Trump threatens retaliation against countries that issue travel warnings against the US

  
Via:  tessylo  •  2 months ago  •  229 comments

Trump threatens retaliation against countries that issue travel warnings against the US

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T



Politics

Trump threatens retaliation against countries that issue travel warnings against the US



aaaa2f80-fa39-11e8-8fbf-da9c00b689c4   David Jackson, USA TODAY   25 minutes ago  






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WASHINGTON – President Donald Trump threatened undefined retaliation Friday against countries and organizations that   issue travel warnings on the United States   because of gun violence.

"If they did that, we'd just reciprocate," Trump said during a wide-ranging impromptu gaggle with reporters at the White House, en route to fundraisers in New York.

He added: "We are a very reciprocal nation with me as the head. When somebody does something negative to us in terms of a country, we do it to them."

Amnesty International   and a growing list of countries have begun issuing warnings about travel to the United States because of gun violence, including mass shootings over the weekend in El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio.

Know the risks:   Travel advisories by country

Warnings:   Amnesty International issues warning about travel to US amid 'high levels of gun violence'

Warnings, which are of varying degrees of intensity, have come from a list of countries that include Uruguay, Venezuela, Japan, Germany, Ireland, Canada and New Zealand.

In an advisory issued Wednesday, Amnesty International said: "Depending on the traveler's gender identity, race, country of origin, ethnic background, or sexual orientation, they may be at higher risk of being targeted with gun violence, and should plan accordingly."

Trump:   Congress discussing 'meaningful' gun background checks, NRA will have input

Trump did not specify any particular country, or what he might do to retaliate.

Trump also said he received another "beautiful letter" from Kim Jong Un, in which the North Korea leader protested recent "war games" – joint military exercises – between the United States and South Korea.

Trump said he sympathized with Kim's complaint, saying he "never liked" the exercises because "I don't like paying for" them. He said he approved the recent round of exercises because he thought they were necessary.

Trump also questioned whether September trade talks would take place between the United States and China, as they are locked in a renewed tariff war.

Trump and the NRA:   Trump spoke with NRA CEO Wayne LaPierre during Dayton, El Paso trip, faces opposition on gun background checks

While both sides still want a trade agreement, Trump said, "we'll see whether or not we keep our meeting in September ... We are winning and winning big."

The president said the nation's children should not worry as they head back to school this fall, even amid a spate of mass shootings in recent years.

"They have nothing to fear,' he said. "They have nothing to worry about."

This article originally appeared on USA TODAY:   Trump threatens retaliation over travel warnings against US


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Tessylo
1  seeder  Tessylo    2 months ago

He added: "We are a very reciprocal nation with me as the head. When somebody does something negative to us in terms of a country, we do it to them."

We are a very petty, vengeful, spiteful, small minded, arrogant, bully, coward nation with me as the head.

What exactly will that be that 'we do it to them?'

You're just talking out of your big fat ass as usual.  

 
 
 
CB
1.1  CB   replied to  Tessylo @1    2 months ago

Donald Trump ("me as head") keeps treating this nation of 300 plus million people as some pet project of his. Or, Trump U.S.A.

Nothing can be farther from the truth. This experiment on the people of this country is unworkablewe are not a private enterprise of Trump Corporation.

Long after this character is dismissed, this nation and its people will have to make amends to directly and indirectly involved nations of the world touched by "a very petty, vengeful, spiteful, small minded, arrogant, bully, coward" named Trump!

Independent voters help us reclaim the high moral ground. These first four years of Trump is only the primer. Allow him four more years and he will unleash "full frontal" Trump upon the lot of us.

 
 
 
WallyW
1.1.1  WallyW  replied to  CB @1.1    2 months ago

he will unleash "full frontal" Trump upon the lot of us.

I certainly hope so. jrSmiley_49_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
CB
1.1.2  CB   replied to  WallyW @1.1.1    2 months ago

Figures.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
1.1.3  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @1.1    2 months ago

He is carrying out his duties as the president of this country. It’s part of his Constitutional responsibities to react to the policies of other nations and international organizations in defense of our nation and its interest.

thank you President Trump for not being a wimp like Obama

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
1.1.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  CB @1.1    2 months ago
we are not a private enterprise of Trump Corporation.

I wish someone would drill that into his thick skull

 
 
 
Tessylo
1.1.5  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @1.1.3    2 months ago

It's not his duty to shit all over everything.

President Obama was a diplomat.

This 'president' is a sniveling, whining, bitchy, petulant, scumbag piece of shit  who doesn't act, he reacts, cannot take any criticism whatever it is.

 
 
 
Ronin2
1.1.6  Ronin2  replied to  Tessylo @1.1.5    2 months ago
President Obama was a diplomat.

President Obama was a doormat. Just listen to the Democratic presidential candidates.

 
 
 
CB
1.1.7  CB   replied to  Ronin2 @1.1.6    2 months ago

Well, we do know this, those candidates for president are men and women under duress to break out from a candidate glut. One can forgive them their intrigue statements as long as it does not go too long or overboard. Of course, any such statements delivered would become canon fodder for republican and conservative talking points. And so here you are as 'promised.'

 
 
 
livefreeordie
1.1.8  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @1.1.7    2 months ago

8.1.16   livefreeordie   replied to  CB @ 8.1.10     an hour ago

No one has any business seeing Trump OR ANY other Americans tax returns.   We who believe in the Constitution and liberty will fight you radical America hating leftists all the way on this

releasing and making public someone’s tax return without their permission is a FELONY. It is also a FELONY to solicit the illegal release of someone’s tax return without their permission 

(a) Returns and return information

(1) Federal employees and other persons

It shall be unlawful for any officer or employee of the United States or any person described in section 6103(n) (or an officer or employee of any such person ), or any former officer or employee, willfully to disclose to any person , except as authorized in this title, any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)). Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable upon conviction by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution, and if such offense is committed by any officer or employee of the United States, he shall, in addition to any other punishment, be dismissed from office or discharged from employment upon conviction for such offense.

(2) State and other employees

It shall be unlawful for any person (not described in paragraph (1)) willfully to disclose to any person , except as authorized in this title, any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b) ) acquired by him or another person under subsection (d), (i)(1)(C), (3)(B)(i), or (7)(A)(ii), (k)(10), (13), or (14), (l)(6), (7), (8), (9), (10), (12), (15), (16), (19), (20), or (21) or (m)(2), (4), (5), (6), or (7) of section 6103 or under section 6104(c). Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.

(3) Other persons

It shall be unlawful for any person to whom any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b) ) is disclosed in a manner unauthorized by this title thereafter willfully to print or publish in any manner not provided by law any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.

(4) Solicitation

It shall be unlawful for any person willfully to offer any item of material value in exchange for any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)) and to receive as a result of such solicitation any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/7213

 
 
 
CB
1.1.9  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @1.1.8    2 months ago

See @8.1.20. That's all.

 
 
 
Dulay
1.1.10  Dulay  replied to  livefreeordie @1.1.3    2 months ago
He is carrying out his duties as the president of this country. It’s part of his Constitutional responsibities to react to the policies of other nations and international organizations in defense of our nation and its interest.

How does kneejerk retaliation 'defend our nation and it's interest? 

Perhaps you should review all of the countries that our own State Dept. has put out travel advisories on. The list includes the United Kingdom, Germany, France, Spain, Italy, Denmark, China and on and on and on. 

I suppose you think that it's the duty of all of the leaders of those countries to retaliate against the US in kind.  

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
1.1.11  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Ronin2 @1.1.6    2 months ago

Obama was a appeaser through and through and certainly no diplomat! Diplomats do not trade one deserter for 5 terrorists.

 
 
 
MrFrost
1.1.12  MrFrost  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @1.1.11    2 months ago
Obama was a appeaser through and through and certainly no diplomat!

Come on Ed.. Obama was great at diplomacy...bush and trump? Not so much...

512

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/09/how-the-world-views-the-u-s-and-its-president-in-9-charts/

In any case, my best to you and yours. 

 
 
 
nightwalker
1.1.13  nightwalker  replied to  livefreeordie @1.1.3    2 months ago

Yes, thank you trump, for insulting all out allies and sucking up to our enemies especially dictators, especially Putin. Thank you for fanning up white supremacists so we don't have to import terrorists, we have our own, thanks.

Thanks for a tariff war with what was one of our biggest trade partners, and for threatening all the other major trading partners (and some smaller ones I imagine) or slapping tariffs on them too. If trump dropped that stuff tomorrow, China was looking for and probably found new trading partners as well as freeing up a lot of land for crops, I don't think they'll ever quite trust the U.S. again so I don't think they'll rush back with open arms saying "all is forgiven."

Oh, a special thank you for NOT signing to renew the SALT (Strategic Arms Limitation Treaties) just as Bolton and Putin wanted. You let the short range and intermediate range missile development treaties lapse, just the long range agreement to go then we can go back to the glorious cold war and spend billons or trillions on better ways to sterilize the Planet. We can always cut social programs, because the Country can't cover it with taxes.

Maybe the tariffs will help but that's all being paid by the U.S. China has refused to pay it down even a little. We can always borrow, if we can find enough suckers.

Guess the uber-rich conservatives final got their blanket sales tax and I'm sure they put in enough loopholes so it doesn't bother them, just the less wealthy on down.

Thanks for a record number of LIES like "Who's going to pay for the wall?!? Mexico!! Yayyyyy."

Thanks for making the U.S. look soooo good to the rest of the world as a nation ruled by a big mouthed overgrown mental defective child  and a toilet twitter-warrior.

There's a whole lot more to "thank" trump for, do you want the rest of the list?  Would take a while.

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

So, thanks a whole lot trump, I'm sure you can drive the Nation deeper in the dirt if you or Putin can come up with some more plans.

 
 
 
nightwalker
1.1.14  nightwalker  replied to  livefreeordie @1.1.3    2 months ago

He had you when you heard the words "religious freedom," because you translated it to mean more freedom for YOU to run your flock.

 
 
 
Krishna
1.1.15  Krishna  replied to  livefreeordie @1.1.8    2 months ago
releasing and making public someone’s tax return without their permission is a FELONY.

LOL!

BTW-- have you, by any chance, considered buying Greenland-- you might find it calms you down a bit!

(One can only hope...)

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2  Vic Eldred  replied to  Tessylo @1    2 months ago

I doubt very much if any country would issue a travel ban against the US. I would love to see it happen so the President can retaliate, especially since the SCOTUS has ruled that he has every right to do it!!!

BTW, the liberals at Amnesty International need to get over to Hong Kong - If they have the guts!

 
 
 
katrix
1.2.1  katrix  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2    2 months ago
I doubt very much if any country would issue a travel ban against the US.

Why shouldn't they? We issue travel bans against other countries, and nobody seems to get their panties in a wad.  Why is it that Trump is such a snowflake and can't take it?

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
1.2.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2    2 months ago

Not bans but warnings:

Warnings, which are of varying degrees of intensity, have come from a list of countries that include Uruguay, Venezuela, Japan, Germany, Ireland, Canada and New Zealand.
 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2.3  Vic Eldred  replied to  katrix @1.2.1    2 months ago
Why shouldn't they?

Every country should have that right.

We issue travel bans against other countries, and nobody seems to get their panties in a wad.  Why is it that Trump is such a snowflake and can't take it?

Do you recall what happened when Trump issued his temporary travel ban? Let me refresh everyone's memory. The President had just come into office. He wanted to suspend entry of those whose countries (some were failed states) which did not meet adjudication standards under US immigration law for 90 days. In other words until the US government could do proper vetting. That order was given in January of 2017 with an FBI spy in the White House and plenty of anti Trump staffers throughout the government. Before security officials even had the orders at the nation's airports, the ACLU was there trying to block it, there were protests there as well and Courts, including the Ninth Circuit Court issues legal interventions. All acting with breakneck speed.  The issue had to eventually go to the SCOTUS, after a long, long process.

On June 26, 2018 the SCOTUS upheld the President's executive order - long after the President's 90 day process was over. (A year and a half after the ban was supposed to go into effect!   And we learned what we already knew - Trump did have that right!!!) Liberals were delighted with their flagrant subterfuge and proclaimed he had his 90 days to fix it!

And that is why I want to see a nice travel ban put in place!  Make my day!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2.4  Vic Eldred  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.2.2    2 months ago
Not bans but warnings:

Yup, that's what it says alright!

 
 
 
katrix
1.2.5  katrix  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2.3    2 months ago

You're talking about banning people from coming here. This is about countries issuing a travel warning, to their own citizens, warning them about coming to the U.S. We do that all the time - yet Trump now says he'll retaliate if someone else does it to us.

Sorry, but the man is a snowflake.

 
 
 
Raven Wing
1.2.6  Raven Wing  replied to  katrix @1.2.5    2 months ago
Sorry, but the man is a snowflake.

Trumps acts as if America is the only safe country in the world simply because he is President. Just taking a glance at the recent shootings and other crimes committed in the US proves that what the President thinks and what is reality are obviously two different things. The US is not as perfect as Trump and his minions would like to think simply because he sits in the WH.

Trump himself is one of the biggest perpetrators of hate in this country, and other countries are not blind to that fact, even if Trump worshipers are.

 
 
 
nightwalker
1.2.7  nightwalker  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2    2 months ago

Oh goody, more wonderful retaliations. What fun! I guess trump will just put it out as "ok, nobody go to any other country, everybody just stay home, NOBODY in, NOBODY out."

Other countries can make advisory warnings (and they have a fairly good reason) and I don't think they were asking permission from trump.

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2.8  Vic Eldred  replied to  nightwalker @1.2.7    2 months ago
Oh goody, more wonderful retaliations.

Nah, more like long overdue treatment, starting with Somalia. The vetting of refugees still isn't what it should be!

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
1.2.9  Trout Giggles  replied to  nightwalker @1.2.7    2 months ago

Does this mean I can't go to Aruba next year?

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
1.2.10  Trout Giggles  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2.8    2 months ago

You go right ahead and spend your summer vacation in Somalia.

I don;t think you're paying attention to nightwalker or katrix and what they're posting

 
 
 
Jack_TX
1.2.11  Jack_TX  replied to  katrix @1.2.5    2 months ago
This is about countries issuing a travel warning, to their own citizens, warning them about coming to the U.S. We do that all the time - yet Trump now says he'll retaliate if someone else does it to us.

Frankly he can issue whatever he wants.  Americans are infamous for not paying attention and famous for refusing to be told what to do....so nobody's going to follow it anyway.

 
 
 
Tessylo
1.2.12  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2    2 months ago

How moronic.  Why would any country want to send their people here to be gunned down in the streets by a right wing domestic terrorist?

 
 
 
Tessylo
1.2.13  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  katrix @1.2.5    2 months ago

'Sorry, but the man is a snowflake.'

He's a whining, sniveling, bully, cowardly turd.  

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2.14  Vic Eldred  replied to  Tessylo @1.2.12    2 months ago
Why would any country want to send their people here to be gunned down in the streets by a right wing domestic terrorist?

Mexico at one time had a lot of their younger people unemployed. You may have noted that the migrants themselves have never let up - THEY WANT TO BE IN AMERICA!

It sounds like you want to leave?  The border works both ways, though you'd never know it!

 
 
 
CB
1.2.15  CB   replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2.14    2 months ago

You R leaving? Tiempo de FIESTA!!!

 
 
 
MrFrost
1.2.16  MrFrost  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2.8    2 months ago

Nah, more like long overdue treatment, starting with Somalia. The vetting of refugees still isn't what it should be!

Well, it used to be a 6 month vetting process, Obama increased that to over two years. Oh yea, I forgot, he was for open borders. /s

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2.17  Vic Eldred  replied to  CB @1.2.15    2 months ago

Lol...Iv'e got my country back, it's your turn!

 
 
 
Vic Eldred
1.2.18  Vic Eldred  replied to  MrFrost @1.2.16    2 months ago
Well, it used to be a 6 month vetting process, Obama increased that to over two years.

Oh how soon they forget!  It was under Obama that the FBI said they couldn't properly do vetting:

"WASHINGTON — The FBI does not have a way to properly vet incoming Syrian refugees and the Federal Bureau of Investigation said so at a  House Homeland Security  committee hearing in February.

Officials from the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), FBI and the National Counterterrorism Center (NCTC) told committee members that an intelligence gap exists about terrorists who joined the fight in the civil war happening in Syria and that more than 20,000 foreign fighters have joined the conflict.
“We don’t have it under control,” Mr. Michael Steinback, Assistant Director for the FBI told the committee.  “Absolutely, we’re doing the best we can. If I were to say that we had it under control, then I would say I know of every single individual traveling. I don’t. And I don’t know every person there and I don’t know everyone coming back. So it’s not even close to being under control.”

Members also asked about the Obama administration’s proposal to accept thousands of Syrian refugees into the United States by the end of 2016 through an expedited refugee program.

Texas Republican Rep. Michael McCaul, chairman of the Homeland Security committee, asked if the agencies present concurred that “bringing in Syrian refugees pose a greater risk to Americans?”

“Yes, I’m concerned,” said Steinback. “We’ll have to go take a look at those lists and go through all of those intelligence holdings and be very careful to try and identify connections to foreign terrorist groups.”

McCaul, along with Subcommittee Chairmen Peter King, R-N.Y., and Candice Miller, R-Mich., previously sent a  letter  to the White House on the Syrian refugee plan.

“Screening these refugees is not a task to be taken lightly,” McCaul and others wrote to the president at the time. “As we saw with previous Iraqi refugees…the lack of a thorough security screening process can result in individuals with terrorist ties exploiting the refugee program to resettle in the U.S. homeland.”

https://dailycaller.com/2015/09/11/flashback-fbi-no-way-to-vet-incoming-syrian-refugees-video/

 
 
 
Tessylo
1.2.19  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Vic Eldred @1.2.18    2 months ago

The Daily Caller  jrSmiley_91_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
nightwalker
1.2.20  nightwalker  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.2.9    2 months ago

That's right, stay home and knit pasta or something useful 'stead of running wild all over the world.

jrSmiley_9_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
2  Ed-NavDoc    2 months ago

Actually, it sounds more like he is saying he will not allow other countries to walk all over us like his predecessor did.

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.1  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2    2 months ago

How did other countries walk all over us?

This dictator in chief is the one who is letting other countries walk all over us like North Korea and Russia.  

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.1.1  livefreeordie  replied to  Tessylo @2.1    2 months ago

Obama was the biggest wimp as a president in defending America in our history.

Trump has strengthened us against Russia far more than Obama or Bush

Record oil and gas exports hurts Russia economically 

Strengthening our military weakens Russian threats

a strong US economy weakens Russian opposition 

improved relationships with Poland, South Korea, Israel, and Saudi Arabia weakens Russia

our military presence in Syria (which Obama disliked) weakens Russia in Syria

in every way that matters, Trump has been tougher on Russia than Obama

Trump has done more to improve the situation with N Korea than any wet dream Obama ever had.

 
 
 
Ronin2
2.1.2  Ronin2  replied to  Tessylo @2.1    2 months ago
This dictator in chief is the one who is letting other countries walk all over us like North Korea and Russia.  

Dictator in chief, sorry you must have Trump confused with Obama.

With North Korea that makes him no different than any other President.

Russia? What has Trump done to benefit Russia? Troops on the ground and still in Syria. Sanctions increased and still in place. Border countries around Russia still being prodded to flip to pro western governments. TDDS is the only thing that Trump has given Russia- and that is a gift from the Democrats.

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.1.3  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @2.1.1    2 months ago
All I have to say to your ridiculous claims about this bully in chief 'president' is as follows:
jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.1.4  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Ronin2 @2.1.2    2 months ago
'Russia? What has Trump done to benefit Russia?'

Not imposing sanctions.

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.1.5  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @2.1.1    2 months ago
Trump has strengthened us against Russia far more than Obama or Bush

Are you fucking serious? He refused to impose sanctions on Russia after they attacked our election process and has literally not spent one thin dime on protecting our election process in 2020. Trump has done NOTHING to protect us from russia's aggression. NOTHING! 

 
 
 
CB
2.1.6  CB   replied to  MrFrost @2.1.5    2 months ago

Actually the Trump Administration was compelled by Congress (both houses) to lay on heavier sanctions. Trump personally was against those additional sanctions, but they are on today. This is what I can locate  on the quick :

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/ 2018/03 /trump-finally-imposes-russia-sanctions-that-congress-ordered-months-ago/

Although there maybe some timing and other issues with Russia and sanctions. Seems to always be 'something' when Trump is involved.

 
 
 
nightwalker
2.1.7  nightwalker  replied to  Tessylo @2.1.4    2 months ago
'Russia? What has Trump done to benefit Russia?'

Not imposing sanctions.

Oh he did better then that, he REMOVED some sanctions that congress put on Russia, once within 48 hours after Congress voted it in. By royal decree, of course.

 
 
 
WallyW
2.2  WallyW  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2    2 months ago
he will not allow other countries to walk all over us like his predecessor did
Yep!  The only US president* known more for his appeasing and apologizing, than any worthwhile legacy
 
 
 
CB
2.3  CB   replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2    2 months ago

We have the mental wealth of other nations. Shut that off, rebrand this country as the place not to be unless are "a very petty, vengeful, spiteful, small minded, arrogant, bully" and watch what manner of characters from across the globe beat a path here and 'knock' for entrance. Get the mental image: That image may be your idea of America - question is: How many others desire us to be that place in the world in say fifty years!

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.1  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @2.3    2 months ago

I’m fine with it

 
 
 
CB
2.3.2  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.1    2 months ago

Well, you and I may not be around in fifty years. So, try again.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.3  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @2.3.2    2 months ago

I absolutely know I won’t be around in 50 years. But it’s not relevant to my position on America first

 
 
 
CB
2.3.4  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.3    2 months ago

Well, you sir are one man in a sea of people. Thankfully, this is so. Your desires for this nation play around the margins. Better to wade out into the middle, because that is where life gets interestingly real and thoughtful.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.5  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @2.3.4    2 months ago

You aren’t in the middle. You hold extreme leftist views on politics, culture, and theology

 
 
 
TᵢG
2.3.6  TᵢG  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.5    2 months ago

What are CB's extreme leftist views?   Especially in theology ... an extreme leftist in theology?

Also, do you consider yourself in the middle, solid right or extreme right?

 
 
 
Don Overton
2.3.7  Don Overton  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.5    2 months ago

And you hold views that nothing more than the jokes you make up

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.8  livefreeordie  replied to  TᵢG @2.3.6    2 months ago

He is a huge supporter of Marxist statist all powerful government.

he believes the Constitution to be mere guidelines subject to popular trends

he follows liberation theology and rejects obedience to Christ and his teachings

My ideology doesn’t fit exactly in any right/left description, although I’m mostly to the right.  

I’m a Christian Minarchist (a distinct type of libertarianism) who believes govt should be as small as possible. National defense, a uniform system of justice (court system), protection of creativity (patents), a uniform monetary system, and negotiation of treaties and trade. That is the legitimate function of our central govt. I oppose all drug laws, censorship, laws against prostitution, or laws on marriage and divorce. These are private moral issues and not the purview of government

Christian libertarianism describes the synthesis of Christian beliefs concerning free will, human nature, and God-given inalienable rights with libertarian political philosophy. It is also an ideology to the extent that its supporters promote their cause to others and join together as a movement. In contrast to the Christian left and the Christian right respectively, they believe charity and enforcement of personal-level morality should be the purview of the (voluntary) church and not the state. These responsibilities must not be abrogated, though any non-governmental organization (NGO) not publicly financed is free to pursue them as well.

 Secular libertarianism, socialism, fascism, and crony capitalism are strongly opposed, as is theocracy. The latter does not include merely being influenced by Christian concepts; whereas in a theocracy, government derives its powers from a divine or religious authority directly exercising governmental control. The use of force is never justified to achieve purely political, social, or religious goals, but is reserved solely to uphold natural rights.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.9  livefreeordie  replied to  Don Overton @2.3.7    2 months ago

I’ve never posted any jokes here, and certainly none “I’ve made up”

the grave threat to our nation and our liberties from the Democrats is no joking matter

 
 
 
TᵢG
2.3.10  TᵢG  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.8    2 months ago
He is a huge supporter of Marxist statist all powerful government.

CB is not a Marxist; that is ridiculous.  I have no sense that he seeks an all-powerful government.   Statism varies in intensity, but I presume you mean his is statist at the level of most liberals.  If so, then I think that is accurate.

he believes the Constitution to be mere guidelines subject to popular trends

That is a rather common left view; certainly not extreme.  

he follows liberation theology and rejects obedience to Christ and his teachings

I think CB would disagree with you on this assessment.

My ideology doesn’t fit exactly in any right/left description, although I’m mostly to the right.  

IMO you are very fringe right in terms of theology (e.g. belief that homosexuality is an abomination, hopefully this not accurate, much biblical inerrant literalism such as speaking in tongues, etc.).   Politically you seem to qualify as (right) libertarian (you do not object to homosexual marriage, right?).

 
 
 
CB
2.3.11  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.8    2 months ago
I’m a Christian Minarchist (a distinct type of libertarianism) who believes govt should be as small as possible. National defense, a uniform system of justice (court system), protection of creativity (patents), a uniform monetary system, and negotiation of treaties and trade. That is the legitimate function of our central govt. I oppose all drug laws, censorship, laws against prostitution, or laws on marriage and divorce. These are private moral issues and not the purview of government

Okay, small government 'icon' let's test this theory you have on display:

  1. In your fine and honorable opinion can a goodly Christian woman be a prostitute?
  2. Secondly, can an active prostitute serve under your leadership Church as a deaconess?
  3. Can a prostitute marry into your family as a prostitute?
  4. Can a prostitute sleep with your current significant other outside the 'marriage bed'?

A large grouping of homosexuals just took over local city council and its governance and have began to institute city-wide change. What do you do:

  1. Laud the new homosexual mayor and his/her council for accomplishing change they can believe in?
  2. Rise up! 'Water the tree of liberty,' with their swollen, bloated bodies?
  3. Move out of town to a new destination within one year?
 
 
 
CB
2.3.12  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.8    2 months ago
Christian libertarianism describes the synthesis of Christian beliefs concerning free will, human nature, and God-given inalienable rights with libertarian political philosophy. It is also an ideology to the extent that its supporters promote their cause to others and join together as a movement. In contrast to the Christian left and the Christian right respectively, they believe charity and enforcement of personal-level morality should be the purview of the (voluntary) church and not the state. These responsibilities must not be abrogated, though any non-governmental organization (NGO) not publicly financed is free to pursue them as well.

Methinks you see your worldview squarely listed in the middle of two religious extremes. That's interesting. And, thinking it makes it so how? Oh, and how does a liar, cheater, thief, and non-Christian Libertarian  like Donald Trump aid in holding this middle you SAY you are anchored?

 
 
 
CB
2.3.13  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.8    2 months ago
Secular libertarianism, socialism, fascism, and crony capitalism are strongly opposed, as is theocracy. The latter does not include merely being influenced by Christian concepts; whereas in a theocracy, government derives its powers from a divine or religious authority directly exercising governmental control. The use of force is never justified to achieve purely political, social, or religious goals, but is reserved solely to uphold natural rights.

Okay; cut the speechifying. Tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth:

Livefreeordie, do you today, or have you ever stated in the past, to any NT 'audience' that you have armament single or plural equivalent to armames of a small country or countries and you and a million of ex-military types and other folks, humans, and/or animals, will use said armaments on American soil if and when a time is deemed appropriate-or words to this effect?

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
2.3.14  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.9    2 months ago
I’ve never posted any jokes here,

Some of your comments have cracked me up.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.15  livefreeordie  replied to  TᵢG @2.3.10    2 months ago

It’s fringe to believe what Jesus clearly gave Noah, Moses, and the Disciples that fornication which is ALL sex outside of the marriage of a man and a woman is extreme.   Until just a few years ago, it was still the beliefs of most Americans

Of course I believe in and speak in tongues. It is clearly taught as one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit for believers.  That is the view held by 100s of millions of Christians.  More Christians and Catholics hold still to that teaching than those who don’t 

I object to homosexual marriage because Jesus and the Apostles condemned it.  My Minarchist beliefs are that I oppose all government involvement in marriage and divorce as was the nearl total practice in this country until 1927.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
2.3.16  livefreeordie  replied to  TᵢG @2.3.10    2 months ago

[Deleted]

 
 
 
TᵢG
2.3.17  TᵢG  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.15    2 months ago
It’s fringe to believe what Jesus clearly gave Noah, Moses, and the Disciples that fornication which is ALL sex outside of the marriage of a man and a woman is extreme.  

I cannot parse this sentence.   First, you have Jesus giving to Noah and Moses.   These individuals were dead before Jesus was born.   So what is going on here?

Removing the Noah and Moses reference, we have:  It's fringe to believe what Jesus clearly gave the Disciples that fornication which is ALL sex outside of the marriage of a man and a woman is extreme.

That seems to mean that it is fringe to believe that fornication is extreme.   Is that what you mean?   I would have expected you to write something like:  it is fringe to believe that fornication is not extreme.  That, however, is the opposite of what you wrote.

Of course I believe in and speak in tongues. 

Theologically it is extreme to truly believe that this is any more than a show.   It reflects biblical inerrancy and literalism.

That is the view held by 100s of millions of Christians. 

There are 2.2 billion Christian worldwide.   220 million would only be 10%.   

More Christians and Catholics hold still to that teaching than those who don’t 

Prove that; I do not believe that the majority of Christians (which includes Catholics by the way) believe that speaking in tongues is anything more than human beings pretending to be channels for auditory utterances by the Holy Spirit.

I object to homosexual marriage because Jesus and the Apostles condemned it.  My Minarchist beliefs are that I oppose all government involvement in marriage and divorce as was the nearl total practice in this country until 1927.

Yeah that is what I thought.   You are theologically against homosexuality (probably view it as an affront to God) but you do not support government preventing homosexuals from marrying.   Well there is something decent in that at least.

 
 
 
TᵢG
2.3.18  TᵢG  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.16    2 months ago

This post is what people mean by proselytizing.

It is one thing for you to make a point and then refer to scripture to back up your point.   That is not what you did here.   I am not going to flag it (because I have no problem simply ignoring it), but I am sure someone will because this is just too obvious.

 
 
 
katrix
2.3.19  katrix  replied to  livefreeordie @2.3.15    2 months ago
Of course I believe in and speak in tongues. It is clearly taught as one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit for believers

Hahaha! And you pretend you don't crack jokes.

Speaking in tongues is only done by delusional people ... it's been studied by linguists and is nothing but empty babbling by brainwashed people.

 
 
 
†hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh
2.3.20  †hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh  replied to  TᵢG @2.3.10    2 months ago
CB is not a Marxist; that is ridiculous

There is only one way to confirm or deny this charge. We must of course ask for CB's consent for the "Boot Test"!

Anarcho-capitalists and other sects of volunteerism have determined this test to be 100% accurate.

The Subject is blind folded naked and deprived of light for two hours, a boot is placed on a stool behind a curtain with a lamp casting light on the boot. The blind fold is removed and as is the curtain. If the subject runs, crawls or moves towards the boot and licks it it, he or she is a Marxist, If the subject attempts to put the boot on, he or she is a fascist.

512

 
 
 
TᵢG
2.3.21  TᵢG  replied to  katrix @2.3.19    2 months ago

Except in LFOD's case because he insists that he speaks in tongues and has had that 'gift' since (to my recollection) he was a teenager.

Yeah, this is a gift.

 
 
 
CB
2.3.22  CB   replied to  †hε pε⊕pレε'š ƒïšh @2.3.20    2 months ago

Okay, what? What if I just take both boots by the tops and start tapping heads, noses, backs, and butts with the toe and heel? What signifies that?

 
 
 
nightwalker
2.3.23  nightwalker  replied to  TᵢG @2.3.21    2 months ago

Well, for him it IS a gift. He smiles every time he "speaks in tongues" because it's a gift that he can add piles of money to his stack using the same baby talk he used to use on his kids when they were 2-8 months old.

No taxes on it for him, god bless 'merica.

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.3.24  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  TᵢG @2.3.6    2 months ago

This is way off topic.  

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.3.25  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @2.3.14    2 months ago

Most of his ass backwards pronouncements make me cringe.  

 
 
 
Sunshine
2.4  Sunshine  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2    2 months ago
walk all over us like his predecessor did.

After 8 years of Obama it takes a while for people to recognize a president with some backbone.

 
 
 
CB
2.4.1  CB   replied to  Sunshine @2.4    2 months ago

O-D-S! Gotcha! You got O-D-S fever!

 
 
 
Sunshine
2.4.2  Sunshine  replied to  CB @2.4.1    2 months ago

Oh you can spell...wonderful. 

 
 
 
CB
2.4.3  CB   replied to  Sunshine @2.4.2    2 months ago

And, you got O-D-S fever, Sunshine. The good news is its non-life-threatening and you will get over it!

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.4.4  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Sunshine @2.4    2 months ago

President Obama was a diplomat.

This 'president' is a piece of shit bully who has his 'presidential' knee pads on for Putin and Un.

 
 
 
Tessylo
2.5  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2    2 months ago

How is another country 'walking all over us' by not spending their money here out of fear of being gunned down by yet another homegrown right wing domestic terrorist?  

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
2.6  Thrawn 31  replied to  Ed-NavDoc @2    2 months ago

Who walked all over us?

 
 
 
WallyW
3  WallyW    2 months ago

We are a very petty, vengeful, spiteful, small minded, arrogant, bully, coward nation....

Thanks for sharing your true feelings.

 
 
 
Tessylo
3.1  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  WallyW @3    2 months ago

'with Rump as 'president'

 
 
 
Heartland American
3.2  Heartland American  replied to  WallyW @3    2 months ago

A part of the progressive “America was never that great” crowd. 

 
 
 
Raven Wing
4  Raven Wing    2 months ago

I wonder why other countries don't retaliate against the US when our government issues travel warnings to their country. Seems a little stupid and paranoid for our 'President' to retaliate against other countries for doing the same to the US. The US is NOT that perfect. No matter what Trump says.

It just shows how totally inane and childish Trump is, and another embarrassment for America.

 
 
 
Sunshine
5  Sunshine    2 months ago
Warnings, which are of varying degrees of intensity, have come from a list of countries that include Uruguay, Venezuela, Japan, Germany, Ireland, Canada and New Zealand.

I hear Canadian geese attack travelers.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
5.1  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Sunshine @5    2 months ago
"I hear Canadian geese attack travelers."

Yeah, I wouldn't stand under them if I were you.  Of course you could always ban them from migrating over the USA.

 
 
 
Split Personality
5.1.1  Split Personality  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @5.1    2 months ago

Of course you, of all people , should know that they, Branta canadensis, are Canada Geese, not Canadian, a popular American misnomer.

They have already spread to the UK, Greenland, Iceland  and northern Europe.

Perhaps one day soon, you too will need a Canada Goose umbrella, lol.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
5.1.2  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Split Personality @5.1.1    2 months ago

LOL.  So either they're a scourge, or they will help increase the sustenance required for the world's growing population. 

 
 
 
Ronin2
5.1.3  Ronin2  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @5.1    2 months ago

I think those doing the banning would be hunters.

Does that mean my friends that hunt Canadian geese are now racist?

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
5.1.4  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Ronin2 @5.1.3    2 months ago

Well, you could say they're coloured, so hunting them could be considered racist.

Canada-Goose.jpg

 
 
 
Sunshine
5.1.5  Sunshine  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @5.1    2 months ago
Of course you could always ban them from migrating over the USA.

They should be banned!  I have had a few chase after me on the golf course...good thing I had a golf club for protection!  

 
 
 
Split Personality
5.1.6  Split Personality  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @5.1.2    2 months ago

For whatever reason(s) the Canada Goose was protected in Canada until 2011 when the government simply changed their staus to "not protected",  not a "pest".

They are still somewhat protected by the US Migratory Bird Act of 1918, but many states now have a specific hunting season and in the off season allow people registered with USFWS to destroy nests and eggs.

Using them for subsistence is a good idea.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
5.1.7  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Sunshine @5.1.5    2 months ago

That's unusual - impolite Canadians. LOL

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
5.1.8  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Split Personality @5.1.6    2 months ago

Smoked, or turned into sausage is fine...... Otherwise, pretty difficult for some to eat.

Why I don't hunt them...

 
 
 
lady in black
6  lady in black    2 months ago

It's trump, did you expect anything different.  He's a disgrace 

 
 
 
JBB
6.1  JBB  replied to  lady in black @6    2 months ago

Trump expects us to all be awed by his new clothes made of invisible thread.

 
 
 
CB
6.1.1  CB   replied to  JBB @6.1    2 months ago

Ahh! I like that, JBB.

 
 
 
Jim Greene
7  Jim Greene    2 months ago

Lash out, deny there is a problem. SOP

 
 
 
Kavika
8  Kavika     2 months ago

He's probably figured out that foreign tourism to the U.S. since he took office is down in the billions of dollars and thousands of jobs.....

Use goggle there are a number of article on the loss of tourism dollars/vistors to the U.S. 

 
 
 
CB
8.1  CB   replied to  Kavika @8    2 months ago

It can get worse if it becomes a generational loss or permanent displacement: 'brain-drain.' People will simply stop desiring to come. Then it's the inverse: America will turn to marketing itself to the world to get (back) what it already has the record of today! Yes, there are problems, but that is what Congress has a representative body employed to resolve. Not this glorified 'loon' on steroids who thinks it is his duty to change the entire makeup of this country under his tenure.

 
 
 
Raven Wing
8.1.1  Raven Wing  replied to  CB @8.1    2 months ago
People will simply stop desiring to come.

That should make Trump and his sheeple very happy. It has been said by those on the right that "There is no more room here in American for any more people." So that should help keep people from wanting to come to America, legally or illegally.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.2  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1    2 months ago

Foreign policy is the Constitutional responsibility of the president, not Congress.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.3  livefreeordie  replied to  Raven Wing @8.1.1    2 months ago

Yes, we should cut immigration numbers by 50% or more. That would be a good policy

 
 
 
CB
8.1.4  CB   replied to  Raven Wing @8.1.1    2 months ago

Yes Raven. Trump's conservatives are scared. So they're pulling that thing they (always) do: They kick people in the teeth, brutalize them, destroy other's interest, then (get this) these same conservatives come a running with a big jar of 'cooling' salve to smooth things out again. It is sad that some conservatives can't be happy—when other people are happy! 

That is not to say that there is not problems with illegal immigration. But, large-scale abuse is something I thought this country swore off when it realized it had made major mistakes in the past with groups of people. Now, the conservative movement has found its 'point-man' in Donald J. Trump. I heard him say it: "There is no more room here in America for any more people." 

I sighed. Let Donald and Trump conservatives' tell it we are all 'packed in' like sardines here! Not true at all. More 'truthful hyperbole' told from the perspective of a truly selfish individual. We do have problems with illegal immigration, adding nastiness and abuse of people to our national record of past crimes won't make the situation any better. In time, it will be one more thing this nation has to apologize for.

Lastly, what happens when the next president comes in and goes in a total different, beneficent direction. Well, how about that?

 
 
 
CB
8.1.5  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.2    2 months ago

I intended nothing about foreign policy where Congress is concerned. "No soup for you."

 
 
 
Raven Wing
8.1.6  Raven Wing  replied to  CB @8.1.4    2 months ago
"There is no more room here in America for any more people." 

That is only in their selfish dreams. There are vast areas of the US that are not yet inhabited for anyone to say there is no more room in America. And...they know it is true. Yet, it is their way to try and promote their anti-immigrant agenda. 

Without the immigrants that came, and come, to America, many of the things in our daily life that we take for granted would not have been possible. And....they know it.

But, sheeple will buy it because they are too bigoted, or too ignorant, to want to know the truth.  

 
 
 
Raven Wing
8.1.7  Raven Wing  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.3    2 months ago
Yes, we should cut immigration numbers by 50% or more. That would be a good policy

Sorry, I didn't include the /s at the end of my comment. It was meant to be sarcastic.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.8  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.4    2 months ago

Quite the opposite. We love the job the president is doing. But we also recognize the decades old battle we’ve been in against the anti-American, anti God ideology of the radical left Democrats.  We will not surrender our nation without a fight.  Too many in the past thought that they could work with the Democrats. That was a huge mistake

As was well stated in this article

“It was quite a surprise to find out that we Trump voters were personally responsible for the savage murder sprees of a creep who dug single-payer and a satanist fan of Big Chief Warren. The El Paso scumbag decided he wanted to murder Hispanics because migration would somehow destroy the environment, which falls right in line with classical progressive eugenics balderdash. The Democrat from Dayton was full-on #Resistance. But apparently we conservatives were to blame for their actions because we refuse to give up our rights.

It will never end. They will always hate you. Always. Nothing you can do will change that. Nothing. So get used to it and invite them to pound sand.

It would be nice to have libs and their media goons not sliming us all the time with manifest falsehoods. It would also be nice to have a pet unicorn named Chet always ready to make a run to the liquor store to pick up a sixer of Dos Equis and some Doritos. Neither one is going to happen, and you can’t change that by giving in. No matter how much you abase yourself it will never be enough for them to not hate you.”

https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2019/08/08/they-will-still-hate-you-even-if-you-disarm-n2551257

 
 
 
Tessylo
8.1.9  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.8    2 months ago

What the fuck is that nonsense you're rambling on about?

jrSmiley_44_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
CB
8.1.10  CB   replied to  Raven Wing @8.1.6    2 months ago

That is so right. It is quite disturbing. Here is Mr. 'The country is full and can't take another' Trump gaslighting all of us:  Note: Get a good look at those enablers surrounding this liar as he makes another beaut of an infamous hyperbolic lie:

Incidentally, that dude running his mouth sounds like the same dude with a stockpile of lawyers dedicated to help him stiff the American people by not allowing anybody whatsoever to oversight any of his state and/or federal tax returns. The question is this:

If and when the authorities do get an eye full of Donald's tax returns —will we feel an urge to order him out of the country?!

Trump is a fraud! Fraud. A cowardly fraud! It is possible and highly probably that some illegal immigrants from all spectrums proportionally pay more in income taxes than this 'Taxpayer in Chief!'  Trump is a fraud!

Question: Will this nation's citizens ask to see Trump's tax returns ahead of the 2020 election cycle getting going in earnest?

 
 
 
CB
8.1.11  CB   replied to  Raven Wing @8.1.6    2 months ago

Robert Oppenheimer of the Manhattan Project and "father of the bomb" which ended World War II was a son from a direct immigrant family to America. Albert Einstein, "the" Albert Einstein, was a German citizen who fled to America when the Nazis took over Germany. . . . 

Shall genius run out of and from the United States doing the era of Trumpism? 

NOTE: Has anyone noticed or got a count on just how many days Trump has 'addressed' the people of this country in one manner or another during his presidency? Donald seems to nearly always be babbling about one thing or another. Can we honestly say we want four more years of his incessant babbling and stirring up the nation's energies just to see its froth?

 
 
 
Raven Wing
8.1.12  Raven Wing  replied to  CB @8.1.11    2 months ago
Shall genius run out of and from the United States doing the era of Trumpism?

Nah....as we all know....only true born Americans can be a genius. /s

And the really funny part of all this is that Trump's own Father was an immigrant to the US. jrSmiley_78_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
CB
8.1.13  CB   replied to  Raven Wing @8.1.12    2 months ago

HA!

 
 
 
Raven Wing
8.1.14  Raven Wing  replied to  CB @8.1.11    2 months ago
Can we honestly say we want four more years of his incessant babbling and stirring up the nation's energies just to see its froth?

Not me....I have much more important things in my life than to froth over anything that Trump says, or does. The only ones that really froth at the mouth about Trump are his rabid followers.

 
 
 
CB
8.1.15  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.8    2 months ago

original

Well, you could stop reading Townhall. They are using your mind as a click devotional . It is clear that you are in no way interested in fairness for all citizens of the country. 'One-way' Libertarians are a big mistake. We see you LFOD. Oh yes, we do.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.16  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.10    2 months ago

No one has any business seeing Trump OR ANY other Americans tax returns.   We who believe in the Constitution and liberty will fight you radical America hating leftists all the way on this

releasing and making public someone’s tax return without their permission is a FELONY. It is also a FELONY to solicit the illegal release of someone’s tax return without their permission 

(a) Returns and return information

(1) Federal employees and other persons

It shall be unlawful for any officer or employee of the United States or any person described in section 6103(n) (or an officer or employee of any such person ), or any former officer or employee, willfully to disclose to any person , except as authorized in this title, any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)). Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable upon conviction by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution, and if such offense is committed by any officer or employee of the United States, he shall, in addition to any other punishment, be dismissed from office or discharged from employment upon conviction for such offense.

(2) State and other employees

It shall be unlawful for any person (not described in paragraph (1)) willfully to disclose to any person , except as authorized in this title, any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b) ) acquired by him or another person under subsection (d), (i)(1)(C), (3)(B)(i), or (7)(A)(ii), (k)(10), (13), or (14), (l)(6), (7), (8), (9), (10), (12), (15), (16), (19), (20), or (21) or (m)(2), (4), (5), (6), or (7) of section 6103 or under section 6104(c). Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.

(3) Other persons

It shall be unlawful for any person to whom any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b) ) is disclosed in a manner unauthorized by this title thereafter willfully to print or publish in any manner not provided by law any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.

(4) Solicitation

It shall be unlawful for any person willfully to offer any item of material value in exchange for any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)) and to receive as a result of such solicitation any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/7213

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.17  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.15    2 months ago

Why should I stop reading one of the best sources of conservative opinion?  I also read all the radical leftist sites also, but I bet you don’t want me to stop reading those.

its precisely because I love fairness that I read at Townhall.   There is nothing fair about your leftist ideology

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
8.1.18  Thrawn 31  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.3    2 months ago
es, we should cut immigration numbers by 50% or more. That would be a good policy

Why? Immigration is the only reason we have positive population growth.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.19  livefreeordie  replied to  Thrawn 31 @8.1.18    2 months ago

But I thought you leftists always complain we have over population?  

besides we could return to people actually having children

 
 
 
CB
8.1.20  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.16    2 months ago

 On one hand, you dislike Trump, Republicans, Government, Democrats, ad nauseam - on the otherhand, you defend this 'freak of nature' president hand and glove . It is painful to watch you do such gymnastics and rebounds.

No one has any business seeing Trump OR ANY other Americans tax returns.

Yes, The Ways and Means Committee does. Moreover, so does other agencies of the government. But, I am done with trying to engage you on this (plus my fingers are sore). Here is the Committee Chair reason for asking for the taxes. Deal with it, not me:

original

original

Source: https://waysandmeans.house.gov/sites/democrats.waysandmeans.house.gov/files/documents/WM%20Letter%20to%20IRS%204.13.19.pdf

 
 
 
CB
8.1.21  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.17    2 months ago

For all the good its doing. . . .

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.22  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.20    2 months ago

Just because they claim that authority, doesn’t make it legal or right. The Courts will stop this obvious UnConstitutional effort by the Democrats 

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.23  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.21    2 months ago

Fighting as I have all my life for what is right to our Constitution, the principles of liberty, and the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles is ALWAYS a good thing

 
 
 
CB
8.1.24  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.22    2 months ago

You hate 'activist' Justices too, don't you? Or, do I confuse you with another miniarchist?

 
 
 
CB
8.1.25  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.23    2 months ago

I hate to burst your bubble, but reconsider the 'blending' of the themes, please. Being old-fashioned and worn-out in context of a shifting world is creating problems all across the human spectrum. Holding an approach to life that is rugged individualistic was conducive when life was 'plains-life' today men are seeking ways off this planet, making ingenuous medicines, and erasing tribalism for tribalism sake. Your 'fronts' are no longer issues we face—except people like yourself stand anchored mentally in the past and won't let us sufficiently by.

Jesus called out liars, cheaters, and thieves to change their course in life. In Trump all you present is favor. How in the world do you except the apostles and Lord to approve of that? Your 'message' is corrupted (by Trump support). You have not corrected Trump here or 'there.' This is not good. Indeed, it is worrisome.

 
 
 
Raven Wing
8.1.26  Raven Wing  replied to  CB @8.1.25    2 months ago
except people like yourself stand anchored mentally in the past and won't let us sufficiently by.

Nah....the majority of the people today simply ignore the outdated ways of life , or find a way to make them blend with the ways of today. There is nothing wrong with today, only those who choose to use them in the wrong way, and persecute those who refuse to follow their own ideology. 

The entire human species cannot be judged by those few who do their best to make the world a place where hatred toward our fellow human beings rules. We see how those few affect the world every day, both in their words and actions in all areas of the world. They have indeed declared war on peace, and it is very plain to see and should not be ignored, as the agenda of hate never dies.

JMOO

 
 
 
MrFrost
8.1.27  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.16    2 months ago
No one has any business seeing Trump OR ANY other Americans tax returns.  

Actually, congress can demand the president's tax returns, legally. That's been proven widely over the last years.

Besides, trump said himself he would release them. You ok with that POS lying to your face? 

 
 
 
Don Overton
8.1.28  Don Overton  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.16    2 months ago
No one has any business seeing Trump OR ANY other Americans tax returns. 

That comment is a total lie that has been explained time and again to you yet you just keep babbling it ou

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.29  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.24    2 months ago

I don’t hate anyone. I hate UnConstitutional actions by judges when they substitute feelings for law.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.30  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.25    2 months ago

The principles of limiting government to prevent infringement on our rights and liberties are timeless, and most definitely not “old fashioned or worn out”.

As noted by John F Kennedy, our nation is idealized by a religious foundation that drives our sense of individualism, opposition to Collectivism, and that our rights come not from the state, but from God

Our deep religious sense is the first element of the American character which I would discuss this morning.

The informing spirit of the American character has always been a deep religious sense.

Throughout the years, down to the present, a devotion to fundamental religious principles has characterized American thought and action.

Our government was founded on the essential religious idea of integrity of the individual. It was this religious sense which inspired the authors of the Declaration of Independence:

  The American character has been not only religious, idealistic, and patriotic, but because of these it has been essentially individual".  

Today these basic religious ideas are challenged by atheism and materialism: at home in the cynical philosophy of many of our intellectuals, abroad in the doctrine of collectivism, which sets up the twin pillars of atheism and materialism as the official philosophical establishment of the State.

The right of the individual against the State has ever been one of our most cherished political principles.

The American Constitution has set down for all men to see the essentially Christian and American principle that there are certain rights held by every man which no government and no majority, however powerful, can deny.

John F Kennedy

Independence Day Oration, July 4th, 194 6

http://www.jfklibrary.org/Research/Research-Aids/JFK-Speeches/Independence-Day-Oration_1946.aspx

From JFKs inaugural address 1961

“And yet the same revolutionary beliefs for which our forebears fought are still at issue around the globe--the belief that the rights of man come not from the generosity of the state but from the hand of God."

JFK on the danger of centralizing power in the Federal Government  

"The ever expanding power of the federal government, the absorption of many of the functions that states and cities once considered to be responsibilities of their own, must now be a source of concern to all those who believe as did the great patriot, Henry Grattan that: “Control over local affairs is the essence of liberty.”  

John F Kennedy Commencement Address, University of Notre Dame, January 29, 1950

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.31  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.25    2 months ago

As to Trump and his behavior. I have repeatedly stated that like all of us, he is a flawed person. And in his case, those flaws are very apparent.

I didn’t vote for him in part because of those flaws, but even more so because I felt he held too many very liberal views over his lifetime (I have voted 3rd Party for the past 50 years except for Reagan).

i might add that I cannot think of a single current politician who is not a serial liar.

There is much to dislike in the way Trump speaks. HOWEVER, I base my support of him on three important things

  1. I agree with 99% of his actions.. they are solidly conservative, more so than anyone since Reagan, and I think even more conservative than Reagan
  2. Since I agree that we should not have a theocratic State, I leave out any Christian Judging of the success or failure of his presidency.
  3. I consider any Democrat president to be a grave threat to our Constitutional Republic and our individual rights and liberties

Those are sufficient for me to be what I consider sound reasons to support Trump despite his very flawed character and personality.  I might add that I also dislike the personality of most people from the Northeastern US.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.32  livefreeordie  replied to  Don Overton @8.1.28    2 months ago

First of all, an opinion cannot by definition be a lie.   Secondly that opinion is grounded in the Constitution and Federal Law

cite for me the section of the Constitution or Federal Law that requires ANYONE, including elected office holders and/or candidates to make the tax returns public.

I’ll make it easy for you.  THERE IS NONE 

 
 
 
Heartland American
8.1.33  Heartland American  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.17    2 months ago

Town Hall is an awesome source of news and opinion.  

 
 
 
CB
8.1.34  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.29    2 months ago

Yes, you do. Don't pull a 'flip-flop. You go after judges and justices when you label them activists. You supported McConnell in his mission to recruit and deliver 'think-tanked' individuals to the courts of this country.

That partially accomplished. Now, you SAY Congress, the second branch of government, is acting unconstitutional to follow its own well-established agency policies issued well in advance of Donald Trump's 'advent' in politics. Moreover, you want Courts to agree with your logic, because of their conservatism.  In effective, you would like Trump to receive 'favored status' from the federal courts simply because it works best for Donald to break and erase rules rather than obey them like the rest of us and the children we raise up.

"Well-played, LFOD." Conservative justices will become this new 'cut' of activists justices (you used to openly berate and protest) on the courts in the instances they deny liberty, justice, and rightness to all—including the House of Representatives.

Your 'stance' here has left you unseemly naked, unsteady, and exposed. Do work harder to cover up now.

 
 
 
CB
8.1.35  CB   replied to  Heartland American @8.1.33    2 months ago
The American Constitution has set down for all men to see the essentially Christian and American principle that there are certain rights held by every man which no government and no majority, however powerful, can deny.

Is your use of the term, "men" universal or specific, LFOD? (Is this a big waste of time? I wonder. You appear to be throwing out quotes with little to no context (A pretext, then.).)

 
 
 
CB
8.1.36  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.31    2 months ago
Since I agree that we should not have a theocratic State, I leave out any Christian Judging of the success or failure of his presidency.

That is fraudulent Christianity. This is plain and simple (your vague attempts to be "foggy" fail) too. Your faith in the Christian Lord is shipwrecked by your dismissal:

  1. You agree with a liar, because 'lies are lies'—everybody's does so - as you put it. "Everybody" is doing a lot of activities you won't give a pass to-including not to liberals, to former presidents, or Barack Obama whom you signify as liar (not true, but I digress). Yet, Trump (a deeply flawed man in your own words) earns your devotion and  'blessing.'
  2. You agree with Trump 99 percent of the time as you consider him a "solid conservative" that much. Yet, Reagan as conservative as he was did not enlist a 'bank' of lawyers to thwart government customs, rules, procedures, or laws (by acting to 'take down' sitting House committee chairs).
  3. Your disrespect for civil authority/ities and all who are doing their best to serve in a hostile political 'arena'  makes your miniarchist worldview incoherent, suspicious, and unworkable for others to grasp or master.

Your faith is not anchored in peace, when you hold armaments of mass destruction stowed up for some future outbreak of violence. That is not Jesus. That is not Christianity. That is not Church. If you can list me one first century apostle who was 'strapped' for combat.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
8.1.37  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Tessylo @8.1.9    2 months ago

deleted

 
 
 
Dulay
8.1.38  Dulay  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.3    2 months ago

Who would mow the fairways @ Trump's golf courses and make the beds @ his hotels? 

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.39  livefreeordie  replied to  Dulay @8.1.38    2 months ago

Americans

 
 
 
livefreeordie
8.1.40  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @8.1.36    2 months ago

Jesus on self defense.  You appear to have a different Jesus than the Jesus of the Bible.  Jesus NEVER told believers we cannot defend ourselves. In fact He told us to be armed for self defense as He stated to the Disciples 

Luke 22:35,36

And He said to them, “When I sent you without money bag, knapsack, and sandals, did you lack anything?”

So they said, “Nothing.”

36 Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one. 

 
 
 
Dulay
8.1.41  Dulay  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.39    2 months ago

Then why did Trump request 76 MORE H-2B visas? 

 
 
 
CB
8.1.42  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.40    2 months ago

And you appear to have a warped sense of what defense means. I asked you once before and you neglected to reply, I will ask again once more:

Name for me a New Testament apostle or leader (a person said to have once lived) written about who carried a weapon used in offense or protection on his or her person? Moreover, one such leader who used a weapon to defend someone else in the New Testament. Please proceed. . . .

Granted a man or woman in this faith can defend themselves and others. It is an extrapolation based not scripture but on the passage of time. But your vain attempt to twist offense into defense of something not in anyway spiritual or peaceful  is insulting and unworthy of the time we spend on it, in my opinion.

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
8.1.43  FLYNAVY1  replied to  livefreeordie @8.1.23    2 months ago

....and all while turning a blind eye to insignificant events like the "Trail of Tears", Japanese internment camps, slavery, the Spanish Inquisition, and embracing the same evangelical thinking that have given us Fred Phelps, The Westboro Baptist Church, Jim Jones and Peoples Temple in Jonestown.

  

 
 
 
lady in black
8.1.44  lady in black  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @8.1.43    2 months ago

Doncha know there is a fake war on faux christians

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
8.1.45  Trout Giggles  replied to  CB @8.1.42    2 months ago
Name for me a New Testament apostle or leader (a person said to have once lived) written about who carried a weapon used in offense or protection on his or her person?

I know you didn't ask me, but didn't Peter carry a sword? He cut off a guard's ear which Jesus promptly healed, amiright?

 
 
 
CB
8.1.46  CB   replied to  Trout Giggles @8.1.45    2 months ago

Dear Trout G' you are always near and dear to my discussions. No matter tone or tenor.

TG, yes you are correct. And, I have taken that narrative into account. As Jesus informed Peter, this task was what he came to do with his life (to give up life on behalf of others). Thus, Jesus "rebuked" the actions of Peter. Moreover, there is an account regarding the "sons of thunder" James and John, the "inner circle" disciples of Jesus:

Luke 9:

Samaritan Opposition

51 As the time approached for him to be taken up to heaven, Jesus resolutely set out for Jerusalem. 52 And he sent messengers on ahead, who went into a Samaritan village to get things ready for him; 53 but the people there did not welcome him, because he was heading for Jerusalem. 54 When the disciples James and John saw this, they asked, “Lord, do you want us to call fire down from heaven to destroy them b ?” 55 But Jesus turned and rebuked them . 56 Then he and his disciples went to another village.

Now then, my larger point for LFOD is regarding after the departure of Jesus from this life, and the 'dawning' of the Church-age. The period when 1st century believers laid the basis of Church-think in Paul and others' ministries, and (long) before Constantine's unfortunate and possibly unintentional politicization of the new religion by empowerment, and the Universal Catholic Church began its reign of terror.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
8.1.47  Trout Giggles  replied to  CB @8.1.46    2 months ago
Thus, Jesus "rebuked" the actions of Peter.

I forgot that part.

Thanks! You are always fun to converse with

 
 
 
CB
8.1.48  CB   replied to  Trout Giggles @8.1.47    2 months ago

Ditto! Thank you! We take time to actually hear each other out. And, it marks the difference!

 
 
 
Tessylo
8.1.49  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @8.1.37    2 months ago

[Deleted]

 
 
 
Split Personality
8.2  Split Personality  replied to  Kavika @8    2 months ago
While both sides still want a trade agreement, Trump said, "we'll see whether or not we keep our meeting in September ... We are winning and winning big."

Meanwhile back on planet earth,

The US-China trade war is creating winners out of Brazil, Australia, Mexico, and Canada

Very interesting graphs and analyses...

 
 
 
Tessylo
8.2.1  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Split Personality @8.2    2 months ago

Yeah, what the hell is it that we are winning, winning bigly?

 
 
 
Tessylo
8.3  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Kavika @8    2 months ago

I imagine tourism here dropped dramatically ever since that shitstain became 'president'.  Why would they want to come here with that braindead racist moron of a 'president'

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.3.1  KDMichigan  replied to  Tessylo @8.3    2 months ago
I imagine tourism here dropped dramatically ever since that shitstain became 'president'

Actually in 2019 we had the highest numbers ever.

Why would they want to come here with that braindead racist moron of a 'president'

Well number one he is a far better choice than the piece of shit that just vacated the White House and they probably feel safer than when the great leader from behind encouraged attacks on law enforcement.

 
 
 
CB
8.3.2  CB   replied to  KDMichigan @8.3.1    2 months ago

Show us your great leader's tax returns. Go ahead ask him for them. I'd be keen to learn what the lawyers reply with be to a 'fanboy.'

 
 
 
Ronin2
8.3.3  Ronin2  replied to  CB @8.3.2    2 months ago

Is that the best you have?  It would be the same response as to everyone else; "None of your damn business". 

Funny how the left loved the IRS under Obama when it went after conservative PAC groups; but suddenly find them incompetent on checking Trump's tax returns. 

 
 
 
CB
8.3.4  CB   replied to  Ronin2 @8.3.3    2 months ago

Please. The easy answer is Trump is president and not a rank and file member of any organization. It wouldn't change anything if he was in an organization. Although, as is evident, Donald is not a team player. Others 'orbit' Trump or kneel! The CLEAR fact is you have no one you can tear off to wipe Trump's hidden taxes and his bank of lawyers on. You are simply twisting in the wind! Talking loud and saying nothing.

The comment stands:

Show us your great leader's tax returns. Go ahead ask him for them. I'd be keen to learn what the lawyers reply with be to a 'fanboy.'

 
 
 
Don Overton
8.3.5  Don Overton  replied to  KDMichigan @8.3.1    2 months ago

Would you care to supply your source

 
 
 
Dulay
8.3.6  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.3.1    2 months ago
Actually in 2019 we had the highest numbers ever.

Link? 

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.3.7  KDMichigan  replied to  Dulay @8.3.6    2 months ago
Link? 

It's hard to find but it's there.

Every search directs you to early 2018 when it was bad. But yeah 2019....bigly.

 
 
 
Dulay
8.3.8  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.3.7    2 months ago
It's hard to find but it's there.

Where? 

Every search directs you to early 2018 when it was bad. But yeah 2019....bigly.

Link? 

 
 
 
Old Hermit
8.3.9  Old Hermit  replied to  Tessylo @8.3    2 months ago
tourism here dropped dramatically

Important point Tessylo, (for those living in the real world). 

Trump & his policies have proving to be slow poison to the American dream in so many different ways.

New Numbers Hint at Tough 2020 for U.S. Tourism Industry
Andrew Sheivachman, Skift
- Jul 10, 2019

.

US sees biggest slump in tourism for four years
David Millward - 23 May 2019

The number of overseas visitors to the US is falling, with a 5.4 per cent drop in March compared to the same time last year.

It represents the worst showing since 2015, prompting fears among the country's tourism chiefs that the US will lose out to rival destinations this year.

Tourism also fell in February, albeit by a more modest 0.2 per cent, figures released by the US Travel Association revealed.

These figures have fuelled concern in an industry which has also been beset by labour shortages because of difficulties bringing in seasonal workers from overseas as a result of the Trump administration's tougher line on visas.

"The outlook for international inbound travel remains lacklustre, suggesting that a further loss of global market share is in the cards for the US in 2019," said David Huether, Senior Vice President for Research at US Travel, the industry trade association.

Tourism is vital to the US economy, representing 11 per cent of the country's total trade surplus of $77.4 billion.

Last year, international tourism generated $197 billion for the US economy.

.

FORBES, June 8, 2019
Bad News For Brand USA: America's Slice Of The Global Tourism Pie Keeps Shrinking

These are sobering times for the U.S. tourism industry. While international tourism is growing around the world, America’s slice of the pie has been shrinking.

America’s share of the global travel market dropped from 13.7 percent in 2015 to just 11.7 percent in 2018 , according to the U.S. Travel Association.

That 2 percent drop is a very big deal. In 2018, international visitors to the U.S. spent $256 billion — so a two percent drop translates to around $5 billion annually. And the travel industry is a huge job generator. Last year, travelers spent $1.1 trillion in the U.S. and directly supported 8.9 million U.S. jobs, according to the U.S. Travel Association.

“When we met last year, I told you that the U.S. is losing international travel market share. Unfortunately, that is still the case,” U.S. Travel President and CEO Roger Dow told a crowd at IPW, the travel industry's premier inbound international conference, last week in Anaheim, California.

Dow noted that the U.S. Department of Commerce just put out figures showing that international travel to the U.S. grew by 3.5 percent last year. “That might sound pretty good — but not when you consider that globally, long-haul travel grew by 7 percent,” he said. “What that means is that the U.S. is still falling behind in the competition to attract international visitors. That’s the bad news.”

On one hand, Dow was reluctant to blame politics. “I know a lot of people want to lay this at the feet of our president. But we’ve come a long way helping the administration appreciate travel as a crucial U.S. export and job creator,” said Dow. “We certainly don’t think the president says often enough that he wants healthy numbers of visitors to come to the U.S. but there is an opening to talk to this administration about policies that help with visitation.”

To illustrate his point, Dow showed a clip from the 2019 State of the Union, where President Trump stated that the U.S. wants international visitors before making a crack about illegal immigration. The IPW audience reacted with cynical laughter.

But the same day Dow had to acknowledge that politics were contributing at least in part to the country’s tourism woes after the Chinese government issued multiple warnings to its citizens about traveling to the United States. Three of China’s ministries — Foreign Affairs, Education, and Culture and Tourism — issued separate warnings to business travelers, students and leisure travelers.

Even before these warnings, there was a drop in Chinese tourism numbers that appears to be connected to politics. After seven years of double-digit growth through 2016, it slowed to only 4 percent in 2017 and remained flat in 2018.

“This move would appear connected to the U.S.-China trade dispute,” said Dow in a statement . “While it's too early to know the impact this might have on inbound travel from one of our top source markets, announcements such as this can have a chilling effect.” Chinese tourists spend $6,700 per trip compared to an average of $4,200 for international tourists overall.

“We continue to urge both governments not to politicize travel for the reasons I have stated often: travel is incredibly valuable for both countries in terms of direct commercial activity and business relationships that have a broad downstream economic impact,” according to Dow’s statement.

“America can be — and should be — the most secure and the most visited country in the world,” said Dow.
 
 
 
CB
8.3.10  CB   replied to  Old Hermit @8.3.9    2 months ago

Really interesting reading.

 
 
 
Tessylo
8.3.11  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  KDMichigan @8.3.7    2 months ago

In other words, you got nothing, as usual.  

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.4  KDMichigan  replied to  Kavika @8    2 months ago

Must be old articles.

Tourism Revenues in the United States increased to 21547 USD Million in May from 21389 USD Million in April of 2019. Tourism Revenues in the United States averaged 14146.78 USD Million from 1999 until 2019, reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019 and a record low of 6496 USD Million in October of 2001.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/tourism-revenues

We have been having a tourist boom with a lot of Foreigners way up north...

 
 
 
Kavika
8.4.1  Kavika   replied to  KDMichigan @8.4    2 months ago

You are correct. It was 2016 and 2017 that the bottom fell out of foreign tourist. In 2018 and 19 it has rebounded. 

 
 
 
Dulay
8.4.2  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.4    2 months ago
We have been having a tourist boom with a lot of Foreigners way up north...

Yet your own link shows that tourism revenues have been just about flat since 2016. 

512

It also shows that Tourist arrivals are flat too. 

So WHERE is this 'boom' you speak of? 

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.4.3  KDMichigan  replied to  Dulay @8.4.2    2 months ago
just about flat since 2016. 

It's 2019 Dulay… 

Have a good evening.

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.4.4  KDMichigan  replied to  Dulay @8.4.2    2 months ago
So WHERE is this 'boom' you speak of? 

Up north like I said.

So are you hitching your wagon to Tessy inane comment that tourism has dropped Dramatically?

What is your point Dulay?

Are you arguing that they didn't set tourism records in 2019? Take a closer look at your graph. But then again I didn't once spend 2 hours hoeing Grandpas vegetable garden so my graph reading capabilities might not be as sharp as yours.

 
 
 
Dulay
8.4.5  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.4.3    2 months ago
It's 2019 Dulay… 

Thanks for the update./s

Both numbers are about flat since 2016. BTFW since 2016 includes 2019...

Have a good evening

Intend to. 

 
 
 
Dulay
8.4.6  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.4.4    2 months ago
Up north like I said.

Pretty vague. 

So are you hitching your wagon to Tessy inane comment that tourism has dropped Dramatically?

No, I used the data in your link. That's where the graph I posted came from. 

What is your point Dulay?

Oh, I thought that I made it clear. My point is that your claim is BS...


Are you arguing that they didn't set tourism records in 2019?

Record REVENUE isn't that same as MORE tourism. Secondly, a slight up tick isn't a 'boom'. 

Take a closer look at your graph.

Yes, KD, look at the graph and recognize that the numbers have been flat since 2016. 

But then again I didn't once spend 2 hours hoeing Grandpas vegetable garden so my graph reading capabilities might not be as sharp as yours.

Your loss. 

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.4.7  KDMichigan  replied to  Dulay @8.4.6    2 months ago
Oh, I thought that I made it clear. My point is that your claim is BS...

Prove it Dulay. Show that tourism right now has dropped dramatically. Don't spin and sputter, you jumped in with you unproven BS. Just for once prove something without having to move the goalpost. Come on Dulay just fucking do it. Show us how you can turn record tourism in 2019 into dropping dramatically. 

 
 
 
Dulay
8.4.8  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.4.7    2 months ago
Prove it Dulay.

Your link proves it KD. 

Show that tourism right now has dropped dramatically.

That's a strawman KD. Look it up. 

Don't spin and sputter, you jumped in with you unproven BS.

The only thing I jumped in with is the data from YOUR link KD. 

Just for once prove something without having to move the goalpost. Come on Dulay just fucking do it. Show us how you can turn record tourism in 2019 into dropping dramatically. 

Another strawman KD.

Where did I say that anything dropped at all KD?

Hint: I didn't. 

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.4.9  KDMichigan  replied to  Dulay @8.4.8    2 months ago

So Dulay you go from spinning your bs to calling everything strawman. LMFAOAY

Your link proves it KD.

reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

That's a strawman KD. Look it up.

reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

The only thing I jumped in with is the data from YOUR link KD.

reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

Another strawman KD.

reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

256

 
 
 
Dulay
8.4.10  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.4.9    2 months ago
reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

You said there has been a boom KD. A slight uptick, whether it's an all time high or not, is NOT a BOOM. The graph from YOUR link proves that NO BOOM HAS OCCURED. 

 
 
 
KDMichigan
8.4.11  KDMichigan  replied to  Dulay @8.4.10    2 months ago
You said there has been a boom KD.

Where I am it is just like I stated Dulay.

A slight uptick, whether it's an all time high

Never said it was but you hitched your little red wagon to tessy comment that tourism has dropped dramatically during President Trumps term.

reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

whether it's an all time high

Just like I said an all time high Dulay. No matter how you try to spin and sputter Tourism has not dropped dramatically as tessy stated.

Just because you are wrong you can twist it anyway you want you are still wrong. 

And I wouldn't tell you where the fuck I live for numerous reasons.

Now get your last spin in ….reaching an all time high of 21891 USD Million in March of 2019

 
 
 
Dulay
8.4.12  Dulay  replied to  KDMichigan @8.4.11    2 months ago
Never said it was but you hitched your little red wagon to tessy comment that tourism has dropped dramatically during President Trumps term.
Just like I said an all time high Dulay. No matter how you try to spin and sputter Tourism has not dropped dramatically as tessy stated.

You're seeing things KD. NONE of my comments has anything to do with Tessylo's comment. 

Where did I say that anything dropped at all KD?
Hint: I didn't.

And I wouldn't tell you where the fuck I live for numerous reasons.

I presume you live in Michigan since it's in your tag and you've said so. 

 
 
 
Tacos!
9  Tacos!    2 months ago

I appreciate his sentiment, and I don't like it when other countries issue travel advisories about the US.

However, being pissed about it doesn't change the fact that the United States does have quite a bit of crime for an advanced country. In many ways, several of our most direct peers and allies have far lower rates of both violent and non-violent crime. That's just the truth.

 
 
 
Raven Wing
9.1  Raven Wing  replied to  Tacos! @9    2 months ago

And it isn't like some Americans who go to other countries don't engage in crimes or bad behavior as well. American's are in no way perfect visitors to other countries. Some just like to think so. 

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
9.2  Thrawn 31  replied to  Tacos! @9    2 months ago

He is just being a bitch because other countries are stating the obvious. The US is a MAJOR outlier when it comes to violent and gun crime. No one else has mass shootings like we do, in other countries it is actually news. Here it is like getting the morning weather report. 

 
 
 
CB
9.2.1  CB   replied to  Thrawn 31 @9.2    2 months ago

Other nation's would not have to do this type of diligence for their citizens if it was not a clear and present danger that could engross foreign visitors.

It is justifiable that people are fearful. The threat assessment is real. The whole country by definition is flooded in millions of guns (with manufacturers pumping out more and more), and young and old white males - currently the definition of a mass murderer- exist in ever city.

To be clear, I mean no insult to anyone personally or as a people; but objectively writing this: that is a partial picture of the rationale other nation's are compelled to consider.

This is going to sound really strange - even to my mind. I almost want to apologize before putting it forward, but I will not.  We are encountering a situation in this country where White fathers need to do a better job of talking to their boys.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
9.2.2  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @9.2.1    2 months ago

We are encountering a situation in this country where White fathers need to do a better job of talking to their boys.

While I agree with that in principle, that is not the over arching issue with violence in America. It’s single parent African American families with no fathers present in the lives of African American boys and young men

More African Americans are murdered EVERY Week in America by Black men than by White males in an ENTIRE YEAR. In fact 9 out of every 10 African American murders came at the hands of an African American male.

Why won’t you leftists address this black on black violence and save innocent African American lives?

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-3.xls

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/08/05/el-paso-shooting-dayton-chicago-gun-violence-reporting-varies/1920237001/

https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/274538/51-mass-shooters-2019-were-black-only-29-were-daniel-greenfield

https://m.facebook.com/watch/?v=1066809936789154&_rdr

https://twitter.com/larryelder/status/1158076684131635200?s=21

 
 
 
CB
9.2.3  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @9.2.2    2 months ago

Okay—that is a topic shift. Either you agree with my point in principle as it relates to the topic of mass shooting broadcasts live on television; or you can be a character on the internet who wants to pound smoke about people who apparently don't qualify to make screen television news.

My 'awkward' statement (which I admitted felt so) was trying to offer a different path to the issue besides the usual exchanges about guns/gun control. It is men talking to boys well in advance of these tensions and other outside noises fill their minds. W hat is wrong with that? You did not 'say.'

Chicago and other big city gang violence (if that is what it is) are wholly another issue to surmount in another thread—perhaps. One fire-hi.png at a time, please.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
9.2.4  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @9.2.3    2 months ago

Perhaps my conclusion to the point of your post misinterpreted your point. But in the context it seemed to suggest that our biggest problem with violence is solely due to White men and how they raise or don’t raise their sons

 
 
 
CB
9.2.5  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @9.2.4    2 months ago

Glad you clarified your misunderstanding! This is a new (old) concept to put on the table. It could be one that can save many lives over time. Men, in general, have got to catch each other 'up,' before extreme violence does. Some of these young men seem to be 'raging' (charging elephant) out of control in these scenarios.  Perhaps, we, boys and men alike, have forgotten how to redirect our internal rage. . . . I don't know. It's something to consider.

Of course, that drives me directly over to the belligerent, enthralling voices (of despair and anger, in this order) carrying across our national airways. . . . 

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.6  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.1    2 months ago
The whole country by definition is flooded in millions of guns (with manufacturers pumping out more and more),

Yes.  Absolutely.

and young and old white males - currently the definition of a mass murderer- exist in ever city.

Actually....

That does not appear to be true, statistically speaking.

https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/mass-shooting

 
 
 
CB
9.2.7  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.6    2 months ago

See @9.2.3. Nice listings, considering the circumstances, on that website all the same. It may be that is a different category of violence. A clear distinction will need to be ascertained from looking through a great many cases on that site!

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.8  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.7    2 months ago
It may be that is a different category of violence.

I've learned since then that the FBI actually doesn't have a definition for "mass shooting".  They have "mass murder" which is four or more people killed.

My point throughout this has been that white America only cares when white America gets shot.  The people most at risk are the same ones always most at risk.  They get killed every day, but we pretend like it doesn't happen.

The stereotypical assault rifle/white guy incidents are a tiny sliver of gun violence in America, and I'm not interested in non-solutions that only serve to make entitled white people "feel" safer.

 
 
 
CB
9.2.9  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.8    2 months ago

This is an interesting point of view. Thank you for sharing it. One thing is consistent throughout, . . . the gun/s. Very interesting, Jack_TX. Food for thought!

 
 
 
Tessylo
9.2.10  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.8    2 months ago
'They have "mass murder" which is four or more people killed.

Which is what I have said here or on another thread which was scoffed at.' 

 
 
 
Tessylo
9.2.11  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.8    2 months ago

You've said that we don't give a shit when it's blacks, which is untrue.  

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.12  Jack_TX  replied to  Tessylo @9.2.10    2 months ago
Which is what I have said here or on another thread which was scoffed at.'

I'm not sure who scoffed at you, but different organizations are imposing different definitions.  4 killed is the FBI definition, but the Congressional Research Office has a different one and Gun Violence Archive has yet another.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.13  Jack_TX  replied to  Tessylo @9.2.11    2 months ago
You've said that we don't give a shit when it's blacks, which is untrue.  

I think we pretend to care about them when it's convenient and if we believe it lends credibility to our political views...which is what we REALLY care about.

Other than that, the evidence that we don't care is pretty strong.  Thousands of black people are killed with guns every year, and tens of thousands more wounded.  So naturally we should only call for gun control after we see white people getting shot on television...and only call for banning the guns used to shoot white people. 

It's not difficult to get an assault weapons ban introduced in Congress.  That's extremely popular with white liberals.  But who has a bill going to curb inner-city violence?  Where is the plan to make Chicago safer?

If we cared, we would be doing something.

 
 
 
CB
9.2.14  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.13    2 months ago
It's not difficult to get an assault weapons ban introduced in Congress.  That's extremely popular with white liberals.  But who has a bill going to curb inner-city violence?  Where is the plan to make Chicago safer?

I have only time to glance those 'figures' you shared. Is the provided link (listing) only or largely characterized as Blacks killed by gun violence or were you listing gun deaths in general?

Not sure a republican majority leader in either assembly of Congress is going to significantly fix this "easily" for everybody. Moreover, whatever Congress does do, major or limited, should be across the board with all communities in mind. We are not talking about "alien" sectors of the populace here. Chicago is not wholly unto itself! It is a city-in a state-of this union. 

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.15  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.14    2 months ago
I have only time to glance those 'figures' you shared. Is the provided link (listing) only or largely characterized as Blacks killed by gun violence or were you listing gun deaths in general?

In general.  

Not sure a republican majority leader in either assembly of Congress is going to significantly fix this "easily" for everybody.

Not sure a Democrat majority will, either.  Pretty sure there isn't an easy fix to be had.

Moreover, whatever Congress does do, major or limited, should be across the board with all communities in mind.

My point exactly, but from a different angle.  Why would we pursue legislation that only addresses 2% of the problem?    

We are not talking about "alien" sectors of the populace here. Chicago is not wholly unto itself! It is a city-in a state-of this union. 

Absolutely.  Chicago has just become the example because of what's happening there.

I like your use of the word "alien" there.  It feels very much like we think of low-income high-violence neighborhoods like they're some sort of alien planet, or like we're talking about the Serengeti where one set of wild animals devours another and that is the natural order....all taking place in some far away land we'll never intentionally visit.

 
 
 
CB
9.2.16  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.15    2 months ago
Not sure a Democrat majority will, either.  Pretty sure there isn't an easy fix to be had.

Sure there is an easy fix. Republicans just have to throw off the NRA and NRA-ILA and come to work for gun legislation compromise. Of course, conservative talk radio, television, and think-tanks will have to drop their contemptible propaganda or at the least remodulate their messaging so that conservative voters won't keep 'fhit-canning' conservative leaders who vote for change in gun laws.

A democratic house and senate majority can 'get er done' - it just has to be reasonable bill and not one laden-down with 'poison pills.'

 
 
 
CB
9.2.17  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.15    2 months ago
I like your use of the word "alien" there.  It feels very much like we think of low-income high-violence neighborhoods like they're some sort of alien planet, or like we're talking about the Serengeti where one set of wild animals devours another and that is the natural order....all taking place in some far away land we'll never intentionally visit.

Disturbing. Emphatically.

 
 
 
Tessylo
9.2.18  seeder  Tessylo  replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.13    2 months ago

Don't include me in your 'we' statements.  I don't speak for you.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.19  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.17    2 months ago
Disturbing. Emphatically.

I wish it were.

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.20  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.16    2 months ago
Sure there is an easy fix.

There are almost never easy fixes to complex problems.

Republicans just have to throw off the NRA and NRA-ILA and come to work for gun legislation compromise.

What would that look like, in your opinion?

Of course, conservative talk radio, television, and think-tanks will have to drop their contemptible propaganda or at the least remodulate their messaging so that conservative voters won't keep 'fhit-canning' conservative leaders who vote for change in gun laws.

When somebody comes up with a comprehensive plan that is actually likely to accomplish something other than making silly white liberals "feel" better, I'll start talking conservative friends into supporting it.  But as of right now, we've pretty much got zero to work with.

A democratic house and senate majority can 'get er done' - it just has to be reasonable bill and not one laden-down with 'poison pills.'

The Democrats had a House majority, a Senate super-majority, and the WH not all that long ago.  Instead of gun control, we got badly written health insurance reform.

I'm sorry I'm not more confident about this.  I'd like there to be a simple solution we could tweak and get everybody on board.  I just think we are more likely to invent Star Trek style personal force fields than we are to pass legislation making our country safer.

 
 
 
CB
9.2.21  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.20    2 months ago
Republicans just have to throw off the NRA and NRA-ILA and come to work for gun legislation compromise.
What would that look like, in your opinion?

Two points:

1. L5465COJ2VUNQAO44TUBCETUNU.jpg

It would look like Our Fallen remembered.

When somebody comes up with a comprehensive plan that is actually likely to accomplish something other than making silly white liberals "feel" better, I'll start talking conservative friends into supporting it.  But as of right now, we've pretty much got zero to work with.

2. Put Talking Points in the grave!

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.22  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.21    2 months ago

Your "compromise" is a picture of victims?  

Did you have a plan or not?

 
 
 
CB
9.2.23  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.22    2 months ago

I wouldn't reveal it to you. Congress gets paid for their plans, "big-time."  Put all the 'fat cats' in a room together and lock the door and don't serve food until midnight. . . . That ought to start something in them!

 
 
 
Jack_TX
9.2.24  Jack_TX  replied to  CB @9.2.23    2 months ago

So you haven't got a plan, either.

OK then.

 
 
 
CB
9.2.25  CB   replied to  Jack_TX @9.2.24    2 months ago

It won't be free or cheap, if that is what you mean!

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
10  Buzz of the Orient    2 months ago

I'm not at all surprised about travel advisories being sent warning people about travelling to the USA.  People who come from countries where sane gun control (or as in China - NO civilians have guns) might not expect to be faced with the excessive gun murder and gun crime rate there is in the USA.  They might innocently think they are safe.  I will never forget a story I read a number of years ago about a Chinese student who was travelling in the  American countryside, got lost and went to a farmhouse to ask for directions - the farmer opened the door and blew the head off the student with his shotgun.  Personally, if I ever return to North America, it will be to my native land, Canada, and I wouldn't take one step into the USA, not even so close as to go eat the world's best Buffalo Wings. 

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
10.1  Thrawn 31  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @10    2 months ago

I don't fault you for that. Here going out in public is a roll of the dice. You just have to hope that you aren't one of the unlucky ones to be in the vicinity of "angry cocksucker" on any given day. 

Part of the reason I chose the school I did for my daughter (she just started kindergarten) is because they have double security doors on every entrance, and you have to be buzzed in remotely. On top of that, not even parents are allowed past the first set of doors, you have to stay in the waiting area. I chose that system because I knew that by sending my 5 year old to school I was putting here in very real danger here in America. 

 
 
 
Kavika
11  Kavika     2 months ago

Did anyone bother to read the countries that the U.S. has issued travel warning about...

Belize, Turkey, China, Belgium, Denmark, Germany, France, Bahama's for starters...

It's the responsibility of each country to warn its citizens if they feel there is a danger traveling to said country. 

 
 
 
Thrawn 31
12  Thrawn 31    2 months ago

Shit, I issue travel warnings to my own family, they are basically "be wary of young/middle aged white males, in other words anyone who looks like me, they are the ones who may kill you because they decide to be an asshole."

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
13  Paula Bartholomew    2 months ago

This country has issued travel alerts to some countries so how come Trump has his knickers in a bunch when other countries also do it.

 
 
 
Raven Wing
13.1  Raven Wing  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @13    2 months ago
how come Trump has his knickers in a bunch when other countries also do it.

Because it gives a bad impression of his and his supporting hangers-on as his being the only perfect US President in all of America's history. 

However, his own mouth and actions, and the word and acts of those he endlessly encourages and induces proves that is not the case. So it is only natural that Trump can't stand any other country disputing his personal mirror image of how great he is. 

To date, history proves there has never been a perfect President, and there will never be one. 

 
 
 
MrFrost
14  MrFrost    2 months ago
Trump Threatens Retaliation Against Countries That Issue Travel Warnings Against The US

What's he going to do, hit them with his purse? With the epic levels of gun violence in this country, people from foreign countries are really taking a huge risk to come here for vacation..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/06/07/ex-minneapolis-cop-sentenced-12-5-years-murder-unarmed-woman/1382798001/

An emotional former Minneapolis police, who told the court he can't apologize enough "for taking the life of a perfect person," was sentenced Friday to 12 and half years in prison for shooting an unarmed Australian woman as she walked toward his squad car.

“I knew in an instant I was wrong,” said Mohamed Noor, his voice breaking as he addressed the court at his sentencing hearing in Minneapolis.

Noor, 33, was convicted by a Minnesota jury in April of third-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter in the 2017 shooting death of Justine Ruszczyk Damond, a 40-year-old dual citizen of the U.S. and Australia.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
14.1  livefreeordie  replied to  MrFrost @14    2 months ago

You are approximately 20X more likely to die because of a Doctor screwup than to be violently murdered. While every homicide is tragic and should be condemned, modern medicine is a far greater killer than gun violence.

“According to a recent study by Johns Hopkins, more than 250,000 people in the United States die every year because of medical mistakes, making it the third leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer.

Other studies report much higher figures, claiming the number of deaths from medical error to be as high as 440,000. The reason for the discrepancy is that physicians, funeral directors, coroners and medical examiners rarely note on death certificates the human errors and system failures involved. Yet death certificates are what the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention rely on to post statistics for deaths nationwide.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/22/medical-errors-third-leading-cause-of-death-in-america.html

About 2460 people die EVERY Week from taking properly prescribed prescriptions according to the directions given them.

“By far the greatest number of [prescription drug-related] hospitalizations and deaths occur from drugs that are prescribed properly by physicians and taken as directed,” says Donald Light, a medical and economic sociologist and lead author of a 2013 paper that detailed the estimate, entitled “Institutional Corruption of Pharmaceuticals and the Myth of Safe and Effective Drugs.” “About 2,460 people per week are estimated to die from drugs that were properly prescribed, and that’s based on detailed chart reviews of hospitalized patients,” says Light, who is a professor of comparative health policy at Rowan University School of Osteopathic Medicine in Stratford, New Jersey. The estimate, which didn’t include those who died as a result of prescribing errors, overdose and self-medication, would make taking properly prescribed drugs the fourth leading cause of death in the U.S.”

https://health.usnews.com/health-news/patient-advice/articles/2016-09-27/the-danger-in-taking-prescribed-medications

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
14.1.1  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1    2 months ago

It doesn't change the fact that some countries are dangerous for tourists.

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
14.1.2  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1    2 months ago
"You are approximately 20X more likely to die because of a Doctor screwup than to be violently murdered."

A second reason not to travel to the USA. What's the third, vehicle accidents?

 
 
 
CB
14.1.3  CB   replied to  Paula Bartholomew @14.1.1    2 months ago

No it does not. And Mr. Frost and Paula B., did you see what LFOD did?  He equated all deaths as equal. In other words, the deaths in higher numbers should 'sound the alarm' and send people down the path to look and see how to patch that breach—leaving his 'pet' breach, incidentally the topic of gun deaths- free and clear.

Neither a fact that cancer kills, so-called 'acts of God' kill, epidemics and plaques kill, or even some other of our tools locked in the barn can send us to the hospital or grave, should distract any one of us from the topic of how to deal with and what do about mass murder brought to us by youths in "Anytown, U.S.A."  holding weapons of mass destruction making for riveting "Live" television and its aftermaths.

Nice try, LFOD. But—We got you!

 
 
 
MrFrost
14.1.4  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1    2 months ago

Yea, guns and doctors....TOTALLY the exact same thing.

 
 
 
livefreeordie
14.1.5  livefreeordie  replied to  CB @14.1.3    2 months ago

Juvenile and ignoring the central point.  You have a far greater risk of dying from seeing a doctor than to be killed from a Firearm.  And the comparison rises astronomically as to the risk from being shot from the legal owner of an AR-15 with no criminal or mental illness record.

you are more likely to die from a car careening onto a sidewalk than to be killed from an AR-15 

you will not take away our rights and turn this country into Stalinist Russia or Nazi Germany

384

 
 
 
livefreeordie
14.1.6  livefreeordie  replied to  MrFrost @14.1.4    2 months ago

Correct. Facts are inconvenient to leftists.  Doctors are far more hazardous to your health than a legally owned firearm

 
 
 
CB
14.1.7  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.5    2 months ago
you will not take away our rights and turn this country into Stalinist Russia or Nazi Germany

This is the heart of your concern. The earlier 'stats' are simple fodder thrown out on the path. Okay, wise guy, what odds of this happening do you give us?

Moreover, your more than what is needed stats fail, because 31 people are graveyard dead from gun fire. It becomes very real for those who are run-down and gun down (Ask Sandy Hook Elementary). Also, in Dayton, Ohio and  El Paso, it was your rather run of the mill: "This one for self defense against enemies, foreign & domestic, for preservation of freedom & Liberty, and to prevent government astrocites" which separated innocent people living out their freedom and liberty from joy to atrocities. Shame on you for ever suggesting again waging war in the United States. Double shame on you for thinking to connect Jesus with your weapons of mass destruction. It could be folks like you that are in Trump's ear and heart. Yes, it could be.

 
 
 
MrFrost
14.1.8  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.5    2 months ago

Wait, you need a gun to put food on the table? Ever heard of a grocery store? 

 
 
 
MrFrost
14.1.9  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.6    2 months ago
Doctors are far more hazardous to your health than a legally owned firearm

So by your logic, if you get sick, don't go to the doctor, buy a gun? You literally make no sense at all. 

Can our society survive without guns? 100%, yes. All the other countries do it. Can we survive without doctors? For a while, until a pandemic comes around, then we're screwed. 

 
 
 
MrFrost
14.1.10  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.5    2 months ago
You have a far greater risk of dying from seeing a doctor than to be killed from a Firearm.

Weird...I have been going to doctors all my life, still alive. I had 9 surgeries in two years, I am still alive. Everyone I know has been going to doctors for all kinds of things, still alive. My neighbors sister put a gun in her mouth....she died. 

Again, your logic is non existent on this issue. 

But it does sadden me that a man of the cloth as you claim to be supports the sale of guns that people simply do not need, over the mounting piles of dead people in our streets. Pretty sure Jesus wouldn't approve. 

 
 
 
JBB
14.1.11  JBB  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.6    2 months ago

Except that there if one big huge giant hole in your ill considered and faulty logic. Statistically speaking, by merely introducing a gun into an American home it will exponentially increase the chances that someone living there, a family member, will die by gunfire. Having tons and tons of guns has not made Americans any safer. In fact, the opposite is true...

 
 
 
livefreeordie
14.1.12  livefreeordie  replied to  JBB @14.1.11    2 months ago

False.  There are more than 400 million firearms in America.  99.99999% are never used to harm innocent people.  you Liberty hating leftists want to take away our right of self defense to finish the enslavement to a totalitarian state 

256

 
 
 
MrFrost
14.1.13  MrFrost  replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.12    2 months ago
There are more than 400 million firearms in America.

Actually closer to 390 million, but either way it's a LOT of fucking guns. Hell, I have 50 guns, one for every birthday, (but still haven't settled on a model for my 51st birthday last April). 

you Liberty hating leftists want to take away our right of self defense to finish the enslavement to a totalitarian state 

Wrong. I have yet to hear anyone saying they want to abolish the 2nd Amendment. It's nothing more than a BS talking point. It was used in 2008, (Obama will take all your guns!!!!", it never happened... 2016, "Hillary will take all your guns", it wouldn't have happened if she did win. And whoever gets the dem nomination this time around? "[insert name here] will take all your guns!!!!!!", it's honestly a stupid thing to say. What people DO want is to limit the TYPES of firearms people can buy. You do NOT need a fucking assault style weapon to hunt deer or protect yourself. I have three guns that I use for protection or when I go to Seattle.

384

1998 Colt Kodiak .44mag

For home defense...

384

Mossberg 590M Shockwave 12 Gauge Mag-Fed Pump Action

For "protection", that's all I need. In town and around my neighborhood? I rarely even lock my doors. 

 
 
 
CB
14.1.14  CB   replied to  livefreeordie @14.1.12    2 months ago

"Play it again, Sam!" 5538d8b0069968b9fef1b3120c0df5a3--matt-d

Clearly, LFOD, you need a foil to keep your screed alive.

 
 
 
CB
14.1.15  CB   replied to  MrFrost @14.1.13    2 months ago

Now, I like that. Just in case, any so-called, "Constitution defender" will understand the liberal and independent "sheeple" ain't going to be corralled easily nor take long to get up to speed if need be!

 
 
 
devangelical
14.1.16  devangelical  replied to  MrFrost @14.1.8    2 months ago
Wait, you need a gun to put food on the table? Ever heard of a grocery store? 

probably points it at people coming out with loaded carts in the store parking lot,.... while shouting scripture at them. you've seen that beat up RV with scripture hand written all over it, right? it's usually parked in a remote corner of a walmart parking lot just off the interstate.

 
 
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Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom


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