'Nobody actually died': QAnon fans already claiming Boulder mass shooting is a false flag

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  john-russell  •  3 weeks ago  •  151 comments

By:   Raw Story - Celebrating Years of Independent Journalism

'Nobody actually died': QAnon fans already claiming Boulder mass shooting is a false flag
On Tuesday, Newsweek reported that the QAnon movement is already spreading wild conspiracy theories that the mass shooting at King Soopers grocery store in Boulder, Colorado was a "false flag" operation."Rather than express empathy for the victims of the attack, supporters of QAnon ... instead decla...

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On Tuesday, Newsweek reported that the QAnon movement is already spreading wild conspiracy theories that the mass shooting at King Soopers grocery store in Boulder, Colorado was a "false flag" operation.

"Rather than express empathy for the victims of the attack, supporters of QAnon ... instead declared that the media reports and statements from the police were all false and that there is no way yet another mass shooting could have occurred in the U.S.," reported Ewan Palmer. "'No question Boulder, Co incident today was a false flag. The only question is by which side?,' one QAnon profile, who has more than 260,000 subscribers on Telegram, wrote. 'False flag means it's fake. Nobody actually died. Was this false flag to try and take your guns or scare the s**t out of you?'"

"An account with more than 58,000 Telegram followers added: 'This Boulder situation reeks of false flag. Anons will pick this apart in a matter of hours if it is,'" continued the report. "Another Telegram user wrote: 'Nobody died. I was there for an actual shooting. This was 100% fake fake.'"

QAnon, a pro-Trump conspiracy theory movement that believes the United States is secretly run by a cabal of Satan-worshiping cannibal child traffickers, has largely been booted off most major social media platforms, but persists on direct encrypted messaging apps like Telegram.

Conspiracy theories that mass shootings are false flags for government social engineering are popular with the far right. Most famously, InfoWars webcaster Alex Jones repeatedly claimed the Sandy Hook Elementary mass shooting in Newtown, Connecticut was staged with child actors — a claim for which he is subject to multiple defamation suits by the parents of the victims.


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JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1  seeder  JohnRussell    3 weeks ago

Millions of Republicans have supported Q Anon beliefs. Why? 

 
 
 
Ozzwald
PhD Quiet
1.1  Ozzwald  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago
Millions of Republicans have supported Q Anon beliefs. Why?

Because QANON believers basically walk around with signs on their backs proclaiming "I am dumb enough to believe anything rightwing conspiracy you tell me to believe". 

Republicans see that and think, "They'll vote for me no matter what"!

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Masters Participates
1.2  Greg Jones  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago

Why are you exploiting a tragedy?

For political gain? To spread propaganda?-

 
 
 
Hallux
Freshman Expert
1.2.1  Hallux  replied to  Greg Jones @1.2    3 weeks ago

John has 250,000+ followers? Seems that it is Q-folk that are exploiting this and spreading their propaganda.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
Professor Principal
1.3  Vic Eldred  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago

With all that we face right now, Q Anon is the main concern/ s


OIP.yxumo805PtffVhYWyn9dZAHaEN?w=306&h=180&c=7&o=5&pid=1.7

 
 
 
Ozzwald
PhD Quiet
1.3.1  Ozzwald  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.3    3 weeks ago
With all that we face right now, Q Anon is the main concern/ s

You just need to change 1 single word Vic.

With all that we face right now, Q Anon is a main concern.

 
 
 
Hallux
Freshman Expert
1.3.2  Hallux  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.3    3 weeks ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Masters Participates
1.3.3  Greg Jones  replied to  Ozzwald @1.3.1    3 weeks ago

Never heard of them until a few months ago

Can't be very many followers

 
 
 
Hallux
Freshman Expert
1.3.4  Hallux  replied to  Greg Jones @1.3.3    3 weeks ago

I heard of them over 2 years ago ... you might try different news sources.

 
 
 
Hallux
Freshman Expert
1.3.5  Hallux  replied to  Greg Jones @1.3.3    3 weeks ago
"Can't be very many followers"

Enjoy:

 
 
 
Ozzwald
PhD Quiet
1.3.6  Ozzwald  replied to  Greg Jones @1.3.3    3 weeks ago
Never heard of them until a few months ago

I believe you...........  Really, I do.........

Would you be interested in some ocean front property in Wyoming, that I am selling?

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.3.7  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.3    3 weeks ago

How many white nationalists, Proud Boz, Etc. are part of the The-Q, that our national security groups have determined are a bigger threat to American security than our external enemies?

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
1.3.8  Texan1211  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.3.7    3 weeks ago

[deleted]

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.3.9  Tessylo  replied to  Greg Jones @1.3.3    3 weeks ago

Two of the batshit crazy freakshows are in Congress - Boebert and Taylor-Greene

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
1.3.10  Texan1211  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.3.7    3 weeks ago

I don't know. Do you?

 
 
 
Hallux
Freshman Expert
1.3.11  Hallux  replied to  Hallux @1.3.2    3 weeks ago

Taunting [Perrie Halpern R.A.]

It was worth it ...

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.3.12  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Texan1211 @1.3.10    3 weeks ago

I don't think anyone knows beyond whatever published estimates can be googled.  Looking back at the statement I made, it may be more important to know how many Q-believers are members of far right white nationalists organizations....

 
 
 
MrFrost
Masters Principal
1.3.13  MrFrost  replied to  Greg Jones @1.3.3    3 weeks ago
Never heard of them until a few months ago

I do not believe this for a second. They have been in the media for YEARS now. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.3.14  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  MrFrost @1.3.13    3 weeks ago

In November 2017, a small-time YouTube video creator and two moderators of the 4chan website, one of the most extreme message boards on the internet, banded together and plucked out of obscurity an anonymous and cryptic post from the many conspiracy theories that populated the website's message board.

NBC

 
 
 
zuksam
Sophomore Silent
1.3.15  zuksam  replied to  Hallux @1.3.4    3 weeks ago
I heard of them over 2 years ago ... you might try different news sources.

I only hear about them from the left, they're always complaining about Q spreading False Conspiracy theories but the only people I ever see repeating/spreading them is the Left. I sure as hell don't know anybody who believes these stories and I would be totally unaware that Qanon even existed if it wasn't for a few stories in the Leftwing media and the stories and comments that Leftwingers post here.

 
 
 
Ender
PhD Principal
1.3.16  Ender  replied to  zuksam @1.3.15    3 weeks ago

Yet one has to ask...better to shine a light on what lives in the shadows or let it fester.

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Masters Participates
1.4  Greg Jones  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago
Millions of Republicans have supported Q Anon beliefs. Why? 

No they haven't. This is just misinformation

 
 
 
Hallux
Freshman Expert
1.4.1  Hallux  replied to  Greg Jones @1.4    3 weeks ago

 
 
 
MrFrost
Masters Principal
1.4.2  MrFrost  replied to  Greg Jones @1.4    3 weeks ago

No they haven't. This is just misinformation

Never heard of Marjorie Taylor Greene either? 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Participates
1.5  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago

Why do millions of democrats believe the moon landing was faked? Or that Russia changed votes in 2016? Or that police officers kills thousands of unarmed blacks every year?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.5.1  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5    3 weeks ago

utter nonsense. 

 
 
 
Ozzwald
PhD Quiet
1.5.2  Ozzwald  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5    3 weeks ago
Why do millions of democrats believe the moon landing was faked? Or that Russia changed votes in 2016?

Same reason that millions upon millions of Republicans believe in a flat Earth.

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
1.5.3  pat wilson  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5    3 weeks ago

You toss crap out with nothing to support it. Do you have any links for this nonsense ?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Participates
1.5.4  Sean Treacy  replied to  JohnRussell @1.5.1    3 weeks ago

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Participates
1.5.5  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ozzwald @1.5.2    3 weeks ago

Sadly. millions of Democrats believe in a flat earth too.

Even more sad, a MAJORITY of Democrats  could not correctly answer both that the Earth goes around the Sun and that this takes a year.

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
Masters Guide
1.5.6  Thrawn 31  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5.5    3 weeks ago

There are a lot of really stupid people out there.

 
 
 
Ozzwald
PhD Quiet
1.5.7  Ozzwald  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5.5    3 weeks ago
Sadly. millions of Democrats believe in a flat earth too.

And millions of Republicans believe the moon landing was faked, and that Russia did not interfere in the 2016 election.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.5.8  Tessylo  replied to  pat wilson @1.5.3    3 weeks ago

"You toss crap out with nothing to support it. Do you have any links for this nonsense ?"

Any links from a trusted source don't say what they say it states and the rest of the sources are not trustworthy 'sources' - just opinion pieces or blogs or way out there 'right wing whackjob conspiracy sites'

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
1.5.9  pat wilson  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5.4    3 weeks ago

I do think Russia interfered in the 2016 and the 2020 elections.

The Politico article is about 9/11. Not one of your claims. The Ipsos article isn't a claim in your post either.

Your claim here is accurate, kinda skeptical about the source though.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Participates
1.5.10  Sean Treacy  replied to  pat wilson @1.5.9    3 weeks ago

I do think Russia interfered in the 2016 and the 2020 elections.

66% of Democrats believe Russian tampered with vote tallies. There is zero evidence Russians changed voting totals in the election. 

The Politico article is about 9/11

True. I just threw it in as a bonus conspiracy Democrats believe in.  

The Ipsos article isn't a claim in your post either.

The IPSOS link is to the poll results showing 11% of Democrats believe the moon landing was faked. 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Participates
1.5.11  Sean Treacy  replied to  Tessylo @1.5.8    3 weeks ago
d source don't say what they say it states and the rest of the sources are not trustworthy 'sources'

I have no idea what you are even trying to say, but if you believe poll results are opinion pieces, I can't help you. 

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
1.5.12  Gordy327  replied to  Thrawn 31 @1.5.6    3 weeks ago

That's what I always say. And I'm proved right on a daily basis.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
1.5.13  Gordy327  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5.5    3 weeks ago

What's sad is anyone who actually believes in a flat earth. Or a young earth too for that matter.

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
1.5.14  pat wilson  replied to  Sean Treacy @1.5.10    3 weeks ago

The Ipsos link was to an article about people believing in "the Deep State". 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.5.15  Tessylo  replied to  pat wilson @1.5.14    3 weeks ago

What did I tell you?

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Participates
1.5.16  Sean Treacy  replied to  pat wilson @1.5.14    3 weeks ago

No, it's not.  Did you read past the first line? 

It lists every questions asked in the poll and breakout of the responses. It's literally titled public poll findings and methodology. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.5.17  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Gordy327 @1.5.13    3 weeks ago

I will offer one million dollars to the family of any flat earther if they die by sailing to the "edge" of the earth and falling off.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.5.18  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  pat wilson @1.5.3    3 weeks ago

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.5.19  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Gordy327 @1.5.13    3 weeks ago

They only believe that the earth is flat, not the millions of other planets.  They must think that God made the earth flat so that he and Jesus can play a game of Frisbee.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.5.20  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Ozzwald @1.5.7    3 weeks ago

I don't know about 2016, but Putin authorized interference in the 2020 one according to CNBC.

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
1.5.21  Gordy327  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @1.5.19    3 weeks ago

How some people can believe and accept such ridiculous ideas as fact is beyond me.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.5.22  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Gordy327 @1.5.21    3 weeks ago

Yeah yeah yeah.  Go tell it to your fellow QAnons.jrSmiley_84_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Gordy327
Professor Principal
1.5.23  Gordy327  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @1.5.22    3 weeks ago

I don't think the somewhat hostile reaction was warranted. I was in support of your prior comment.

 
 
 
gooseisgone
Senior Quiet
1.6  gooseisgone  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago
Millions of Republicans have supported Q Anon beliefs. Why? 

Funny.........I haven't met any. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.6.1  Tessylo  replied to  gooseisgone @1.6    3 weeks ago
"Millions of Republicans have supported Q Anon beliefs. Why?" 
"Funny.........I haven't met any."

You can rest assured that there are several of them right here on Newstalkers for starters.

 
 
 
gooseisgone
Senior Quiet
1.6.2  gooseisgone  replied to  Tessylo @1.6.1    3 weeks ago
You can rest assured that there are several of them right here on Newstalkers for starters.

Really.......name them. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.6.3  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Tessylo @1.6.1    3 weeks ago

Met one and his wife four years ago on a cruise.  He broke his nose slipping on a bar of soap sometime after asking me if I was a traitor to the US Constitution for not voting for Trump in 2016...  His wife was big into Amway. 

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
1.6.4  pat wilson  replied to  gooseisgone @1.6.2    3 weeks ago

That's a site violation.

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Junior Expert
1.6.5  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  pat wilson @1.6.4    3 weeks ago

Tough shit. It is a lie? or the truth. Can always PN the questioner for the answer. Well for those who care about credibility that is.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.6.6  Tessylo  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @1.6.5    3 weeks ago

It's true!

 
 
 
gooseisgone
Senior Quiet
1.6.7  gooseisgone  replied to  pat wilson @1.6.4    3 weeks ago

[Deleted]

 
 
 
MrFrost
Masters Principal
1.6.8  MrFrost  replied to  gooseisgone @1.6    3 weeks ago

Funny.........I haven't met any. 

I've never met a KKK member, that doesn't mean they don't exist. 

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
1.6.9  pat wilson  replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @1.6.5    3 weeks ago

Tough shit.

Tough shit what ? Your response to me makes no sense.

Tough shit that it is a site violation to name members in offensive terms ?

Have you ever read the CoC here or the Terms of Service ?

 
 
 
gooseisgone
Senior Quiet
1.6.10  gooseisgone  replied to  MrFrost @1.6.8    3 weeks ago
I've never met a KKK member,

Well....you have been around long enough to know who Robert Byrd is. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
1.6.11  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.6.3    3 weeks ago

I hope you came right back at him with the same question about him being a Trumpturd.  I would have.

 
 
 
Tacos!
PhD Expert
1.7  Tacos!  replied to  JohnRussell @1    3 weeks ago

I think QAnon might be less popular than you realize. A lot of crazy fringe groups are just loud. That doesn’t mean they have any support.

Last month, the NBC News poll asked voters whether they had positive, negative, neutral or no views of QAnon. A mere 2% held positive views. The rest were either negative (42%), neutral (11%), or weren't sure or didn't know (45%).

2% sucks when you consider that 20% of Americans still believe vaccines cause autism and cell phones cause cancer. Heck I think about that many think the Earth is flat.

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.7.1  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Tacos! @1.7    3 weeks ago

I think your data would have a built in unknown skew Tacos as I believe The-Q don't trust the media any more than they trust federal agencies.  Do you think a group that wants to be left in the shadows is going to talk honestly to a pollster?

 
 
 
Tacos!
PhD Expert
1.7.2  Tacos!  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.7.1    3 weeks ago

Well in that case, we can claim anything we want, can’t we?

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.7.3  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Tacos! @1.7.2    3 weeks ago

We need data that we can hang our hats on.   I know the-Q exist.....  I've found myself talking to one a few years ago.....  The I one I talked to matched much of what has been reported about them.....   So they walk among us...! 

 
 
 
Tacos!
PhD Expert
1.7.4  Tacos!  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.7.3    3 weeks ago

I don’t doubt they exist. I just doubt they have the support of millions of people as JR suggested. At least not very many millions. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.7.5  Tessylo  replied to  Tacos! @1.7.4    3 weeks ago
"At least not very many millions."

jrSmiley_88_smiley_image.gif

Yeah, 'not very many millions' of freakshow batshit crazy whackjobs to worry about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What a relief!!!!!!!!!

jrSmiley_80_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
2  Paula Bartholomew    3 weeks ago

I am watching the story on the news right now.  The suspect who killed 10 people was shot by the police but is alive.  I am glad he is so that he can go to trial and be put away for 10 consecutive life sentences.  Too many times, these cowards kill themselves.  I hope this pos is passed around in prison like the little bitch he is.

 
 
 
devangelical
PhD Principal
2.1  devangelical  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @2    3 weeks ago

he's eventually going to supermax in canon city to begin a long life as a turd sculptor in solitary.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
2.1.1  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  devangelical @2.1    3 weeks ago

Even those in solitary can be gotten to.

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Junior Silent
3  SteevieGee    3 weeks ago

This is great news for Officer Talley and his 7 kids.  RIP Officer.

 
 
 
Greg Jones
Masters Participates
4  Greg Jones    3 weeks ago

Police identified 21 year old Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa as the suspect. He's in custody and charged with 10 counts of murder in the first degree.

No wonder it took so long to name the perp.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
4.1  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Greg Jones @4    3 weeks ago

You mean the whole couple of hours that it normally takes?

 
 
 
MonsterMash
Sophomore Participates
4.1.1  MonsterMash  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @4.1    3 weeks ago
You mean the whole couple of hours that it normally takes?

A hell of a lot longer than a couple of hours. I went to bed at 3am this morning at that time the perps name still wasn't released. When I went to bed I knew the perp wasn't a white guy, if he had been his name would have been plastered all over CNN. MSNBC, CBS, ABC, and NBC with demands he be charged with a hate crime. 

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
Masters Guide
4.2  Thrawn 31  replied to  Greg Jones @4    3 weeks ago

You mean less than a day? 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
4.3  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Greg Jones @4    3 weeks ago
Where did this kid get the AR15?

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Junior Silent
4.3.1  SteevieGee  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @4.3    3 weeks ago

Walmart.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
4.3.2  Texan1211  replied to  SteevieGee @4.3.1    3 weeks ago

proof or just a bad wild-assed guess?

 
 
 
devangelical
PhD Principal
4.3.3  devangelical  replied to  SteevieGee @4.3.1    3 weeks ago

nah, probably he probably got it at the local tanner gun show held every month, where most of the cash for guns sales take place in the parking lot.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
4.3.4  Texan1211  replied to  devangelical @4.3.3    3 weeks ago

Man, you should really report all these transactions you keep seeing.

 
 
 
SteevieGee
Junior Silent
4.3.5  SteevieGee  replied to  devangelical @4.3.3    3 weeks ago

It's where I got mine.

 
 
 
devangelical
PhD Principal
4.3.7  devangelical  replied to  SteevieGee @4.3.5    3 weeks ago

estate sales are best.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.3.8  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  devangelical @4.3.7    3 weeks ago

I know someone who would disagree.  He tried selling his father's gun collection at an estate sale.  His downfall was that an ATF officer whose hobby was estate sales happened to be there.  Within an hour, other agents arrived and he got busted, not for the shotguns, but the ten handguns that require checks and a waiting period by law.  He also did 30 days in jail and had a hefty fine.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
4.3.9  Texan1211  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @4.3.8    3 weeks ago

Just more proof that we have enough laws regarding guns.

What we need is enforcement of those laws.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.3.10  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Texan1211 @4.3.9    3 weeks ago

My friend ended up on the business end of enforcement.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
4.3.11  Trout Giggles  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @4.3.8    3 weeks ago

Good to know

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.3.12  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.3.11    3 weeks ago

What part?

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
4.3.13  Trout Giggles  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @4.3.12    3 weeks ago

Not selling handguns at an estate sale

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
4.3.14  Texan1211  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @4.3.10    3 weeks ago

That is fantastic. I wish more people were held accountable.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.3.15  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.3.13    3 weeks ago

Ahh.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.3.16  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Texan1211 @4.3.14    3 weeks ago

One of my line officers at the gun range I managed got busted there after he sold a gun illegally at a gun show to an undercover cop.

 
 
 
Ender
PhD Principal
4.3.17  Ender  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @4.3.16    3 weeks ago

One thing I actually agree with the pro gun crowd...is the selling of like antique guns. I shouldn't have to sell something of potential value to a dealer.

 
 
 
MonsterMash
Sophomore Participates
4.5  MonsterMash  replied to  Greg Jones @4    3 weeks ago
Police identified 21 year old Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa as the suspect. He's in custody and charged with 10 counts of murder in the first degree. No wonder it took so long to name the perp.

WHAT !! No demands from the left the shooter be charged with a racist hate crime and/or with terrorism. Of course not, the perp is a Muslim that killed white people. The lefts attitude is: Nothing to see here move along. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
4.5.1  FLYNAVY1  replied to  MonsterMash @4.5    3 weeks ago

BOULDER, Colo. -- Police on Tuesday identified a 21-year-old man as the suspect who opened fire inside a crowded Colorado supermarket, and court documents showed that he purchased an assault rifle less than a week before the attack that killed 10 people, including a police officer.

A law enforcement official briefed on the shooting said the suspect’s family told investigators they believed Alissa was suffering some type of mental illness , including delusions . Relatives described times when Alissa told them people were following or chasing him, which they said may have contributed to the violence, the official said. The official was not authorized to speak publicly and spoke to AP on condition of anonymity.

Officials: Gun in supermarket shooting bought 6 days earlier - ABC News (go.com)

And contrary to your thoughts.... " perp is a Muslim that killed white people."  

I think you've shown us all we need to see.

 
 
 
MonsterMash
Sophomore Participates
4.5.2  MonsterMash  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @4.5.1    3 weeks ago

He was born in Syria, do you think he's a Christian?

 
 
 
MrFrost
Masters Principal
4.5.3  MrFrost  replied to  MonsterMash @4.5.2    3 weeks ago

He was born in Syria, do you think he's a Christian?

There are Christians in every country on the planet. Christians are prone to violence just like any other religion.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
4.5.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @4.5.1    3 weeks ago

21 years old? From my "vast" knowledge of mental illness I believe schizophrenia begins to manifest at around that age

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.5.5  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @4.5.1    3 weeks ago

He had a previous conviction for assault which here would deny him purchasing any firearm.

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
4.5.6  FLYNAVY1  replied to  MonsterMash @4.5.2    3 weeks ago

Timothy McVeigh was born in the US and into the Catholic church MM.... What's you're point?

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.5.7  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Trout Giggles @4.5.4    3 weeks ago

Sometimes it develops earlier.

 
 
 
MrFrost
Masters Principal
4.6  MrFrost  replied to  Greg Jones @4    3 weeks ago

No wonder it took so long to name the perp.

It's called verifying the reporting. I know, fox news just blurts shit out without checking sources, (especially that worthless hack Sean Hannity), but in the real world, the police want to make sure that the information they pass along is accurate. 

We'll skip over the fact that you have no right to know anything and the police divulging information is a courtesy. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
4.6.1  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  MrFrost @4.6    3 weeks ago

Now that we know his name, it should never be mentioned again by the media so that he can't get his 15 mins.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
5  Trout Giggles    3 weeks ago

I'm sure those 10 dead people are fake, too

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
Masters Guide
6  Thrawn 31    3 weeks ago

Ahhh, glad we are getting back to normal. Weekly mass shootings, political grandstanding, and of course total pieces of shit claiming that it’s all fake.

America, I missed you lol.

 
 
 
Freefaller
PhD Guide
6.1  Freefaller  replied to  Thrawn 31 @6    3 weeks ago

With all due condolences to the friends and family's of those killed I was thinking the same thing.  This is just a return to normal, while Covid slowed things down for awhile I think I read somewhere else that there has been 8 mass shootings prior to this one this year.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7  Buzz of the Orient    3 weeks ago

It will be interesting to know what the motive was in this case - after all, opinions about the motive in the spa murder case have almost caused a revolution, so I wonder if what it is will ever be released, or the truth told as to what it was. 

 
 
 
evilgenius
Professor Participates
7.1  evilgenius  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7    3 weeks ago
It will be interesting to know what the motive was in this case...

One of his family members said he's been paranoid people were watching him. This coupled with some anger issues made for someone that needed treatment, but never got any, if these ideas hold. Hopefully we will get some answers since the guy is still alive, for now. I'm hoping they have him on suicide watch until after trial.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  evilgenius @7.1    3 weeks ago

If his family members knew he had such anger issues and knew he went and bought those guns, and did not report that to the police or FBI, then in my opinion they are COMPLICIT in those murders.  They are most likely just trying now to build up an insanity defence for him. 

 
 
 
evilgenius
Professor Participates
7.1.2  evilgenius  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.1    3 weeks ago

There are thousands of people in the US with mental health issues AND guns. Only a tiny fraction of them are dangerous to themselves or others. Who and how are we to determine which is which? There have also been many killers who have shown no history of mental illness before they gun down multiple people. The Biden Admin is now pushing to allow LEOs to enter a home and remove guns without a warrant. I support sensible gun control, but that goes over the line. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.3  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  evilgenius @7.1.2    3 weeks ago

A tiny fraction of 320 million or so of dangerouis people with guns is enough for me to worry about my son and his family in Wisconsin, and enough to keep me from stepping foot into the USA to see my grandchildren.  What happened in Boulder is proof enough that you never know when and where something can happen. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
7.1.4  seeder  JohnRussell  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.3    3 weeks ago

No other country glorified gunplay in its national mythologies the way the U.S. did. 

The gunslinger, Billy The Kid, Wild Bill Hickock, Wyatt Earp, Bonnie and Clyde ,John Dillinger, Elliot Ness, Sgt York, Annie Oakley, and on and on, heroes and villains who used guns to get what they wanted or to perform as heroes. And of course John Wayne and Clint Eastwood and Rambo on the fictional side. 

Background checks and restrictions on gun shows will not stop random shootings. There are far too many guns that pass hands by other methods. And far too many guns already in the hands of potentially unstable people. Gun laws would stop some of the random killings, but they dont happen everyday and there would be no way to know how effective gun laws had been at preventing shootings other than over the course of decades not months or years. 

The only thing that can stop shootings is for people to stop thinking that shooting someone is a legitimate way to alleviate one's own psychological pain or shortcomings. And there has to be an end to "gun love". I'm afraid that is a far off miniscule hope. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
7.1.5  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  evilgenius @7.1.2    3 weeks ago

It only took "one tiny fraction" to wipe out the lives of ten innocent people.

 
 
 
evilgenius
Professor Participates
7.1.6  evilgenius  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @7.1.5    3 weeks ago
It only took "one tiny fraction" to wipe out the lives of ten innocent people.

As tragic as that is. And it is tragic. It is my opinion that we would be far better spending time and energy on mental health than we spend arguing on gun control. Again I'm not against sensible gun control. I just don't think taking guns from people without due process is fair or legal.

 
 
 
evilgenius
Professor Participates
7.1.7  evilgenius  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.3    3 weeks ago
A tiny fraction of 320 million or so of dangerouis people with guns is enough for me to worry about my son and his family in Wisconsin, and enough to keep me from stepping foot into the USA to see my grandchildren.  What happened in Boulder is proof enough that you never know when and where something can happen. 

I'm not saying there aren't issues and there aren't some good ideas. I'm only saying that we can't take away rights from people without some sort of due process. I live in WI and I don't have a problem walking down the street every night to walk my dog. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.8  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  evilgenius @7.1.7    3 weeks ago

Well, the people in the Boulder supermarket were just doing everyday things as well. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.9  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  evilgenius @7.1.6    3 weeks ago

 I think that American people and Canadian people are fairly the same when it comes to mental hearlth, so how do you explain that the rate of gun deaths in America is about 8 times that of the rate of gun deaths in Canada.  By "rate" I mean per 100,000 population.  

Rate Of Gun Violence Deaths In U.S. Is Higher Than Much Of ...

1 day ago · That was more than eight times as high as the   rate   in   Canada , which had 0.47   deaths   per 100,000 people — and nearly 100 times higher than in the United Kingdom, which had 0.04   deaths
 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.10  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.4    3 weeks ago

It's too late.  It was too late as soon as the 2nd Amendment was passed. Because of the glorification of the rights and freedoms of the American people there will NEVER be an effective control of guns in the USA.  The only solution imaginable would be to issue guns and ammunition to every person 12 and older in the USA and eventually the population might be reduced to only those who DON'T want to kill anyone. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.11  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.10    3 weeks ago

what a spectacularly ignorant "solution".

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.12  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.11    3 weeks ago

Ignorant?  Okay, YOU tell me how you think the rate of gun deaths in America could be reduced to the rate in the country right next door to the north where the people are no different than Americans in just about every way, instead of being comparable to the rate of gun deaths in primitive third world countries.  Are Americans willing to give up their guns like the Australians and New Zealanders did?

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.13  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.12    3 weeks ago

giving guns to everyone over 12 is certainly no help, surely you can recognize how ignorant that is.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.14  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.12    3 weeks ago

and since you can't tell how ignorant it is, I am here to tell you it is ignorant.

smh

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.15  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.13    3 weeks ago

And OBVIOUSLY, to any NORMAL person my suggestion was entirely satirical.  However, I notice that YOU have NO SOLUTION or even a SUGGESTION save for useless critical comments. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.16  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.15    3 weeks ago

I notice YOU didn't provide any solutions, and you seem to be the one so worried about murder rates in a country you don't even live in 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.17  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.16    3 weeks ago

Let's see YOUR solution, since you DO live there.  I worry because my son and his family live in Wisconsin, and his profession makes him a prime target for white supremicist neo-Nazis.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.18  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.15    3 weeks ago

here's something that could help.

if a gun is used in the commission of any crime, even if it isn't fired, an automatic 10 year sentence added on, without the possibility of early release.

possession of any gum without a license, 10 years prison.

no dropping of any gun charges, ever.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.19  Texan1211  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.18    3 weeks ago

real solutions, not smart-alec comments that do ZERO for anyone or anything

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.20  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.17    3 weeks ago

do you have any solutions?

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.21  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.20    3 weeks ago

Well, congratulations, you DO have a suggestion that would at least be a start, although I'm sure there are members here who would call you a traitor for even such a minimal abrogation of their liberties.  As for me having a valid solution - no, taking into consideration your 2nd Amendment, JohnRussell's opinion about the historical gun use in America, the gun-love mindset of the American people and their resistance to ANY abrogation of their rights, I don't have a solution, especially growing up and living most of my life where the rate of gun deaths is 1/8th the rate of gun deaths in the USA, and presently living where almost NOBODY has guns, it's hard for me to come up with a realistic solution.  I have never owned a gun other than a water pistol and a cap gun when I was a kid, and I never had any desire to own one, EVEN THOUGH I was the rifle marksman target shooting champion of my whole school. I was the rifle Robin Hood - perfect bulls eyes in every target, and I STILL had no desire whatsoever to use a gun outside of the school target shooting. 

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
7.1.22  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.18    3 weeks ago
possession of any gum without a license, 10 years prison.

 no wrigleys with out the double mint twins being aware.....

 not all states require a lic to possess a gun, thus it would be better to say no one that is a prohibited person under federal law 

 first 2 you mention are already federal law and carry pretty much the same penalties give or take some years , its that last thing you mentioned that becomes the problem with enforcing the other 2, gun charges are dropped in the plea bargaining process to get a guilty plea. without having to have a lengthy trial.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.23  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @7.1.22    3 weeks ago

I say no plea bargains on gun charges.

I also would not allow sentences for guns to be served along with the sentence for the crime. make them do that time after their other sentence us served.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.24  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.21    3 weeks ago

wtf happened to your 

IMPASSE

???

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.25  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.21    3 weeks ago

my solutions don't infringe on any legal gun owner's rights.

Since you think they do. please explain.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.26  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.24    3 weeks ago

I changed my mind.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.27  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.25    3 weeks ago

I'll bet there are a lot of gun owners who THINK they infringe on their rights, whether or not they do.  I would venture to say that from the feelings stated by gun owners that I've seen over the years, it was a good guess on my part. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.28  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.26    3 weeks ago

good, then perhaps you can answer post 7.1.25

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
7.1.29  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.23    3 weeks ago

so consecutive terms , and not concurrent terms of penalty , i could agree with that.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.30  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @7.1.29    3 weeks ago

yep. and even if they plea bargain, it would have no effect on the 10 year gun sentence.

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
7.1.31  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.30    3 weeks ago

again , agreeable.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.32  Texan1211  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.30    3 weeks ago

I would go as far as making a 2nd gun offense an automatic 25 year sentence

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
7.1.33  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.32    3 weeks ago

well the first offence and sentence would already make them federally a felon , thus a prohibited person.

 usually anything that one has to serve more than 365 days ( 1 year) constitutes a felony / felon.

 
 
 
charger 383
PhD Quiet
7.1.34  charger 383  replied to  JohnRussell @7.1.4    3 weeks ago

I agree with you, especially this "for people to stop thinking that shooting   someone is a legitimate way to alleviate one's own psychological pain or   shortcomings "  

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
7.1.35  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Texan1211 @7.1.28    3 weeks ago

7.1.27 was in reply to 7.1.25.  If you're unhappy with my answer, that's it and I really don't intend to continue replying to your prodding which I do not believe is in the spirit of dialogue, but is intentionally becoming harrassment.  

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.37  Texan1211  replied to  Mark in Wyoming @7.1.33    3 weeks ago

yes, but we all know there will be some dumbass repeat offenders.

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.38  Texan1211  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @7.1.35    3 weeks ago

Meh.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
PhD Guide
7.1.39  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  evilgenius @7.1.6    3 weeks ago

If his family had spoken up or gotten the help he needed, this might not have happened.  Also, a judge struck down a ban on assault weapons before he bought his.  IMO, that judge is also culpable.

 
 
 
Just Jim NC TttH
Junior Expert
7.1.40  Just Jim NC TttH  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @7.1.39    3 weeks ago

You do realize that the weapon he used was a hand gun modified to look and act like a rifle right? I don't think the judge's stupid action would have changed the weapon. But I'm probably wrong

 
 
 
Texan1211
PhD Principal
7.1.41  Texan1211  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @7.1.39    3 weeks ago

a judge is culpable for following the law?

 
 
 
Mark in Wyoming
Professor Silent
7.1.42  Mark in Wyoming   replied to  Just Jim NC TttH @7.1.40    3 weeks ago

thing i think is funny/interesting is that most times it is a pistol /handgun round that is turned into a rifle , think cowboy action shooting , guys compete with both a handgun and a rifle , usually both chambered for the same round .

now the ar pistol , i have a different opinion on , mainly because i put ar's together in the past from a pile of parts , the issue i found with the pistol version was the AR buffer system , there is no feasable way to get rid of that part of the gun so that it doesnt stick out the back in some way that is inconvienient .

 Now rifle cals used in handguns is not a new concept , the current platform I do like is made by thompson center , one can buy the whole firearm in any desired cal , in rifle or pistol form, or just the parts to make what one desires ( imagine a 30.06 or .300 H&H mag pistol?) and all it takes is changing out the barrel and the stocks. eat your wheaties people , your gonna need it .

But one can still run afoul of BATFE regulations and the law if one isnt careful and or up to speed on the regulations.

 Example , i bought a TC pistol in this platform , but decided i needed another rifle for family to hunt with during big game season, no problem just order the rifle barrel and stocks , and issue solved or so i thought.

In BATFE regulations there is some little known and obscure and sometimes hidden things , i could legally change the pistol into a rifle  and back, but it is illegal to turn a rifle sold as a rifle into a pistol. how do they tell? they go back to the initial purchase forms and see if it was sold as a rifle , or a pistol. and if BATFE wants to be anal retentive , legally they have you . 

 another thing they can get one on is if i change the stocks alone from pistol to rifle but leave the 15 inch or shorter barrel on it , it then becomes a short barreled rifle , which is subject to the $200 dollar tax stamp and federal lic  and background check. wonder how many people have done that without thinking?

thats just some " nice to know info" .

point im making is that whether a frame , in the ARs case the lower receiver which is only part when completely finished that requires a serial number( reasoning use to be it is the one part that if not present , one does not have a functioning gun.) all the rest are just parts .

 the serial number and how even that one critical part and how it was initially sold ( pistol or rifle frame ) will dictate what laws can be enforced on the individual. 

 
 
 
Hal A. Lujah
Professor Principal
8  Hal A. Lujah    3 weeks ago

'Nobody died. I was there for an actual shooting. This was 100% fake fake.'"

I was there for an actual shooting?  How is this relevant to anything about this shooting?

 
 
 
freepress
Freshman Silent
9  freepress    3 weeks ago

The police officer who died and his entire department and family beg to differ on that crazy conspiracy.

 
 
 
MrFrost
Masters Principal
9.1  MrFrost  replied to  freepress @9    3 weeks ago

Obviously. But the point is that these conspiracy nuts know that all they have to do is make the claim and their fellow idiots will believe every word. It's a fact free world they live in. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
9.1.1  FLYNAVY1  replied to  MrFrost @9.1    3 weeks ago

It's a fact free world they live in. 

Unfortunately that fact free world in impinging on the reality most of us want and do live in.  It has greatly infected the GOP and it's followers.

 
 
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