The Trump Presidency Is Over

  
Via:  larry-hampton  •  2 weeks ago  •  189 comments

The Trump Presidency Is Over
It has taken a good deal longer than it should have, but Americans have now seen the con man behind the curtain.

S E E D E D   C O N T E N T


When, in January 2016, I wrote that despite being a lifelong Republican who worked in the previous three GOP administrations, I would never vote for Donald Trump, even though his administration would align much more with my policy views than a Hillary Clinton presidency would, a lot of my Republican friends were befuddled. How could I not vote for a person who checked far more of my policy boxes than his opponent?

What I explained then, and what I have said many times since, is that Trump is fundamentally unfit—intellectually, morally, temperamentally, and psychologically—for office. For me, that is the paramount consideration in electing a president, in part because at some point it’s reasonable to expect that a president will face an unexpected crisis—and at that point, the president’s judgment and discernment, his character and leadership ability, will really matter.

“Mr. Trump has no desire to acquaint himself with most issues, let alone master them” is how I put it four years ago. “No major presidential candidate has ever been quite as disdainful of knowledge, as indifferent to facts, as untroubled by his benightedness.” I added this:

Mr. Trump’s virulent combination of ignorance, emotional instability, demagogy, solipsism and vindictiveness would do more than result in a failed presidency; it could very well lead to national catastrophe. The prospect of Donald Trump as commander in chief should send a chill down the spine of every American.

It took until the second half of Trump’s first term, but the crisis has arrived in the form of the coronavirus pandemic, and it’s hard to name a president who has been as overwhelmed by a crisis as the coronavirus has overwhelmed Donald Trump.


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Larry Hampton
1  seeder  Larry Hampton    2 weeks ago

To be sure, the president isn’t responsible for either the coronavirus or the disease it causes, COVID-19, and he couldn’t have stopped it from hitting our shores even if he had done everything right. Nor is it the case that the president hasn’t done anything right; in fact, his decision to implement a travel ban on China was prudent. And any narrative that attempts to pin all of the blame on Trump for the coronavirus is simply unfair. The temptation among the president’s critics to use the pandemic to get back at Trump for every bad thing he’s done should be resisted, and schadenfreude is never a good look.

That said, the president and his administration are responsible for grave, costly errors, most especially the epic manufacturing failures in diagnostic testing, the decision to test too few people, the delay in expanding testing to labs outside the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and problems in the supply chain. These mistakes have left us blind and badly behind the curve, and, for a few crucial weeks, they created a false sense of security. What we now know is that the coronavirus silently spread for several weeks, without us being aware of it and while we were doing nothing to stop it. Containment and mitigation efforts could have significantly slowed its spread at an early, critical point, but we frittered away that opportunity.

 
 
 
Kavika
1.1  Kavika   replied to  Larry Hampton @1    2 weeks ago

Chinese billionaire Jack Ma to send 500K coronavirus test kits, 1 million face masks to US

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/487535-chinese-billionaire-to-send-us-500000-coronavirus-test-kits-1-million-face
 
 
 
Larry Hampton
1.1.1  seeder  Larry Hampton  replied to  Kavika @1.1    2 weeks ago

What a dude!

Thanks Jack!

 
 
 
Krishna
1.1.2  Krishna  replied to  Kavika @1.1    2 weeks ago

Chinese Billionaire Jack Ma To Send 500K Coronavirus Test Kits, 1 Million Face Masks To US

Oh-- the irony!

(I watch Fox News every day-- mainly to see what they're telling people. I'm gonna check again to see if they report that story at all).

 
 
 
Dulay
1.1.3  Dulay  replied to  Kavika @1.1    2 weeks ago

But are they cleared by the CDC? /s

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
1.1.4  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Krishna @1.1.2    2 weeks ago
"Chinese Billionaire Jack Ma To Send 500K Coronavirus Test Kits, 1 Million Face Masks To US"
"Oh-- the irony!"

That is SO true!!!  I guess Trump won't apply a tariff on them, but he might be worried that they'll send back secret information to Beijing.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
1.1.5  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Kavika @1.1    2 weeks ago

Awesome.  Thank you so much Mr. Ma.  Hopefully something like this will inspire other 1 percenters to follow in kind.

 
 
 
squiggy
1.2  squiggy  replied to  Larry Hampton @1    2 weeks ago

You can't test your way out of this problem. If you used 300,000,000 tests today, you'd still have spaghetti tomorrow. I can sit in a shithouse stall and count the no-flush and no-wash carriers who leave every minute. People need to respect themselves and others.

 
 
 
Ozzwald
1.2.1  Ozzwald  replied to  squiggy @1.2    2 weeks ago
You can't test your way out of this problem.

If you don't know what you are dealing with, you cannot deal with it. 

One of the primary ways to evaluate a situation is testing. 

  • Testing will tell you how widespread it is. 
  • Testing will tell you where hot spots are located.   
  • Testing will tell you demographics about the victims.
  • Testing will tell you what to do to get ahead if it.
  • Testing will tell you if current procedures are effective, or need to be rethought.
 
 
 
cjcold
1.3  cjcold  replied to  Larry Hampton @1    2 weeks ago

Sounds a lot like the gop response to AGW.

 
 
 
Ed-NavDoc
1.4  Ed-NavDoc  replied to  Larry Hampton @1    2 weeks ago

As far as Trump's presidency being over, pretty sure that is a pipe dream on the part of the fanatical liberal left. He is hated so much that the left just cannot comprehend or contemplate any other possible outcome. Pipe dreams seldom come to pass.

 
 
 
WallyW
2  WallyW    2 weeks ago

Trump and his team of professionals experts are starting to get a good handle on this outbreak.

It is highly unlikely that any other person or entity could have done any better.

 
 
 
Krishna
2.1  Krishna  replied to  WallyW @2    2 weeks ago
Trump and his team of professionals experts are starting to get a good handle on this outbreak. It is highly unlikely that any other person or entity could have done any better.

Trump and his mindless followers have been sending one message-- that the Virus is not to be taken seriously. Totally distorting the facts. To cite but one example:

In our line of work you shake hands.The president will continue to do it I will continue to do it.

--Vice President, role model, and Pandemic Expert Mike Pence

So what message did that send to the American people? Did that message cause people to act in a manner that slowed down-- or accelerated-- the spread of the virus?

 
 
 
WallyW
2.1.1  WallyW  replied to  Krishna @2.1    2 weeks ago

I think the message being sent is to not succumb to mass hysteria and media induced panic.

It's highly unlikely that a person can get infected from doorknobs, or toilet seats, or shaking hands

 
 
 
Larry Hampton
2.1.2  seeder  Larry Hampton  replied to  WallyW @2.1.1    2 weeks ago

That is an ignorant statement. Of course you can get an infection from any of those things! 

 
 
 
TᵢG
2.1.3  TᵢG  replied to  Larry Hampton @2.1.2    2 weeks ago

Especially for a virus that seems capable of surviving on a surface for several days.   It is very difficult to keep washing one's hands (the very best thing that one can do in this situation short of steering clear of public places) and thus avoid passing the virus to one's mouth.

 
 
 
sixpick
2.1.4  sixpick  replied to  WallyW @2.1.1    2 weeks ago

Actually Wally, doorknobs, toilet seats and shaking hands are very good places to become infected.  It's not that this virus is more contagious, but it does seem to have the ability to live longer on hard surfaces than most of those in the past, not all. 

This is really important, since a difference of a few hours to a few days of surviving on hard surfaces could make the possibility of spreading to many more people than, for example the H1N1 or Human Swine virus of 2009, although the H1N1 was 20 times as likely to be deadly for young people and this Corona Virus in the USA doesn't follow that pattern..  Older people are the ones who have to worry the most with this Corona virus.

The Trump administration has done as good of a job as anyone could expect of any administration.  I'm sure the last administration did the best they could at the time and I'm sure the Trump administration is doing the best it can at this time.  No one is interested in people dying. 

We can fuss back and forth all we want, but I think Trump's travel restrictions from China initially saved many from suffering from this virus as well as the new travel restrictions will have the same effect.  In both actions he has received criticism from those wanting to gain political points, when they backed up every one of the last administrations actions, although the first case of the 2009 Swine Flu was noted in April 2009, a National Emergency wasn't declared until October 2009.  There are many countries with much smaller populations who have many more cases of this virus than us. 

You'll see many of the same news sources saying Obama declared a National Emergency in April 2009, but what he did was tell the American citizens the Department of Human Services had declared a public health emergency as a precautionary tool to assure we had the necessary resources at our disposal to respond quickly.

This was the latter part of April 2009:

World Health Organization (WHO)

Dr Margaret Chan speaks to the media at the agency's headquarters in Geneva, on the 11th of June 2009. On the basis of available evidence and expert assessments of the evidence, the scientific criteria for an influenza pandemic have been met. The Director-General of WHO has therefore decided to raise the level of influenza pandemic alert from phase 5 to phase 6. "The world is now at the start of the 2009 influenza pandemic," she said at a press conference today.

Neither Obama nor Trump jumped right in screaming "The Sky Is Falling", although Obama was much more well spoken in his in his address of the issue, but the actions by both have ended up accomplishing the same thing.  Only we can hope as time goes by there will be fewer people who suffer or die from this disease.

It probably wouldn't be so difficult to confront the unwarranted criticism of this President if a person had all the time in the world to do it and although I may have a desire to tackle that task, it has become evident, it is a waste of time.  April 2009, the Swine flu was noted in the USA.  June 2009, WHO declared a World Pandemic and October 25, 2009 Obama declared a National Emergency.

The first case of this coronavirus was reported in the the USA on January 20,2020.  On March 11, 2020, WHO declared this coronavirus a Pandemic.  On March 13, 2020, Trump declared this coronavirus a National Emergency.

These actions didn't start on March 13, 2020, although some would like us to think so.

Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/summary.html

 
 
 
Dulay
2.1.5  Dulay  replied to  sixpick @2.1.4    2 weeks ago
Neither Obama nor Trump jumped right in screaming "The Sky Is Falling", although Obama was much more well spoken in his in his address of the issue, but the actions by both have ended up accomplishing the same thing. 

The difference is that Obama had Directors and Secretaries of Agencies that were competent. From the CDC's website:

https://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/cdcresponse.htm

On April 26, 2009, the United States Government determined that a public health emergency existed nationwide; CDC’s Strategic National Stockpile (SNS) began releasing 25% of the supplies in the stockpile that could be used to protect and treat influenza. This included 11 million regimens of antiviral drugs, and personal protective equipment including over 39 million respiratory protection devices (masks and respirators), gowns, gloves and face shields, to states (allocations were based on each state’s population).

That was just over 3 weeks after the first case. Azar just talked about not having many requests for SNS materials. WHY is he WAITING to be asked. 

Here's more:

Also on April 30, 2009, HHS announced that the Federal government would purchase an additional 13 million treatment courses of antiviral drugs to help fight influenza icon_out.png . The additional treatment courses would be added to the SNS. As the outbreak spread, CDC began receiving reports of school closures and implementation of community-level social distancing measures meant to slow the spread of disease. School administrators and public health officials were following their pandemic plans and doing everything they could to slow the spread of illness. (Social distancing measures are meant to increase distance between people. Measures include staying home when ill unless to seek medical care, avoiding large gatherings, telecommuting, and implementing school closures).

Then this:

The real-time PCR test developed by CDC was cleared for use by diagnostic laboratories by FDA under an  Emergency Use Authorization (EUA)  on April 28, 2009, less than two weeks after identification of the new pandemic virus. Prior to the availability of this EUA, public health laboratories had been able to identify whether influenza A viruses were seasonal influenza viruses or were a novel strain, but the new diagnostic kits allowed labs to confirm a virus as 2009 H1N1. On May 1, 2009, CDC test kits began shipping to domestic and international public health laboratories. (Each test kit contained reagents to test 1,000 clinical specimens). From May 1 through September 1, 2009, more than 1,000 kits were shipped to 120 domestic and 250 international laboratories in 140 countries. Once labs had the test kits and verified that their testing was running properly, they were able to identify new cases more quickly than before and no longer needed to send samples to CDC for lab confirmation. The transition away from CDC lab confirmation testing didn’t happen overnight though - between April 23 and May 31, 2009, CDC influenza laboratory analyzed about 5,000 influenza virus samples, five times the number that were processed in a similar timeframe in 2008, and more than during any previous influenza season. By May 18, 2009, 40 states had been validated to conduct their own 2009 H1N1 testing, with eight states having multiple laboratories able to do their own testing. CDC alerted the public that the expansion in testing capacity would likely result in a jump in the number of 2009 H1N1 cases, but that this would actually present a more accurate picture of the true scope of 2009 H1N1 influenza in the United States.

So in just ONE MONTH the CDC was shipping out tests and the first 60 days, the CDC had analyzed 5000 samples. 

Contrast that with what has gone on in the last 2 months in the US under Trump. 

Then Trump walks out today, during a COVID-19 task force press briefing, and gloats about the Fed lowering the fucking interest rates. You cannot make this shit up...

 
 
 
sixpick
2.1.6  sixpick  replied to  Dulay @2.1.5    2 weeks ago
On April 26, 2009, the United States Government determined that a public health emergency existed nationwide; CDC’s Strategic National Stockpile (SNS) began releasing 25% of the supplies in the stockpile that could be used to protect and treat influenza. This included 11 million regimens of antiviral drugs

Dulay, you don't just hit the ball back anyway you think you can get it over the net, you want to score or at least keep it in play and you didn't.  You'll notice it was 6 months later when Obama declared the National Emergency on October 25, 2009 and they hadn't progressed any and still just had those 11 million regimens of antiviral drugs, it appears.  Just look at the video.

I'm not going to argue with you any further Dulay.  Trump should have had a better start, because Obama had 8 years to make it so, but he didn't get it over the net either and left the country unprepared for this latest Pandemic.  Just look at the video.

List of national emergencies in the United States

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_national_emergencies_in_the_United_States

Let me emphasize I feel Obama did what he could at the time with what he had to work with.  Obviously, after experiencing the H1N1 (Human Swine Flu) Pandemic, he didn't follow through and prepare this country for any future Pandemics.  I don't know if that is the case, but it sure seems so with 8 whole years to go and statements made in the video above, Trump should have had it easy.  Hopefully Trump will prepare us for future Pandemics a little better.

 
 
 
Dulay
2.1.7  Dulay  replied to  sixpick @2.1.6    2 weeks ago
Dulay, you don't just hit the ball back anyway you think you can get it over the net, you want to score or at least keep it in play and you didn't.  You'll notice it was 6 months later when Obama declared the National Emergency on October 25, 2009 and they hadn't progressed any and still just had those 11 million regimens of antiviral drugs, it appears.  Just look at the video.
I'm not going to argue with you any further Dulay.  Trump should have had a better start, because Obama had 8 years to make it so, but he didn't get it over the net either and left the country unprepared for this latest Pandemic.  Just look at the video.

Way to attempt to make an 'argument' by comparing apples and artichokes.

Those Anitviral drugs were NOT vaccines Six.

LET!

The video you posted was of people waiting to be VACCINATED. So thanks for pointing out that by October, there was a VACCINE for H1N1, which looks to be at least 6 months FASTER than what Trump's officials are predicting for COVID-19. 

The FACT is that the H1N1 VACCINE was not available until the beginning of October 2009 and per the CDC link:

As vaccine supply increased, by late November and early December most states had begun easing restrictions for 2009 H1N1 vaccine use, and by late December vaccination had been opened up to anyone who wanted it.

So you see, per the CDC, Obama [since Trump gets all the praise, so should Obama]  broadly distributed an H1N1 VACCINE within 60 days of it's licensing. 

Trump has failed to accomplish that with just the TEST. 

Obviously, after experiencing the H1N1 (Human Swine Flu) Pandemic, he didn't follow through and prepare this country for any future Pandemics.  I don't know if that is the case, but it sure seems so with 8 whole years to go and statements made in the video above,

If it obvious, why don't you know Six? /s

Trump should have had it easy.  Hopefully Trump will prepare us for future Pandemics a little better.

After cutting the budgets for ALL of the agencies responsible for public health, placing incompetents as Agency heads and eliminating the NSC Pandemic directorate, Trump is the one that made it harder to address this and future pandemics.

Add that to the fact that until the last week Trump has been publicly in denial, has spewed utter bullshit that put people's lives in danger and is STILL more worried about the stock market and investments than he is about the physical health of our citizens. 

But ya, Obama! /s

 
 
 
MrFrost
2.1.8  MrFrost  replied to  WallyW @2.1.1    2 weeks ago
I think the message being sent is to not succumb to mass hysteria and media induced panic.

512

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
2.2  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  WallyW @2    2 weeks ago

I agree.  Those former republicans who started the Lincoln project are really impacted by their TDS.  

 
 
 
pat wilson
2.3  pat wilson  replied to  WallyW @2    2 weeks ago
Trump and his team of professionals experts are starting to get a good handle on this outbreak

They knew about this virus and the scenarios two months ago. TWO MONTHS AGO !!!!

This botched response has been an utter failure.

 
 
 
WallyW
2.3.1  WallyW  replied to  pat wilson @2.3    2 weeks ago
This botched response has been an utter failure.

How was it botched? Please give us detailed specific details why you think so. How is the lack of test kits Trump's fault? Be advised that the hysteria will have died down by midsummer and that Trump will receive all the credit for tte recovery

 
 
 
JBB
2.3.2  JBB  replied to  WallyW @2.3.1    2 weeks ago

In reality by mid Summer we will likely be in our third quarter of negative economic growth making Trump's an official recession thus dooming his chances for reelection and ultimately resulting in the Democrats regaining both the White House and the Senate...

 
 
 
pat wilson
2.3.3  pat wilson  replied to  WallyW @2.3.1    2 weeks ago

Your failure to observe reality is not my problem.

 
 
 
It Is ME
2.3.4  It Is ME  replied to  JBB @2.3.2    2 weeks ago

Doom, Doom, Doom ! jrSmiley_123_smiley_image.gifjrSmiley_42_smiley_image.gif

Like everything else in this country, or on the planet for that matter jrSmiley_38_smiley_image.gif , This too, shall pass ! 

 
 
 
WallyW
2.3.5  WallyW  replied to  pat wilson @2.3.3    2 weeks ago

My grip on reality is strong and steady.

But it seems you're unable to answer some easy questions

 
 
 
WallyW
2.3.6  WallyW  replied to  JBB @2.3.2    2 weeks ago

I'm sorry to inform you that the American people are NOT stupid enough to elect Befuddled Biden or Commie Bernie.

 
 
 
Dean Moriarty
2.3.7  Dean Moriarty  replied to  WallyW @2.3.6    2 weeks ago

I hope you are right but after electing Obama twice I have no confidence in them. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.3.8  JohnRussell  replied to  WallyW @2.3.5    2 weeks ago

Wally, give your opinion and your complaints IN DETAIL. Explain exactly why the critics of trump are wrong. 

Donald Trump said yesterday that Google was going to have a screening process for the virus  "very soon". 

After Trump said that Google said their effort was in the opening stages and openly questioned how Trump characterized them. 

How do you explain the president speaking to the nation and mischaracterizing such a potentially important development? 

Wally, I want you to go into complete detail about this.

It’s been more than a week now since Trump assured the country: “ Anybody, right now, and yesterday, anybody that needs a test, gets a test. They’re there. They have the test. And the test is beautiful.”

He persisted with that thought as recently as Thursday, a day after his Oval Office address, when he asserted “the testing has been going very smooth.” This, as the government’s top infection expert, Dr. Anthony Fauci, was telling lawmakers: “It is a failing, let’s admit it.”

https://apnews.com/19963ea122c12eb72b8f0ff14e84b1b7

Trump was not telling the truth. Please tell us, in detail, why you don't require Donald Trump to tell the truth to you. 

 
 
 
WallyW
2.3.9  WallyW  replied to  JohnRussell @2.3.8    2 weeks ago

Anyone that NEEDS a test can get one. That's true.

Prove it's not. I see you remain confused about the testing procedures and process

 
 
 
It Is ME
2.3.10  It Is ME  replied to  JohnRussell @2.3.8    2 weeks ago

The "Media" is a Wonderful thing to fall on a sword over ! jrSmiley_25_smiley_image.gif

They seem to have to correct themselves when they initially "PUT HYSTERICAL SHIT OUT" in the first place ! jrSmiley_80_smiley_image.gif

https://www.newsweek.com/coronavirus-mortality-rate-covid-19-fatalities-ebola-sars-mers-1489466

"Correction: This article originally stated 8,098 people died of SARS during 2003. This was the number of people who became sick. 774 people died. 
The article originally stated the case-fatality rate of COVID-19 patients aged 70-79 years is 80 percent. It is 8 percent. Newsweek regrets these errors. 

OOOOPS ! jrSmiley_98_smiley_image.gif

I wonder how many folks actually get to the "Bottom" of an article to read "Retractions" or "Corrections" from "Fuck-ups" already in the articles put out for the world to read. jrSmiley_87_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
JohnRussell
2.3.11  JohnRussell  replied to  WallyW @2.3.9    2 weeks ago

Wally, you dont get to define the word 'needs'.  You define needs as anything that comports with what Trump said. 

This was during the time period when Trump was saying that everyone who needed a test could get tested.  

Do sick health care workers in an infected nursing home "need" the test Wally? 

 
 
 
loki12
2.3.12  loki12  replied to  WallyW @2.3.9    2 weeks ago

This was a week ago,

Food and Drug Administration Commissioner Stephen Hahn said the federal government doesn’t know how many individual Americans have been tested for the infection. The number is less than the 5,861 specimens tested, because each patient requires from two and 20 tests to confirm a diagnosis, he said at a briefing for reporters at the White House on Saturday.

If this is accurate, it would take between 660 million and 6.6 billion tests to test everyone in the US, What kind of moron thinks this is possible? are the drug companies supposed to stop making all other tests?

Again from a week ago,

As cases multiply, the U.S. response is set to ramp up substantially, Hahn and Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar said. About 1.1 million tests have been shipped since last week and another 1 million are being prepared, Hahn said, allowing for more than 851,000 patients to be screened for the virus.

So that is 2.1 million test to check 850 thousand, best case scenario, [deleted]

 
 
 
Texan1211
2.3.13  Texan1211  replied to  JBB @2.3.2    2 weeks ago
In reality by mid Summer we will likely be in our third quarter of negative economic growth making Trump's an official recession thus dooming his chances for reelection and ultimately resulting in the Democrats regaining both the White House and the Senate...

Didn't you claim that the good economy under Trump was because of Obama's policies? So why aren't you crediting Obama policies for the downturn?

 
 
 
Jasper2529
2.3.14  Jasper2529  replied to  pat wilson @2.3    2 weeks ago
They knew about this virus and the scenarios two months ago. TWO MONTHS AGO !!!! This botched response has been an utter failure.

One of the first things Trump did was close/restrict entry from China in January. Many on the Left accused him of being a xenophobe and racist. This month, March, he did the same with Europe and was again accused of the same.

People should blame the real source of this pandemic: the Chinese government and its "medical professionals", because they refused to share vital information with the world.

 
 
 
pat wilson
2.3.15  pat wilson  replied to  Jasper2529 @2.3.14    2 weeks ago

Ya, trump telling bolton to 86 the NSC pandemic response office was a big help /s

People should blame the real source of this pandemic:

I don't think anyone is confused about the source, it's the response that was totally botched.

 
 
 
bugsy
2.3.16  bugsy  replied to  JBB @2.3.2    2 weeks ago
In reality by mid Summer we will likely be in our third quarter of negative economic growth

Maybe you are thinking of the Obama administration. The Trump admin has never had a negative economic growth quarter.

 
 
 
WallyW
2.3.17  WallyW  replied to  pat wilson @2.3.15    2 weeks ago
it's the response that was totally botched.

No it wasn't.

 
 
 
Jasper2529
2.3.18  Jasper2529  replied to  pat wilson @2.3.15    2 weeks ago
it's the response that was totally botched.

I listed 2 of the Trump Administration's many responses and implementations in comment 2.3.14 but you ignored them. Oh, well. Have a good Sunday.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
2.3.19  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  pat wilson @2.3    2 weeks ago

If Pence is part of his team, then jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif .

 
 
 
bugsy
2.3.21  bugsy  replied to  Dulay @2.3.20    one week ago

This turned out to be a lie. The truth is it is not 1 hospital, but 7 across the state.

Democrats never let a crisis go to waste, huh?

 
 
 
Dulay
2.3.22  Dulay  replied to  bugsy @2.3.21    one week ago

Link?

 
 
 
bugsy
2.3.23  bugsy  replied to  Dulay @2.3.22    one week ago

https://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3825327/posts

It says 200 nurses over 7 hospitals and 2 states, New York and Connecticut. It is UNCLEAR if all the nurses come from the same hospital, but, hey, why not spew non facts when you think you can get cheap political points?

 
 
 
Dulay
2.3.24  Dulay  replied to  bugsy @2.3.23    one week ago
It is UNCLEAR if all the nurses come from the same hospital, but, hey, why not spew non facts when you think you can get cheap political points?

Interesting that you would say that after claiming this:

It says 200 nurses over 7 hospitals and 2 states, New York and Connecticut.

It does NOT say that bugs. That's one of those 'non facts' you were whining about. Were you trying to get a cheap political point with it? 

It states that the Nurses work for Nuvance Health system, which OPERATES in 2 states in 7 hospitals. It does NOT say that the nurses WORK in both NY and CT. As you stated, it hasn't been confirmed whether all 200 Nurses work in the same hospital. 

 
 
 
bugsy
2.3.25  bugsy  replied to  Dulay @2.3.24    one week ago
it hasn't been confirmed whether all 200 Nurses work in the same hospital. 

That;s my point. The governor is saying he lost 200 nurses from 1 hospital. That clearly is an unknown.

Cheap political point.

 
 
 
Dulay
2.3.26  Dulay  replied to  bugsy @2.3.25    one week ago
That;s my point.

It says 200 nurses over 7 hospitals and 2 states, New York and Connecticut.

It does NOT say that bugs. That's one of those 'non facts' you were whining about. Were you trying to get a cheap political point with it? 

 
 
 
Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom
2.4  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom  replied to  WallyW @2    2 weeks ago
Trump and his team of professionals experts are starting to get a good handle on this outbreak. It is highly unlikely that any other person or entity could have done any better.

[Deleted]

[(Sorry, Larry.)]

 
 
 
Freedom Warrior
3  Freedom Warrior    2 weeks ago

Complete fucking hindsight involving an unprecedented event in our lifetime. Peter  Weiner truly is a major league dick.

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
3.1  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  Freedom Warrior @3    2 weeks ago

He and the Lincoln project are the dick of the GOP elephant.  

 
 
 
Freedom Warrior
3.1.1  Freedom Warrior  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @3.1    2 weeks ago

I’ve seen some things from the Lincoln project attempting to elevate themselves as being incredibly righteous only to  expose  an abhorrent level of phoniness. 

 
 
 
pat wilson
4  pat wilson    2 weeks ago

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5  JohnRussell    2 weeks ago

Trump supporters don't want to or don't know how to face reality, and the rest of us are supposed to be willing to spend four or eight years humoring them. This country is fucked up. Trump is not fit for office and we have had this travesty shoved down our throat anyway.

It's embarrassing to be an American in 2020. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5.1  JohnRussell  replied to  JohnRussell @5    2 weeks ago

Google Contradicts Trump: Coronavirus Site in ‘Early Stages’

The president’s announcement of a screening tool sowed confusion among reporters and officials inside the White House and was quickly clarified by the tech giant.

GettyImages-1200825328_tgxmhq

President Donald Trump appeared to   raise eyebrows   Friday when he announced during his Rose Garden   address   that Google was working on a website to be “very quickly done” that would help members of the public “determine whether a [coronavirus] test is warranted”—a claim that was quickly clarified by the tech giant, which said the tool is still “in the very early stages of development.”  

“I want to thank Google. Google is helping develop a website. It's going to be very quickly done, unlike websites of the past,” Trump said, adding that the company had “1,700 engineers” working on the effort.

The president’s announcement   sowed confusion   among reporters and officials inside the White House about what exactly the president was talking about. Google, too, was reportedly taken aback by Trump’s remarks, especially since his description of a nationwide testing site soon to be available was inaccurate, according to a source at Google cited by  Wired.

Shortly after Trump’s announcement, Google issued its own statement about the site, which appeared to offer a different assessment. The company gave no indication of a timeframe but said the tool, still in early development by Google and Verily, would be tested in the Bay Area “with the hope of expanding more broadly over time.”

The head of communications at Verily, an Alphabet subsidiary, told   The Verge   shortly after Trump's address that the website he described as a sort of screening tool was actually a “triage website” that was intended for health workers rather than the general public.

Carolyn Wang said plans changed to make the website publicly available after Trump's announcement, though it will still only direct people to testing sites in the Bay Area. It is expected to expand beyond California “over time,” Wang was quoted saying.

It was also not immediately clear where Trump got the “1,700 engineers” figure, but an employee at Google told The Daily Beast that point was blatantly incorrect. 

“There's absolutely not 1,700 engineers at Verily. I'm not even sure there are 1,700 people at Verily,”the employee, who wished to remain anonymous, told The Daily Beast Friday. Fewer than 1,000 people work at the biosciences company, the employee said. Google did note on Twitter that Google employees from other divisions had volunteered for the diagnostic project.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/google-says-coronavirus-testing-site-announced-by-trump-still-in-early-stages?source=politics&via=rss

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5.1.1  JohnRussell  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1    2 weeks ago
Brian Tyler Cohen
@briantylercohen

Trump: "If you go back to swine flu, they didn't do testing like this."

H1N1 was first diagnosed on 4/15/09. The CDC called for emergency operations on 4/22/09. 1 million tests were released by 5/15.

We knew about COVID-19 in January. It's March. We've had 11,000 tests so far.

 
 
 
WallyW
5.1.2  WallyW  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.1    2 weeks ago

Not Trump's fault.

 
 
 
lady in black
5.1.3  lady in black  replied to  WallyW @5.1.2    2 weeks ago

Yes, trump's fault....

 
 
 
It Is ME
5.1.4  It Is ME  replied to  lady in black @5.1.3    2 weeks ago

As quick as the "Anti-Trump media" is on everything else, When's the first time you heard the "News" about this ….. ISSUE (travelers have been traveling the entire time)? jrSmiley_87_smiley_image.gif

December 2019 ?

January 2020 ?

February 2020 ?

March 2020 ?

You should have been protecting yourself and others against CV-19, before you even heard about it ! jrSmiley_42_smiley_image.gif

Don't you care about "Others" …... at all ? jrSmiley_97_smiley_image.gifjrSmiley_98_smiley_image.gif

Sheesh ! jrSmiley_27_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5.1.5  JohnRussell  replied to  WallyW @5.1.2    2 weeks ago
Not Trump's fault.

What comes out of Trump's mouth is his fault. It is pathetic how much Trump supporters excuse him.  Trump supporters are a bigger problem in this country than Trump himself is. 

 
 
 
TᵢG
5.1.6  TᵢG  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.5    2 weeks ago
Trump supporters are a bigger problem in this country than Trump himself is. 

Struggling with the logic here.   Seems Trump would be the bigger problem;  his supporters are only a problem because of him.   Or do you have some other factors that you are considering?

 
 
 
It Is ME
5.1.7  It Is ME  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.5    2 weeks ago
Trump supporters are a bigger problem in this country than Trump himself is. 

"The People" speaking....is a "Problem for YOU ? 

Vote "Bernie". It will STOP your nightmares ! He's Big on Government telling one what to do !

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5.1.8  JohnRussell  replied to  TᵢG @5.1.6    2 weeks ago

Donald Trump has lied thousands of times. He has shown extreme ignorance on a myriad of topics. He has personally and specifically insulted hundreds of individual Americans using his "official" way of communicating as president, his twitter page. He has embarrassed America repeatedly when overseas. 

etc etc etc. 

Everyone in this country knows that Trump is not fit to hold the office of president.  The thousands of lies to the public, in itself, makes him unfit. His overall character makes him unfit. He is a known liar crook bigot moron and cheat. 

Without his 40% or so political base, that excuses EVERY SINGLE ONE of his shortcomings (we see that excuse making on NT every minute of every day), Trump would have no support for his abominable behavior. His support in Congress would be MUCH smaller. There are many instances of reports that Republicans in Congress support him only because they are afraid of being voted out of office by Trumpsters. 

When a large part of the people (35 -40% or so) is willing to ignore a leader who lies to them thousands of times, often repeating the same lie 50 or 100 times even after the lie has been pointed out to him,  those supporters are THE problem. They are enabling him to continue being a liar crook bigot moron and cheat. 

 
 
 
TᵢG
5.1.9  TᵢG  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.8    2 weeks ago
Donald Trump has lied thousands of times.   ....

Yes, John, I am aware.    

TiG @5.1.7 ... Seems Trump would be the bigger problem ...

I asked why you think his supporters are a bigger problem than Trump himself.

They are enabling him to continue being a liar crook bigot moron and cheat. 

So you think Trump himself is a lesser problem than his supporters???

 
 
 
Freedom Warrior
5.1.10  Freedom Warrior  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.8    2 weeks ago

I wonder how many times now you’ve been informed that despite all of those shortcomings which you obsess about, Trump represents a better alternative than the one you’re espousing. Somehow that realization never sinks in.

Further Trump represents the in-your-face middle finger response to his  detractors. Do you ever wonder why that is and how it came to be because I observed it regularly over the decades.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5.1.11  JohnRussell  replied to  TᵢG @5.1.9    2 weeks ago

I think my answer to you was quite clear. 

 
 
 
TᵢG
5.1.12  TᵢG  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.11    2 weeks ago

Then you misunderstood the question.

Of course without his supporters Trump would be hobbled.   I am not suggesting that his supporters have nothing to do with this.

What strikes me as odd coming from you is that you are arguing that there is something worse than Trump.   That the greater problem is not Trump but rather his supporters.  

Those same supporters could have been behind someone like, say, John Kasich as PotUS.   Clearly a far better person than Trump.   Partisan support does not really care who is in office as long as the proper letter is next to the name.   So if you are indirectly railing against blind partisanship I would agree.   But blind partisanship is not limited to the R party.

 
 
 
WallyW
5.1.13  WallyW  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.8    2 weeks ago

What lies are you referring to.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
5.1.14  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.5    2 weeks ago

I don't blame Trump for the CV.  I do blame him however for dragging his feet and putting out disinformation.

 
 
 
pat wilson
5.1.15  pat wilson  replied to  WallyW @5.1.2    2 weeks ago

THE WORDS OF A FAILED LEADER:

"No, I don't take responsibility at all."

Here is a brief timeline of the completely incompetent response of the dumbest president in US history to an actual crisis:

• January 22: “We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. It’s going to be just fine.”

• February 2: “We pretty much shut it down coming in from China.”

• February 24: “The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA… Stock Market starting to look very good to me!”

• February 25: “CDC and my Administration are doing a GREAT job of handling Coronavirus.”

• February 25: “I think that's a problem that’s going to go away… They have studied it. They know very much. In fact, we’re very close to a vaccine.”

• February 26: “The 15 (cases in the US) within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero.”

• February 26: “We're going very substantially down, not up.”

• February 27: “One day it’s like a miracle, it will disappear.”

• February 28: “We're ordering a lot of supplies. We're ordering a lot of, uh, elements that frankly we wouldn't be ordering unless it was something like this. But we're ordering a lot of different elements of medical.”

• March 2: “You take a solid flu vaccine, you don't think that could have an impact, or much of an impact, on corona?”

• March 2: “A lot of things are happening, a lot of very exciting things are happening and they’re happening very rapidly.”

• March 4: “If we have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people that get better just by, you know, sitting around and even going to work — some of them go to work, but they get better.”

• March 5: “I NEVER said people that are feeling sick should go to work.”

• March 5: “The United States… has, as of now, only 129 cases… and 11 deaths. We are working very hard to keep these numbers as low as possible!”

• March 6: “I think we’re doing a really good job in this country at keeping it down… a tremendous job at keeping it down.”

• March 6: “Anybody right now, and yesterday, anybody that needs a test gets a test. They’re there. And the tests are beautiful…. the tests are all perfect like the letter was perfect. The transcription was perfect. Right? This was not as perfect as that but pretty good.”

• March 6: “I like this stuff. I really get it. People are surprised that I understand it… Every one of these doctors said, ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability. Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president.”

• March 6: “I don't need to have the numbers double because of one ship that wasn't our fault.”

• March 8: “We have a perfectly coordinated and fine tuned plan at the White House for our attack on CoronaVirus.”

• March 9: “This blindsided the world.”

• March 13: "I don't take responsibility at all."

In a crisis we need a REAL leader not this incompetent joke we call a president.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
5.1.16  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  JohnRussell @5.1.8    2 weeks ago

Even if his tongue were notarized, I still would not believe a word he says.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
5.2  XDm9mm  replied to  JohnRussell @5    2 weeks ago
It's embarrassing to be an American in 2020. 

It WAS embarrassing watching an American President going on global apology tours blaming America for the ills of the world. 

THAT was a period of extreme embarrassment for not only this country, but a slap in the face to every American that lost their own life and the lives of loved ones fighting for the rights of people all over the world.

PS:  If you're so embarrassed to be here, there are other places in the world that I'm sure would welcome you with open arms. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
5.2.1  JohnRussell  replied to  XDm9mm @5.2    2 weeks ago

The claim that Obama repeatedly has apologized for the United States is not borne out by the facts , especially if his full quotes are viewed in context.

Obama often was trying to draw a rhetorical distinction between his policies and that of President Bush, a common practice when the presidency changes parties. The shift in policies, in fact, might have been more dramatic from Clinton to Bush than from Bush to Obama, given how Obama has largely maintained Bush's approach to fighting terrorism.

In other cases, Obama's quotes have been selectively trimmed for political purposes. Or they were not much different than sentiments expressed by Bush or his secretary of state. Republicans may certainly disagree with Obama's handling of foreign policy or particular policies he has pursued, but they should not invent a storyline that does not appear to exist.

Note to GOP speechwriters and campaign ad makers: The apology tour never happened.

pinocchio.gifpinocchio.gifpinocchio.gifpinocchio.gif

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/02/obamas_apology_tour.html

 
 
 
loki12
5.2.2  loki12  replied to  XDm9mm @5.2    2 weeks ago

I was embarrassed when our liberal friends whined like little bitches when trump said he could shoot someone and not lose supporters.....And then defended a President who literally murdered Americans.

Being a liberal used to mean something, not it appears to mean hypocrite.

 
 
 
loki12
5.2.3  loki12  replied to  JohnRussell @5.2.1    2 weeks ago

Washington post fact checkers? Hahahahahahahahahaha. Those are the same morons who promoted the Russian hoax and claimed that 17 agencies said so. Fake News John!

 
 
 
XDm9mm
5.2.4  XDm9mm  replied to  JohnRussell @5.2.1    2 weeks ago
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/02/obamas_apology_tour.html

Note to people attempting a rebuttal to a post.  It is likely a smart move to NOT//NOT use 'The Washington Post' as the source for your rebuttal.   

That would be similar to the Communist Chinese government attempting to accuse the US Military and/or CIA of creating the COVID19 virus in Wuhan Province. 

A laughable argument.

 
 
 
bbl-1
6  bbl-1    2 weeks ago

For me personally I got 'the Trump fatigue' way back when the Trump kept uttering "Little Marco" about a dozen times.  The 'Stormy Who' Trump and his Trumpers are just-----fatiguing.  If they lose will they attack or just go back into normal Ku Kluxer hibernation?

 
 
 
Dean Moriarty
7  Dean Moriarty    2 weeks ago

It’s opinions like this that are really motivating me to vote for Trump. I wish journalists would report the news instead of their opinions of who they would like to see in office. I can’t remember the last time I saw something from The Atlantic that was unbiased and not an opinion piece.

 
 
 
bbl-1
7.1  bbl-1  replied to  Dean Moriarty @7    2 weeks ago

Truth is never 'biased'.  The bias lies with those who will not accept truth or facts.

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
8  The Magic Eight Ball    2 weeks ago
The Trump Presidency Is Over

y'all are too funny.   

cheers :)

 
 
 
It Is ME
9  It Is ME    2 weeks ago

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/peter-wehner-trump-presidency-over/607969/

"To be sure, the president isn’t responsible for either the coronavirus or the disease it causes, COVID-19, and he couldn’t have stopped it from hitting our shores even if he had done everything right. Nor is it the case that the president hasn’t done anything right; in fact, his decision to implement a travel ban on China was prudent. And any narrative that attempts to pin all of the blame on Trump for the coronavirus is simply unfair. The temptation among the president’s critics to use the pandemic to get back at Trump for every bad thing he’s done should be resisted, and schadenfreude is never a good look."

jrSmiley_91_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
WallyW
9.1  WallyW  replied to  It Is ME @9    2 weeks ago

Thanks to Trump's leadership and the Dems reluctant cooperation, extensive strides have been made toward getting ahead of the infection rate. It's likely that new case numbers will begin dropping substantially by mid April.

 
 
 
lady in black
9.1.1  lady in black  replied to  WallyW @9.1    2 weeks ago

Alternative news

 
 
 
It Is ME
9.1.2  It Is ME  replied to  WallyW @9.1    2 weeks ago

This too will pass....just like ALL THE OTHERS have ! jrSmiley_79_smiley_image.gif

It's like folks are watching the "Andromeda Strain" or "Outbreak"  waaaaaaay to many times ! jrSmiley_98_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
JumpDrive
9.2  JumpDrive  replied to  It Is ME @9    2 weeks ago

From the first two paragraphs of your linked article:

...I would never vote for Donald Trump...

...a lot of my Republican friends were befuddled.

What I explained then, and what I have said many times since, is that Trump is fundamentally unfit—intellectually, morally, temperamentally, and psychologically—for office. For me, that is the paramount consideration in electing a president, in part because at some point it’s reasonable to expect that a president will face an unexpected crisis—and at that point, the president’s judgment and discernment, his character and leadership ability, will really matter.
 
 
 
It Is ME
9.2.1  It Is ME  replied to  JumpDrive @9.2    2 weeks ago

It wasn't "MY" linked article. I just "Re-Linked" the article we are commenting on.

Click the "BIG SEED" Button at the top. jrSmiley_82_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
9.2.2  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  JumpDrive @9.2    2 weeks ago
 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
9.2.3  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @9.2.2    2 weeks ago

Trump is not remotely finished.  He’s going to guide us through this crisis and restore our economy to what it was before China trashed our economy.  Trump will cruise to re election in 2020 by a grateful nation.  

 
 
 
Nerm_L
10  Nerm_L    2 weeks ago

Gee, that's swell.  The reality is that the interconnected global civilization that the experts have been working to create for the last 70 years completely melted down in nine weeks.  Free trade and open borders are responsible for the pandemic.  And those global open borders have allowed the virus to spread rapidly.  Supply-side Republicans and Democrats bear the responsibility for what is happening.

Testing won't provide any medical benefit.  Besides, the test kits that everyone is hyping about are actually sampling kits.  There isn't an on-site, immediate test for coronavirus (or influenza, for that matter).  The only thing testing accomplishes is data collection.  The COVID-19 virus is new and novel; there aren't any cures or vaccines and testing won't provide any guidance for treatment.  Medical experts have been telling the public that the only treatment regime available is quarantine, hygiene, and social distancing.

Blaming Trump only provides a scapegoat that avoids public scrutiny of globalization as cause for the spread of COVID-19 and the failure of our medical infrastructure to actually practice medicine.   Globalization has created risks that the experts blithely ignored.  

 
 
 
It Is ME
10.1  It Is ME  replied to  Nerm_L @10    2 weeks ago
Gee, that's swell.  The reality is that the interconnected global civilization that the experts have been working to create for the last 70 years completely melted down in nine weeks.

Exactly !

Being strictly "Global" has it's MAJOR drawbacks. 

 
 
 
loki12
10.2  loki12  replied to  Nerm_L @10    2 weeks ago
Blaming Trump only provides a scapegoat that avoids public scrutiny of globalization

DIng, Ding, Ding,  We have a winner, every liberal who was complaining about trumps border policy and trade deals and who are now complaining about how he is handling this are fucking hypocrites, but they lack the integrity to admit it and say they were wrong so they just blame trump for their failures in life......again.

The good thing is we can add this to the HUGE list of things these morons have said would end his Presidency, where are we now? 8 or 9?  

 
 
 
Freedom Warrior
10.3  Freedom Warrior  replied to  Nerm_L @10    2 weeks ago

True but it’s a byproduct of an inevitable process, so blaming something that is inevitable really doesn’t accomplish much either and then the question turns to how do you manage it properly and what I’ve observed so far has been that a recognition of the threat that China poses to ourselves and the world should be something near the top of everyone’s mind right now.

 
 
 
Nerm_L
10.3.1  Nerm_L  replied to  Freedom Warrior @10.3    2 weeks ago
True but it’s a byproduct of an inevitable process, so blaming something that is inevitable really doesn’t accomplish much either and then the question turns to how do you manage it properly and what I’ve observed so far has been that a recognition of the threat that China poses to ourselves and the world should be something near the top of everyone’s mind right now.

Inevitable?  The Hellenic Empire, Roman Empire, Holy Roman Empire, Ottoman Empire, and British Empire suggest that the only inevitability is collapse.  Globalization is nothing new or unique to modern times.  The elite have been trying create global empires throughout history.  All have collapsed.  

The facts of history clearly demonstrate that globalization is a foolish idea.  Globalization hasn't worked in the past and nothing suggests that globalization will work in the future.  We are watching history repeat itself.

China is only a threat this time.  The problem really isn't China; the threat are elites who ignore history.  As the seeded article shows, the elites are searching for scapegoats to avoid accountability for their lack of historical hindsight.  The elites are going to blame Trump for failing to save the house of cards they have built.

The global institution that is supposed to manage a global health crisis is the World Health Organization.  But the elites aren't going to blame a global institution because that would focus public attention on their own stupidity.  The WHO is supposed to manage coordination between countries during a pandemic.  So, why not blame the WHO?

 
 
 
Freedom Warrior
10.3.2  Freedom Warrior  replied to  Nerm_L @10.3.1    2 weeks ago

Yes I think that it is all inevitable so excuse my fatalism but it is factually based. I don’t seek to blame anyone, rather I prefer to acknowledge and accept that reality while knowing that collapse is certainly a possibility so to are our choices in response to such an existential existence. 

These are the discussions I am having with my colleagues and family and the  choice is not to give up but to move forward with the best choices we can make in an imperfect world. Relying on others is not my first choice however and dependence on a nation state antithetical to my existence is abhorrent to my natural being.

 
 
 
Dulay
10.4  Dulay  replied to  Nerm_L @10    2 weeks ago
Blaming Trump only provides a scapegoat that avoids public scrutiny of globalization as cause for the spread of COVID-19 and the failure of our medical infrastructure to actually practice medicine.   Globalization has created risks that the experts blithely ignored.  

That's ridiculous. Seriously, there has been extensive international travel for over 100 years. International trade for much more than that. Trying to pretend that 'globalization' is some kind of boogie man is laughable. Unless and until the world decides that we ALL want to go back to the stone age, we as a planet would be much better served to address reality rather than fantasy. 

 
 
 
Nerm_L
10.4.1  Nerm_L  replied to  Dulay @10.4    2 weeks ago
That's ridiculous. Seriously, there has been extensive international travel for over 100 years. International trade for much more than that. Trying to pretend that 'globalization' is some kind of boogie man is laughable. Unless and until the world decides that we ALL want to go back to the stone age, we as a planet would be much better served to address reality rather than fantasy. 

Need to add a zero; international travel has been around for more than 1,000 years.  The era of colonization required travel, although, technically that travel wasn't international.  Keep in mind that the human population was a little over 400 million in 1300 when the Black Death pandemic occurred.  The Black Death was caused by international travel, too.

There hasn't been any global civilizations throughout history that survived.  If globalization is inevitable then history tells us that collapse is also inevitable.  Our modern global civilization has proven to be less resilient simply because that global civilization has been built upon exploitation made possible by cheap, abundant fossil fuels.  Even now countries are trying to exploit the COVID-19 pandemic for economic and political purposes.

The pertinent question is whether or not we ignore the lessons of history.  Yes, the modern global civilization is attractive because exploitation can be quite profitable.  But what we are experiencing really does demonstrate that exploitation isn't sustainable.  Our modern global civilization must inevitably collapse.

 
 
 
Dulay
10.4.2  Dulay  replied to  Nerm_L @10.4.1    2 weeks ago
There hasn't been any global civilizations throughout history that survived. 

What 'global civilization' are you talking about? There have been 'empires' that have dissolved but the 'civilizations' that they ruled over still very much exist. 

There is no such thing as a 'global civilization', modern or otherwise.  

The pertinent question is whether or not we ignore the lessons of history. 

Since your historical predicate is flawed, you'll have to correct that before that question is pertinent. 

 
 
 
loki12
11  loki12    2 weeks ago

An example of what we have come to expect from the leftest bullshit that comes out of the MSM when a republican is in charge instead of a democrat.

Trump closes borders and bans air travel, he then works with the Private sector on testing and using their facilities for testing areas where none may be available, The evil walmart and walgreeens. Plus he suspends student loan interest so you don't accumulate debt when you can't work or go to school.  With all this the Main stream Media headline would be........

Trump Administration Fails to Protect US Citizens From Pandemic and Takes No Action!

Now if that senile old fool Biden was in charge he would be touting open borders and how everyone is entitled to the best healthcare, completely overwhelming the system leading to worst case scenarios, at a 3% mortality rate, that is 10 million mostly elderly deaths, what would the MSM headline read like?

Biden Single Handily Restores Social Security to Solvency.  And Takes Giant step to solving Global Warming!

 
 
 
Krishna
11.1  Krishna  replied to  loki12 @11    2 weeks ago
Biden Single Handily Restores Social Security to Solvency.

Are you aware of the fact that Biden is not president?

(This is just yet another example of the BDS (the widespread "Biden Derangement Syndrome") that is so commonplace here on NT! jrSmiley_5_smiley_image.png

 
 
 
Texan1211
11.1.1  Texan1211  replied to  Krishna @11.1    2 weeks ago
Are you aware of the fact that Biden is not president?

Pretty sure HE is.

Otherwise, why would he have written THIS?

Now if that senile old fool Biden was in charge he would be touting open borders and how everyone is entitled to the best healthcare, completely overwhelming the system leading to worst case scenarios, at a 3% mortality rate, that is 10 million mostly elderly deaths, what would the MSM headline read like?
Biden Single Handily Restores Social Security to Solvency.  And Takes Giant step to solving Global Warming!

The bold was my doing to illustrate my exact POINT.

 
 
 
loki12
11.1.2  loki12  replied to  Texan1211 @11.1.1    2 weeks ago

sigh, they will defend him even after he turns to Jill in a live broadcast and says, “mommy I pooped myself again” and this is the best they have.

 
 
 
Krishna
12  Krishna    2 weeks ago

I just finished watching today's news conference. I was quite surprised-- Trump did not look well. I have never seen him look this way.

My guess is that he already has the Corona Virus. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
12.1  Texan1211  replied to  Krishna @12    2 weeks ago

So, no official diagnosis--just a guess, eh?

 
 
 
loki12
12.1.1  loki12  replied to  Texan1211 @12.1    2 weeks ago

Hahahahahahahahahaha.........

and the winner is.......

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/03/14/politics/trump-press-conference-coronavirus/index.html

Trump tests negative, and the left is proven wrong again!

 
 
 
cjcold
12.2  cjcold  replied to  Krishna @12    2 weeks ago

Heard it on the radio and he definitely sounded like he was sick. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
12.3  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Krishna @12    2 weeks ago

Actually, he did finally get tested and it was negative.  He always like 250 lbs of condemned veal.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
12.3.1  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @12.3    2 weeks ago

looks like*

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
12.3.2  Trout Giggles  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @12.3    2 weeks ago

And that could be lie Number 17,999

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
12.3.3  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Trout Giggles @12.3.2    one week ago

Good point.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
13  Paula Bartholomew    2 weeks ago

It will only be over if the EC does not fuck us again.

 
 
 
cjcold
13.1  cjcold  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @13    2 weeks ago

It will only be over if we all get out the vote.

 
 
 
WallyW
13.2  WallyW  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @13    2 weeks ago

You won't to worry about that...it will be a double digit win for Trump

 
 
 
Krishna
13.2.1  Krishna  replied to  WallyW @13.2    2 weeks ago

You won't to worry about that...it will be a double digit win for Trump

What makes you so sure he will even run?

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
13.2.2  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Krishna @13.2.1    2 weeks ago

He is too much of a narcissist not to run.

 
 
 
Texan1211
13.3  Texan1211  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @13    2 weeks ago
It will only be over if the EC does not fuck us again.

Claiming the EC fucked us is like saying that the EC fucked us EVERY Presidential election.

That is incorrect.

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
13.4  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @13    2 weeks ago
It will only be over if the EC does not fuck us again.

the EC worked exactly as designed. but blaming others is much easier huh?  

the left lost on policy in 2016 and will again next election.

 
 
 
dennis smith
13.5  dennis smith  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @13    2 weeks ago

Ae you saying everything is the EC fault?

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
14  Buzz of the Orient    2 weeks ago

 "BEWARE THE IDES OF MARCH"

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
15  sandy-2021492    2 weeks ago

You know, I really hope this is true.  But there are still plenty of people who are minimizing this pandemic - acting like it's just a common cold, or complaining that the media is fueling panic. 

The media is just reporting the facts, including interviews with experts from the Trump administration.  I haven't heard a single news anchor telling people to go buy all the toilet paper.  People are choosing to panic.

 
 
 
bccrane
15.1  bccrane  replied to  sandy-2021492 @15    2 weeks ago
The media is just reporting the facts,

Yes they are, but do they need to be 24/7 constantly in your face about it?  Our governor closed all the schools in Michigan from today to April 6, some in our area closed last Friday. 

Last Friday the geese flew over in disperse patterns in fear, but today they are in tight "V" formations again so they are over their fear already.

 
 
 
WallyW
15.1.1  WallyW  replied to  bccrane @15.1    2 weeks ago
The media is just reporting the facts.

That ain't necessarily so.

 
 
 
bccrane
15.1.2  bccrane  replied to  WallyW @15.1.1    2 weeks ago

Yep.

Do you remember when there were studies by experts that conservatives basically live in fear and yet here we are being criticized for not fearing this enough.

Maybe the fear factor gives the person the ability to cope with fears better and those without the fear factor overreact and panic when a fear crops up. 

 
 
 
WallyW
16  WallyW    2 weeks ago

The media is indeed intentionally fueling this panic by endless worst case scenarios in a concentrated effort to make Trump look bad, which has not happened. All this media induced hysteria has done is to hurt the little people and caused panic buying, including guns and ammo

 
 
 
MrFrost
16.1  MrFrost  replied to  WallyW @16    2 weeks ago

The media is indeed intentionally fueling this panic by endless worst case scenarios in a concentrated effort to make Trump look bad, which has not happened. All this media induced hysteria has done is to hurt the little people and caused panic buying, including guns and ammo

So posting facts makes trump look bad. Gee Wally, I think you're finally getting it. 

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
16.1.1  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  MrFrost @16.1    one week ago

Publishing facts makes Biden look bad.  https://www.instagram.com/p/B-COQGZDus9/?igshid=yc983h4fdhso

 
 
 
Krishna
16.2  Krishna  replied to  WallyW @16    2 weeks ago
The media is indeed intentionally fueling this panic by endless worst case scenarios in a concentrated effort to make Trump look bad,

I'd be curious to know what your basis is for believing that Fox News is not part of the media? 

 
 
 
MrFrost
16.2.1  MrFrost  replied to  Krishna @16.2    2 weeks ago

I'd be curious to know what your basis is for believing that Fox News is not part of the media? 

It's that old, "everyone else is wrong, i'm right", mantra. 

 
 
 
dennis smith
16.2.2  dennis smith  replied to  Krishna @16.2    2 weeks ago

Fox news is as guilty as the CNN/MSNBC etc.

 
 
 
dennis smith
16.3  dennis smith  replied to  WallyW @16    2 weeks ago

The media has the ability to remind people not to panic buy, but have so for refused

 
 
 
Dulay
16.3.1  Dulay  replied to  dennis smith @16.3    2 weeks ago
The media has the ability to remind people not to panic buy, but have so for refused

After years of being told by Trump and his sycophants that the media are the enemy, WHY would anyone listen to what they say? 

Fox has been telling their sheeple that COVID-19 is just like the flu, no worries, everyone's overreacting, go to your neighborhood pub. Now with Trump's whiplash Fox is still concentrating on the economic effect of the virus. Perhaps now that Trump is starting to take this seriously,  they'll interview better medical 'experts' than Ronny Jackson. 

 
 
 
Krishna
16.3.2  Krishna  replied to  dennis smith @16.3    one week ago
The media has the ability to remind people not to panic buy, but have so for refused

How many hours a week (or day?) do you watch MSNBC? Because I've noticed just the opposite iof what you say-- recently there was another long segment about that. (Actually there a something similar a few days ago on Fox).

 
 
 
bugsy
16.3.3  bugsy  replied to  Dulay @16.3.1    one week ago
ox has been telling their sheeple that COVID-19 is just like the flu, no worries, everyone's overreacting, go to your neighborhood pub.

Link?

 
 
 
JBB
16.3.4  JBB  replied to  bugsy @16.3.3    one week ago
 
 
 
bugsy
16.3.5  bugsy  replied to  JBB @16.3.4    one week ago

Sorry but media matters is a far left wing rag to not be trusted. Anyone with a brain cell knows this. In addition, the entire article is nothing but left wing opinion babble.Absolutely noting informative.

 
 
 
dennis smith
16.3.6  dennis smith  replied to  Dulay @16.3.1    one week ago

The media has been doing the same thing for many years before Trump became POTUS. As usual your hatred of Trump is the basis of your entire comment.

 
 
 
dennis smith
16.3.7  dennis smith  replied to  bugsy @16.3.3    one week ago

You will get no link from Dulay, he simply hates Trump based on his comments since Trump was elected.

 
 
 
dennis smith
16.3.8  dennis smith  replied to  Krishna @16.3.2    one week ago

I watch Fox, CNN and MSNBC probably 1/2 to 1 hour each per day. All of them have a history of being prejudiced and all of them are suddenly reporting better than before. 

 
 
 
Dulay
16.3.9  Dulay  replied to  dennis smith @16.3.6    6 days ago
The media has been doing the same thing for many years before Trump became POTUS.

The media has been saying the media is the enemy of the state? 

As usual your hatred of Trump is the basis of your entire comment.

As usual, you have no idea WTF you are talking about. 

 
 
 
Dulay
16.3.10  Dulay  replied to  dennis smith @16.3.7    6 days ago
You will get no link from Dulay, he simply hates Trump based on his comments since Trump was elected.

The link provided by JBB does a fine job of proving my point. 

 
 
 
Veronica
17  Veronica    2 weeks ago

May I ask a serious question?  I would like an honest answer.  Is there anything Trump could do or not do that would make you stop supporting and defending him?  I just do not understand blind faith in any person.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Veronica @17    2 weeks ago

I can't wait to hear that answer

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
17.1.1  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.1    2 weeks ago

both of you better have plenty of time on your hands

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
17.1.2  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.1    one week ago

Can you understand cricketneese?

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.1.3  Trout Giggles  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @17.1.2    6 days ago

Only when one is calling for a mate

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
17.2  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  Veronica @17    one week ago

May I ask a serious question? I would like an honest answer.  Is there anything Trump could do or not do that would make you stop hating and attacking him?  I just do not understand blind hostility directed at any person.  

 
 
 
Krishna
17.2.1  Krishna  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @17.2    one week ago
May I ask a serious question? I would like an honest answer.  Is there anything Trump could do or not do that would make you stop hating and attacking him?

Well, for starters he could stop the continual stream of lies.

And he could improve the character of the people he appoints-- a fair number are currently under indictment ....

And while I don't personally care that much, screwing around with porn stars and in fact any women while married does set a bad example for our kids.

And there's there his pal Putin....

And that's just for starters. The guy is a real sleazebag...and that's one of his better traits!

 
 
 
JBB
17.2.2  JBB  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @17.2    one week ago

He could resign and go into exile on Elba!

 
 
 
Veronica
17.2.3  Veronica  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @17.2    one week ago

So you refuse to answer the question &instead deflect it onto me.  Where have I ever attacked the man or spewed hatred?  I state that I do not like the man, but I have never attacked him.  But you have no answer for my question.  

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.2.4  Trout Giggles  replied to  Krishna @17.2.1    one week ago
for starters he could stop the continual stream of lies.

If he could just do that, I might be able to trust him a smidgen more

 
 
 
TᵢG
17.2.5  TᵢG  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @17.2    one week ago
Is there anything Trump could do or not do that would make you stop hating and attacking him?

You might be misinterpreting a bit.   I think most anti-Trumpers are just frustrated having Trump as our PotUS.   He is an embarrassment; a perpetual illustration to the rest of the world of the low standards of the USA electorate.

Not wanting Trump to be PotUS is not the same as hatred.   I suspect plenty of people actually do hate Trump, but I also suspect the majority simply want him to no longer be PotUS.    That is, I trust that most people are more rational than emotional.

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
17.2.6  sandy-2021492  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.2.4    one week ago
If he could just do that, I might be able to trust him a smidgen more

TBH, hes' been lying so long that it would take a long time before he could gain my trust.

 
 
 
It Is ME
17.2.7  It Is ME  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.2.4    one week ago
If he could just do that, I might be able to trust him a smidgen more

" Actions " really do "Speak Louder than Words".

"Trust Me" ..... and Representative Omar ! jrSmiley_18_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom
17.2.8  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom  replied to  sandy-2021492 @17.2.6    one week ago
TBH, hes' been lying so long that it would take a long time before he could gain my trust.

He's been lying on CNN all morning.  And PS:  You can tell when he's talking out his ass because Dr. Fauci crosses his arms across his chest.  He has them crossed now and Pompeo is talking.

 
 
 
Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom
17.2.9  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.2.4    one week ago
If he could just do that, I might be able to trust him a smidgen more

You are a much better person than me.  (Of course I've known that for years.)

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.2.10  Trout Giggles  replied to  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom @17.2.8    one week ago

I wish he would just let Dr Fauci give all the press briefings. That guy knows what he's talking about

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.2.11  Trout Giggles  replied to  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom @17.2.9    one week ago

I think quite a few would disagree with you....

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
17.2.12  sandy-2021492  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.2.10    one week ago

Fauci is the most trusted person in the room now.  Trump would do well to button his lip and just nod along to whatever Fauci says.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.2.13  Trout Giggles  replied to  sandy-2021492 @17.2.12    one week ago

Or better yet...take a nap

 
 
 
Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom
17.2.14  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom  replied to  Trout Giggles @17.2.11    one week ago
I think quite a few would disagree with you....

Dog-do!

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
17.2.15  Trout Giggles  replied to  Sister Mary Agnes Ample Bottom @17.2.14    one week ago

They know who they are.....

 
 
 
Dulay
17.2.16  Dulay  replied to  sandy-2021492 @17.2.6    one week ago
TBH, hes' been lying so long that it would take a long time before he could gain my trust.

Which is the why the question: So what? is so galling. The American people need a POTUS who they can trust to tell the truth to them. We all know that Trump cannot be trusted. Even Trump's sycophants admit that he is a compulsive liar.  

 
 
 
Krishna
17.2.17  Krishna  replied to  sandy-2021492 @17.2.6    one week ago
TBH, hes' been lying so long that it would take a long time before he could gain my trust.

What I find so interesting is that his diehard supporters are not bothered at all by his frequent lying. And they (especially the self-proclaimed "Christians") could care less that he's cheated on his wife...one of his liasons being with a porn star no less!

And then his associations with convicted and indicted felons. 

And "grab 'em by the p*ssy"? Nah-- his devout "Christian" supporters aren't bothered by that in the least!

 
 
 
Krishna
17.2.18  Krishna  replied to  Krishna @17.2.17    one week ago

And "grab 'em by the p*ssy"? Nah-- his devout "Christian" supporters aren't bothered by that in the least!

(I sometimes wonder-- do these so-called "Christians" supporters (CINOs?) have their kids watch trump on TV...as a role-model and an inspiration? 

 
 
 
Dean Moriarty
17.2.19  Dean Moriarty  replied to  Krishna @17.2.17    one week ago

No they can weigh that against two conservative Supreme Court Justices and a tax cut and they end up on the winning end of the stick with Trump. 

 
 
 
Larry Hampton
17.2.20  seeder  Larry Hampton  replied to  Dean Moriarty @17.2.19    one week ago

Your correct Dean, Too many Christians have placed ideology above practicality, the truth, or moral compulsion. 

 
 
 
sandy-2021492
17.2.21  sandy-2021492  replied to  Dean Moriarty @17.2.19    one week ago

How very Machiavellian.

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
17.2.22  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Krishna @17.2.18    one week ago
"grab 'em by the p*ssy"?   his devout "Christian" supporters aren't bothered by that in the least!

why would we be?

trump was talking about when women throw themselves at him.

every time a woman throws herself at me I grab her by the p*ssy also.

the one time I didn't?  she got mad at me... LOL, never making that mistake again.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
17.2.23  JohnRussell  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.2.22    one week ago

no one cares

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
17.2.24  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  JohnRussell @17.2.23    one week ago
no one cares

no one cares what you say?  ya got that right.

cheers :)

 
 
 
XDm9mm
17.2.25  XDm9mm  replied to  JohnRussell @17.2.23    one week ago
no one cares

You do JR, you do.

 
 
 
Krishna
17.2.26  Krishna  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.2.22    one week ago
every time a woman throws herself at me I grab her by the p*ssy also.

Well, then you are a role model for our children...just like Trump!

Congraulations...! jrSmiley_27_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Krishna
17.2.27  Krishna  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.2.22    one week ago
trump was talking about when women throw themselves at him. every time a woman throws herself at me I grab her by the p*ssy also.

But . . .What Would Jesus Do?

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
17.2.28  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Krishna @17.2.27    one week ago

for one thing... jesus would not take trumps words out of context.

and umm... there was that bit about:  "let those without sin cast the first stone"

seriously, if a woman throws herself at someone?  she wants her p*ssy grabbed.  that is her plan from the start.

about trying to act like trump said he would just grab any woman he wanted by the p*ssy?    jesus would say, "do not bear false witness.  (in other words... don't lie. )   perpetuating lies and using jesus' name for cover?  can't be good.   

 

 
 
 
Larry Hampton
17.2.29  seeder  Larry Hampton  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.2.22    one week ago

trump was talking about when women throw themselves at him.

Oh yeah; really? How do you know that? That is extremely disgusting and totally wrong.

Only a cad or creep would EVER take advantage of such a situation. Oh, never mind, I just described rump. Do you also fit that definition?

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
17.2.30  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Larry Hampton @17.2.29    one week ago

you apparently have a differing view of what's actually going on when a woman throws herself at someone./

your problem, not mine, or trumps... LOL

everyone else knew the left was full of shit and elected him.

the left's credibility was never lower than in 2016 

now?  even lower.

 

 
 
 
Larry Hampton
17.2.31  seeder  Larry Hampton  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.2.30    one week ago

So to you, if an opportunity for grabbing pussy is open, it’s because the woman was “ throwing herself” at you.  Ok. 
A word to the wise women, beware of creeps who would attempt to have their way with you and then later say it was because you were “throwing yourself” at them. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
17.2.41  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  Krishna @17.2.1    one week ago

He can no more stop lying than I can unbend a pretzel.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
17.2.42  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  JBB @17.2.2    one week ago

Does Elba have WiFi?

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
17.2.43  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @17.2.42    one week ago

I have cleaned up this thread and now am closing it, so that quality discussion can go on elsewhere. 

 
 
 
The Magic Eight Ball
17.3  The Magic Eight Ball  replied to  Veronica @17    one week ago
Is there anything Trump could do or not do that would make you stop supporting and defending him?

sure.. a bunch of things.

  • had he signed the tpp and paris agreements?  that would do it.
  • had he not pushed to secure the border? that would do it.
  • had he put a liberal justice on the supreme court?  that would do it.
  • had he not put an end to the icc and wto interfering in our business?  that would do it.

 

I could go on....  but why?

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
17.3.1  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.3    one week ago

All are good points

 
 
 
Veronica
17.3.2  Veronica  replied to  The Magic Eight Ball @17.3    6 days ago

Why not?  If you found out that he had killed someone would you support him?  If you found out that he was involved in human trafficking would you support him?  Or as long as he (a former democrat) tells you what you want to hear and does anything against democrats you are ok with him?

You ask why should you go on?  If you have to ask that question why bother answering at all. 

 
 
 
XDm9mm
17.3.3  XDm9mm  replied to  Veronica @17.3.2    6 days ago
Why not? 

Simply because the left invariably refuses to accept any positives.

If you found out that he had killed someone would you support him? 

Predicated on circumstances.  There are times when people kill others and there are legitimate reasons.  Hell, Trump and Obama both did that by proxy.

If you found out that he was involved in human trafficking would you support him? 

Well, I know that he along with federal law enforcement are doing everything in their power to stop that as much as possible.  

Or as long as he (a former democrat) tells you what you want to hear and does anything against democrats you are ok with him?

His actions are preferable to his words, and yes, there are times when I want to shout at the TV "DONALD....  JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!"

You ask why should you go on?  If you have to ask that question why bother answering at all. 

I've provided the answers.  Now, is there anything you will admit is positive?  Or is everything all bad.  Be specific.  Who knows, maybe we can even get to a compromise.

 
 
 
Veronica
17.3.4  Veronica  replied to  XDm9mm @17.3.3    6 days ago

I have yet to see anything positive from him.  I do not like the man - did not like him before he became a Republican.  

I am sorry, but you did not answer the questions.  Would you support him if he murdered someone?  Would you support him if you found out he was involved in human trafficking?  Your responses were not answers to the questions at all - an answer would be yes or no, not a deflection away from the question.

 
 
 
dennis smith
17.4  dennis smith  replied to  Veronica @17    one week ago

May I ask a serious question?  I would like an honest answer.  Is there anything Trump could do or not do that would make you stop supporting and defending him?  I just do not understand blind faith in any person.

The same question applies to all elected officials. They are given blind faith by those that elected them.

 
 
 
Veronica
17.4.1  Veronica  replied to  dennis smith @17.4    6 days ago

True, BUT that was not the question posed.  If you cannot say how far you would go in your support then I guess he has a blank check from you.

 
 
 
Donald J. Trump Fan #1
17.5  Donald J. Trump Fan #1  replied to  Veronica @17    one week ago

i remember when we asked a similar question of Obama supporters.  

 
 
 
Veronica
17.5.1  Veronica  replied to  Donald J. Trump Fan #1 @17.5    6 days ago

So once again you refuse to answer the question.  I was never asked that of Obama, myself, so it does not apply.  If you can't answer the question then admit that there is nothing this man could do that would make you turn your back on people.

 
 
 
Freewill
18  Freewill    6 days ago

To be honest, whether Trump's presidency is over should be the least of our concerns.  Getting through this situation together with the least amount of pain, suffering, death and economic peril should be the primary concern.  Does the President, lie, mis-speak, bumble the technical details at times?  Does a bear shit in the woods?  Of course he does.  The important question though, is does he follow the recommendations of the  experts who have the most experience during this unprecedented and dynamic situation, and make the best of the resources already at his disposal at the NIAID, CDC, and other medical resources?

I have seen some references to Anthony Fauci, director of the NIAID since 1984, in the discussion above.  Can we all agree that Mr. Fauci is an authority who can be trusted in advising a President on matters like COVID-19?  My inclination, after much reading, is to trust what this man has to say. 

In another article at The Atlantic , here is what he said,

Nicholas:   Have you felt pressure from the Trump administration to deliver a particular message about the coronavirus?

Fauci:   No, they’ve not [pressured me]. [ Laughs. ] I’m not sure why.

I made up my mind a long time ago, Peter—and this goes back to the first time I had to speak the truth to Ronald Reagan about the seriousness of HIV/AIDS, when people were not paying attention to it. I was, like, the lone wolf out there:   This is going to be big. We’ve got to do something about it. I’m doing the same thing now. And my attitude is: I’m going to keep doing that. I don’t think they’re going to try to silence me. I think that would be foolish on their part. And I don’t even think they want to. I think, in some respects, they welcome my voice out there telling the truth. I’m going to keep doing it. And no matter what happens to me, I’m going to keep doing it.

Nicholas:   How does Trump compare with other presidents with whom you’ve worked?

Fauci:   He has a very unique style. But the thing that encourages me is that every time I’ve asked him to do something—cut out China travel, or go to the mitigation guidelines—he’s always ultimately listened to what I’ve said. When I’ve said,  I really think we should do this , he’s never said no and overruled my recommendation. No matter what his style is, when it comes to the core of what gets done, thankfully, he has listened to me.

Underlined emphasis mine.  Now when you look at some of the author's spin on what was learned in his interview with Fauci, and some of the other articles at The Atlantic, you realize that nothing Fauci said even remotely supports the conclusions drawn by this author, or other authors at The Atlantic, with respect to the President's willingness and actions to follow Fauci's recommendations.  This demonstrates something I have found to be quite common with those who wish to criticize the President for his actions, or reactions, to this crisis; a tendency to ignore the fact that this is a dynamic situation that requires shifting strategies and trust in the experts to ultimately guide policy.  Instead, the focus is on silly anecdotal snippets of stupid things the President has uttered rather than on the fact that ultimately he has followed the advice of the primary expert in the field on policy/action/response every step of the way.

Just my observations. Fauci also spoke of he and the President sharing views on the virus today in an article on CNN Politics, despite minor differences in approach or presentation.

Fauci says 'there isn't, fundamentally, a difference' between his view and Trump's on coronavirus .

 
 
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