear every thang down and piss in the corners too? Because that is what you calling for when you suggest there are "no standards" to uphold!
If that is what Trump is about: Throw the bum out of office and let him go straight back home to his mansion!
Who gives a shit about Trump's shoes?
Trump and his administration is the epitome of what America and other decent countries renounce in other countries and their dictators that willfully use their positions and governments for their own greed and personal gain at the expense of their own people's welfare.
Trumps tariff war with China is a great failure, and a serious detriment to the livelihood of so many of our farmers and businesses, and also negatively affects our people. Yet he thinks he deserves adulation and a Nobel Peace Prize.
He deserves the Pelosi Impeachment Prize.
He's already been served that, and well deserved. Now we will see how well he and puppet master McConnell can find a way to kill the required trial. I am sure they will try every illegal trick in the books to do that, try to say it is legal.
Just how far down the sewer are they willing to go for Trump. We will soon see.
Now he can intimidate and threaten both the whistle blower and his family.
Okay then... fantasy land... I will play.
if what ya say is true, id say, next thing ya know he will be charging obamas, federal officials, with fabricated crimes and then become dictator for life like in china.
or, not so much... LOL
I see. And has that actually been happening or did you just make that up?
The latter!
Wow!
You must be extremely talented to make up a comment that Paula Bartholomew posted.
How did you do that?
Can you explain what other reason would there be to expose the whistleblower in two days' worth of tweets? What could be gained by doing that, other than knowing his base would want to frighten and intimidate the whistleblower? trump is known to be a retaliator.
If you're not sucking trump's dick, he considers you human scum. Doesn't matter how many years you've served your country admirably. Doesn't matter. If you're not bending over for trump, he'll trash you. Being trashed by trump and getting his base frothing (his base doesn't even do their own fact-finding before frothing) in order to appear ferocious, is a badge of honor at this point.
trump and his base ... paper tigers, every last one of them.
If I had to guess, it would be to attack his credibility. That seems far more likely to me than frightening or intimidating him. There's no reason to frighten or intimidate him. The whistleblowing has already happened. It won't be undone. The best Trump can hope for is to discredit it.
Sure. If you say something nasty about him, he'll say something nastier back. That's about the end of it. It's not like he's causing people to die or disappear. You might be thinking of someone else.
[[deleted - misinformation]]
You dare to post misinformation here without taking time to identify it as such?! This is offensive to the ng degree, in my opinion.
I figured obvious satire was obvious. Apparently not.
People frequently misunderstand me too.
They think I'm joking because "no one could be that fucking meme".
"Two weeks of public testimony has revealed new, damaging details of the Trump administration’s dealings with Ukraine, but witnesses who come before Congress and the American people have had to pay a price.
Witnesses have endured harassment, threats and attacks on their personal character as they are suddenly thrust into public view."
Asked during his testimony this week whether he or his businesses had received any threats or reprisals due to his sudden prominence, Sondland testified that there were “many.”
“We have countless emails apparently to my wife. Our properties are being picketed and boycotted,” he said."
The Hill
Sounds like that guy better call the cops, eh? He may be the victim of actual crimes.
Whistleblower statutes are meant to protect people from being fired, passed over for promotion, denied opportunities, etc. (things that are not normally against the law) for complaining about things at work.
They are not intended to protect people from all manner of evil in the world. They couldn't manage that even if that were the intent. And anyway, it's not necessary. As I indicated before, things like threats and harassment are already against the law. They are also crimes that could be perpetrated on a person for a million reasons that aren't whistleblowing.
Sondland was a witness, not a whistleblower. As an Ambassador he has a security detail.
Oh ok. Maybe tell Paula, I guess. I haven't been paying attention to names and roles. This thread, starting @1.4 (and the seed in general) was about intimidating and threatening a whistleblower. Obviously nobody should be threatening or harassing an ambassador, a whistleblower, or anyone else.
Why?
Paula was talking about witnesses:
For some reason, you replied by talking about whistleblower statutes.
Please don't try to blame Paula for your misunderstanding.
With Sondland, Trump had help from the governor of OR who is a rabid Trump supporter. He called for people to go after him and his businesses.
Because I didn't bring up Sondland in the context of a conversation about the whistleblower. She did.
Yes because that's what the seed is about and that's what the conversation has been about. Have you read the title of this seed? You seeded it and you still don't know?
So, that would the "some reason."
I haven't misunderstood anything. I don't care too much for bullshit, though.
Uh . . . What?
When you say "OR" do you mean Oregon? Because the governor of Oregon is Kate Brown. A Democrat. Not a "he" and most certainly not a "rabid Trump supporter."
The Whistleblower Protection Act prohibits ANY form of reprisal, which arguably would include divulging their name.
That isn't 'complaining about things at work.
Argle-bargle.
It would be bad form to threaten or harass someone unless their identity were confirmed. Since the IG is prohibited from disclosing the identity of the WB, that can't happen, unless of course Trump mandates it. Trump seems to prefer innuendo more though.
Typical
Yes, for those with a decent vocabulary. Would you prefer I dumb it down for you?
Civil discourse is just not an option for you, is it?
Unfortunately the current Attorney General has no interest in law enforcement. He is in charge of covering up everything evil that Trump does. He must be a very busy MF'er.
Ha, ha. I haven't heard that in years.
I think we called it "argy-bargy" back in my old Poly-Sci daze in college.
My prof used that comment on one of my many papers when I took "comparative governments". Butt he was one of those "lefty pinkos" that the White-wingers love to hate. He may have been one of the few people on the planet who was even further to the left than I was.
I think someone here may think "argle-bargle" is profanity or something.
It's certainly NOT "typical".
BTW,
HAPPY NEW YEAR, DULAY!!
Typical.
When I saw that Scalia used it in the DOMA ruling, I was in...
Happy New Year to you too...
Oh shit.
DOMA = typical Republican doublespeak.
There should be a port-a-let, instead of a headstone, on Scalia's grave because he was such an asshole
It seems not. They are totally uncivil toward those who disagree with them and then they blame us conservatives for daring to express our views as to why they can’t or won’t be civil.
It seems not. They are totally uncivil toward those who disagree with them and then they blame us conservatives for daring to express our views as to why they can’t or won’t be civil.
Clearly not, it seems.
Clearly not, it seems.
Who's "they".
I'm the most polite MF'er here.
Why are you stuttering?
Are you ridiculing Biden?
Are you channelling Sarah Fuckabee Sanders?
In case your repetitious comments get deleted, I thought I should copy them so people can see why I asked you about "stuttering".
He is the way he is BECAUSE his supporters have allowed it. They are to blame and they should be held accountable for his actions. People have been attacked and murdered because of this President's supporters. I hate those motherfuckers with every fiber of my being. I will NEVER give them a pass for what they've done to this country through their support of this president. God damn I hate them.
I wish I could vote your comment up multiple times.
You and me both!
Count me in. The cowardly fucker bad mouthed prisoner of war McCain. Not an ounce of honor. He disparages the dead. Mocks the survivors.
I guess all three of you could each hate us all equally badly. We’d settle for such enmity for five more years telling us how much you dislike us re-electing President Trump. Small price to pay for a good economy, low taxes and less regulations, not to mention remaking the federal court system. We already did MAGA and now we are going to KAG!
What did you GAG on that made you smock CRACK?
Did the president Twitter FAKE News all over you?
Wake up and smell the fucking COVFEFE!
Thank you for your hate! I really appreciate it more than you can imagine! MAGA complete KAG an ongoing effort. TRUMP-PENCE 2020!
Out of curiosity, would you let your young children watch one of his rallies? How he mocks peoples, derides people, thrives on attempts to humiliate?
Please spend more time with your children, Heartland. I'm saddened for them.
You and the Trumpers are the haters.
Agree!
when things get bad just remember all the good times you had under obama
that is funny... I mean as if... LOL
but for now, you are on a watch list
Obama got us out of the economic nightmare that DuhBya gave us.
the slowest economic recovery in history.
while selling us out to the chinese.
such an accomplishment. bless his heart.
cheers
Which is still progressing at about the same pace despite the increase in deficit spending.
with exception to the last year, the labor participation fell for 7 straight years under obama. with our jobs and money going overseas the whole time. that is not something to be proud about. obama did not set the record for lowest unemployment is 50yrs but obama did ok in putting people on welfare.
I will take the number 1 with fries and a coke
cheers
Save yourself. They will never admit a black man was a better leader than their broken witless and easily manipulated white man. I don't waste my time communicating with them. I don't respect them and I view them as enemies of America.
You've got it. Trump just set a new record for deficit spending (breaking last year's record).
Here are the actual numbers for the first nine months of this years spending.
Well, shit Trump has broken the federal deficit spending record for the last two year.
He must be doing better on trade deficits, right?
Wrong!
Remember what Trump said about the trade deficit?
Yep. Trump lied (as usual).
wait... did you think it would not be expensive to rebuild our military and add a space force to our military all the while reversing 30yrs of bad economic policy and trade deals?
don't worry... mexico will pay for it... LOL
Read my comment.
I included the documentation (that you obviously did NOT read).
Try reading my comment.
Trump has not "reversed" anything.
Trump has managed to increase the both the federal deficit and the trade deficit.
Here are ALL of the numbers from YOUR source (so don't try to call it "fake"):
Obama inherited the worst economy since the Great Depression which required significant deficits to pull it out of the toilet.
Trump inherited a healthy economy butt he significantly increased the deficit anyway.
Obama's last deficit was:
Trump's first deficit was:
If you examine the data above, the president who had the highest percent increase of the deficit was your hero, Ronald Reagan.
Ronald Reagan : Added $1.86 trillion, a 186% increase from the $998 billion debt at the end of Carter's last budget, FY 1981.
In the 1980 campaign Reagan criticized Jimmy Carter's high deficits. Reagan promised to balance the budget by 1983. Look at the data. Reagan ran a then record high deficit that year - more than twice as high as Carter's highest deficit.
Here's what I actuated posted (comment # 2.5.6):
I backed it up with documentation (also comment 2.5.6):
The deficit was higher after DuhBya's Great Recession because revenue was so low.
So Obama's first budget surplus (FY 2010) was high because the economy sucked and did not produce much tax revenue.
Yes.
I know Republicans can't do math.
Deficits are an equation:
It's not a fucking game.
Since Trump inherited a healthy economy, he owns any increase in the deficit.
All you've done is spam another one of my threads.
Posting the same old shit over and over is fucking spam.
Obvious being the operative word.
You posted about 35 comments on my article "Transsexuality". They were spam too.
Now you're spamming this thread too.
TRUMP, REPUBLICANS RIDICULED AS FEDERAL DEFICIT, $3.7 TRILLION SPENDING HIT RECORD HIGHS
You sound like a broken record. Are you high?
This is what I actually said (see comment #2.5.6): " Trump just set a new record for deficit spending"
I said " DEFICIT SPENDING ".
Maybe you're confused because I also said Trump has a record high trade deficit (which I also documented).
You may have a reading disorder.
You can't seem to see the word "spending".
A deficit is what occurs when federal spending exceed revenues (from taxes).
Record deficit spending occurs when Trump spends more than any other president has ever spend while running a deficit.
Please quit spamming my thread by pretending that the deficit and deficit spending are the same thing.
Don't worry about Tex. He's always wrong.
Well, with that ringing endorsement, now Tex knows he's on the right track.
Like many Republicans, he does not understand economics.
That's why Republicans, since Eisenhower, have never been able to balance the budget.
Derp.
SOS.
Maybe you should read the comments I've posted on this thread.
Comment #2.5.36 is the latest example.
Okay, so by your "logic" Trump did NOT cut taxes, right.
Derp, derp, derp.
Total fucking BS.
Derp.
You can't reason with people who don't understand what deficit spending is, or that it increases a deficit.
I wish that was true!
this article claims that the Trump deficits are the largest ever in an economy that is not in recession or post recession.
this article claims that instead of eliminating the deficit, it has increased 68% under this Admin.
this article claims that, despite two good months, the trade deficit is the largest since 2008
And this oldy but goody from January of 2018
I have said this on multiple articles. It seems that people read what they want to read. But you are right, SP.
Butt, didn't Trump say he could eliminate the entire national debt?
Maybe he's gonna declare bankruptcy. He's got lots of experience doing that.
Butt, Butt, MSNBC.....
Geez, I hope you don't scare the stalker/trolls away.
This article appears to be popular (432 comments).
In reality many of the comments are taunts posted by frenemies.
OMG!
A Rachel Maddow clip will cause Trumpsters' heads to explode.
Just out of curiosity, what were the budget deficits he inherited??? Have any of the cuts he has made in taxes caused any spending he has authorized to be unfunded?
I'm just wondering if the deficit he was saddled with (those "cans" that have been kicked down the road for decades) are what is causing him to fall behind in revenues needed to pay for his programs he is pushing through.
Just as a side note, I am a FIRM believer that we should have a balanced budget requirement in the Constitution with a requirement for a Rainy Day Fund added in. The only exception would be for actual defense of the country during a time of War or a cataclysmic natural disaster, and even then the funds would come first from the Rainy Day Fund and have to be replaced before any other Bridge To Nowhere BS project got a greenlight.
The deficit Trump inherited was:
Here are ALL of the numbers from 1978 to the present:
Obama inherited the worst economy since the Great Depression which required significant deficits to pull it out of the toilet.
Trump inherited a healthy economy butt he significantly increased the deficit anyway.
Obama's last deficit was:
Trump's first deficit was:
If you examine the data above, the president who had the highest percent increase of the deficit was your hero, Ronald Reagan.
Donald Trump has spent more than any president in history and he is simultaneously running a deficit.
I have provided a shit load of documentation the fucking PROVES that point.
You can deny that until you're blue in the face butt it is 100% true.
Why do you insist on posting stupid bullshit spam trying to deny that FACT.
Here's the documentation AGAIN;
Please read it this time.
My claim is not a lie.
Your lack of comprehension doesn't make me a liar.
I am the author of this article and YOU are spamming it.
OMG! I am "spammed out." I think as a child I ate some spam; I have not even seen a can of spam as an adult; I have NEVER seen as much spam as has been displayed on this article! Blah!
Psst. I don't even know (remember) it was a good 'treat.'
Oh boy! More spam.
I've provided the documentation several times (and included the links).
I'm not going to post documentation again because you appear to be incapable of understanding it.
Here's another snack.
I did a lot of backpacking in places like Yosemite. Hunting is not permitted there. I usually ate trout (which are plentiful and delicious). Butt, when I wasn't near water, the Spam provided protein, fat and salt (all are necessary nutrients).
Definitely NOT my "hero" by any means, but what pisses me off the most when looking at these figures is the way they throw money around. I see millions, billions, and trillions treated like nickels, dimes, and quarters.
Disgusting!
All of these fuckers need to quit blowing money away and start paying down that deficit.
On the other hand, if the dollar gets devalued enough, my house note becomes easier to pay!
First of all it's not my claim. I have been quoting what has been published by every credible source.
Bear in mind thatI didn't say Trump set record for the highest deficit. I said he set a record for the highest deficit spending.
The documentation I previously posted is more current and cover the first nine months. He also set a new record for deficit spending in the first seven months of 2019.
You sound like a fucking broken record.
Yes, I did post this:
And YOU continue to say shit like this:
The latest source that I've provided (which apparently you can't read) has this title :
Are you going to continue spamming this thread?
Here's some spam for you:
I think I can remember the salt content. SALTY!!!! It was a preservative, yes? Happy New Year!
From 1999-2001 the government ran budget surpluses. Guess what there was also federal spending. Butt is was not deficit spending.
Butt Trump is running a deficit. His spending is deficit spending. And his spending "HIT RECORD HIGHS". Therefore, he has set a record for deficit spending.
Here's the definition of deficit spending :
And here's the definition of deficit :
You are the one who is spamming my thread.
I can see that you need more so here you are:
Yes, it does have lots of sodium.
If you're camping out and "living off of the land", you usually don't get enough salt in that diet.
Spam is one solution and it gets boring eating trout all of the time (I also carry a little salt shaker).
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Muttley will like my new meme:
I guess you don't even understand dictionary definitions.
Oh my. Are you resorting to CoC violations?
Don't worry, I won't flag your little tantrum.
I never flag anything.
You can't make me "STFU". I'm the author of this article, so this is my thread that you insist to keep spamming.
I can see that you're still hungry so here you are:
You're wrong. Again.
Actually, I think he's probably right - extreme right.
BTW, did you know Spam fossils were discovered in Texas?
I hope the Texan sees this impressive find:
She didn't say that either.
Here's your New Year's snack:
so conservative opposition to your point of view on your seeds is to be considered spam?
so conservative opposition to your point of view on your seeds is to be considered spam?
When some repeatedly calls me a liar, refuses to acknowledge simple concepts that have been explained several times and posts the same old shit over and over and over and over and over and.... It's spam .
And it's strange that you keep repeating yourself.
Here's a New Year's gift just for you (it's not Spam):
Spamming also includes repeating the same lines from the article written over and over and over again.
There are some prolific writers that have nothing to say. Some are predestined to stay confined within the bubble of nothingness they created. No one pays attention to those people. No one.
Cite
You're wrong, Texan. Again.
Have a MUTTLEY New Year! USE SPARINGLY FOR PUNCH!
How could I not while you're here.
You're wrong, Texan. Own it. You. Are. Wrong.
Again.
Here's some Spam for you:
I hope you don't drown in denial.
Nobody said Trump set a record for the highest deficit, he set a record for the highest deficit spending .
I know you won't understand, butt he is one more attempt at enlightening you (these numbers are for the first 10 months of FY 2019).
I know you've worked up an appetite avoiding that documentation so here's your snack:
I am NOT a liar.
Here's your tasty treat:
That says record for spending not deficit.
Obama set the record for deficit.
The largest annual deficits ever were achieved by the Obama “Administration in 2009, 2011, and 2010 when the deficits reached $1.413 trillion, $1.300 trillion, and $1.294 trillion, respectively.”
That's exactly what I've been saying throughout this thread. Trump has't set a record for the highest deficit, butt he has set the record for the highest deficit spending.
Obama's deficit was higher because of very low tax revenue (caused by DuhBya's Great Recession).
Trump has set a spending record. Since he too is running a (lower) budget deficit, it's known as "deficit spending". Since it's record high spending, it's "record deficit spending". It's an easy concept to understand anywhere outside of Texas.
I appreciate you for getting that right.
Yes deficit spending is lower under Trump than Obama because Trump is generating record revenue. The difference between the revenue and spending is the deficit and Obama has the record for largest deficit spending.
Yes he did and that record for spending has been broken by Trump.
Revenue and spending are opposites. Are you from Texas?
When the federal budget is running a deficit (every year recently except 1998-2001) and the government spends money, it is called "deficit spending".
Please read comment #2.5.6 for the first installment of this concept. Here's the short version:
Wrong. Record revenue has offset record spending so it's not a record deficit. Butt it is a record for deficit spending.
Record deficits and record deficit spending are two different things (except in Texas, apparently).
And that record revenue is coming from tariffs on the backs of American consumers.
Not really a great thing considering the layoffs in manufacturing due to the tariffs,
or the additional debt from short term subsidies to farmers being crushed by the tariffs.
You are absolutely right.
China does NOT pay the fucking tariffs, we pay the tariffs (although this is probably not believed in Texas).
Oh come on, you are too smart to say that. It's a temporary record, it's a partisan "talking" point at best.
Trump plans on spending more and more of OUR money.
If he gets a second term as planned he will match or exceed any measurement of Obama's 8 year economic performances
and will do so without the excuse of recession or post recession economy.
Trump's history is one of spending other peoples money then declaring bankruptcy.
The economy and the stock market are cycles, good times are always followed by crashes.
The only constant is debt.
Oh well, I am making wings and enjoying the surprising Outback Bowl.
The article is exceeding the capacity of the system and my last comments took more time to load
than it took Minnesota to score again.
Happy New Year to everyone!
Later...
Sorry about that. There are over 550 comments on this thread (and about 100lbs of Texas Spam).
Happy New Year (again), Split Personality!
You hit the nail on its head and drove it home. As President, former President Obama had announced that taking care to end the recession would not be his only legacy, but that he would make emboldened strives to pass his own agenda to boot! Thus, he did add to the mounting deficit because it was necessary for him to accomplish something he had promised the peoples who voted for him—beyond George W. Bush's doings.
Thank you for your wise answer. And to our host, who kept the room open for such a statement as it is, Al Jizzerror!
SP is extremely intelligent and well informed. He is an important asset for NT. We're lucky to have him here.
We're lucky to have you too.
Just a suggestion - you could lock this one, and open another article with the same title and "Part II" or something similar. We've done that in the past when discussions got too big to load. Not often, but not many articles get this amount of traffic.
It's an experiment.
My frenemies are spamming the comments.
I want to see how much Spam it takes to make an article explode.
Well he did say we would pay off our national debt about midway that 'thang.' And he is right our nation does print the money! (Though that would be a truly hard way to get out of national debt.)
He doesn't pay off debts, he just declares bankruptcy.
Maybe he's planning to default of the U.S. debt and declare victory over China since they hold so much of our debt in U.S. bonds.
He said it himself, he could shoot someone on 5th avenue and his supporters wouldn't blink an eye.
And we know that his supporters have trump denial syndrome....sickening. His mindless robots make excuses for all his bad behavior.
Whenever I see that I think of Charles Bronson in the Death wish movies cleaning up the city and taking out the trash.
The whistleblower is that part of the magic trick, or the bullshit artist, where he says, "look over here".
A distraction from the truth. An excuse. A "dont blame me, blame the whistleblower" moment.
And yes, Trumpsters who fall for it are dumbfucks.
Blame yourselves, not everyone else.
How silly! Trump didn't name anybody who wasn't already being named by someone else. It's not like he outed this guy himself. What's the point of this?
You're right. Donnie Trump Junior made the talk show rounds outing the whistleblower weeks ago.
This is the first time The Donald personally outed the whistleblower.
I thought he deserved the recognition for his unethical bullshit.
Yessirree. Stir up his base so they threaten the 'whistleblower', threaten the family, then he can tweet that he doesn't endorse the expressions of violence so he can manipulate his base to do his bidding while he holds up his hands as if they're clean. He uses his base like minions. And they don't get it.
Do you not understand the concept of "outing" someone? It's kind of hard (i.e impossible) to out someone who is already out.
Don't worry.
I won't rat on you.
That’s for sure!
Okay, thank you for the HUUUUGE laugh this morning!!! I almost spewed my coffee!!!
Your response above was to these sentences: "He uses his base like minions. And they don't get it."
On M*A*S*H:
Hawkeye: "Frank!! Quit acting like an idiot!!!"
Frank Pierce: [whining] "I'm not acting!!!"
The whistle blower is a true patriot along with the other civil and core servants that stepped forward to testify at their own peril. If this country survives the voters who voted in trump, history will portray them as the traitors they became to this country because of their hatred and jealousy of others.
They are all very brave people who will be recognized as true patriots by future historians.
Yes, it's disturbing how they are being attacked for carrying out their oaths. It's simply madness. I do not know any other way to describe it. I remember when all Americans cheered patriotism but not this lot. They attack it while praising and protecting russia. These are not the actions of true Americans.
Brilliant. And true.
CB, I predicted 3 1/2 years ago that one day it would all come down to the Trump supporter.
When you have someone who is so monumentally unfit and unqualified for the office, and people vote him in anyway, it is inevitable that one day the spotlight would fall on those voters. They are the ones who are to blame for all this. And if they wont accept the responsibility then it has to be thrust on them.
There is no other way.
Yes.
Hillary was right - they're fucking deplorable.
The tax cuts have resulted in doubling the deficit.
I have always blamed the voters.
I know. You get it.
Tax cuts reduce revenue (the side of the equation that republicans always ignore).
When federal expenditures exceed federal revenues it results in federal deficits. It's a simple arithmetic equation. Excessive spending increases the deficit. Excessive tax cuts reduce revenue and increase the deficit.
Republicans do not understand the revenue side of the equation. That's why every Republican president since Reagan has set a new record for the highest deficits in history.
Bill Clinton, a Rhodes Scholar in economics, set the record for the highest surpluses in history by raising taxes .
- 2003 - $377.6 billion budget deficit
- 2002 - $157.8 billion budget deficit
- 2001 - $128.2 billion budget surplus
- 2000 - $236.2 billion budget surplus
- 1999 - $125.6 billion budget surplus
- 1998 - $69.3 billion budget surplus
- 1997 - $21.9 billion budget deficit
- 1996 - $107.4 billion budget deficit
- 1995 - $164 billion budget deficit
- 1994 - $203.2 billion budget deficit
- 1993 - $255.1 billion budget deficit
- 1992 - $290.3 billion budget deficit
- 1991 - $269.2 billion budget deficit
- 1990 - $221 billion budget deficit
- 1989 - $152.6 billion budget deficit
- 1988 - $155.2 billion budget deficit
- 1987 - $149.7 billion budget deficit
- 1986 - $221.2 billion budget deficit
- 1985 - $212.3 billion budget defici
Please notice that deficits became surpluses from 1998-2001 (Clinton's last 4 budgets).No! Income minus spending equals the surplus or (deficit). All adults should understand the basics of...math. Surely even you know this...
Let this be for Al and JBB.
Now follow these links and show me where the national debt goes down during Clinton or any President's time in office. Clinton didn't have a surplus.
The first link covers before Clinton took office and most of Clinton's two terms and the second link covers the balance plus more years with Bush and so on. There is no surplus. It's math. It's how Clinton did the math, but if there was a surplus, then the National Debt would have gone down, not up as it did every year Clinton was in office.
You can do this yourself or I'll be glad to go into it further.
The national debt and budget deficits/surpluses are two different things.
Clinton ran four years of budget surpluses 1998-2001. Detractors like the CATO Institute are full of shit.
Here is the full text of a statement released by the U.S. Treasury Department about Clinton's success:
And openly proud of it. We can’t wait to go out and campaign and donate for him and then vote to re elect the President! Proud to be a deplorable.
I blame the morons that comprise the EC.
I know you'd like to truthfully say Clinton had surpluses, but it just ain't so.
If you really read what he is saying instead of what he wants you to hear, then you will see what he has done. And you know what? He didn't say a thing about Mama or the pickup truck, nor did he say anything about the Republicans controlling both Houses of Congress for the last 6 years of Clinton's presidency. And he didn't even mention the Dot.com bubble that was a Dot.com boom at the time fixing to crash. He acted like what a beautiful world and how it was always going to be that way.
You see....
Year
Date
Surplus
Debt
Holdings
Debt
You know that Social Security Trust fund he called an asset. Of course it was doing pretty good with the Dot.com boom Clinton being fortunate enough to be sitting in the White House when it was roaring alone bringing in lots of money. Wilcox didn't even mention anything about Congress or the Boom, but the fact is Clinton increased the Social Security Trust Fund IOU by using it to pay the Public Debt down. It was kind of like not paying one loan, but instead borrowing more money from it to pay another loan down. And since they didn't consider the Social Security Trust Fund which was nothing but a bunch of IOU's as a debt, well, you get the message.
I see. I appreciate the way you posted a link to your disinformation.
Did you get that pile of stupidity from Putin or the Ukrainians?
You should probably stop smocking those NRA bullets.
They seem to be blowing your mind.
yay!
You know al, you should stop telling people the national debt and budget deficits/surpluses are two different things. I assume you left out the part where surpluses and deficits are what determines what the national debt is. Of course they are two different things, but they determine the final debt depending on whether you have one or the other.
On a personal level, the national debt is how much you have borrowed and thereby how much you owe. Surpluses or deficits come about if you either make more than what you owe plus any other cost such as interest giving you a total debt, in this case your very own personal national debt.
If you earn more than you spend, then you have money to pay your debt down, but if you earn less than you need to keep up with your debt, you have to find some way to cover that debt, usually by borrowing more money and getting further and further in debt as we have done for decades. Or you can shift the excess tax receipts from the Intragovernmental Holdings, such as Social Security with IOU's and us that money to pay down the Debt Held By The Public, which is exactly what Bill Clinton did. That's why the National Debt never went down, but only continued to go up every year.
I assume you would agree with me that the economy was booming during Bill Clinton's two terms as President? Since that is true, the payroll taxes were the highest at that time than they had ever been. There was plenty of money to pay Social Security benefits because the Social Security Trust was not running a deficit. They could have reduced those IOU's..More people were paying into it than ever before and if the government had not borrowed from it the balance of IOU's could have been going down during the years you refer to as Bill Clinton's surplus years, I hope you agree with that, because it is true.
Now at this point, I'm going to leave it with you to evaluate the following graph.
This is directly from the government, not someone who wants to leave a legacy of how well things went while they were employed by the government.
You may have to enter information. I chose January 4, 1993 through December 29, 2019. I don't know if this link will work without you having to enter those dates.
The Daily History of the Debt Results
Historical returns from 01/04/1993 through 12/29/2019
The data for the total public debt outstanding is published each business day. If there is no debt value for the date(s) you requested, the value for the preceding business day will be displayed.
We'll see.
Look at it yearly. You'll see the Intragovernental Holdings increasing while the Debt Held By The Public decreasing every year at the end of the 9th month, but if you observe you will see the National Debt continues to increase. Clinton increased the IOU's on the Intragovernmental Holdings to reduce the Debt Held By The Public during a time when there should have not been any increase in these IOU's. They have been trying to pass this off as Clinton's surpluses and most people just take it for granted it is true without investigating it at all.
The national debt is the total of all of the federal budget deficits minus all of the budget surpluses in American history.
Obviously "the national debt and budget deficits/surpluses are two different things."
Here is an analysis of the Clinton years published by the U.S. Department of the Treasury. It addresses all of the issues in your ridiculous comment.
I posted this before. You should read it this time. Or click on the link at the bottom of the report to see it at the Treasury Department's website.
Al, I've read that so many times, I can almost recite it. Let's just say we agree to disagree. I agree with you in the assumption Clinton could have had a surplus, but in the end the way the Intra-governmental Holdings work, there is no money in reality, only IOU's and at the end of the day, there is no balanced budget if we have a higher National Debt at the end of the year than we did the year before. It's a funky accounting system in my opinion. I wish we had the finances of the 1990's back when the National Debt was was 3.7 trillion public debt and 1.6 trillion Intra-governmental Holdings. Everything after that has been downhill.
It's a shame you don't understand it.
take the twist out of your panties... this is not even news.
his name is everywhere. did y'all just find out or what?
that mbfc bubble meant to keep the left safe and uninformed must be working.
This is the first time Trump himself has mentioned his name.
I wanted to give The Donald some recognition for his unethical bullshit.
OMG - stop the presses... LOL
yer cracking me up
Then why are you here? You crack ME up! It's like inviting yourself to a party and then bitching about the music, the food and the company.
for the laugh...
cheers
Drink a lot, do ya?
I don't drink.
so why else would a person use that expression?
- lets put our thinking caps on ey? -
It's usually used as thank you or goodbye. I doubt you're thanking us for the experience, and if you mean goodbye, you're still here. So what is it ol' chap?
hint: follow the yellow brick road
ta
The Wizard of Oz, like Trump, was a fraud.
was imaginary. a dream.
don't worry, trump will be removed any day now... LOL
at the end of your dream trump will escape in a hot air balloon just like the wizard of oz did.
watch the ending. they have it pre-recorded... LOL
The Donald keeps his hair dyed golden with his golden showers (provided by hookers).
being outraged by proof the cia is involved in the coup?
never crossed a mind... LOL
but I forgot, that is just how the left rolls now.
y'all do understand before it is over every traitorous prick involved in trying to remove our president will be named.
better buckle up your big boy pants.
april showers bring may pains
WTF?
What "coup"?
mbfc says your not allowed to know yet.
cheers
The coup according to Breitbart fans:
Pretty fuckin' funny if you ask me.
Wha'?
And they say we're going through a drug epidemic.......... I'd say there's a mental illness crisis happening with about 40% of voters
I'm sure you can provide plenty of it.
it's coo coo.
There is no other explanation. This is the mindset of those who vote for trump.
"Us"?
Are you a Siamese twin?
I know there hasn't been a "coup".
did you forget about the ongoing (expanded) criminal investigation into obamas admins actions and everything before during and after the 2016 election?
I understand, there is a massive blind spot on this subject. the mbfc has not approved the conversation yet.. LOL
Who did the coup overthrow?
it was unsuccessful.
trump is still your president.
Oh heck. Now you're just bringing logic to subject. Don't confuse them.
The "coup" is imaginary.
so adm rogers, the guy who told trump obamas admin was spying on him and is now working with durham on an expanded criminal investigation into same, is imaginary also?
Okay then... LOL good to know
glad you cleared that up for me
You promote conspiracy theories here constantly. Your credibility is shot to hell.
everything I have said would happen has or is in progress.
I'm still batting 1000 my friend.
I told everyone in 2017 adm rogers was working with the good guys... "conspiracy theory then... and now it published fact.
yepp. still batting 1000
but hey, back to you... hows that impeachment going? still hate trump and all that stuff? any thing new in your life?
as is the deep state
but hey
it keeps journalists busy.
And republicans are currently doing nothing about it?? Are you saying that republicans are inept? Are you saying that the republicans simply don't care? Where are they at regarding the criminal investigation on President Obama? And while we're on the subject of criminal investigations, how come Hillary isn't locked up as promised?
"Us" is plural indicating that you are speaking for other people too when you posted this:
Who are these other people you're speaking for?
[deleted]
No there was no coup. Just an attempted coup that Admiral Rogers of NSA spilled the beans about to Trump during his transition period.
[deleted]
He simply equated someone's credibility with Trump's.
He wasn't being a "ball breaker".
Consider the source.
... and those names will be engraved on Medals of Valor.
History will not be kind to trump. But we'll have to wait and see.
Oh boy. Can't wait. I'll bring popcorn.
history is written by winners - spoiler alert - the left loses.
I got the good stuff... and will share
Nice of you.
Again, I'm hearing that the republicans didn't do anything about any of that. Funny, isn't it. You'd think it'd be all over the news. You'd think trump would be tweeting up a storm about that. You'd think the right would have indictments in order. Are the republicans brain dead or is it they don't care, they're merely watching their party sink? So many choices ...
You think Obama can still be impeached and now you're accusing me of not being familiar with how impeachment works?
Wow! I wish I had some of the shit you're smocking!
OTOH, I'd be afraid to smoke anything that fucking powerful. It must cause dain bramage.
Smocking gun? Did this moron not learn from the backlash the first time he used that word?
Hilarious again!! And he used it more than once. He uses it because he knows words. He knows words more than the generals. Hahaha!
Everybody here needs to realize something, although republicans need not bother. We have to get Trump out of office in November 2020. Else, can you imagine the state of our minds after watching this megalomaniac, and his conservative sycophants, trapped inside our televisions and our mental 'spaces' crowding out all other knowledge that seeks to take root?
You, me, we will not survive —the outrages I mean.
Independents, do get a clue. Donald Trump wants all our minds for a Trump branded garden!
But don't let facts like that stop the propaganda.
I never said the whistleblowers name is classified.
Evidently you did NOT read the fucking article.
Evidently you [deleted ]
That's a beautiful example of a CoC violation (personal attack).
Butt don't worry, I never flag comments no matter how shitty they are.
[Deleted]
And yet the whistle blower on the tobacco industry probably saved millions of lives.
AUTHORS NOTICE:
As some of you may have noticed I changed gears in the way I'm responding to trollish comments being posted by certain "conservatives".
For the first 300+ comments on this thread I've been posting thoughtful, well researched, thoroughly documented explanations of complex subjects like deficit spending. The replies have usually been the same old worn out talking points and boring deflections that have become the signature responses from the right.
Rather than continue to waste my time on serious comments time consuming comments, I've decided to give those idiots a taste of the shit they spew. I know it may not help their halitosis butt it is far more amusing than long winded explanations that they are apparently in capable of understanding.
Ridiculous comments deserve ridiculous replies.
Lol .... this one is closer to the truth for you:
Oh sparty, sparty, sparty. I laugh easily and I have fun watching the desperation on the right (honestly ... some comments should be on the trump edition of cards against humanity ... they're fuckin' hilarious!), but you just cause eye rolling. C'mon sparty. Say something that I can read aloud to dinner guests so we can roll with laughter ... c'mon.
Aww sweetie, it's okay. I know things haven't been going your way for the last three years but buck up. You only have five more years to look forward to and decades of more conservative judges as well. Good times eh?
Hug and kisses as always and make sure to serve the copious amounts of whine with your cheese that you're known to serve.
Toodles!
Some might think you're rather condescending....
True but most would also agree that the person who cold responded to my post in the first place is as well.
Well .... at least the unbiased ones would
That wouldn't have been my word choice.
Yeah...but I'm biased
Well, I know you laugh at the the flag that goes with the MAGA hat.
BREAKIN NOISE.......................
Can this be true?
This is NOT TRUE!
Trump would never delete his unethical tweet (which is really a retweet of a bot's tweet ).
Here's what Twitter said about the apparent deletion:
Happy New Year, Al Jizzerror! What a ball you threw this week. Good on you!
Thanx for noticing that I throw a ball (NYC drops a ball).
Yippee, baby. Yippee!!!
Happy New Year, everyone! Wishes for a joyous and healthy new year.
Happy New Year, Cobalt Blue!
I owe you a big sloppy wet kiss (a little south of your mouth).
HAPPY NEW YEAR, CB!!
I hope you enjoyed the shit show.
We don't have the leeway that BHN eventually eventually earned on NV.
It would be amusing if I could bitch slap the shit out of the trolls on this site too, butt SiNNERS and ButtHeads here is not that kind of group (yet). We may have slightly more latitude here than some of the other groups butt pushing the envelope here is highly frowned upon.
I don't want to cause an avalanche of censorshit. It much more fun when the entire congregation can follow along and read everything.
If I go too far, be sure to wave when I get thrown on the banned wagon.
To all of my friends on NewsTalkers:
HAPPY NEW YEAR!!
Remember 2019 as the year The Donald go impeached.
And 2020 will be the year Trump leaves the White House.
And to all of my wonderful NewsTalkers frenemies, please have a mediocre New Year.
All of the above candidates are vastly superior to Donald Fucking Trump.
Butt, then again, I would vote for a turnip over The Donald.
Happy New Year !!!!!
Thanx, Pat.