Trump Pardons Michael Flynn, Who Pleaded Guilty To Lying About Russia Contact : NPR
Category: News & Politics
Via: sister-mary-agnes-ample-bottom • 4 years ago • 204 commentsBy: Sidney Powell (NPR. org)
S E E D E D C O N T E N T
President Trump has pardoned his first national security adviser Michael Flynn, who spent years enmeshed in an often bizarre legal war with the government that sprung from the Russia investigation.
Trump announced the news on Twitter as Americans prepared to observe the Thanksgiving holiday this week.
It is my Great Honor to announce that General Michael T. Flynn has been granted a Full Pardon. Congratulations to @GenFlynn and his wonderful family, I know you will now have a truly fantastic Thanksgiving!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) November 25, 2020
The pardon brings an end to a long-running legal odyssey for Flynn, who was the only member of the Trump administration to be charged as part of special counsel Robert Mueller's Russia investigation.
Flynn pleaded guilty in 2017 to lying to the FBI about his contacts with the Russian ambassador, and then cooperated extensively with prosecutors. But he ultimately reversed course and accused the government of trying to frame him.
Flynn went to so far as to withdraw his first plea of guilty and substitute a second plea of not guilty, even though he'd acknowledged the underlying conduct that was against the law and been close to receiving a sentence.
The pardon was expected to draw intense condemnation from critics who've said Trump's actions interfere with the justice system.
It also opens the door to possible clemency for other former Trump advisers who were indicted as part of the Russia investigation, including former campaign chairman Paul Manafort.
Longtime military spy boss
Flynn is a retired Army lieutenant general who once led the Defense Intelligence Agency.
He became a security and geopolitical consultant in private life and took tens of thousands of dollars in payments from Russian entities. In 2015, Russia's state-backed TV network RT paid him $45,000 to attend a dinner in Moscow where he sat at the right arm of President Vladimir Putin.
Back in the United States, Flynn became a vocal supporter of Trump's outsider campaign in the 2016 presidential race. At the Republican National Convention that year, Flynn led the crowd in chants of "lock her up" about Trump's rival, Hillary Clinton.
When Trump took office in January 2017, Flynn was rewarded for his loyalty with the job of national security adviser, a post that put him in the White House at the president's side.
But questions already were swirling about Flynn's Russian contacts, including with Russia's then-ambassador to the United States, Sergey Kislyak. Flynn was forced to resign after less than a month on the job for allegedly misleading the vice president about his conversations with Russian envoy.
Flynn was interviewed by the FBI in January of 2017, just days after assuming his White House post.
Intelligence and law enforcement officials worried that the Russian's knowledge about the true facts of Flynn's discussion with Kislyak could open Flynn to the prospect of coercion given the contrast with his public statements at the time.
Flynn lied to the agents about his conversations with Kislyak, saying he didn't urge Moscow not to respond to sanctions the Obama administration imposed on Russia for the Kremlin's election interference.
Legal odyssey
Flynn pleaded guilty in December 2017 to making false statements to the FBI. He went on to cooperate extensively with Mueller's team, providing "substantial assistance" to the special counsel's investigation, according to court papers.
Before the Mueller investigation wrapped up, Flynn appeared in court in December of 2018 for his sentencing. The Justice Department had said it would not object to Flynn receiving no prison time.
Flynn's defense team, however, tried to downplay his crimes despite his admissions and his guilty plea. That prompted sharp criticism from the presiding judge, Emmet Sullivan, who said it raised questions about whether Flynn truly accepted responsibility for his actions.
Sullivan postponed sentencing to allow Flynn to complete his cooperation, including testifying against his former business partner who was facing charges tied to foreign lobbying.
In the summer of 2019, Flynn dumped his legal team and brought on a new set of lawyers led by Sidney Powell, a Texas attorney and frequent critic on Fox News of the Mueller investigation.
After the shakeup, Flynn took a combative approach with the government. In one court filing after another, Flynn's counsel asserted his innocence and accused the government of misconduct, withholding exculpatory evidence and other wrongdoing.
Sullivan considered Flynn's claims and then, in a 92-page ruling, rejected them all.
Then, in January 2020, Flynn filed to withdraw his guilty plea because of what he called "the government's bad faith, vindictiveness and breach of the plea agreement."
Prosecutors, meanwhile, repeatedly point out in their filings that Flynn twice pleaded guilty before the court to his offense. They also reject his allegations of violating his plea agreement or misconduct.
But Flynn's allegations of government misconduct found a sympathetic audience in President Trump, who along with his conservative allies declared Flynn a victim of an FBI gone rogue.
Those allegations dovetailed, of course, with the president's own claims that the Russia probe was a "witch hunt" and a "hoax" designed to delegitimize his presidency.
Ultimately, Attorney General William Barr ordered a review of Flynn's case, and the Justice Department moved in May to drop its prosecution of Flynn. The decision fueled concerns that Barr was using the department's powers to benefit an ally of the president.
Judge Sullivan declined to immediately grant the department's request to drop the case. Instead, he set up a process to examine the DOJ's stated reasons.
Flynn's lawyers challenged Judge Sullivan's actions to try to force him to dismiss the case.
Ironically, that effort may ultimately have drawn out the process so long that the only way to ensure Flynn was out of legal peril before Joe Biden's inauguration was to prompt Trump to pardon him.
Article is LOCKED by author/seeder
Who is online
401 visitors
Just in, but not unexpected.
I wonder who's next
James Fields? Trump did say he was a good man.
I suspect this pardon is one more example of a trump revenge based decision which has a number of possibilities of coming back to haunt him, in more ways than one. the primary candidates for pardon are those people than can directly connect trump to criminal activities. flynn has a presidential pardon and can't be indicted for his crimes he plead guilty. that doesn't keep him out of court rooms or from the attention of any intelligence agencies. when the official RNC/GOP blame game starts, flynn will be a popular topic.
No surprise.
yup. pardon the witness to any criminal activity. ezpz
There was none
we'll never know now. hopefully the scumbag becomes a special ops project outside the US.
Lying to the FBI is a crime. Trump even said he fired him for doing so. Nice try.
Case closed.
Outstanding!
Indeed it is! This is but one of many outstanding things they are going regarding governing even while contesting all the vote fraud that happened. It’s the de regulations front where really good things are happening now!
Voter fraud doesn't even come up in court. Only while in front of the camera with no consequences for lying.
The only just result after Judge Sullivan disgraced the federal bench. In a just world, he would be impeached.
Not to mention the awads at the FBI that altered evidence and interview records. I guess entrapment isn't a crime anymore. If you have an R behind your name then anything goes; so long as the left gets the end results they want.
Well the left are quite fascist so no surprise coming from them that they did all that to him.
Sean, are you a Q Anon supporter?
Michael Flynn is.
Those who support Q Anon are traitors to the United States. Period. End of story.
What does Qanon have to do with Sullivan embarrassing himself?
what does Sullivan have to do with Flynn and Trump embarrassing this country?
Michael Flynn is a traitor.
So I'm not pleased a traitor is going free even if he was freed by another traitor.
Biden is the real traitor. He’s going to sell us out to 🇨🇳 Communist China...
Because Sullivan violated precedent by not dropping the charges against Flynn. The pardon was only necessary because of Sullivan's unconscionable subversion of our legal system.
Michael Flynn is a traitor
No, he's not.
People who espouse Q Anon are traitors. Flynn is a traitor.
Do you know what a traitor is?
A traitor betrays his country. A traitor typically has committed treason. That means he has made war against his own country or given aid or comfort to an enemy the country is at war with. Flynn hasn't done anything like that.
You don't think the demented QAnon worldview gives comfort to enemies of the US ? lol.
Traitor means you are not loyal to your country. Flynn has not been loyal to the US, he has been loyal to Donald Trump. Not at all the same thing.
Your opinion is erroneous and absurd.
What real word crime did Flynn commit?
Really Sean? Care to cite the case that set that precedent or would you like to just admit now that your claim is BS?
What subversion of the legal system Sean. Be specific.
Flynn has not been loyal to the US
Do you really wanna go there John???
December 24, 1958 (age 61) Middletown, Rhode Island , U.S.
So, lemme see yours - as a comparison of course. What military branch were you in that made you so loyal to the U.S.?? Doncha think 33 years active service and retiring as a LIEUTENANT GENERAL (that's with 3 stars) kinda overshadows yours and also kinda shows where his "loyalty to the U.S." has been, doncha think????
[ deleted ]
Wow 1st.
I could list Major General Benedict Arnold's extremely impressive military record but that wouldn't change the fact that he was a traitor.
Flynn LIED to Federal investigator 1st. The US puts people in JAIL for that shit. That's where Flynn should have been a long time ago.
Read 7.1.1. - then do your own research. You'll learn more from that than you will here.
Actually 1st, I read the filing. It's pure machination to give Flynn a pass
Well, if he does, there are a few on this site who could get sent to a "reeducation camp", like this one....
that is a prison not an educational site
But, do they speak the language? Most of the people there are middle east terrorists are they not?
They would have to use sign language, like a sign on their back that says "Kick me!" or "Your Mother is a Ho". A great way to start the steps to mutual understanding.
Lying to the FBI? That's a felony, which is a CRIME.
Hello!!!!????
He even said he knew it was a crime.
You accuse Flynn of being a traitor, but not even the FBI thought that was true. You're just ranting at random.
I don't think you have the first clue as to what a traitor is, based on your outlandish accusations
if you can show where Trump owes any US taxes, you will have an actual point.
So... If you conspire with a foreign country to influence our elections like Flynn did you aren't a traitor. If you make war against our country like Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson did you ARE a traitor. OK. Got it.
If you "got it", your post doesn't show it.
Flynn was not even accused of the thing you said.
Sure, the Fokker Services case.
What subversion of the legal system Sean. Be specific
I thought this was too obvious to have to explain but I guess not. Here's a primer on how our legal system works.
In America, the prosecutorial power is invested in the executive branch. The judiciary does not have prosecutorial powers. Sullivan ignored the executive's admission they couldn't successfully prosecute Flynn and tried to assume prosecutorial power himself by appointing a private citizen to try and deprive another American citizen of his liberty.
That's not how it works in America.
Nope, Flynn had no DPA and waived his right to trial.
FAIL.
I know how the legal system works Sean.
You seem desperate to recognize that the SCOTUS ruled on the Flynn case stating that since Judge Sullivan had yet to make a ruling, the case wasn't 'ripe'.
BTFW, the DOJ filing says NOTHING about Flynn being 'innocent' yet THAT is the basis of Trump's pardon.
Or maybe death camps like they have in.....China
Well, most self exclaimed internet expert "fill in the blank" usually do.
Sometimes I really pity people who rely on propaganda and then spread it around as if it were the truth, although I can understand why they do when they don't have personal knowledge of what they speak about, and are easily misled.
[removed]
Keep in mind, Buzz, that some NTers post crap, knowing that it's crap, just to "own the libs". Or to "own" a specific other NTer.
That's true. [Deleted]
He lied to the people who lied to FISA Courts to justify their bullshit.
False.
And should I wait for your proof or........
The person that was prosecuted for making a false statement in the 4th FISA court filing was NOT one of the people that interviewed Flynn.
Since you make the assertion, YOU have the burden of proof.
The person was prosecuted under false pretense starting with the 1st FISA warrant application.
If the FISA Court wasn't lied to, this wouldn't have happened.
Not much sense injecting reason and common sense into the conversation.
You're conflating shit Jeremy. There is NO connection between the FISA warrant and ANY prosecution.
Secondly, as I said, it was the 4th application [3rd extention] of the FISA warrant that included the falsified email. THAT is a FACT.
The first 3 sure as hell would have happened and there is NO evidence that 4th application would have been denied were it not for the falsified email.
Nor does it seem that FACTS matter to your narrative.
Please, do tell what my "narrative" is that you claim to know.
Is it based on facts or just fantasies about what I didn't write?
Your narrative is that Jeremy's comment somehow injected reason and common sense.
I am of the opinion that reason and common sense are inherently connected to FACTS.
Since Jeremy's comment isn't, neither is yours.
It's based on the content of your post.
Very, very good. And it is as true now as when I wrote it. Problem?
Good to know, should the occasion ever arise that I seek your opinion. I did not.
That may work for you, but I look at ALL the information. Not just what appeals to me.
No it wouldn't. The FISA courts were lied to or not given all the needed information from the start.
Talking to many of these people is like clapping with one hand.
Yes, since Jeremy's statement isn't based on reason or common sense.
Well then all you have to do is cite a prosecution based on 'false pretenses'.
Please proceed.
Prove it Jeremy. Cite a document, an article, a tarot reading, SOMETHING other than your unfounded OPINION.
Funny that you of all people are calling fact an unfounded opinion. Given you've used unfounded opinion as fact for 4 years in you tantrums.
You claim I'm wrong then give me proof. And a news article isn't proof. That merely the same "I heard" bullshit you've used countless times before).
You dug up this 2-week-old seed just to say that?
Oh. Brother.
You can either approve this pardon, or you can be pro law enforcement. You cannot be both.
Right....
You can either believe in the law and law enforcement following it; or you can believe in the Democrats altered view of reality where the ends justify the means. You can't believe in both.
So law enforcement is never wrong?
He pled guilty several times. It is not a matter of law enforcement being right or wrong. It is a matter of Flynn lying multiple times to law enforcement, and admitting to it.
That doesn't prove what you think it does.
Uh huh. And why was law enforcement talking to him? Because they thought he had committed a crime? No. They knew he hadn't. They just wanted to trick him into lying to them. Their actions were despicable.
Honestly, when will one of you who make that claim explain to me how the fuck anyone forced Flynn to lie?
Oh and someone who can be 'tricked' into lying is just the person we all want as the NSA.
No one has claimed he was forced. But he may have had what he felt was a good reason. I could speculate on it, but what would be the point? I don't expect you to entertain any suggestions with an open mind.
The government was bankrupting him through court costs; was in bed his original defense lawyers- who were giving him horrendous advice in return; withholding evidence (as well as doctoring it); and was threatening his son with prosecution. Real scum sucking assholes at work there. Too bad they turn toothless when investigating the Clintons; but the Clintons have that all important D behind their names.
So you are against police breaking the law to stop/punish criminals; but for the DOJ and FBI doing it- so long as it is against someone with an R behind their name that is.
Wait WHAT?
So if one has what they think is a good reason to lie to a Federal Investigator. they get a pass? Since when has THAT been a thing?
It's really sad to see people twist themselves into pretzels trying to excuse Flynn, who was allowed to plea to ONE crime out of the many he ADMITTED to under oath. Hell, Flynn was an Agent for Turkey at the same time he was the NSA.
It's become obvious that as long as Flynn and his ilk are conservative icons, there is little to nothing they can do to loose the support and praise of sycophants.
Again, I am not going to argue speculation with you. As predicted, you will dispute absolutely anything I come up with, so I don't see the point.
Yes, Im sure you're all broke up over it. It must be tough.
Hardly. He was the Director of Defense Intelligence for Obama. How you get "conservative icon" from that is surely a trip through FantasyLand. He has only become a demon for the Left because some in the FBI saw him as a tool for destroying the incoming president.
Nor it seems are you willing to defend your own speculation.
Actually I not only dispute it, I refute it.
Which he sucked at and was fired from.
I get 'conservative icon' from all the shit he has done SINCE he left the military.
Right, that's why the FBI WARNED Trump about Flynn's lie...
To you? Why would I care to?
Everything else you wrote was irrelevant nonsense.
Credibility?
That characterization is obtuse nonsense.
You mean he lied to the same "law enforcement" that lied to FISA Courts to obtain false warrants?
Again, NO.
Then prove me wrong. Show me the actual proof. Not some news article actual proof that I'm wrong.
Again, Jeremy, YOU have the burden of proof since YOU made the original allegation.
Please proceed.
You are the one saying I'm wrong. Then prove me wrong. If you cant then why are you still blathering on?
Yes, I have challenged your assertion Jeremy and YOU have the burden of proof.
Perhaps this will help you understand the concept:
You've done NOTHING but flap your gums. There is no challenge. Its just you stomping your feet crying because I won't just change my mind.
LOL! What a crock!!!
[removed]
What happened to unity? Smh. Wafj.
Their idea of unity is the same as that of China and lock up dissenters in re education camps.
I have zero doubts that some dems think that way.
Unfortunately, we will be saddled with far right wing fascism for the foreseeable future. Morons are minting more gullible morons as we speak.
[Deleted]
Very adult there. OOHHH extra large print, I am so impressed. Noootttt!
Yeah well, that's what all pardons do. They nullify something prosecutors have tried to. And there's always someone who complains that it subverts justice somehow. But I can't see the victim in Flynn's crime. This was a situation created by the FBI, with the apparent intent of setting him up to fail. This kind of thing should not be encouraged and a pardon is the least that should happen here.
Are you under the belief that somehow Flynn was forced to lie?
The interview took place in Flynn's West Wing office, NOT a dungeon.
The FBI agents gave Flynn the chance to 'clarify' his statements by reading him parts of the call transcript verbatim and he STILL continued to lie.
Any person with a modicum of intellect would recognize that due to his prior position in the military, Flynn was well aware that lying to a Federal investigator is a Federal crime.
Oh and Flynn pled guilty, TWICE.
Oh, and the FBI said they could find no lies in his testimony -
But the Justice Department now says there was no basis to question Flynn, especially since agents were prepared to close their investigation into him weeks earlier after finding nothing to suggest he had committed a crime.
The department also suggests the FBI erred by not advising Flynn that it was a crime to lie, even though the agency said less than two years ago it wasn’t required.
the justice department said it moved to dismiss the charges "after a considered review of all the facts and circumstances of this case, including newly discovered and disclosed information".
The department said the interview between investigators and Flynn in January 2017 was "unjustified" and not conducted on a "legitimate investigative basis".
It also said it could not prove beyond reasonable doubt that Flynn had lied , and said that after the interview, FBI agents had "expressed uncertainty as to whether Mr Flynn had lied".
The department also said proving someone made a false statement to federal investigators "requires more than a lie.
"It also requires demonstrating that such a statement was 'material' to the underlying investigation."
Neither of the links you provided support that claim 1st.
When you cite the Justice Department, you are citing Trump's 'wingman' AG Barr and the buddy he installed into the position in DC.
yeah, well, Flynn has received a pardon so that's the end if it!
An arrogant prick like Flynn will do something else to violate the law in 3,2,1.
Oh and BTFW, Flynn makes a perfect witness against Trump and he can no longer invoke the 5th Amendment. Perhaps they didn't tell Donald that part...
I believe he was entrapped in a situation created by law enforcement. Hiding behind the standard of not being "forced" is what corrupt law enforcement does. You don't want to follow along with that.
Irrelevant.
It is if they are investigating a crime. My understanding is that they were prosecuting Flynn under 18 US §1001, which reads:
Also irrelevant, as I just explained.
I'm not saying anything about your particular point of view, but I think it's interesting that some of the same people who assume corruption, entrapment, and racism in both police and the legal system when it comes to people of color, just assume white people (especially those working for Republican administrations) who are prosecuted must be guilty. No open minds at all.
oh, he will, will he?
what did he do wrong as director of dds under obama?
witness for WHAT?
LOL
excuse me. director of dia
What 'situation' did they create? Be specific.
Hiding behind the standard of being 'entrapped' is what criminals do.
Follow along with WHAT?
Actually, it's not. Flynn is an arrogant prick and he was on his own turf. He felt embolden to BS his way through the interview. He thought that he was untouchable. He was wrong.
Where's the investigation thingy in that statute Tacos?
Seriously, you can have your own opinion but you can't have your own facts. Any thinking person reading the clear language you copied and pasted here can see for themselves that there isn't a fucking thing about investigating a crime in that statute.
I bet that even you can recognize that a 'matter under the jurisdiction of the executive, legislative, or judicial branch of the Government of the United States ' can be something other than a crime.
Do you really hold to the ridiculous idea that a principle under investigation for committing a crime is the only person who can be charged for lying to a federal investigator? How did you come to that unfounded conclusion Tacos?
Irrelevant.
Repeating the same bullshit doesn't make it any closer to truth.
Except for the FACT that it is a violation of Federal law right?
Evidence Tacos, give me evidence.
Strawboss response since, it "seems" that, in your mind, anything said, done or thought by/through/with/for or in passing is a conspiracy/lie/underhanded or illegal by this administration.
Link??
The situation we have been talking about. If you are unfamiliar with it, do more research.
Oh, so you don't believe in the concept of entrapment. Interesting.
Your irrational bias is telling, but ultimately irrelevant.
Apparently not, since you missed it. [Deleted] Your words, your standard.
For example in this specific instance?
And yet you keep doing it.
You have been given plenty of evidence. Either you don't understand it, partisanship blinds you, or for that same reason, you are deliberately ignoring the evidence that has both been in the news and posted by others here. I'm not going to waste any more time with someone who just keeps denying the truth that has been presented to them.
Hoping for a smooth transition on 1/20. Then hoping for Trump to be jailed with no bail (flight risk) pending multiple felony charges.
Nope, you said the FBI 'created a situation'. Prove it.
What's interesting is that you fabricated that assumption from thin air.
No, I didn't miss it. There is NO predicate of an investigation into a crime in the statute Tacos. Continuing to try to pretend that there is merely continues to degrade your credibility.
Baseless superciliousness.
[Deleted]
I am addressing the statute YOU posted, which obviously FAILS to prove what you are desperate to prove.
You've posted NO evidence that Flynn was entrapped and 'others here' HAVE posted that Flynn testified under oath that he was NOT entrapped.
It's obtuse to demand that I should accept as fact the 'evidence' that you and others fabricate out of thin air while insisting that I 'deliberately ignore' DOCUMENTED evidence sworn to in signed Court filings and testified to under oath in Federal Court.
You are the one denying the truth Tacos.
Tell you what, quote the text from the statute that mandates that an investigation into a crime predicates a charge under the statute. If you cannot, since you won't admit you are [wrong,Deleted]
You have drawn an unfounded conclusion 1st.
What do you want a link for?
It's nice to have hope--even when it is pie-in-the-sky kind.
7.1.4 - no longer can plead the 5th.
Per the 5th amendment, a witness, like a defendant, may assert their Fifth Amendment right to prevent self- incrimination. A witness may refuse to answer a question if they fear their testimony will incriminate them. The criminal activity that the witness fears does not have to pertain to the case at hand. If a witness chooses to plead the fifth, unlike criminal defendants, this does not allow them to avoid testifying altogether. Witnesses subpoenaed to testify must testify, but can plead the fifth for questions that they deem are self-incriminating. Prosecutors may offer witnesses immunity in exchange for their testimony. Witnesses with immunity will not be charged for any incriminating statements made while testifying. When immunity is not on the table there is another option. Prosecutors may offer to reduce the charges if the witness agrees to testify.
I think there will be a smooth transition, but don't hold your breath about Trump going to jail. He has multiple layers of teflon coating on his back, with lots of money and power just like the Clintons and others.
For what specifically, and maybe you can lay out exact laws he broke?
Wow, I have never read THAT 5th Amendment 1st. Where did you find it?
As far as I know, Trump's DOJ hasn't actually released the documentation of Flynn's pardon so it's hard to tell what acts it encompasses. Will it start from birth to yesterday or from when Flynn signed his NDA with Trump to yesterday or from the 2016 election through yesterday.
Whatever the pardon covers, Flynn would NOT be exposed to prosecution and therefore cannot be 'incriminated' in anything for those actions. Flynn could not claim the 5th for any questions about events that are covered by his pardon.
So Flynn pleads guilty on two different occasions in front of Judge Sullivan both verbally and in writing.
Two plea deals protecting him from further prosecution and apparently dropping any charges or investigation of Flynn's son and lobbying company...
And, now if Flynn accepts the Pardon, he has to plead guilty again?
Sullivan never sentenced him?
Can you understand the irony in believing his "innocence" after 3 acknowledgements of being guilty?
As Spock would say, "Fascinating".
I see no particular significance to that
Why?
I understand that people are blissfully ignorant of the games cops and prosecutors play that put our liberty at risk, and the the choices people make in court to minimize the damage.
For crying the eff out loud. Without it, he wouldn't need a pardon.
The significance is that everybody who has ever worked for Trump is a serial liar and a criminal.
That's not really true.
Either you don't understand it, partisanship blinds you, or for that same reason, you are deliberately ignoring the evidence that has both been in the news and posted by others here.
[deleted]
I see that many liberals now believe confessions to crimes are never falsely given to mitigate risk or under duress. So I assume they will be criticizing those who vacated punishments of the Central Park 5 and demanding the central Park 5 be arrested and charged with lying to the Court.
It happens every day,
An innocent man pleaded guilty to a drug charge to get out of jail. It's more common than you think.
and liberals used to actually care about this kind of thing. But here, there is no analysis, just partisan hate.
While I appreciate your desire to comment, this seed is about Donald Trump issuing a pardon to Michael Flynn. It has nothing to do with false drug deal confessions or partisan hate or your Aunt Doodle's stuffin' muffins.
[Deleted]
Well yes. Yes it is. And it's significant and stays on your public record.
Good Grief.
Well no. No it isn't.
It's significant of nothing but partisan politics run amok.
Oh yeah, I'm sure he's super worried about his public record. Maybe he won't get into a good college now.
Good grief.
It isn't to anyone who has never had to take a deal, plea bargain.
good or bad,
innocent or not.
To those who have, it is usually life altering.
Oh, I certainly agree with that.
My link discusses why innocent people might plead guilty in court. That strikes me as being entirely consistent with the seed.
Please point out in the article where the possibility of a false confession was even remotely mentioned/implied/suggested/insinuated.
OK
Why do you keep mentioning that as if I made some sort of big-ass blunder? You mentioned Obama's pardon similarities, so I searched for some reliable info, and happened across the Cartwright pardon. I took a non-partisan interest in your commentary and you jumped me like I stole Christmas. Relax, for crying out loud. Not every comment or response made to you is a bitch slap.
Which is what Flynn's counsel is infamous for. It PROVES nothing.
Now that we have the pardon document, it's clear that not even Trump believes that Flynn is innocent.
My guess is that we'll see a truckload of pardons between now and Jan 20.
Maybe, so far his rate of pardons and commutations is way less then any of his recent predecessors where the total granted is < .5%. And the ability for a president to pardon is pretty much absolute so any that he grants should be ok. You may not agree with all of them, I didn't agree with all the pardons that President Obama did in his last couple of months, I felt he pardoned too many who had gun crimes included with their drug offenses.
For Trump to catch up he's gonna have to really work it hard. President Obama had 78 pardons / commutations in Dec 2016, and another 65 in Jan 2017.
Pardons Granted by President Barack Obama (2009-2017) (justice.gov)
A large number of criminal pardons is typical in the lame duck period. The outgoing President can correct whatever they feel to be too harsh.
It's not the number of pardons that bothers me; it's their nature. Trump does "political" pardons.
All of which were applied for through the Pardon Attorney, vetted through the DOJ and recommended for Executive clemency.
Most of the pardons went to people convicted of drug offenses. But there was one pardon that stood out. James Cartwright . Talk about an interesting, not to mention a timely, subject matter. Skip down to Leak Investigation, Conviction, and Pardon .
Spectacular differences in the 2 cases as Cartwright accepted a plea and went back to work defending the country in many different roles.
Flynn consorted with an enemy, lied, forgot to register as a foreign lobbyist, took $$ from the Russians for
speeches,
lobbied for Turkey,
and acted like the NSA instead of the future trump NSA.
All pretty bad form.
He should be kneecapped in my opinion.
Cartwright deserves more medals.
flynn broke the law. he admitted he broke the law. he plead guilty to the charges. he was pardoned before his sentencing. he supports Q-anon anarchists. he's promoting martial law, suspension of the US Constitution (that he took an oath to defend), and is attempting to instigate domestic terrorism. is that your concept of patriotism?
Nope. Flynn was trying to withdraw his guilty plea AND his lawyer claimed his innocence. In short, he nullified his plea deal. Cartwright didn't.
Flynn wasn't charged with all of that because of it was part of his plea deal. It's in his plea documents.
No, he wasn't, quite possibly in deference to his future potential to be useful to the DoJ in other ways.
It's above my pay grade and I certainly would not expect you to understand it either. Thanks for the insults.
Thanks for your thoughts Dennis.
Scale and context are unimportant. Got it.
So you're relying in a member of the 'deep state' for information?
Let's face it. Your brother cares no more about opinions on social media than I do yours.
It will be like that scene from Ghostbusters when the EPA guy had the containment grid shut down and the evil spirits were turned lose on society.
Disgusting!
He pled guilty to lying twice to the FBI...Did he lie that he lied or did lie to cover the truth. Or didn't he know that he was lying and thought that lying was telling the truth.
Sometimes it's a good thing to be away for a day, and have to catch up.
It's fascinating to observe the way that our TrumpTrueBelievers have twisted themselves into pretzels - logically, semantically, legally, ... They will do anything to deny the simple reality that Flynn lied to the FBI, got caught, was indicted, and pled guilty.
Flynn was guilty and now Trump has pardoned him.
It's very simple.
"Loyalty to Trump is more important than the law" is just conjecture... but it seems likely.
Just like with Sheriff Joe, does Flynn realize that accepting this bs pardon finalizes his guilt? Good luck to either of them ever getting even a low level security clearance again. Maybe Wal Mart needs new greeters even if they are under qualified for the positions.
I was just thinking, as long as you're a friend of the POTUS, and the POTUS himself is no angel, you could set off a bomb at the Superbowl and kill 100 people, maiming 1000, publish the nuclear codes in the New York Sunday Times, and rape the daughter of the leader of the opposite political party, the POTUS might actually pardon you.
And if the President did it himself, some might actually forgive him or give him a free pass.
What really disappoints and saddens me is that I think there are even some NT members who would.
Probably.
And if the President did it himself, all his followers would forgive him or give him a free pass.
Fixed.
Thanks. But I am usually hesitant to use absolutes.
Bob might have a point, taking into consideration that NOT ONE of the Trump supporters on this site has EVER admitted that Trump has EVER done ANYTHING wrong. Some Republicans, such as the Lincoln Project, and those who have been trying to convince Trump that he is destroying the reputation of democracy for the rest of the world to see, have done what the NT Trump supporters STILL refuse to do.
Well that's here, where the Trump cheer squad is.
give him a free pass
They have been doing that for 4 years now.
Good work Donald, keep making those liberal heads explode.
That's what's important, for you?
Wow.....
Not important but highly amusing to see.
Wow...
sound dead center to me...