Go ahead.  Defend this.  I DARE YOU.

Oh wow.  What great pictures!  But unfortunately, they are MISPLACED in this situation.  You see Willjay, there is a custom for TAPS.  Military members render a hand salute, and civilians and those not in uniform place their hands over their hearts and remain silent.  At the Tomb, this custom is told to the visitors, and those who have chosen to sit in the grandstands to watch the Changing of the Guards, and Passing in Review. 

So no.  This dumbass was not praying, or kneeling in honor.  The Honor is in standing and placing your hand over your heart, like he was instructed to do.

Blow that smoke up someone else's ass.

So no.  This dumbass was not praying, or kneeling in honor.  The Honor is in standing and placing your hand over your heart, like he was instructed to do.

Blow that smoke up someone else's ass.

So it's about honor and respect for the service members how died protecting the United States of America and their way of life......and yet I supposed to take history advise and lectures from someone who's avatar and defense of the Confederate flag is blatant?

You can take you faux patriotism and cover the ass of the person who you want the smoke to be blown up!

and yet I supposed to take history advise and lectures from someone who's avatar and defense of the Confederate flag is blatant?

Well. I'm glad you brought that up. Allow me to school you on my avatar.

He is a larger picture of it.

If you look closely, you may notice some subtle differences between it and the Confederate Battle Flag. Yes, it has the same Red and Blue St. Andrews Cross. But there are some differences.

First, the Confederate Battle flag has 13 stars, representing the first 13 colonies (I think..not real sure on that). This one has 8. The CBF stars are white. This one is gold boredered.

Now, look at the motto at the bottom. "Gettysburg to the Marne". Now we all know where Gettysburg is. And you may know that the Marne is a river in France. And while the Confederates fought at Gettysburg, they didn't fight in the Marne during the Civil War.

Yes, the confederates fought at Gettysburg. But they weren't the only ones to fight there. There were also Union troops, if my recollection of history is correct (and it is).

You see, the Red in this icon represents Artillery. The Blue, service in the Union Army. The Gold Stars, the eight engagements fought during the Civil War. This is actually a US ARMY Distinctive Unit Insignia or DUI. It's for the 107th Field Artillery Regiment.

The castle, taken from the Puerto Rican Occupation Medal, denotes service in the Spanish American War, the coiled rattlesnake, Mexican border duty, the fleur-de-lis, overseas service during World War I, and the battle-axe, a medieval weapon in common use in the European area (added to the coat of arms), symbolizes combat service in Europe during World War II.

The distinctive unit insignia was originally approved for the 107th Field Artillery Regiment, Pennsylvania National Guard on 14 June 1929. It was amended to add the motto on 8 November 1929. It was redesignated for the 107th Field Artillery Battalion, Pennsylvania National Guard on 3 December 1942. The insignia was amended by addition of a charge (battle-axe) to represent World War II service on 20 May 1953. It was redesignated for the 107th Artillery, Pennsylvania National Guard on 14 September 1961. The insignia was redesignated for the 107th Field Artillery Regiment, Pennsylvania Army National Guard on 11 July 1972.

Now, I was raised in South West Georgia. But I was actually born in Rural Ridge PA. You see, my father was stationed there in the Army with the Air Defense Artillery. He was assigned to a Nike Ajax Missile battery in defense of Pittsburgh. IN 1963, his battery was turned over to the 107th Field Artillery, PA National Guard. For a short period of time, he wore this DUI during the transition. It just so happens that it was the DUI on his uniform the day I was born.

So, to honor him, and as a reference to my birth, I use it as an avatar.

No, it is not a Confederate symbol. Far from it.  Get a clue.  They're free.

No, it is not a Confederate symbol. Far from it.

It's also not the Flag of the United States of America either.......so once again pick up that faux patriotism and wall back down the street

How did you go from this:

So it's about honor and respect for the service members how died protecting the United States of America and their way of life......and yet I supposed to take history advise and lectures from someone who's avatar and defense of the Confederate flag is blatant?

to this:

It's also not the Flag of the United States of America either.......so once again pick up that faux patriotism and wall back down the street

????

I'm not following you.  Please clarify for me.  Where do you see faux patriotism?

It's just funny how you can hold sedition and treason in so high esteem claiming "heritage" but outraged at someone who is exercising their rights given to them by the people that your 'heritage" fought against

It's just funny how you can hold sedition and treason in so high esteem claiming "heritage" but outraged at someone who is exercising their rights given to them by the people that your 'heritage" fought against

When did I say it was my heritage?

Your comment makes it sound like I run around waving the battle flag yelling "Heritage, not Hate!!!"

I don't.  I don't even own a battle flag.  Don't have one on my pickup.  I do have this:

Oh, and this:

But no battle flag. 

The whole issue of bringing up the Confederate Battle flag was to see how far those who support the NFL player's kneeling protest would go in supporting Free Speech.  So far Perrie, Sandy, and LMM have acknowledged that displaying the battle flag, while it is offensive, is protected speech.

Where do you stand on it?

Oh, and these are the flags I fly, when I'm not flying the American Flag.

And rather than waving a battle flag, you're more likely to find me like this:

Or this:

You want me to make it about you?

What a douche bag.  Maybe he should move to a more diverse country.

Or maybe you should move to a less one? Look I not defending him doing it especially during taps, only that it's his right to....and speaking a former active duty Marine, I don't feel disrespected.

Then you should know better, Marine.

Bruce,This is a strange conundrum.

Men and women have died for this country to protect our Constitution.

Which also gives people the right to protest. 

But..The men and women who died giving them the right to protest are being disrespected. Thanks for my rights but....

It's the old chicken and the egg. 

I disagree.  There is a protocol for Taps, and laying of the wreath at the Tomb.  It is not the place for a protest.

Here is a question I've asked in several articles here.

The basic issue comes down to Freedom of Speech/Expression, which is a First Amendment Right.  ON this, everyone agrees.  One camp says that kneeling during the National Anthem is a protected act of speech.  One camp says it's offensive to the country, and by extension to veterans, etc.  So the other camp says that you must accept the offense because that is what the veterans etc fought and died for.  In other words, if you support the National Anthem and what it stands for, then you must by default support their "Right" to protest during it.

So my question is this:  If you think that the offensive behavior of protesting by kneeling during the National Anthem is protected and must be supported, would you also say that an NFL player waving a Confederate Battle Flag in protest is protected and must be supported?

So my question is this:  If you think that the offensive behavior of protesting by kneeling during the National Anthem is protected and must be supported, would you also say that an NFL player waving a Confederate Battle Flag in protest is protected and must be supported?

Yes. As well as the Westboro Baptist Church. Look, we are all going to be offended this freedom of speech. It only matters when we are offended. Otherwise, it is useless. 

Thank you.  Now step back and look at that from the bigger picture.  Remember Charlottesville?  What was it that the media and the left demanded from Trump in that issue?  Denouncement of the White Supremacist protestors?  It took him a while, but he finally did it to their satisfaction, even signing the worthless resolution the House and Senate passed.

But now he denounces the offensive behavior of the NFL and everyone loses their shit.

Progressives want to ban all references to slavery, pull down statues, change names of buildings, parks and roads, etc.  All because it's a reminder of slavery and it's offensive.  Yet we're supposed to accept when they want to protest something by an act that is offensive.

This meme pretty much sums it up.

speaking a former active duty Marine, I don't feel disrespected.

Nor does this Vietnam era Marine.

When the hell did America become a Nation of Idolaters?

The flag, the anthem represent the north star of our countries ambitions, they are not forking deities to be worshiped.

This Countries goal is to treat all citizens with equality as we march toward "E Pluribus Unum".

When some segments fell that they're not being brought into the process then they might break into a merchants warehouse and throw his goods, (tea), into the harbor to get heard.  Or they might protest and get arrested over 100 years as they fight for the right to vote, (Women's Suffrage).  Or they might have to riot and fight the police over  their very right to exist, like the gay men at Stonewall.

Or you might have to take a knee, quietly, respectfully during a National event to highlight your less than equal place in the land. 

I served to give you that right and I'm glad to see it used.

Equality for many different segments of our Nation has been hard won and is still a work in progress.

No, YOU ARE THE ONE WHO IS CONFUSED.

Since when did we put limits on the 1st Amendment?  Do they not have a 1st Amendment right to fly a Nazi or Confederate Battle Flag?  I don't give one rat fuck what they represent, if you support the 1st Amendment, YOU MUST SUPPORT THEIR RIGHT TO DISPLAY WHATEVER THEY WANT. 

You cannot put a limit to the speech.  Period.  So if you want to support a player's right to kneel during the National Anthem, and call his violation of Protocol Free Speech, then you MUST support a player's right to display the Confederate Battle Flag.  To oppose it is hypocritical, and par for the course for Progressives.

AS Marines, both of you SHOULD understand Protocol. 

As a Retired Submarine Sailor, I have no problem with protesters.  I have no problem when a protester burns a flag in protest.  I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WHEN THEY BREAK PROTOCOL AT A HALLOWED EVENT SUCH AS THE ONE ABOVE.

Perrie mentioned Westboro Baptist Church protests.  SCOTUS got it right when they said that though their protest are vile and objectionable, they are protected speech.  BUT, they also got it right when they said that the government COULD limit the LOCATION that they protest at to prevent disruption and possible violence.  THIS is just such a location.

So if you want to support a player's right to kneel during the National Anthem, and call his violation of Protocol Free Speech, then you MUST support a player's right to display the Confederate Battle Flag.

The converse is true, too.  Do you support a player's right to take a knee during the Anthem?

If you consider that to be disrespectful (but still allowable), do you also consider the display of the Confederate flag to be disrespectful?

Then you should know better, Marine.

Really? What should I know better? That it's his right to kneel, stand or jump on one foot whenever he chooses? That I fought for his right to be kneeling during this ceremony? That for this man to be kneeling and exercising his freedom that I gave 10 years of my life to defend makes me proud to be an American........tell me what should I know?

Sandy, I will join you in denouncing both.  Or I will join you in supporting both.  You choose.  But keep in mind, that if you support both, you have to support the KKK and white supremacist's rights to display the Confederate Battle Flag and the Nazi flag in Charlottesville.  In for a penny, in for a pound.

So choose for us Sandy.  Which side do we come down on?  Support or Oppose.

And that meme shows your hypocrisy....because when I see both pictures I see EQUAL disrespect

Protocol.

you have to support the KKK and white supremacist's rights to display the Confederate Battle Flag and the Nazi flag in Charlottesville.

When have I opposed their right to display those flags?

Never.

But I'm not the one complaining about disrespect for the American flag (or Anthem, or soldiers who fought for freedom of speech but apparently only when it doesn't piss off some people), am I?  I'm not the one saying we have to stand because some soldiers died, while forgetting exactly what they died for, am I?

I support the right to stand, kneel, or burn the flag (so long as it is the burner's legal property).  I support the right to fly the traitors' flag, but I'm going to call it out as the support for treason and anti-American values that it is.

Because I support the First Amendment, and not just when I agree with what's being expressed, at the time it's being expressed.

AS Marines, both of you SHOULD understand Protocol. 

Protocol?! What does protocol have to do with customs? It is CUSTOMARY for civilians to do this or that, but protocol has nothing to do with civilian. The only protocol that is required is for people to be silent, that's IT

Ah, but you are mistaken.  I have not yet opined on my position on either of them as an "act" of protest.  What I have opined on is the protocol of the ceremony of the Tomb. 

But let's just go ahead and get that out of the way right here.  Yeah, do what you want to the flag in protest.  It's a right I served to protect for you.  But I also have a right to feel and voice that it is disrespectful.  AND, I feel that protesting during the National Anthem is disrespectful.  But, you have that right. 

The difference between the Football Stadium and the Tomb is, the Tomb is hallowed ground.  Many would say that kneeling in the Football stadium is disrespectful to the vets and those who died.  And much of the argument by the progressives is that (1) they died for that right, and (2) the kneeling is not disrespecting those who fought and died.  BUT, at the Tomb, it is.  Kneeling for the ceremony, when protocol CLEARLY states (and the Guards have actually addressed people in the viewing stands and made them stand or leave before) to stand for the ceremony is NOT the appropriate venue to protest cops killing blacks.  HERE, in THIS PLACE, it IS disrespect to those who died for that right, and IS inappropriate.

As for the Confederate Flag, I'm a southern boy.  Raise in Southwest Georgia.  To me, it's not a symbol of slavery.  BUT, I respect that to many others it is.  Thus, I would join in saying that to display it is disrespectful.  However, just like burning or stepping on the American Flag, while I feel it is disrespectful, I still support the right to display it, however twisted the displaying is meant to be.

Nope.  Protocol at the Tomb is to remain silent, stand, and if in uniform salute. If not, place your hand over your heart.  There is even a dress code for those who wish to view from the viewing area.  The guards have told people to leave for improper dress, or for not standing.  And they will admonish people who act the fool at the tomb.  Google it.  There's many videos of it on YouTube.  Protocol. 

Do you really want to put limits on Free Speech?

When have I opposed their right to display those flags?

Didn't say you did.  I simply reminded you that support stretches to ALL displays of it.

And thank you for your response.  So far you and Perrie are the only ones who have given an honest response.

No, you are ignoring the issue.  Do you support their right to display the Confederate Flag.  I think in that screech you posted, you may have answered it, but please clarify for me.  Yes or No?  Would you support an NFL player displaying the Confederate Battle Flag in protest?

Go ahead and fly your flag of traitors and slavery, if you want.

This isn't about me.  Don't make it personal.

Oh there's plenty wrong with Neo-Nazis, and white supremacists.  And the statues are part of our history.  Our history hasn't been pretty. Far from it.  But just pulling them down because they are offensive to some is not something I support.  I've got no problem with relocating to a museum or some other venue.  But wiping them from existence denies our history. 

Are you aware that the tactics of Lee, Forrest, and others are still taught to our officers at West Point and other schools?  Did you know that Rommel's books on tank tactics are required reading for our tank corps?  Did you know that the snorkel on our modern submarines was actually adopted from German U-boats?

Our history is as I said somewhat ugly.  And erasing the ugliness from it puts us on a dangerous path of forgetting how we got where we are today.  (Although we are not perfect today by no stretch of the imagination).

I have not yet opined on my position on either of them as an "act" of protest.

 But we're not talking about protest we're talking about respect and disrespect

As for the Confederate Flag, I'm a southern boy.  Raise in Southwest Georgia.  To me, it's not a symbol of slavery.  BUT, I respect that to many others it is.  Thus, I would join in saying that to display it is disrespectful.

But, you also claim you have not problem displaying it and contradict yourself by not explain WHY you see it as disrespectful so I'm going with the assumption that you're just going with the status quo....you also make the assumption that the players that are kneeling don't see think that some people don't see it as disrespectful, the problem is no one is taking time to actually listen to why they are kneeling, to the point that this entire movement has been hijacked by faux patriotism and divisiveness.

There is no such thing as protocol when it regards civilians! There are only customs and traditions...please stop using that word in this context because it does not apply!

I simply reminded you that support stretches to ALL displays of it.

I don't need reminding, thanks.

Protocol at the Tomb is to remain silent, stand, and if in uniform salute. If not, place your hand over your heart.

Dude, that's a bunch of bull! I was born in Virginia and have been to the tomb to see the Changing of the Guard many times! There is absolutely NO requirement that you have to stand, or even place your hand over your heart. The only requirement is that you remain silent,

There is even a dress code for those who wish to view from the viewing area. 

There is no dress code, there are certain requirements like you have a have a shirt and footwear unless there is a special event because its still in a national park, Arlington Cemetary, other than that you're wrong

The guards have told people to leave for improper dress, or for not standing. 

And legally, they cant the only thing the guard can do is stop people from being too close to the actual tomb

And they will admonish people who act the fool at the tomb.  Google it.  There's many videos of it on YouTube.  Protocol. 

Dude that's called etiquette! But if those people told them to blow sand there's nothing they can do, because protocol doesn't apply to civilians!

From the website for Arlington National Cemetery:

Dress Code For Public Wreath Ceremonies

Personal appearance and dress of persons participating in ceremonies at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier will adhere to the dress standards expected of such dignified occasions. The minimum standard is business casual, defined as:

• For men: A combination of collared shirt (such as a dress shirt or polo shirt), trousers (such as khakis or blue, green, brown, or black trousers) with a belt and appropriate shoes. A blazer or business jacket and tie can optionally be added.
• For women: A reasonable length skirt (knee length) or trousers of a non-denim material combined with a top that covers the shoulders (such as a blouse, dress shirt, or sweater set) and appropriate shoes are considered acceptable. An informal dress with appropriate skirt length is also acceptable.
• School uniforms will be allowed as long as an adult official from the school confirms that the student’s attire is in accordance with the school uniform policy.

The following attire is considered not appropriate for participation in the ceremonies:

• Blue Jeans / Denim Pants
• Ripped clothing
• Athletic Wear
• Patched Pants
• Shorts of any kind (except when part of an established uniform, e.g. School Uniforms, Scout Uniforms, Foreign Military Uniforms, and period Military Uniforms)
• Tee Shirts
• Tank Tops
• Halter Tops
• Underwear as outerwear
• Shirts that expose the midriff
• Miniskirts
• Sneakers
• Open toed shoes (nice sandals [not shower type shoes or flip-flops] during warmer months for women is appropriate)
  

The Executive Director, Army National Cemeteries Program, or designated representatives; the Sergeant of the Guard; and Relief Commanders have the authority to prohibit a person in non appropriate attire from participating in a wreath ceremony at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier.

(f) Conduct within the Cemetery. Because Arlington National Cemetery is a shrine to the honored dead of the Armed Forces of the United States and because certain acts, appropriate elsewhere, are not appropriate in the Cemetery, all visitors, including persons attending or taking part in memorial services and ceremonies, shall observe proper standards of decorum and decency while within the Cemetery grounds. Specifically, no person shall:

(1) Conduct any memorial service or ceremony within the Cemetery, except private memorial services, without the prior approval of the Superintendent or Commanding General. All memorial services and ceremonies shall be conducted in accordance with the rules established in paragraph (h) and, except for official ceremonies, paragraph (i) of this section. Official ceremonies shall be conducted in accordance with guidance and procedures established by the Commanding General;

(2) Engage in any picketing, demonstration or similar conduct within the Cemetery grounds;

(3) Engage in any orations, speeches, or similar conduct to assembled groups of people, unless the oration is part of a memorial service or ceremony authorized by this section;

(4) Display any placards, banners, flags or similar devices within the Cemetery grounds, unless, in the case of a flag, use of the same is approved by the Superintendent or Commanding General and is part of a memorial service or ceremony authorized by this section;

(5) Distribute any handbill, pamphlet, leaflet, or other written or printed matter within the Cemetery grounds except that a program may be distributed if approved by the Superintendent or Commanding General and such distribution is a part of a memorial service or ceremony authorized by this section;

(6) Bring any pets on to cemetery grounds. This rule does not pertain to legitimate service animals or military working dogs;

(7) Use the Cemetery grounds for recreational activities such as sports, athletics, or picnics;

(8) Ride a bicycle on cemetery grounds without a family pass;

(9) Deposit or throw litter on Cemetery grounds;

(10) Play any radio, tape recorder, or musical instrument, or use any loudspeaker within the Cemetery grounds unless use of the same is approved by the Superintendent or Commanding General and is part of a memorial service or ceremony authorized by this section;

(11) Drive any motor vehicle within Arlington National Cemetery in excess of twenty miles per hour or such lesser speed limit as the Superintendent posts;

(12) Park any motor vehicle in any area on the Cemetery grounds designated by the Superintendent as a no parking area; or leave any vehicle in the Visitors' Center Parking Lot at the Cemetery beyond two hours;

(13) Engage in any disorderly conduct within the Cemetery grounds. For purposes of this section, a person shall be guilty of disorderly conduct if, with purpose to cause, or with knowledge that he is likely to cause, public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, he:

(i) Engages in, promotes, instigates, encourages, or aids and abets fighting, or threatening, violent or tumultuous behavior;

(ii) Yells, utters loud and boisterous language or makes other unreasonably loud noise;

(iii) Interrupts or disturbs a memorial service or ceremony;

(iv) Utters to any person present abusive, insulting, profane, indecent or otherwise provocative language or gesture that by its very utterance tends to incite an immediate breach of the peace;

(v) Obstructs movement on the streets, sidewalks, or pathways of the Cemetery grounds without prior authorization by competent authority;

(vi) Disobeys a proper request or order by the Superintendent, Cemetery special police, park police, or other competent authority to disperse or to leave the Cemetery grounds; or

(vii) Otherwise creates a hazardous or physically offensive condition by any act not authorized by competent authority.

(g) Soliciting and Vending. No person shall display or distribute commercial advertising or solicit business while within the Cemetery grounds.

(h) Requests to Conduct Memorial Services and Ceremonies. (1) Requests by members of the public to conduct memorial services or ceremonies shall be submitted to the Superintendent, Arlington National Cemetery, Arlington, Virginia 22211. Such requests shall describe the proposed memorial service or ceremony in detail to include the type of service, its proposed location, the name of the individual or organization sponsoring the service, the names of all key individuals participating in the service, the estimated number of persons expected to attend the service, the expected length of the service, the service's format and content, whether permission to use loud-speaker systems or musical instruments or flags during the service is requested and, if so, the number, type, and how they are planned to be used, whether permission to distribute printed programs during the service is requested, and, if so, a description of the programs, and whether military support is requested. Individuals and organizations sponsoring memorial services or ceremonies shall provide written assurance that the services or ceremonies are not partisan in nature, as defined in paragraph (i) of this section, and that they and their members will obey all rules set out in this section and act in a dignified and proper manner at all times while in the Cemetery grounds.

(2) Requests to conduct official ceremonies shall be submitted to the Commanding General.

(3) Memorial services or ceremonies other than private memorial services may be conducted only after permission has been received from the Superintendent or Commanding General. Private memorial services may be conducted only at the gravesite of a relative or friend. All other memorial services and ceremonies may be conducted only at the area or areas designated by the Superintendent or Commanding General as follows:

(i) Public memorial services may be authorized to be conducted only at the Arlington Memorial Amphitheater, the Confederate Memorial, the John F. Kennedy Grave, or other sites designated by the Superintendent.

(ii) Public wreath laying ceremonies may be authorized to be conducted at the tomb and plaza area of the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier (also known as the Tomb of the Unknowns).

(iii) Official ceremonies may be authorized to be conducted at sites designated by the Superintendent or Commanding General.

(i) Conduct of Memorial Services and Ceremonies. All memorial services and ceremonies within Arlington National Cemetery, other than official ceremonies, shall be conducted in accordance with the following rules:

(1) Memorial services and ceremonies shall be purely memorial in purpose and dedicated only to the memory of all those interred in the Cemetery, to all those dying in the military service of the United States, to all those dying in the military service of the United States while serving during a particular conflict or while serving in a particular military unit or units, or to the memory of the individual or individuals interred or to be interred at the particular gravesite at which the service or ceremony is held.

(2) Partisan activities are inappropriate in Arlington National Cemetery, due to its role as a shrine to all the honored dead of the Armed Forces of the United States and out of respect for the men and women buried there and for their families. Services or any activities inside the Cemetery connected therewith shall not be partisan in nature. A service is partisan and therefore inappropriate if it includes commentary in support of, or in opposition to, or attempts to influence, any current policy of the Armed Forces, the Government of the United States or any state of the United States; if it espouses the cause of a political party; or if it has as a primary purpose to gain publicity or engender support for any group or cause. If a service is closely related, both in time and location, to partisan activities or demonstrations being conducted outside the Cemetery, it will be determined to be partisan and therefore inappropriate. If a service is determined to be partisan by the Superintendent or the Commanding General, permission to conduct memorial services or ceremonies at the Cemetery will be denied.

(3) Participants in public wreath laying ceremonies shall remain silent during the ceremony.

(4) Participants in public memorial services at the John F. Kennedy Grave shall remain silent during the service.

(5) Public memorial services and public wreath laying ceremonies shall be open to all members of the public to observe.

(6) Participants in public wreath laying ceremonies shall follow all instructions of the Tomb Guards, Superintendent, and Commanding General relating to their conduct of the ceremony. (40 U.S.C. 318a, 486, and delegations of authority from the Administrator, General Services Administration, Secretary of Defense, and Secretary of the Army).

I've been nothing but respectful with you Sandy.  But you still want to be snarky.  Take it somewhere else.

Assume what ever you want.  I've been pretty clear in my position. 

You presuming to remind me was snarky.  If you don't want snark, don't lead with it, and don't presume to know my opinions to the point of assuming that I need reminders.

Since when did we put limits on the 1st Amendment?

Perhaps you should re-read your own question before discussing protocol.

Really?  How so?  Oh, I get it, because I don't want him to protest at the Tomb.  Yeah.  Well, I'm pretty sure I explained that in another comment.  I'm not going to retype it here.  Go find it.  But lets just say the limits do not limit his ability to protest (which is what my "limit" comment was inferring).  Just where he can do it.  He's free to protest outside of Arlington National Cemetery.  By law. 

How's that for snark?

You demand a consistency of position in others to which you do not seem to hold yourself.

Bruce, is the guy at the front of this picture (next to the woman) in compliance with the dress code?

He has shorts on. He is wearing gym shoes or athletic shoes. He also appears to be wearing a tank top over his shirt.  The woman next to him appears to be wearing a tee shirt. She also has sneakers on. According to you, neither of these people should be there, they are disrespecting the ceremony.

snopes

A viral image shows a man kneeling in protest at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier in Arlington National Cemetery.

RATING

UNPROVEN

ORIGIN

Amid intensifying public debate about the right of NFL players and others to protest against police brutality and social injustice, a photograph emerged online in late September 2017 appearing to show a young black man kneeling at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier in Arlington National Cemetery. 

The web site America’s Freedom Fighters wrote :

An anonymous poster recently uploaded a particularly disappointing picture in a thread discussing the protests of the National Anthem during the NFL games. In the photo, a black man with scraggly hair, dressed in baggy khakis and a white t-shirt is seen on one knee hunched over to the side as a crowd of respectful on-lookers places their hands over their hearts and looks toward the flag.  

…This is a protest that occurred during the changing of the guard at the most sacred site in all of the Arlington National Cemetery: the tomb of the Unknowns.

The earliest postings of the photograph that we could find were around the same time on 27 September 2017, first in a Reddit group called “The Donald” at 9:50 Eastern time. The caption says only that the scene of the image is the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier and does not provide a date or any further details. About thirty minutes after that, the Facebook page Salute Media posted what appeared to be a screenshot of an earlier version of the photograph, along with a caption that read:

This photo was taken by my daughter yesterday at the tomb of the unknown soldier while they were playing TAPS. Words cannot express my anger right now. 

After publication of this article, Katie Wiederhoeft contacted us to explain that she had taken the photograph. It was originally posted to her Facebook page at 1:03 A.M. on 27 September. In an e-mail, she told us that she took the photograph while visiting Arlington earlier that day: 

I did not speak with the man and don’t know his reasonings for kneeling. I felt at the time (and the place) it was not appropriate as I was trying to be respectful to my fallen brothers and sisters and maintain silence… He was video taping so maybe he was trying to get a better shot, but with all that is going on currently I just can’t imagine that’s what it was. I truly hope that his actions were innocent in nature and that he didn’t intend to be disrespectful.

In response to a question under her Facebook post, Wiederhoeft confirmed that the man had been recording a video during the ceremony. 

It’s possible that the man was both protesting and recording a video when Wiederhoeft’s photograph was taken. It’s also possible that he was kneeling to get a better angle for his video, or in order to steady his hands while he recorded. Without further evidence, and without being able to speak with the man in the photograph, we cannot say with any authority what exactly might have prompted or motivated his kneeling, although we know from the person who took the photograph that he was recording a video. 

There is a dress code  for the public during wreath-laying ceremonies. T-shirts, jeans and shorts are “considered not appropriate for participation in the ceremonies.” That means that all members of the public visible in the foreground of the photograph are technically in violation of the dress code. The public is also  requested to remain “silent and standing” during the wreath-laying ceremony, so the person in this image appears to not be adhering to that request. 

Bruce, is the guy at the front of this picture (next to the woman) in compliance with the dress code?

Nope.  That's why he's behind the barriers and not in the stands.  Se my post on this page about dress code from the Arlington National Cemetery Website.

So then the black guys arent violating the dress code either, since they were not admitted to the stands.

The woman who took the photograph says the kneeling guy was taking a video.  I think that casts considerable doubt on the idea that he was protesting. Without hearing from him, who knows?

Overall, I would say this story is overblown.

Here John, you can read it yourself:

arlingtoncemetery

I looked at that when you posted on this seed.

By the way, I have a feeling some of the people in the stands werent that well dressed either.

Overall, I would say this story is overblown.

Well thank you John, for that Official John Russell Ruling on my article.  I was so worried it would actually meet your approval!

Why didnt you mention that the woman said he was taking a video at the time?

I guess that didnt make it into your sources.

Dude look at the picture you provided for this seed.....please tell me who in the picture meets proper attire you claim there is! Now look at your link you provided for proper attire, notice how it states THE WREATH CEREMONY.....A SPECIAL EVENT in which I clearly stated that when appropriate attire has to be adhered to! And to make matters worse the pic is during the Wreath Ceremony! So I that leads me to believe this picture may not be real!

Dude, look at the picture.  Do you see the people in the viewing stands?  Do you see the barriers that this guy is behind?  Do you see that the people who are outside the viewing stand (not properly attired to be in the viewing stands) behind the barriers with this dude still appear to be showing the proper respect?

Why would God bless America?

Then "protocol" should not apply to them right?

Of course it should.  While they are not allowed in the viewing stands, they are still there observing the ceremony.  Now, I will allow as John and LMM have pointed out that we really don't know what this guy was doing.  BUT, if he is taking a knee, as a form of protest like the NFL players, then he is WRONG.  The rules for the attire are for the viewing area of the Tomb.  The law against protests cover the entire Arlington National Cemetery.

Dude, look at the picture.  Do you see the people in the viewing stands?  Do you see the barriers that this guy is behind?  Do you see that the people who are outside the viewing stand (not properly attired to be in the viewing stands) behind the barriers with this dude still appear to be showing the proper respect?

Ok.....I'm going to try to make this civil, because maybe you don't know....the only dress code that is adhered to his for people who PARTICIPATE in Wreath Ceremonies....spectators do not have to adhere. Now look at your picture again, the participants are the people standing next to the soldiers, and the reason people are standing behind a chain is because sitting in the stands is limited and is first come first serve! Now read you link about the dress code again. Once again I have been to SEVERAL Wreath Ceremonies in my day sitting in the stands and NEVER had to think about my attire or told otherwise, so please stop trying to further this misrepresentation.

Sorry but that didn't impress me the last 3 times I read it on this seed!

PARTICIPANTS are the people that are actively laying the wreath down on the tomb! Anyone can do it!

eremonies

(f) Conduct within the Cemetery. Because Arlington National Cemetery is a shrine to the honored dead of the Armed Forces of the United States and because certain acts, appropriate elsewhere, are not appropriate in the Cemetery, all visitors, including persons attending or taking part in memorial services and ceremonies, shall observe proper standards of decorum and decency while within the Cemetery grounds. Specifically, no person shall:

(1) Conduct any memorial service or ceremony within the Cemetery, except private memorial services, without the prior approval of the Superintendent or Commanding General. All memorial services and ceremonies shall be conducted in accordance with the rules established in paragraph (h) and, except for official ceremonies, paragraph (i) of this section. Official ceremonies shall be conducted in accordance with guidance and procedures established by the Commanding General;

(2) Engage in any picketing, demonstration or similar conduct within the Cemetery grounds;

You want to take knee?

And here's the funny part about this....I myself would NEVER kneel for the National Anthem, that's not because I respect the flag or country more than they do, that's just my bearing, but that also doesn't say I don't respect the right of the other person doing it, or the issue he is protesting also, I fully understand....and that's what makes this country great that people can have respect for both kneeling or standing

Oh, and there is this update to the article, from the woman that took the photograph:

I regret not speaking with the young man and finding out what his intentions were. I was so upset at the time and completely speechless, which doesn’t happen often. Part of me was afraid of what his answer would’ve been, what if he was kneeling in protest?! I honestly don’t believe that I would have been able to maintain composure. Out of respect for my fallen brothers and sisters, I chose not to confront him. Hindsight is 20-20, maybe he would’ve answered that his actions were completely unintentional and he was trying to get a better angle (he was video taping). But in light of what our country is currently going through and the fact that the guard specifically stated to stand I can’t help but feel it was in protest. But I guess I’ll never know.

From the website for Arlington National Cemetery:

Dress Code For Public Wreath Ceremonies

Personal appearance and dress of persons participating in ceremonies at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier will adhere to the dress standards expected of such dignified occasions. The minimum standard is business casual, defined as:

• For men: A combination of collared shirt (such as a dress shirt or polo shirt), trousers (such as khakis or blue, green, brown, or black trousers) with a belt and appropriate shoes. A blazer or business jacket and tie can optionally be added.
• For women: A reasonable length skirt (knee length) or trousers of a non-denim material combined with a top that covers the shoulders (such as a blouse, dress shirt, or sweater set) and appropriate shoes are considered acceptable. An informal dress with appropriate skirt length is also acceptable.
• School uniforms will be allowed as long as an adult official from the school confirms that the student’s attire is in accordance with the school uniform policy.

The following attire is considered not appropriate for participation in the ceremonies:

• Blue Jeans / Denim Pants
• Ripped clothing
• Athletic Wear
• Patched Pants
• Shorts of any kind (except when part of an established uniform, e.g. School Uniforms, Scout Uniforms, Foreign Military Uniforms, and period Military Uniforms)
• Tee Shirts
• Tank Tops
• Halter Tops
• Underwear as outerwear
• Shirts that expose the midriff
• Miniskirts
• Sneakers
• Open toed shoes (nice sandals [not shower type shoes or flip-flops] during warmer months for women is appropriate)

I think he got you Bruce. The dress code is for the people laying the wreath. I didnt notice the word 'participant' in the text either.

That must be why I noticed a lot of people in the stands looking pretty casually dressed.

"Take a knee" was barely a thing before Trump made it one. I think there were two guys in the NFL doing it prior to last Sunday.

To suggest it is inspired by "the left" is just silly.

Wait, so it's okay for someone to take a knee in protest, because the rest of the folk are in shorts? 

I stand by this:

(f) Conduct within the Cemetery. Because Arlington National Cemetery is a shrine to the honored dead of the Armed Forces of the United States and because certain acts, appropriate elsewhere, are not appropriate in the Cemetery, all visitors, including persons attending or taking part in memorial services and ceremonies, shall observe proper standards of decorum and decency while within the Cemetery grounds. Specifically, no person shall:

(1) Conduct any memorial service or ceremony within the Cemetery, except private memorial services, without the prior approval of the Superintendent or Commanding General. All memorial services and ceremonies shall be conducted in accordance with the rules established in paragraph (h) and, except for official ceremonies, paragraph (i) of this section. Official ceremonies shall be conducted in accordance with guidance and procedures established by the Commanding General;

(2) Engage in any picketing, demonstration or similar conduct within the Cemetery grounds;

I am not saying it is right that he was kneeling , but he maybe didnt know the rules. OK, maybe he's a dumbass.  That is a far cry from how this seed started out.

Lacking any proof he knelt as a protest, I think the charge he hates the flag or country or the military is a big stretch.

This is starting to smell a little like more selective outrage from the right.

Yeah, well, the Left has had their share of selective outrage as well.

Look, you know me.  If it turns out in a couple of days or so that this guy comes forward with an explanation for kneeling other than protest, I will back off.   And post a comment about it here in this article.

But, if it turns out he was kneeling as act of solidarity with the NFL protest, will you join me in condemning it?

I sure hope this guy gets identified, and blasted in social media for this shit.

This is why people are opposed and outraged at the NFL.  Because dumbasses don't know when to stop.  And it carries over to shit like this.

So... You can't kneel during Taps now?  How about God Bless America?  Can I kneel then?  How about This Land is Your Land.  America the Beautiful?  Of course you know that flying the American Flag from the back of a pickup truck is illegal right?  It's a violation of the US Flag code. 

I respect your freedom, but not your opinion. That is my opinion, and my feedom. 

If you're offended by someone kneeling down, then you choose to be offended and will rationalize the Why any way you can. How does someone protesting what they see as a miscarriage of justice impact your life? Be a little more phlegmatic about things that have zero impact on you.  You'll live longer, and probably won't be so grumpy about things.

But I like being grumpy.  It keeps me warm at night.

If you're offended by someone kneeling down, then you choose to be offended and will rationalize the Why any way you can.

And that is a two way street. Both sides are making a choice and are rationalizing it as the right choice for them.

The problem comes from both sides when they begin telling everyone else that their way is the only true way.

#8 bird shot hitting you from a few hundred yards away still stings when it hits, Memphis, Tennessee, 1962. 15 stitches in the scalp, Montgomery, Alabama, 1963. Broken arm and three broken ribs, Crossing the Pettus Bridge Selma, Alabama, 1965, also known as "Bloody Sunday"

I laugh at all the people getting their panties in a bunch and thinking that they are really accomplishing something by sitting down, by not showing up, or bending a knee.

They have the gall to call it a protest. They have the right?, and there are people all over the world who have died for them to have said right. There are people like me that put it out there where it was really happening, to perfect that right.

Yet you disrespect us, when we simply ask for a little respect for those that came before....

You want us to respect your paltry ideal of a demonstration? show a little respect for those that spilt their blood making sure you have that right to whine and call it a protest....

Stop feeding us ideology and get out an actually do something. Some of us that have, would appreciate the effort.

"I laugh at all the people getting their panties in a bunch and thinking that they are really accomplishing something by sitting down, by not showing up, or bending a knee."

Actually, I agree with you there. Getting your panties in a wad over something you have no control over is a waste of time and effort.  That's why I said people need to be a little more phlegmatic over such things and stop with the faux outrage. It doesn't solve the problem.  All it does is divert attention from the problem to a different problem.