RNC 2020: Democrat Vernon Jones delivers blistering attack on his party

  

Category:  News & Politics

Via:  citizen-kane-473667  •  last year  •  331 comments

By:   Tamar Lapin (New York Post)

RNC 2020: Democrat Vernon Jones delivers blistering attack on his party
Democratic Georgia state Rep. Vernon Jones bashed his party and declared his ardent support for President Trump in a speech Monday night at the 2020 Republican National Convention.

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August 24, 2020 | 10:24pm

Enlarge Imagejones.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&w=618&h=410&crop=1 Georgia State Rep. Vernon JonesCommittee on Arrangements for the 2020 Republican National Committee via AP

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Democratic Georgia state Rep. Vernon Jones bashed his party and declared his ardent support for President Trump in a speech Monday night at the 2020 Republican National Convention.

Jones, who was elected to the Georgia House of Representatives in 2016, made waves in April with his endorsement of Trump.

During his RNC address, he railed against his party, saying it had become "infected with a pandemic" of intolerance, bigotry, socialism and anti-cop sentiment.

Dems have "a dangerous tolerance for people who attack others, destroy property, and terrorize our communities," he said.

Jones, who is black, added: "The Democratic Party does not want Black people to leave the mental Plantation they've had us on for decades."

And when Trump sought the African-American vote, Jones said, "Democratic Party leaders went crazy!"

"Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer literally started wearing Kente cloth scarves around the Capitol!," he quipped.

Jones said he backs Trump because of his support for criminal justice reform and historically black colleges and universities.

His rebuke of Democratic leaders echoed that of Kim Klacik, the Baltimore congressional candidate, who caught the attention of the GOP last week with a viral video ripping "Democrat-run cities" and Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden.

Filed under2020 Republican National Convention, georgia, RNC 2020, 8/24/20

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Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667    last year

I'm waiting for the predictable reaction to the "traitor" DINO...

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1    last year

Traitor is a term to be used only used in war.

But you have to question his thinking and motivation where a large chunk of Trump's supporters still consider him a monkey as was made evident again yesterday. Appeasement of racism does not lead to solutions to eliminate racism

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.1  JohnRussell  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1    last year
But you have to question his thinking and motivation where a large chunk of Trump's supporters still consider him a monkey as was made evident again yesterday. Appeasement of racism does not lead to solutions to eliminate racism

The truth is some of these people will never learn. I didnt see all the speeches last night  but I understand at least one of them included a defense of the offensive monuments. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.2  FLYNAVY1  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.1    last year

I fought through the entire night.  I think it is important to take in information from that which I may be disagreeing with as sort of a recalibration check.  I saw nothing new to challenge my thoughts on voting against Trump, only more data points that reinforce why we should all be voting against him.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.3  Ender  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.2    last year

You are a better man than I am. No way was I going to pollute my brain. Just listening to summaries is enough doom and gloom for me.

I have had my fill of the left is going to destroy America crap.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.4  JohnRussell  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.2    last year

That is actually a little reassuring. 

What did you think of the St Louis gun couple?   I didnt see their performance. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.5  Ender  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.4    last year

Shows me the lie that they were 'Liberal'.

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.6  FLYNAVY1  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.4    last year

More stoking of racial fear that speaks of a 1968 George Wallace mentality from the couple.  

From what I understand they are not well thought of in their neighborhood....... That coupled with the felony charges related to gun use.   So much for do unto others.....

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.7  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1    last year
But you have to question his thinking and motivation where a large chunk of Trump's supporters still consider him a monkey as was made evident again yesterday.

Horseshit ...... how so?

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.8  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.7    last year

Sparty...... it was caught on tape just yesterday at Trumps event in NC.  Trump grinned about it.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.9  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.8    last year

???? Link?

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.10  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.9    last year

I've listened closely, the term "monkey" is clear, it was not spygate as some want to portray it as.

Trump heard it that way too, otherwise he wouldn't have said "lets be nice"... and "only in North Carolina".

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.11  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.10    last year

So one man, in a partisan audience that shouts "monkey," is a large chunk of conservatives?

C'mon man .... you can do better than that.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.12  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1    last year
Traitor is a term to be used only used in war.

Since when?

one who betrays another's trust or is false to an obligation or duty
 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.13  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.10    last year
Trump heard it that way too, otherwise he wouldn't have said "lets be nice"... and "only in North Carolina".

So Trump admonished them...

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.14  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.13    last year

Watch the video CK...... It was right up there with his "good people on both sided" statement......

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.15  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.11    last year

Have you forgotten Charlottesville?  Support from David Duke?

Seriously...... I can do this all day

Not all Trump supporter are racist, but all racists support Trump......

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
1.1.16  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.12    last year
Since when?

Since the United States Constitution, Article III, section 3 which reads:

"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort."

Trump and Republicans who downplay or ignore Russian bounties on US soldiers and Russian attacks on our elections are "giving aid and comfort" to our enemies.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.17  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.15    last year
Seriously...... I can do this all day

Seriously ...... feel free to keep doing so.   It doesn't change jack-shit.

Your supposition that a "large chuck" of conservatives are somehow racist and against minorities is one of the most obtuse comments i have ever seen here on NT.   You point to a few isolated incidents and now its a large chunk?   Ridiculous!  

Yeah i know, that's the narrative the hive wants you to push but it's ridiculous and insulting to those of us who are conservative and are no more or less racist than you or your average liberal.   It's a partisan dog whistle.   Nothing more, nothing less.

And i can keep telling you that all day long as well so lets go.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.18  JohnRussell  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.13    last year
So Trump admonished them...

LOL. You're joking , right? 

"Knock it off" would be an admonishment. 

a man in the crowd yelled, quite audibly, that Obama was a "MONKEY," to which Trump, grinning, said "Let's be nice!" to a chorus of laughs. Warmed by the yuks, his smile widened and he added, "Only in North Carolina."

Widened smiles and grins are not admonishment, they are sideways approval. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.19  JohnRussell  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.17    last year
a man in the crowd yelled, quite audibly, that Obama was a "MONKEY," to which Trump, grinning, said "Let's be nice!" to a chorus of laughs. Warmed by the yuks, his smile widened and he added, "Only in North Carolina."

Why does Trump joke about Obama being called a "monkey" ?  Give us a clear to the point answer. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.20  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.17    last year
It doesn't change jack-shit

For those that don't care about jack shit of course.....  For those of us that do give a shit.....well. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.21  Ender  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.19    last year

He loves it as he doesn't have to say it himself.

He can sit back and smile and laugh.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.22  Sparty On  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.19    last year
Why does Trump joke about Obama being called a "monkey" ?

Did he?   

Are you sure that is what he was responding to and what he intended?  

Absolutely sure not just TDS ridden sure.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.23  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.20    last year

There you go again .....  jumping on that sanctimonious high horse without knowing what you are talking about ...... yeehaw!

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.24  JohnRussell  replied to  Sparty On @1.1.22    last year

The reason that people give you a hard time is because you make an excuse for every single bigoted and idiotic thing Trump does. 

Now you are going to tell us that he didnt hear the word "monkey" and that wasnt what he was referring to when he immediately joked about it, even though there are numerous news stories about it. 

Do your thing, and undoubtedly people will keep giving you a hard time.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
1.1.25  Gsquared  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1    last year

The Tea Party yesterday = The Trump Party today

The video shows...

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.26  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.14    last year
It was right up there with his "good people on both sided" statement......

You just totally gutted your own argument with that reference right there as it has been proven time and again that this particular comment was taken totally out of context.

As to him giving a " wink and a nudge " to someone denigrating someone else who has been calling him a "racist, sexist, nativist"

Doesn't necessarily mean he approves, just that he found it amusing that Obama (and a lot of others apparently) can't tell the difference between Trump's supposedly racist comments  and a real racist comment like the one on display.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.27  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.18    last year
"Let's be nice!"

That's not an admonishment? Since when.

Widened smiles and grins are not admonishment, they are sideways approval.

I would think those are signs of amusement. [Deleted]

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.28  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @1.1.16    last year
Since the United States Constitution, Article III, section 3

So now we are limited to just the one definition as used in the Constitution defining treason against the State??? 

ROFLMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.29  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.28    last year

Oops, I'm smiling...I guess that means I agree with what you said...DOH!

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.30  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.26    last year

Taken out of context.....? Only by someone that thinks racism is acceptable.  Next think you will tell me is there never was an Access Hollywood tape....

BTW.... Lets see your proof that it was taken out of context..... Links please.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.31  Texan1211  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.30    last year

All you have to do is type it into your browser window.

Maybe looking at more than one or two selected sentences that people who don't like Trump are always pushing would go a long ways towards understanding the context of his remarks, which some on the left simply refuse to even look at.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.32  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.12    last year
one who betrays another's trust or is false to an obligation or duty

So whose trust did Jones betray or what obligation or duty was he false to? Please be specific. 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.33  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.30    last year
Only by someone that thinks racism is acceptable.

Knock off the Personal Attacks and stick to facts.

From the transcript of the interview (emphasis added)

Trump : "Excuse me, excuse me. They didn’t put themselves -- and you had some very bad people in that group , but you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides. You had people in that group. Excuse me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name."

And you well know he was talking about the people protesting the removal of the statute and their counter-protestors when he spoke of the two groups having fine people on both sides. He also started out by condemning the violence of BOTH sides earlier in the transcript linked to above!  If you didn't before, now you will no longer have the excuse as I have provided you with the entire transcript to read.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.1.34  JohnRussell  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.27    last year

I'm not surprised when confederate sympathizers make excuses for Trump. 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.35  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.32    last year
Please be specific. 

The Democratic Party, Joe Biden, and apparently Democrats in general as the current news cycle has their outrage on full display!

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.36  Trout Giggles  replied to  Gsquared @1.1.25    last year
The Tea Party yesterday = The Trump Party today

Only they are a lot more nastier and meaner

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.37  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.15    last year
but all racists support Trump......

Really??? Well whaddayaknow...

I'm surprised they crossed over like that. Got a link to the story???

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.38  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.33    last year

That wasn't a personal attack..... Do you see your name there or the word "you" in the sentence?

Makes one wonder...... 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.39  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.38    last year
Do you see your name there or the word "you" in the sentence?

Hmmm, let's see, am I saying it was taken out of context? Just in case you are unsure, I most certainly am! How do you feel about people who say it was taken out of context?  Your words (emphasis added;

Taken out of context.....? Only by someone that thinks racism is acceptable.

So now you want to walk it back??? Why not just apologize for the sweeping generalization and name calling instead of trying to distance yourself from what you said so proudly???

Makes one wonder...... 

Indeed it does...

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.40  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.35    last year
The Democratic Party, Joe Biden, and apparently Democrats in general as the current news cycle has their outrage on full display!

So you assume that the Jones was trusted by ANY of them? What lead you to that conclusion? 

Or is it your posit that Jones had an obligation or a duty to them? If so, and Jones was false to that, it says more about him don't you think? 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.41  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.31    last year

Both links are non-starters.  There is ample evidence that Trump is a racist... It just comes down to being willing to admit to facts.

Blaming judges because they are Mexican, Going after Gold Star parents, failing to condemn white supremacist's while they campaign for him, the central park five.... it goes on and on. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.42  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.26    last year
who has been calling him a "racist, sexist, nativist"

Why post a link that doesn't support your comment? 

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.43  Texan1211  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.41    last year
Both links are non-starters.  There is ample evidence that Trump is a racist... It just comes down to being willing to admit to facts.

Switching horses in midstream, are ya?

My links were in direct response to your post:

Post 1.1.30  "Taken out of context.....? Only by someone that thinks racism is acceptable.  Next think you will tell me is there never was an Access Hollywood tape....

BTW.... Lets see your proof that it was taken out of context..... Links please."

I provided the asked-for links, which you now claim have no relevance, Weird shit---get exactly what you ask for, then ignore it and claim something new. Is it because the links show that the Trump quote WAS taken out of context?

Never mind. The answer is obvious.

There is ample evidence that Trump is a racist... It just comes down to being willing to admit to facts. Blaming judges because they are Mexican, Going after Gold Star parents, failing to condemn white supremacist's while they campaign for him, the central park five.... it goes on and on. 

Strawman. Do better.

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.44  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.39    last year

More word salad from you CK.   

You can't run away from the fact that Trump is a racist, and that you are seemingly in support of a racist by what you have posted.  Thems the facts. 

You might like Trump for other reasons, which you think are more important, but it doesn't clear you of supporting a racist which he clearly is.  

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.45  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.43    last year

Strawman...... ?????   Try facts Tex.  All of those listed are well documented episodes of racial slurs.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.46  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.40    last year
If so, and Jones was false to that, it says more about him don't you think? 

Yes! It means as he says, he has left the Democratic Plantation that has worked so diligently to murder black children, tear apart their families, and keep them in poverty!

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.47  Texan1211  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.45    last year
Strawman....?????

Yes, No need whatsoever for the question marks.

 Try facts Tex.

I did.

You just didn't like them because they don't agree with your point of view, so of course, to you, it is fake or irrelevant.

All of those listed are well documented episodes of racial slurs.

You asked for links, I provided them, and now you don't like the links.

Be careful what you ask for--especially when you don't know the answers already.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.48  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.37    last year

I thought that you and yours decried any and all ratings by SPLC.

You must have missed the RNC Resolution denouncing SPLC, where they state:

WHEREAS, The SPLC makes a practice of incorrectly labeling persons and organizations as “hate groups”; 

I know, it's a lot to keep up with...

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.49  Texan1211  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.33    last year
If you didn't before, now you will no longer have the excuse as I have provided you with the entire transcript to read.

It won't do any good if the links are not read and understood.

0-2 is a bad way to start!

I think your argument (and mine) is falling on deaf ears.

Or perhaps something is impeding the hearing?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.50  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.42    last year

49 seconds in to the video when he is discussing "those in power", exactly whom do you think he is referencing ???

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.51  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.44    last year
You might like Trump for other reasons, which you think are more important, but it doesn't clear you of supporting a racist which he clearly is.

And you ain't black if you don't vote for Biden...

I guess that makes you a Racist too, eh? Now which one of the two is clearly showing their Racism??? Hell, even the VP pick called Biden a racist along with his policies. Are you saying Kamala Harris is wrong and that Joe Biden has done more for the Black Community in 47 years than Trump has done in 3 1/2 years???

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.52  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.49    last year
Or perhaps something is impeding the hearing?

I understand that a lack of any obstruction in the way  will cause sound waves to continue in their progression without impediment, therefore I believe there is actually something missing rather than blocking the message...

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.53  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.51    last year

even the VP pick called Biden a racist 

Liar..... No she didn't.  Busted again.  Not even word salad this time.

You use to be good at debating CK.  I can only think you've lost your edge because you're trying to defend the  the indefensible in Trump. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.54  Texan1211  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.52    last year

In one, out the other? Without the impediment of gray matter?

LOL!

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.55  Sparty On  replied to  JohnRussell @1.1.24    last year
The reason that people give you a hard time is because you make an excuse for every single bigoted and idiotic thing Trump does. 

Nah, the people here that give me a hard time are real bigots.   They can't accept the idea that someone doesn't goosestep in exact unison with their preferred narratives, so they get triggered, possibly TDS ridden and act out against the folks who have the temerity to have a different opinion than they do.

That said, this thread isn't about me John.   If you really want to have a discussion about the pro's and con's of being Sparty On vs John Russell i'll be glad to participate but otherwise keep me out of this discussion

Thx

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.56  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.48    last year
I thought that you and yours decried any and all ratings by SPLC.

Are you saying their assessment is wrong in this case?  Got links to prove it?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.1.57  Tessylo  replied to  Trout Giggles @1.1.36    last year

"The Tea Party yesterday = The Trump Party today"

"Only they are a lot more nastier and meaner"

Those teabaggers certainly are.  

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.1.58  Tessylo  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.41    last year
"Blaming judges because they are Mexican, Going after Gold Star parents, failing to condemn white supremacist's while they campaign for him, the central park five.... it goes on and on."

I don't know if this is racist, but accepting QANons' support is really out there.  

They're considered domestic terrorists.  tRump said there are some fine folks in the QANon crowd.  

They're whackjobs, crazy as ****houserats, bat****crazy, nuttier than a fruitcake.  

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.59  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.53    last year
No she didn't.  Busted again. 

From a transcript of the debate:

So, on the issue of race, I couldn’t agree more that this is an issue that is still not being talked about truthfully and honestly. I—there is not a black man I know, be he a relative, a friend or a coworker who has not been the subject of some form of profiling or discrimination. Growing up, my sister and I had to deal with the neighbor who told us her parents couldn’t play with us because she—because we were black. And I will say also that—that in this campaign, we’ve also heard—and I’m going to now direct this to Vice President Biden. I do not believe you are a racist and I agree with you when you commit yourself to the importance of finding common ground.

Now why do you think she found it necessary to stress that she doesn't believe him to be a racist other than to sugar coat what she is actually doing--calling him a racist because of all the things he's done to hurt the Black community ??? Which she then goes on to call him out for and which the entire country agrees are racist policies aimed at the Black communities. I know, I know...it is so hard to see the Racial Jungle with all those trees in the way.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
1.1.60  Trout Giggles  replied to  Tessylo @1.1.57    last year
Those teabaggers certainly are.  

ssshhhhh!!!! We're not allowed to use that word!

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.61  Texan1211  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.59    last year
Now why do you think she found it necessary to stress that she doesn't believe him to be a racist other than to sugar coat what she is actually doing--calling him a racist because of all the things he's done to hurt the Black community ??? Which she then goes on to call him out for and which the entire country agrees are racist policies aimed at the Black communities. I know, I know...it is so hard to see the Racial Jungle with all those trees in the way.

Isn't it rather odd that we are supposedly racist ourselves because we support a racist Trump (either implied or explicitly told), but no one is racist for supporting a racist Biden?

And if they are both racist--either by actions or support of those who are racist--should perhaps the scope of that racism and its effects on its victims be under examination?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.62  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Texan1211 @1.1.61    last year
should perhaps the scope of that racism and its effects on its victims be under examination?

Now that wouldn't do at all...comparing millions imprisoned to millions put to work to determine who is more Racist. Perish the thought!

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
1.1.63  Texan1211  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.62    last year
Now that wouldn't do at all...comparing millions imprisoned to millions put to work to determine who is more Racist. Perish the thought!

I was thinking more along the lines of comparing denying some housing to a few folks (admittingly bad) to institutional policies and law effecting every member of a race in some way (undeniably worse).

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.64  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.46    last year
Yes!

So you're heralding a man who failed in his obligations and duties. Why? 

Seriously CK, do you think that you're making a cogent argument by misrepresenting what Jones said?

Why not quote Jones and let his own words speak for themselves and let everyone see how you twisted them?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.65  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.64    last year
Why not quote Jones and let his own words speak for themselves and let everyone see how you twisted them?

ROFLMAO!!!   (emphasis added)  You really need to try harder...

"I'm a man of color, and I'm a lifelong Democrat too. You may be wondering, 'Why is a lifelong Democrat speaking at the Republican National Convention?' And that's a fair question, and here's your answer: The Democratic Party does not want Black people to leave their mental plantation ," said Georgia state Representative Vernon Jones during the convention.
 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.66  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.65    last year
their mental plantation

You realize he is calling people stupid...

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.67  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.50    last year
49 seconds in to the video when he is discussing "those in power", exactly whom do you think he is referencing ???

Wow. Are you actually trying to claim that Obama's eulogy supports your bullshit? 

You post two different articles, NEITHER of which have video or audio and then try to pretend that you're making an argument.

Weak sauce CK. 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.68  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.67    last year
You post two different articles, NEITHER of which have video or audio and then try to pretend that you're making an argument.

You need to adjust your browser settings because they work just fine. Do you need help with that?

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.69  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.56    last year
Are you saying their assessment is wrong in this case? 

No, I'm saying I find it hypocritical for you to rely on a source that you and yours demonize. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.70  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.59    last year

Oh I get it, when she says one thing, you interpret it to mean the opposite and expect everyone to follow your 'logic'. jrSmiley_84_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.72  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.69    last year
I'm saying I find it hypocritical for you to rely on a source that you and yours demonize. 

So you are saying that the NBPP is indeed a Racist organization and that they are supporting Trump?

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.73  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.71    last year

So now you are going to use a right wing tabloid from the UK...

If you actually think donald is going to win the Black popular vote, I would say you believe in conspiracy theories.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.74  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.70    last year

Since there are some who are too stupid to see what she did there, or are blithely ignoring it to justify their support of someone whose actions alone prove him waaaay more racist than Trump, i find it necessary to point it out in no uncertain terms.  Want some more proof of Biden's racism???

Needless to say the mental contortions at the end of that linked video are hilarious, and yet oddly familiar...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.1.75  Tessylo  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.74    last year

No way in hell is Joe Biden racist much less more racist than tRump.

That's nuts.  

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.76  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Ender @1.1.73    last year
If you actually think donald is going to win the Black popular vote,

Where did I say that??? Nowhere. So quit trying to put words in my mouth Ender.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.77  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Tessylo @1.1.75    last year
No way in hell is Joe Biden racist much less more racist than tRump.

Their policies that affect the Black community say different.

That's nuts. 

Really?  Let's see your proof.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.78  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.76    last year

If you are not implying that, then why post what you did?

You are the one posting tabloid articles that says Black people are going to turn republican...

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.79  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Ender @1.1.78    last year
You are the one posting tabloid articles that says Black people are going to turn republican...

Quote from the article supporting your assertion please. I must have missed that portion.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.80  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.79    last year

Really? The title of the article is about Democrats losing the Black vote to trump.

Then goes on to somehow say that Black voters are disenfranchised with the party.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.81  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Ender @1.1.80    last year
The title of the article is about Democrats losing the Black vote to trump.

And tell me, how much has his support in the Black vote gone up since he was elected? Does this mean that the Black vote will turn Republican?  Hardly; so again, cite your claim from the article, or admit you were misstating the articles claims.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
1.1.82  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.81    last year

So your tabloid article from another country claiming Black voters are disenfranchised with the party, is not stating it accurately?

If they leave the party, where would they go?

I can insinuate all day long. Does that mean my intent is not true or clear?

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.83  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.68    last year
You need to adjust your browser settings because they work just fine. Do you need help with that?

Let's see how my settings work:

You said: 

As to him giving a "   wink and a nudge  " to someone denigrating someone else  who has been calling him a "racist, sexist, nativist"

Which includes a link whose headline reads:

Obama calls Trump ‘racist, nativist and sexist’ at private campaign event, report says

While that article DOES have a video of Obama's eulogy, it does NOT have a video of a 'private campaign event'.

That article also alleges to quote Obama yet those quotes do NOT show Obama CALLING Trump anything. Members need not take my word for it, they can go READ it for themselves. 

The headline to your second link is:

Obama rips Trump and says he tries to ‘tap into fears and use them in racist, sexist ways’

I invite everyone to note the distinct difference in those two headlines. 

Now while the headline to your second link is more accurate about what your first link quotes Obama as saying, it STILL does not have an video of a 'private campaign event'.

Should they choose to, everyone can go to the timeline you cited for the Obama eulogy [first link]  and hear for themselves that Obama DID NOT call Trump a "racist, sexist, nativist'. In fact, Obama did not use ANY of those terms nor did he mention Trump. 

In short, the claims in you post are bullshit. 

So do you still think I need to adjust my browser settings?  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.84  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.74    last year
Since there are some who are too stupid to see what she did there, or are blithely ignoring it to justify their support of someone whose actions alone prove him waaaay more racist than Trump, i find it necessary to point it out in no uncertain terms. 

Except your 'terms' are galactically uncertain and fabricated.

 

 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.85  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.72    last year
So you are saying that the NBPP is indeed a Racist organization and that they are supporting Trump?

You JUST quoted what I said. Why try to put your own unworthy words in my mouth? 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.86  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.85    last year
Not all Trump supporter are racist, but all racists support Trump......

Do you remember this comment made by FLYNAVY that started our discourse?  You jumped in to the conversation and now you have been left hanging in the wind by your own words....and those of your fellow compatriot that you sought to defend!

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.87  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.84    last year
Except your 'terms' are galactically uncertain and fabricated.

Your lack of comprehension of the subtleties of PC speech are your own problem, not mine. It does tend to explain how easily some people can be  are confused by their discourse though.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.88  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.83    last year
it does NOT have a video of a 'private campaign event'.

Guess what the video is from??? A PRIVATE FUNDRAISER...DOH!!!

In short, the claims in you post are bullshit. 

Suuure...to anyone  who prides themselves as being a  Democrat blowhard!

So do you still think I need to adjust my browser settings? 

Nah, you've already shown it isn't any technical difficulty causing the problem...

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.89  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Ender @1.1.82    last year
f they leave the party, where would they go?

Hopefully to (I)ndependent so that BOTH Party's couldn't "count" on their vote--they would actually have to earn it!

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.90  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.86    last year
Do you remember this comment made by FLYNAVY that started our discourse?  

Why yes CK, YES I do. It was:

Traitor is a term to be used only used in war.

Since when?

one who betrays another's trust or is false to an obligation or duty

My question was:

one who betrays another's trust or is false to an obligation or duty
So whose trust did Jones betray or what obligation or duty was he false to? Please be specific. 

That was the beginning of our conversation. 

 You jumped in to the conversation and now you have been left hanging in the wind by your own words....

How so CK? 

and those of your fellow compatriot that you sought to defend!

I didn't seek to defend anyone.

YOU chose the definition of traitor that YOU felt suited your agenda yet you still couldn't support it.  You couldn't show that Jones betray anyone's trust and you sure as hell couldn't explain why you heralded a man who you claim failed to meet his obligation and duty. 

Looks to me like you're the one left hanging. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.91  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.87    last year
Your lack of comprehension of the subtleties of PC speech are your own problem, not mine. It does tend to explain how easily some people can be  are confused by their discourse though.

No CK. I merely read the statement and interpreted it without self serving vitriol. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.92  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.88    last year
Guess what the video is from??? A PRIVATE FUNDRAISER...DOH!!!

What video CK? Post a fucking link. 

Suuure...to anyone  who prides themselves as being a  Democrat blowhard!

Nope, for anyone who reads with comprehension. 

Nah, you've already shown it isn't any technical difficulty causing the problem...

Nah, I've shown that I'm not the one with the problem. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.1.93  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.59    last year

OH.... So she DIDN'T call him a racist..... even though you said she did.  So you now admit to the lie...????  No of course not..... but it would be nice if you took responsibility for what you write.

On another note, its a pity, so many out there it seems only want to see monkeys in those racial jungle trees as described.  White privilege is an ugly thing don't you think? 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.94  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.28    last year

No, all you have to do is show that he meets the definition YOU chose. You haven't and your can't. 

 
 
 
XXJefferson51
Senior Guide
1.1.95  XXJefferson51  replied to  Dulay @1.1.48    last year

The SPLC is a terrorist inspiring hate group run by racists and misogynistic men who launder contributions abroad.  They falsely label legitimate conservative and Christian groups as so called hate over policy disagreements.  It’s the SPLC that is a hate group.  

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
1.1.96  Tessylo  replied to  XXJefferson51 @1.1.95    last year

They are not a hate group.  They identify hate groups.  Largely right-wing.  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.97  Dulay  replied to  XXJefferson51 @1.1.95    last year

Forward the memo to CK Xx.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.98  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.90    last year
You couldn't show that Jones betray anyone's trust

So the Democrats wanted him to endorse Trump instead of Biden?  Gotcha. Wanna buy a bridge in the Arizona desert too?

and you sure as hell couldn't explain why you heralded a man who you claim failed to meet his obligation and duty.

Uhm, because he left the Democrat Plantation!  I guess you missed that! I have no problem giving someone who betrayed the trust of those who are fucking him by ditching them. Do you? Or maybe you believe someone should stay in an abusive relationship just because their partner trusts them not to leave???

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.99  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.84    last year
Except your 'terms' are galactically uncertain and fabricated.

So Biden didn't brag about his signature anti-crime bill that ended up putting more Blacks behind bars than anyone else had managed to do since??? Riiight......

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.100  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.1.93    last year
but it would be nice if you took responsibility for what you write.

I stand behind everything I write and do not try to move the goal posts to fit my agenda like some people do here.

White privilege is an ugly thing don't you think?

Wouldn't know because I'm still trying to get that term defined. Care to tell us exactly what it is?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.101  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.94    last year
You haven't and your can't.

I have, and you just didn't comprehend...

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.102  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.98    last year
So the Democrats wanted him to endorse Trump instead of Biden?  Gotcha. 

Still can't prove a betrayal I see. 

Wanna buy a bridge in the Arizona desert too?

Nah, it looks fine at Lake Havasu City. 

Uhm, because he left the Democrat Plantation!  I guess you missed that! I have no problem giving someone who betrayed the trust of those who are fucking him by ditching them. Do you? Or maybe you believe someone should stay in an abusive relationship just because their partner trusts them not to leave???

He DID?

Got a link showing that he 'left the Democrat Plantation' CK?

His Website says he's still a Democrat.

Looks like he indeed DID decide to ' stay in an abusive relationship'. 

jrSmiley_84_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.103  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.99    last year

Still waiting for your 'certain terms' CK. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.104  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.101    last year

Are you under some illusion that your comments are too deep for me to comprehend CK?

That's pretty fucking funny since the shallowness of the shit you post here is epic. 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.105  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.102    last year
Got a link showing that he 'left the Democrat Plantation' CK?

Sure!

“Turn the lights off, I have left the plantation,” Jones said.

Hmmm I wonder why:

Looks like he indeed DID decide to ' stay in an abusive relationship'. 

Could it be:

“I don’t plan to leave the Democratic Party because somebody’s got to be in there to hold them accountable — hold them accountable to how they are treating black people [and] root out the bigotry,” he said.
 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.106  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.104    last year
That's pretty fucking funny since the shallowness of the shit you post here is epic. 

You never fail to disappoint! Here is an idea...stay away!

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.1.107  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @1.1.103    last year
Still waiting for your 'certain terms' CK.

No you're not. You are trying to figure out a way to get me to give you another way to violate the CoC and get away with it again. Guess what?  I'm not playing your game. DO NOT ADDRESS ME AGAIN--EVER. Stay the fuck off of my seeds and articles. Your presence is no longer wanted or welcomed.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
1.1.108  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.107    last year

This thread has gone off the rails. You both better stop with the personal comments. Only warning.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.109  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1.1.105    last year
Sure!

The NEXT day he retracted his resignation. 

Fail. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
1.1.110  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Dulay @1.1.109    last year

If I were Pelosi, I'd make him stand in the hall the next time the Democrats have a meeting. 

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
1.1.111  JBB  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @1.1.110    last year

Buzz, Vernon Jones is not a member of the US Congress. He is a one term back bench member of the lower house of the Florida legislature. He is basically a nobody going nowhere who is only a Republican for pay...

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
1.1.112  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  JBB @1.1.111    last year

Good thing.  How much do you think he was paid for his endorsement speech?

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.1.113  Sparty On  replied to  JBB @1.1.111    last year
Vernon Jones is not a member of the US Congress.

Which automatically raises his standing in society.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
1.1.114  Dulay  replied to  JBB @1.1.111    last year

Actually, he is all of that but in Georgia, not Florida. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.2  JohnRussell  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @1    last year
The president made mention of his predecessor, Barack Obama, and a man in the crowd yelled, quite audibly, that Obama was a "MONKEY," to which Trump, grinning, said "Let's be nice!" to a chorus of laughs. Warmed by the yuks, his smile widened and he added, "Only in North Carolina." Which is not, strictly speaking, true. Though it might be slightly less false when Donald Trump is in North Carolina.

This was yesterday, in the speech where Trump accepted the Republican nomination. 

One of his fans, an attendee at his acceptance speech, made a grossly racial slur about a political rival, and the president of the United States made a joke about it. 

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
1.2.1  JohnRussell  replied to  JohnRussell @1.2    last year

Remember when a woman at one his town halls said Obama was "an Arab" she could not trust and John McCain told the woman that no, Obama was a good man, a family man.  

That was then. Now we have a Trump making a joke when one of his audience makes a racial slur against Obama. The difference is glaring, but the truth is some Trumpsters think McCain was a chump. 

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.2.2  FLYNAVY1  replied to  JohnRussell @1.2.1    last year

Pretty ugly times.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.2.3  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.2.2    last year

Yeah, unless you agree with the ugliness and think its funny because it supports this narrative or that which one tends to agree with right?

[ deleted - do not drive traffic away from one seed to another this way. ]

Once again, the hypocrisy on display here with some holier than thou liberals is exponential and make no mistake, it is FUBAR.

[ Deleted ]

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.2.4  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.2.3    last year

Sparty.... I don't agree with the ugliness.  Making fun of people with handicaps, going after the heritage of a Gold Star Family, Etc. Etc. Etc.

What you call holier than thou....... is just simple human decency.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.2.5  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.2.4    last year

Talk is cheap and you've got zero room to talk.   

And regardless of how many posts that get censored, you know exactly what i'm talking about.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
1.2.6  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Sparty On @1.2.3    last year
[ deleted - do not drive traffic away from one seed to another this way. ]

SP, I think it is worth leaving in as evidence submitted to make the point. I don't mind it being there.

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.2.7  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.2.5    last year
Racism in my book in any shape fashion or form is ugly Sparty, and that's the topic here.  Whatever word salad you put together doesn't change the facts that Trump is a racist and a vote for Trump either willingly ignores or supports that racism.  
 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.2.8  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.2.7    last year
Talk is cheap and you've got zero room to talk.   

 
 
 
FLYNAVY1
Professor Expert
1.2.9  FLYNAVY1  replied to  Sparty On @1.2.8    last year

You're making less sense than usual....

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
1.2.10  Sparty On  replied to  FLYNAVY1 @1.2.9    last year

Lol ..... thanks for the laugh Navy

 
 
 
arkpdx
Masters Participates
1.2.11  arkpdx  replied to  JohnRussell @1.2.1    last year
McCain was a chump. 

No but here is a picture of him

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
2  Dismayed Patriot    last year

A State Representative who happens to claim to be a Democrat, from one of the deepest Red States, is Republicans response to the numerous Republicans including Republican governors, former governors, former Republican Secretary of State and former Trump officials who spoke at the DNC and support Biden along with the 70 senior officials who served under Republican administrations who signed a letter calling Trump “unfit to lead” while outlining their support for Biden. But Republicans got a lone Democrat State representative to regurgitate their lies and sad divisive talking points.

/ golf clap... "Way to go guys!"

What's even funnier is that some Republicans think their parade of lies is "winning". Hilarious.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
Masters Expert
2.1  XDm9mm  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @2    last year
A State Representative who happens to claim to be a Democrat, from one of the deepest Red States, is Republicans response to the numerous Republicans including Republican governors, former governors, former Republican Secretary of State and former Trump officials who spoke at the DNC and support Biden along with the 70 senior officials who served under Republican administrations who signed a letter calling Trump “unfit to lead” while outlining their support for Biden. But Republicans got a lone Democrat State representative to regurgitate their lies and sad divisive talking points.

Wow...   castigating a CURRENTLY sitting representative and making aspersions that he is NOT a Democrat, while lauding FORMER Republicans is laughable at best.

The hatred of the MAN President Trump is palpable, yet they also hate any and all that support him.

TRUMP //  PENCE  2020

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
2.1.1  Texan1211  replied to  XDm9mm @2.1    last year

Next they will claim the dude isn't even black, really, if he supports Trump in any way, shape, form, or fashion!

Hidin' Biden has thus declared it so!

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
2.1.2  Tessylo  replied to  XDm9mm @2.1    last year
TRUMP //  PENCE  2020

FOR PRISON 2020

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
2.2  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @2    last year

Thank you for not disappointing me. Now would you like to know his reasons for endorsing Trump as stated in an interview in July? Tell me his assessment is factually wrong and I will wait patiently for your presentation of facts proving him so.

 
 
 
Greg Jones
PhD Expert
3  Greg Jones    last year

Some of the best race card players in the world were and are the Democrats.

From owning slaves to founding KKK to supporting BLM violence, they have a legacy to be ashamed of

 
 
 
XDm9mm
Masters Expert
3.1  XDm9mm  replied to  Greg Jones @3    last year
supporting BLM violence, they have a legacy to be ashamed of

That should actually indicate RADICAL MARXIST IDEOLOGY BLM violence.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Greg Jones @3    last year
From owning slaves to founding KKK to supporting BLM violence, they have a legacy to be ashamed of

And they were, back in the 1960's, which is why they changed their policy as a party, wrote, passed and signed into law the civil rights act and voting rights act that required all the Southern ex-confederate States that had long histories of denying the vote to black Americans to get pre-clearance for any voting laws. This obviously angered the Southern conservative Democrats who had worked so hard at denying black Americans their equal representation.

Now, I don't know about you, but I would much rather support someone like former Senator Robert Byrd who at one time was a hard core racist who not only had a change of heart but became a strong advocate for civil rights who the NAACP said "became a champion for civil rights and liberties" than to support the party who tries to avoid mentioning race or racial inequality and keeps claiming they never did anything racist but also stay silent when it comes to fixing systemic inequities or even denies any exist at all.

The parties changed over the last 60 years, this is undeniable. Those former Conservative Democrats or "Dixiecrats" didn't move and most didn't change their personal philosophies, prejudices and conservative ideology. Those Southern Democrats who wrapped themselves in the confederate flag, erected confederate monuments and proclaimed themselves "Rebels" didn't vanish from the south. They were the majority in the South back then and still are today, they just started voting for the party that best represented their racist conservative values. It took 30 years for the shift from Dixie blue to Dixie red, but by 1994 it was a done deal. The last vestiges of the Southern Democrat in the House and Senate flipped and changed parties in the mid-1990's.

Today, we have those same folk wrapping themselves in the confederate flag, defending the confederate monuments their ancestors erected, denying systemic racism even exists, crafting disenfranchising voting laws that target black Americans with "surgical precision", defending the killings of unarmed black men by labeling them all "thugs" while also trying to shift any blame for their racist past onto their opponents. Perhaps we should rename them "Dixpublicans" as that seems to be most fitting on several levels.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.1  Trout Giggles  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2    last year

Thanks for your comment but did you hear that  swoosh? It was like a pterodactyl flying over the heads of those that will continue to insist that the Democratic Party has not changed in the last 60 years.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
Masters Expert
3.2.2  XDm9mm  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2    last year

A knowledge of history would be helpful.   It was the DEMOCRATS that opposed the 1964 Civil Rights Act.    So your revisionist history isn't going to work.

When the bill came before the full Senate for debate on March 30, 1964, the "Southern Bloc" of 18 southern Democratic Senators and one Republican Senator ( John Tower of Texas) led by Richard Russell (D-GA) launched a  filibuster to prevent its passage. [18] Said Russell: "We will resist to the bitter end any measure or any movement which would have a tendency to bring about social equality and intermingling and amalgamation of the races in our (Southern) states." [19] Source: 

It was the REPUBLICANS that got the CRA passed.

 
 
 
XDm9mm
Masters Expert
3.2.3  XDm9mm  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.1    last year
It was like a pterodactyl flying over the heads

Hot shit....   how fucking old are you anyway to know what an extinct animal sounded like?

 
 
 
evilgenius
Professor Guide
3.2.4  evilgenius  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2    last year

Hey DP, I don't why you bother to type this all out yet again. It's a pointless exercise trying to debate anyone that uses the same false talking points. I'd rather just remind them they are defending a President that's good with people chanting, "Jews will not replace us!", "White Power!" and "He's a monkey!" 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.5  Trout Giggles  replied to  XDm9mm @3.2.3    last year

I babysat Moses

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
3.2.6  Sparty On  replied to  XDm9mm @3.2.2    last year

That "swoosh" that just went of over their heads was more like a category 5 hurricane than a simple "swoosh" .....

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.7  Trout Giggles  replied to  XDm9mm @3.2.2    last year

That's pretty much what DP said.....but once again you skimmed his comment instead of reading it thoroughly. The Northern Democrats along with the Republican Party got the Civil Rights Act passed....and Johnson, a Southern Democrat I might add....signed it into law

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.8  Ender  replied to  evilgenius @3.2.4    last year

It is like they sick their fingers in their ears.

Butt, butt, seventy five years ago.....

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
3.2.9  Sparty On  replied to  evilgenius @3.2.4    last year

Blah, blah, blah .... still waiting for real proof that says a "LARGE" chunk of conservatives feel that way but feel free to keep blowing your dog whistles until such a time that someone can actually prove it.   In the meantime keep tooting your partisan horns.

Good luck and i won't hold my breath for real, unbiased proof on this one.   Not for one second ....

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.10  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.1    last year
those that will continue to insist that the Democratic Party has not changed in the last 60 years.

Uhm, don't believe the hype...

And how many racist Dixiecrats did Nixon win for the GOP? Turns out, virtually none. Among the racist Dixiecrats, Strom Thurmond of South Carolina was the sole senator to defect to the Republicans — and he did this long before Nixon’s time. Only one Dixiecrat congressman, Albert Watson of South Carolina , switched to the GOP. The rest, more than 200 Dixiecrat senators, congressmen, governors and high elected officials, all stayed in the Democratic Party.

The progressive notion of a Dixiecrat switch is a myth. Yet it is myth that continues to be promoted, using dubious case examples. Though the late Sens. Jesse Helms of North Carolina and John Tower of Texas and former Mississippi Sen. Trent Lott all switched from the Democratic Party to the GOP, none of these men was a Dixiecrat.  

The South, as a whole, became Republican during the 1980s and 1990s. This had nothing to do with Nixon; it was because of Ronald Reagan and former House Speaker Newt Gingrich’s “ Contract with America .” The conservative appeal to patriotism, anti-communism, free markets, pro-life and Christianity had far more to do with the South’s movement into the GOP camp than anything related to race.
 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2.11  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.1    last year
It was like a pterodactyl flying over the heads of those that will continue to insist that the Democratic Party has not changed in the last 60 years.

I just find it amazing that some can, with a straight face, proclaim that those Southern conservative Democrats from pre-1964 and their descendants who wrapped themselves in the confederate flag, supported confederate monuments, supported segregation, tried to prevent blacks from voting and tried to shred the voting rights act are totally different than the Southern conservative Republicans today who wrap themselves in the confederate flag, support confederate monuments, support re-segregating schools, craft voter ID laws with the specific intention of keeping blacks from voting and literally fought till they shredded the voting rights act.

Do Republicans really believe the rest of Americans are so stupid they'll believe this bullshit narrative? No wonder they ridicule higher education, they can't have their base learning actual American history or they risk losing their control.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.12  Trout Giggles  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.11    last year

That's why I pretty much ignore the idiocy that they display on a daily basis regarding this issue

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.13  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.10    last year

An opinion piece?

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2.14  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  XDm9mm @3.2.2    last year
It was the REPUBLICANS that got the CRA passed.

What a laugh.

Democrats authored the civil rights act, brought it up for a vote and then passed it with a Democrat majority and then a Democrat President signed it into law. Whoever you're learning your US history from is lying to you, but I'm not surprised. Republicans seem to love the poorly educated.

1964 Civil Rights Act vote by party and region:

The House of Representatives:

  • Southern Democrats: 8–87   (7–93%)
  • Southern Republicans: 0–10   (0–100%)
  • Northern Democrats: 145–9   (94–6%)
  • Northern Republicans: 138–24   (85–15%)

The Senate:

  • Southern Democrats: 1–20   (5–95%)
  • Southern Republicans: 0–1   (0–100%)
  • Northern Democrats: 45–1   (98–2%)
  • Northern Republicans: 27–5   (84–16%)

So 199 Democrat Senators and Congressmen voted FOR the civil rights act vs 175 Republicans voting for it. Notice not a single Southern Republican voted for it. Sure, there were only 11 Southern Republicans, but there were nearly that many (9) Southern Democrats who actually supported the civil rights act. 

So, the facts prove you wrong. Perhaps you should do a smidgen of homework before just believing some bullshit right wing talking points from Alex Jones or Glen Beck.

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.15  Kavika   replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.14    last year

The question that I ask is, if the democratic party is so racist today why do the majority of minorities vote democratic, this includes, blacks, Hispanics, American Indians, Asians, Pacific Islanders, and if you want to count religious minorities you can include Jews and Muslims. 

I guess it's the unlimited ''free stuff'' that we get. When you find my free stuff please send it to me. I haven't seen it in 80 years. 

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.16  Sunshine  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.14    last year

Perhaps you forgot a few facts as usual....

By party [ edit ]

The record of the roll call vote  kept by the  House Clerk  on final passage of the bill

The original House version: [24]

  • Democratic Party: 152–96   (61–39%)
  • Republican Party: 138–34   (80–20%)

Cloture in the Senate: [25]

  • Democratic Party: 44–23   (66–34%)
  • Republican Party: 27–6   (82–18%)

The Senate version: [24]

  • Democratic Party: 46–21   (69–31%)
  • Republican Party: 27–6   (82–18%)
The Senate version, voted on by the House: [24]
  • Democratic Party: 153–91   (63–37%)
  • Republican Party: 136–35   (80–20%)

Democrats authored the civil rights act,

It was authored by Congress, 2 Democrats and 2 Republicans.

 Perhaps you should do a smidgen of homework

You should listen to your own advice.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.2.17  JohnRussell  replied to  evilgenius @3.2.4    last year
they are defending a President that's good with people chanting, "Jews will not replace us!", "White Power!" and "He's a monkey!" 

pretty good summary

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.2.18  JohnRussell  replied to  Sunshine @3.2.16    last year

I have a question for you Sunshine. How many southern Republicans voted for the 1964 Civil Rights Act?  

That figure would be ZERO. There is an article that was in a British newspapaer or magazine, if I remember correctly, during the 1990's that lays out quite exactly how the parties and regions voted on the Civil Rights Act of 1964. 

Somewhat similar to what you and DP posted just now.  I have posted that magazine article about a dozen times on NT, when every now and then some ignorant person tries to say that Democrats opposed the bill. 

SOUTHERNERS OPPOSED THE BILL. 

A higher percentage of Democrats than Republicans voted aye for the Civil Rights Act from both the north and the south. This is not a guess, it is not a hoax, it is the fact. 

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.19  Sunshine  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.14    last year
When the bill came before the full Senate for debate on March 30, 1964, the "Southern Bloc" of 18 southern Democratic Senators and one Republican Senator ( John Tower  of Texas) led by  Richard Russell  (D-GA) launched a  filibuster  to prevent its passage. [18]  Said Russell: "We will resist to the bitter end any measure or any movement which would have a tendency to bring about  social equality  and  intermingling and amalgamation of the races  in our (Southern) states." [19]

United States President  Lyndon B. Johnson  signs the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Among the guests behind him is  Martin Luther King Jr.

Strong opposition to the bill also came from Senator  Strom Thurmond  (D-SC): "This so-called Civil Rights Proposals, which the President has sent to Capitol Hill for enactment into law, are unconstitutional, unnecessary, unwise and extend beyond the realm of reason. This is the worst civil-rights package ever presented to the Congress and is reminiscent of the  Reconstruction  proposals and actions of the  radical Republican  Congress." [20]

After 54 days of filibuster, Senators  Hubert Humphrey  (D-MN),  Mike Mansfield  (D-MT),  Everett Dirksen  (R-IL), and  Thomas Kuchel  (R-CA), introduced a substitute bill that they hoped would attract enough Republican swing votes in addition to the core liberal Democrats behind the legislation to end the filibuster. The compromise bill was weaker than the House version in regard to government power to regulate the conduct of private business, but it was not so weak as to cause the House to reconsider the legislation. [21]

Without Republican support the bill would not have been passed as XD commented.  And as you see in the facts a much larger percentage of Republicans voted for the bill than Democrats

Some simple research on your part.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.2.20  JohnRussell  replied to  Sunshine @3.2.19    last year

What people who make your argument fail to realize or understand is that in 1964 Democrats were a majority of members of Congress from the south. That ENTIRELY explains why you think Republicans were responsible for the passage. Frankly, if there had been more Republicans in the south it might have failed as zero southern republicans voted for the bill. 

Today, the map is different than it was in 1964. Trump is expected to sweep most of the southern states. The north, where the vast majority of support for the Civil Rights Act came from in 1964, is expected to largely vote for Biden. 

I'm kind of at a loss as to why Republican backers bring up the Civil Rights vote in Congress. A knowledgeable look at it doesnt help them. 

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.21  Sunshine  replied to  JohnRussell @3.2.20    last year
What people who make your argument fail

You are attempting to make a foolish argument not me.  I only presented what the facts are.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.2.22  JohnRussell  replied to  Sunshine @3.2.21    last year

LOL. Well, you presented partial facts that obscure the true situation of the vote on the Civil Rights Act.  If you are happy with that god bless ya. 

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.23  Sunshine  replied to  JohnRussell @3.2.22    last year
LOL. Well, you presented partial facts that obscure the true situation of the vote on the Civil Rights Act.  If you are happy with that god bless ya.

You are free to discredit the facts.  The vote is the vote, without the Republican vote the Democrats would not have been able to pass a bill.  Whatever you may want to conjure, it doesn't change the facts.  A higher percentage of Republicans voted for the bill than Democrats.

Unlike DP, I and XD provided a link to facts.  You can use the link if you wish.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2.24  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sunshine @3.2.16    last year
It was authored by Congress

“Next week I shall ask the Congress of the United States to act,” President Kennedy said, “to make a commitment it has not fully made in this century to the proposition that race has no place in American life or law."

Eight days later, on June 19, 1963, Emmanuel Celler, a New York Democrat, introduced H.R. 7152—what would become the Civil Rights Act of 1964—to the House of Representatives. But the political fight over the bill's passage was just beginning.

Kennedy knew that he would need support from both sides of the aisle to ensure the bill's passage, and wasted no time recruiting allies to his purpose. One such ally was William McCulloch, a Republican congressman from a conservative district in rural Ohio who would become one of the civil rights movement’s most ardent supporters. During President Kennedy’s administration, McCulloch worked with the Democrat-led White House to ensure Republican support of the Civil Rights Act in Congress."

So a Democrat President requested the Democrat majority craft the civil rights act, then recruited a few Republicans to work with them on crafting the bill so that Northern Republicans would vote for it along with Northern Democrats. Then a Democrat introduced the bill to congress, the majority of Democrats voted for it and a Democrat President signed it into law. How exactly is this supposed to be somehow credited to Republicans passing the bill? Just because they didn't side with the Southern Democrat minority and supported Northern Democrats in passing the bill they expect to get all the credit while lying about the majority of Democrats claiming they somehow didn't support it? It's a hilarious theory they have, and one only poorly educated dumb shits would believe, so I'm not all that surprised such a sad narrative is still being thrown around among them.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.25  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Ender @3.2.13    last year
An opinion piece?

Facts are facts. Interpretation of those facts are always opinions.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2.26  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  JohnRussell @3.2.18    last year
SOUTHERNERS OPPOSED THE BILL. 

Well, to be specific white Southern conservatives opposed the bill, just like white Southern conservatives opposed the voting rights act which they finally got their conservative Supreme Court majority to overturn in their favor, where they no longer have to get their discriminatory voting laws checked by the courts before they can be enacted. As soon as the white Southern conservatives killed the voting rights act they were immediately back at crafting voting laws that targeted black Americans with "surgical precision" the courts have found. They are the same southern conservatives and their descendants who fought both the civil rights act and voting rights act 60 years ago, they are now Dixpublicans.

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
3.2.27  JohnRussell  replied to  Sunshine @3.2.23    last year

I dont need a link. I have read the relevant article a dozen times, before every time I had to post it on NT. 

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.28  Sunshine  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.24    last year
Kennedy knew that he would need support from both sides of the aisle to ensure the bill's passage, and wasted no time recruiting allies to his purpose. 

Well of course he did, Democrats where busy fillibustering it.  jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

Believe what you wish, without the majority of the Repubulican vote in both houses the CRA would never have passed. 

That Democrat president who said I will have those n word voting for the next two hundred years would not have been able to sign the bill.

You do know that only Congress passes bills.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.29  Trout Giggles  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.10    last year

As Ender asked...an opinion piece?

Look, CK, if you want to refute my comment, please provide factual sources not opinion pieces. I thought you knew better than that

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
3.2.30  Texan1211  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.26    last year

yeah, it is just freaking terrible that some now-red states in the South don't have to jump through hoops to comply with laws designed to prevent the kind of laws Democrats passed.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.31  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.5    last year
I babysat Moses

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

Too funnyTG!  Were we neighbors  back then???

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.32  Trout Giggles  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.31    last year

Possibly. Were you the one that built a pyramid for his kids in the backyard?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.33  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.29    last year

The piece presents the facts as well as expresses an opinion of the facts. Which facts are in doubt?  The actual lack of Party switching taking place? As noted, only one did and that was Strom Thurmond.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
3.2.34  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.10    last year
Uhm, don't believe the hype

Then you link an opinion piece by D'Souza.

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.35  Trout Giggles  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.25    last year

Facts are facts...but when someone twists the facts for their own purposes they become distorted

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.36  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Kavika @3.2.15    last year
When you find my free stuff please send it to me.

Well, it isn't exactly free...

1) Quit working

2) Have  bunch of kids

3) Kick the daddy out of the house

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.37  Sunshine  replied to  JohnRussell @3.2.27    last year
I dont need a link.

I am sure you have no use for one.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.38  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Dulay @3.2.34    last year
Then you link an opinion piece by D'Souza.

Why not counter one opinion with another? Do you have any facts to contest what D'Souza says???

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.39  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.38    last year

Yep...

Democratic defectors, known as the “Dixiecrats,” started a switch to the Republican party in a movement that was later fueled by a so-called "Southern strategy."

Posted before, will probably have to be posted again.

Amazing to me what people want to willingly deny, even though the truth is there.

The dixiecrats started the move as early as 1948...

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.40  Ender  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.29    last year

Especially an opinion piece from a man that is a known conspiracy theorist, was forced to resign from a Christian college for his supposed sexual escapades and plead guilty to campaign finance fraud... 

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
3.2.41  Trout Giggles  replied to  Ender @3.2.40    last year

In other words...a loon

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.42  Ender  replied to  Trout Giggles @3.2.41    last year

Exactly. A loon donald pardoned and now he is trying to rewrite history.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.43  Tessylo  replied to  Ender @3.2.42    last year

Y'all beat me to the punch about that whackjob D'Souza.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.44  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Ender @3.2.39    last year
The dixiecrats started the move as early as 1948...

Thank you for showing exactly how wrong you are with that comment because if this was all about "racist" Southerners, it wouldn't have taken over 40 years to happen...

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.45  Ender  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.44    last year

Everything takes time. Nothing happens overnight.

Read the article. Not all left or changed right away.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.46  Ender  replied to  Ender @3.2.45    last year

By the way, pointing to any switch being a myth by only using the metric of reps that changed is in itself a false analogy as I am talking about the whole, as in the voting public.

Also using the presidential elections only as a metric is also a misnomer as it conveniently dismisses any state or rep elections.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.47  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @3.2.46    last year

Not all left or changed right away.

That's progress. Last time you tried to touch this topic you defended a fake LBJ quote about how the Civil Right Act supposedly immediately turned the south conservative for a generation.  

The south has gradually become more Republican as the Democrats became more radically leftist. That's true. What's also indisputable is became less racist and more prosperous , it became more Republican. 

You mention the Dixiecrats as some sort of conservative movement, but it wasn't. It contained  liberals who remained liberals in good standing and ended up supporting LBJ's big society. Racism isn't what divided southern conservative from southern liberals. Democrats were more than happy to keep racist southern liberals in the fold for decades after the Civil Rights Act. 

The gradual movement towards the the Republican Party (at least liberal here finally recognize that it was gradual and not caused by the Civil Rights Act) coincided with the Democrats embrace of radical leftism.  It wasn't until the mid 90s that Republicans were able to win many state legislatures and a majority of congressional delegates. In the 70's the Democrats became the party of abortion, acid and amnesty while Republicans focused on middle class prosperity, opposing abortion and supporting the military.  Those are the issues the Democrats lost the south on.  And the party has only continued its furious march to the left since then.  A moderate like the 90s version of   Bill Clinton, who did well in the South, could never be a Democrat today.

What's more, and this should be common sense, if the movement towards the Republican party was a reaction  based on race, then it would have began in the most racist areas of the deep south. Yet the evidence shows the movement towards the Republican party came on the peripheral states  of the deep south, and in the cities and suburbs. It was in  the isolated, rural  areas of the deep south that the racist democrats maintained their grip on power the longest. Again, this is all backed by actual analysis of voting trends, although  objective data is apparently  worthless to those who cling bitterly to the false narrative that reinforce their racialist worldview.  

  It's no wonder why so many modern progressives refuse to acknowledge the reality of why the south gradually changed parties as the Democrats became more radical. They are raced obsessed and, like Nazis, see only simplistic   racial explanations for everything.  They literally are incapable of thinking outside the race obsessed box their minds are stuck in. So a faulty narrative that falls apart under the most cursory of scrutiny gets treated like divine scripture because it reinforces their simplistic worldview, which they reinforce by  mindlessly reciting to each other so they don't have to think. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.48  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.47    last year

What a load...

Trying to blame it on abortion does not fly.

The ones not facing reality are the ones trying to rewrite history.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.49  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @3.2.48    last year
Trying to blame it on abortion does not fly.

I'm not "blaming" it on anything.  I know progressives only see the world in racial terms, but, as I pointed out, the world and the parties reaction to it, did not remain static since 1948.  Fixating on race, (again, I understand that's what progressives do) and pretending  the Democrats positions  have remained exactly the same since 1948 (or any other year) is idiocy. The democrats lost the south as they became radicalized. The proof is actually in the data. 

The proof is in the pudding. As the south became less racist, it became more Republican. 

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.50  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.49    last year

First off, I hope you realize that even if what you said was true, you are basically backing up what I have been saying.

The conservative Democrats switched to where their so called conservative values would be more embraced.

And no matter what your opinion is, I live in the deep south and I know a lot of people's racist tendencies and I know where their votes lie.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2.51  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sunshine @3.2.19    last year
Without Republican support the bill would not have been passed as XD commented.

Would it have passed without Democrat support? You know, Democrat President asking the Democrat majority in congress to craft the bill, Democrat majority in house voting for the bill, Democrat majority in the Senate voting for the bill and then a Democrat President signing it into law... Apparently to you that's all the little stuff and the minority Republican party who voted with the majority of Democrats should be seen as the party who passed the bill.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.52  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @3.2.50    last year

The conservative Democrats switched to where their so called conservative values would be more e

no kidding. Conservatives tend to vote for Conservative party.  as the Democratic Party turned to radicalism and became hostile to moderates in the 70s, it lost conservatives in the south and elsewhere.  

As the old guard racist liberals died off, republican fortunes 
Improved. Your mistake is believing racism is a conservative value. That’s simply ignorant.

as I pointed out, some  of the racist signers   of the southern manifesto Remained liberals in good standing, supporting LBJs great society decades later. Death removed them from the Democratic Party.  Racism and liberalism went hand in hand in the Jim Crow  south and Racist liberals remained Democrats in good standing for decades after the civil rights acts.  

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.53  Ender  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.52    last year

So now all racists are Liberals?

I suppose you can back this up.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
3.2.54  Dulay  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.38    last year
Why not counter one opinion with another?

I thought the point was to avoid believing hype. Guess not...

Do you have any facts to contest what D'Souza says???

The best way to contest D'Souza is to ignore him. 

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
3.2.55  Sean Treacy  replied to  Ender @3.2.53    last year
So now all racists are Liberals

Nice strawman. 

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.56  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.36    last year
When you find my free stuff please send it to me.

Well, it isn't exactly free...

1) Quit working

2) Have  bunch of kids

3) Kick the daddy out of the house

So do you think that people actually go about this as a plan?

And who would these people be? Only the women apparently. 

Kind of a sweeping generalization of the facts I would say.

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
3.2.57  Sunshine  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @3.2.51    last year

So now you are stating that the Republicans are not racist bigots or whatever name calling rant you dream up?  The fact that about 80% of the Republicans voted in favor of passage while the Democrats could only convince about 60% of their caucus to give blacks civil rights is quite evident who the racist are. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.58  Kavika   replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.36    last year
Well, it isn't exactly free...

1) Quit working

2) Have  bunch of kids

3) Kick the daddy out of the house

Well done, that is the perfect example of Trailer Park Trash. 

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.59  Tessylo  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.36    last year

"Well, it isn't exactly free...

1) Quit working

2) Have  bunch of kids

3) Kick the daddy out of the house"

Where is this happening?

Kavika is right, that is the definition of trailer park trash, mostly white folks.

I'm sure you meant it differently, a dog whistle perhaps?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.60  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Tessylo @3.2.59    last year
I'm sure you meant it differently, a dog whistle perhaps?

That's a racist statement since requirements are based on economic and familial situations, not skin color--which I specifically did not mention since I am well aware of  what race compromises the largest recipient..,,by numbers, but not by race percentages .

FAIL!  Try again...

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.61  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.56    last year
Kind of a sweeping generalization of the facts I would say.

Uhm, NO! Facts are just that ...facts!

Welfare Demographics

  • More women (22 percent) participated in a food assistance program than men (12 percent) at some point in their lives. [Source: Pew Research Center ]
  • 39 percent of children under the age of 18 participated in some form of government assistance program in 2012. [Source: United States Census Bureau ]
  • On average 50 percent of female lead households participated in a form of government assistance programs. [Source: United States Census Bureau ]
 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.62  Tessylo  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.61    last year

What facts have you provided?

That one source is from 2012.  

What does that have to do with 'free stuff'?

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.63  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Kavika @3.2.58    last year
Well done, that is the perfect example of Trailer Park Trash.

Section 8 Housing recipients in general actually. Unless you think of our inner city slums as "Trailer Park Trash" that is...

But as long as you are allowed to use Racial slurs like that, maybe Perrie will allow you to refer to those inner city slum dwellers by the " N " word while you're casting aspersions based on incomes and race...

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.64  Tessylo  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.63    last year

Section 8 housing isn't limited to black folks like you are implying.  

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.65  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Tessylo @3.2.62    last year
That one source is from 2012.

Feel free to post updated statistics that counter the argument made.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
3.2.66  Tessylo  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.65    last year

Feel free to post updated statistics to counter the argument made.  

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.67  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Tessylo @3.2.64    last year
Section 8 housing isn't limited to black folks like you are implying.

Where did i state or imply that? Matter of fact, I've already acknowledged that the majority of people on Welfare are WHITE!

Try again with the faux outrage...

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.68  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.61    last year

Not exactly. You posted:

1) Quit working:

That is not true. I know as a fact that many people work and still get some government assistance. More women because they can't work the hours that men do because they have kids. How do I know this? Since I ran the food program for my school, and that is considered gov. assistance. 

2) Have bunch of kids:

I'm sorry, but where is the fact for that? I don't see a number per household.

3) Kick the daddy out of the house:

How do you know that daddy just didn't up and leave? Where is the fact for that?

Also, from your own link, it says that most get from the gov. healthcare and some housing assistance and food. 35% leave in 2 years or less and 35% leave in 4 years or less. That says that these are not lifestyle choices as you implied, but circumstantial.  

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.69  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.68    last year

1)

Worst Effects on the Poor

Unfortunately, these distortionary effects hit poor and near-poor households the hardest. As Gene Steuerle of the Urban Institute has documented , phase-outs of programs like cash welfare, food stamps, the Earned Income Tax Credit, and Obamacare subsidies mean households making roughly $10,000-$40,000 can lose almost as much in government benefits as they gain in added income by working additional hours.

The new NBER study further quantifies this phenomenon. It finds that, both over the current year and over their lifetimes, individuals in the lowest income quintile (the bottom 20 percent) face higher marginal tax rates than those in the next three income quintiles (from the 20th percentile of income through the 80th percentile). Essentially, when taking the phase-out of government benefits into account, the poor face more disincentives to work than the middle class.

2)

Most states generally vary maximum benefits by family size, paying bigger benefits for larger families. Only Idaho and Wisconsin pay the same maximum benefit regardless of family size.

As a side note, if you do fail to qualify for "extended" coverage in one State, you can move to another and reapply under their program.

3)

Conclusions from Surveys

Our surveys show that the incentives of TANF-eligible women with children to cohabit or marry are affected by TANF program rules.  The way in which incentives are affected depends on the financial resources of the male with whom the woman might cohabit or marry and on the males relationship to the children.  The relevant TANF rules that affect these incentives are those governing eligibility, how the basic grant is structured, how blended families are treated, how unrelated cohabitors are treated, and work rules.

Concerning eligibility, our main finding is that if a male has financial resources, TANF provides the greatest disincentive to form and/or maintain a biological family, and the least disincentive, if not an incentive, to form an unrelated cohabitor family.

Feel free to post contradictory evidence proving any and or all authors information out of date or wrong in general as these are subjects that most people/government agencies/media try to avoid discussing, so current information is a bit harder to find

Thanks.

CK

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.70  Kavika   replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.63    last year
Section 8 Housing recipients in general actually. Unless you think of our inner city slums as "Trailer Park Trash" that is...

Actually I don't, it was your reference that was derogatory. But you know that.

But as long as you are allowed to use Racial slurs like that, maybe Perrie will allow you to refer to  those inner city slum dwellers by the " N " word while you're casting aspersions based on incomes and race.  

It was you that used the disparaging language/reference towards black people so it's far more likely that you would use the ''N'' word than I would.

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.71  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.69    last year

I would like to see the link to that information. I will post my rebuttal after that.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.72  Ender  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.71    last year

I would like to understand how a working mother would make more money working more hours, when that money would just be spent on someone or daycare to watch her kids...

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.73  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Ender @3.2.72    last year

That is part of the problem. They have to wait till the kids are at least school age or have assistance from a grandparent. 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.74  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.71    last year

Click on the numbers preceding the quoted text for links to the articles/publications in question.

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.75  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Kavika @3.2.70    last year
Actually I don't, it was your reference that was derogatory. But you know that.

To what exactly did you take offense? I stated a generic scenario which by everyone's agreement applies predominately to white people, so I really am curious exactly how you took offense to what was given and proven to be the true steps to getting the "free stuff" you are requesting!

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.76  Kavika   replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.75    last year
To what exactly did you take offense? I stated a generic scenario which by everyone's agreement applies predominately to white people, so I really am curious exactly how you took offense to what was given and proven to be the true steps to getting the "free stuff" you are requesting!

I didn't take offense. Everyone's agreement that applies to predominately white people...LMAO, who is everybody? 

Actually my question was why are the majority of minorities democrat's if the democratic party is so racist. 

 
 
 
Citizen Kane-473667
Professor Guide
3.2.77  seeder  Citizen Kane-473667  replied to  Kavika @3.2.76    last year
Actually my question was why are the majority of minorities democrat's if the democratic party is so racist.

Good Lord woman lol, that should be in a whole thread of its own on this board because there are many reasons being promoted even though by all rights it should be the opposite that should be true by all accounts of economists...

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.78  Kavika   replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.77    last year
Good Lord woman lol, that should be in a whole thread of its own on this board because there are many reasons being promoted even though by all rights it should be the opposite that should be true by all accounts of economists...

Perhaps you have a problem with your eyesight but if you look at my avatar and my name it should be obvious to you that I'm a male American Indian, 99.44 % pure Indian. You know one of those minorities you're babbling on about. 

 
 
 
Raven Wing
Professor Principal
3.2.79  Raven Wing  replied to  Kavika @3.2.78    last year
Good Lord woman lol,

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif     jrSmiley_86_smiley_image.gif

Ahem........sorry, but..........jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif    

jrSmiley_78_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.80  Ender  replied to  Kavika @3.2.78    last year

It's that .56%

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
3.2.81  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.69    last year

OK so first thing is that this came from "The Federalist" which has a long history of disliking federal assistance programs, so let's just say, that there is going to be a bias. 

Number 1 is not wrong when it talks about working v not working by both Urban Institute and the NBER. But their conclusion was not to end the programs, but to change the tax code and make it more advantageous to work and thus give less program money.    In fact, the snap program was found to have a huge benefit in the communities that have them and that it ended up a net win: 

Providing access to food stamps for pregnant women and families with children under age five is associated with substantial subsequent gains in productivity, economic self-sufficiency, neighborhood quality, and physical health for those children when they reach adulthood. This is the central finding of  Martha J. Bailey Hilary W. Hoynes Maya Rossin-Slater , and  Reed Walker 's new study,  Is the Social Safety Net a Long-Term Investment? Large-Scale Evidence from the Food Stamps Program   (NBER Working Paper  26942 ), which offers a comprehensive analysis of the long-term consequences of program access.

Number2:

Most states generally vary maximum benefits by family size, paying bigger benefits for larger families. Only Idaho and Wisconsin pay the same maximum benefit regardless of family size.

That is not from a study, but from a site called "The single Mother guide" (.com). The actual facts speak for themselves from the US Bureau of Labor Statistics. 

800

First of all, please note that the number of children in families receiving assistance is only .3 more than those who don't. That is virtually the same, so the idea that the poor are having more children to suck out more benefits is wrong. Furthermore, I checked and I could not find a single source to back up that families move to get more assistance. In fact, the NBER, implied that families tend to stay in place making the snap programs worthwhile. 

3. Our surveys show that the incentives of TANF-eligible women with children to cohabit or marry are affected by TANF program rules. 

That is The Federalist surveys, which is hardly not biased. The one thing that works against many people is the marriage tax and not federal and state programs. 

Couples in which spouses have similar incomes are more likely to incur marriage penalties than couples in which one spouse earns most of the income, because combining incomes in joint filing can push both spouses into higher tax brackets.

With poor families, this is usually the case, since they tend to take min or close to min wage jobs, which fits into this demographics. 

The rest of that is telling us what we all already know. That it is better to keep families together than not. 

 
 
 
Kavika
Professor Principal
3.2.82  Kavika   replied to  Ender @3.2.80    last year

Just like the soap.

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
3.2.83  pat wilson  replied to  Citizen Kane-473667 @3.2.77    last year

That's beyond ignorant.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
3.2.84  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Kavika @3.2.76    last year
Actually my question was why are the majority of minorities democrat's if the democratic party is so racist. 

As you can see by the deflection they don't want to say what they think on this matter because it will expose them. His response of "by all rights it should be the opposite" betrays their belief which is that they think minorities are stupid and apparently easily tricked into voting against their own interests. It doesn't matter to them that the Democrats are diverse and the people we elect more often reflect what the people in our communities look like because they are from those communities. They grew up there and understand the issues that their minority communities face and know that just electing another white male, which is often the only candidates put forward by Republicans, likely won't solve the complex systemic problems they often face.

But in Republicans minds, that's reverse racism and sexism, not voting for them because they are white male Christians and don't reflect the community they think they should be given control over. Sure, for the last two hundred years we had effectively white male Christian affirmative action where they were the only ones either party put forward for elected positions, but Republicans apparently think that just saying "There is no more racism, anyone eligible can be a candidate" then continuing to select almost all white male Christians is somehow the picture of equality. They have essentially said "We will only base our selections on qualifications, not race. It's just a coincidence that based on our party make up and candidates we support that apparently none of the minorities are qualified, so the best selection, once again, is another white male Christian".

Often those folk believe that just not saying anything about race, not saying anything about gender or inequity is what will really solve things and make it go away. Just vote for their conservative white male candidate and stop examining or exposing the systemic inequities and pretend that they don't exist, just like pretending Covid doesn't exist, and it will just miraculously "go away". What I think many of them really want is for the conversation about inequity to "go away" because they like things as they are, they prefer having a perceived privileged space in society, where their skin color or faith puts them on the pedestal as "real Americans" which is different for anyone who doesn't look like them or pray like them.

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
3.2.85  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  Ender @3.2.48    last year
trying to rewrite history

As opposed to what, erasing history? Just wondering. Seriously just curious.

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
3.2.86  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  Sean Treacy @3.2.47    last year
A moderate like the 90s version of   Bill Clinton, who did well in the South, could never be a Democrat today.

Agreed. 

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
3.2.87  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @3.2.56    last year

While yes, it's a sweeping generalization... I've actually witnessed people having a bunch of babies and couples purposely filing for divorce to obtain more state / government aid or never getting married, and for the most part living together but one of them maintaining a different mailing / listing address for the same reason. 

It's not necessarily just women; men will help with the plot / plan. I don't defend it, I don't condone it, but I have actually witnessed it.

 
 
 
Ender
Professor Principal
3.2.88  Ender  replied to  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka) @3.2.85    last year

Imo it is the same thing. Rewriting history is basically erasing the truth.

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
Professor Guide
4  Paula Bartholomew    last year

Is this schmuck the one who Trump claimed he owned in 2016?

 
 
 
JohnRussell
Professor Principal
4.1  JohnRussell  replied to  Paula Bartholomew @4    last year

LOL. No that was "my African American" . I dont think that guy was a politician. 

He actually renounced Trump after he had seen Trump in office for awhile. 

 
 
 
Paula Bartholomew
Professor Guide
4.1.1  Paula Bartholomew  replied to  JohnRussell @4.1    last year

Ahhh, okay.

 
 
 
Account Deleted
Freshman Quiet
5  Account Deleted    last year

It's a bit of a stretch for Vernon to identify himself as a Democrat when he claims to have voted twice for Bush and donated to Republican candidates. 

This is probably the best definition of his politics . A moderate conservative libertarian.

This is not the equivalent of  an Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez defecting to the Trump camp.

Nor does it match Biden's support from Kasich  - an actual conservative Republican who shares no policy goals with the Democrats other than removing Trump from office.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
6  Gsquared    last year

The Tea Party yesterday = The Trump Party today

 
 
 
Release The Kraken
PhD Principal
7  Release The Kraken    last year

A black guy leaves the democrat party and all the woke crowd shows what racists they are.

Amazing!

Well done!

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
7.1  Sunshine  replied to  Release The Kraken @7    last year
all the woke crowd shows what racists they are.

To be expected...it is what they do.

Twitter leftists attacked NFL great Herschel Walker with the racist slur “Uncle Tom” because he endorsed President Trump at the Republican National Convention.
 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
7.2  Gsquared  replied to  Release The Kraken @7    last year

Amazing non-sequitur!

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8  Kathleen    last year

I will hate to see what the stock market will do if Biden  takes office.  We will be taxed to death. The media will hold his hand, and crime will get worse. If he plans on closing the country... God help us.

 
 
 
JBB
Professor Principal
8.1  JBB  replied to  Kathleen @8    last year

That comment would make Chicken Little blush...

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.1.1  Kathleen  replied to  JBB @8.1    last year

We shall see. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.1.3  Sparty On  replied to    last year

Yep, more and more Americans are seeing right through that gambit though.

It's a very tired old cliche ..... and yet it's still all they got.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.1.4  Kathleen  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.3    last year

Trump did do well with the economy. I am afraid that it will not be so with Biden.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.5  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.4    last year

Trump did do well with the economy. I am afraid that it will not be so with Biden.

Do you realize his "Middle Class" taxcut goes to those who need it least /? Thus, in the short term it spurred the economy, not so much in the long term, and how could the economy not do better, after removing so many regulations on large corporations ?

You do realize when Obama/BIDEN took office, our country was bleedin 200,000 jobs a month ? Yet, they were able to hand Trump a very solid and still growing economy, some how, despite Trump claiming all the credit. 

Not sure how ANYONE, Can Continue to believe this constant LYING FOOL, but what ever. 

When History looks back at Trumpers, it is not going to be kind or pretty, and nor should it !

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.1.6  Sparty On  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.4    last year

No, you've got it wrong.  

The economy did good all because of Obama and now it's magically doing worse all because of Trump. /S

Get with program Kathleen .......... jrSmiley_9_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.1.7  Kathleen  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.6    last year

Lol! I think we know what is and what’s not... 

jrSmiley_79_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.1.8  Sparty On  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.7    last year

jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

The funny part is some people here actually believe they are changing peoples minds with their lies, propaganda and disinformation.

Well, maybe not "funny" funny but you know what i mean .....

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
8.1.9  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.6    last year
The economy did good all because of Obama and now it's magically doing worse all because of Trump.

The economy recovered under Obama and we saw record highs in the stock market and record low unemployment numbers which were all improving when Trump took office. Since then he continued the trends, though we never saw Trumps promised 4% or more GDP growth average. Then, because of Trump downplaying and slow reaction and response to the Corona virus, we saw the economy tank again, under Trumps watch. He had every opportunity to take this serious from day one back in January, but waited to do anything while telling people it wasn't a big deal and it would just "disappear" like a "miracle". Then, when it didn't disappear "like a miracle", he blamed everyone else but himself and never instituted a clear federal response with clear guidelines recommended by the CDC and HHS.

On top of that, when certain States started getting things under control he came out and declared it was essentially over and we could all go back to our normal lives which of course led to a second spike even before we had actually reached a plateau on the first spike. Now we have 170,000+ dead Americans, still no coordinated federal response and dozens of States infections and deaths still rising.

The only fantasy "magical" effect was Trumps claim that Covid would miraculously disappear. The tanking of the economy under Trumps watch and lack of response wasn't magical, it was predictable.

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.1.10  Sparty On  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @8.1.9    last year

I rest my case .....

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.12  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.10    last year

shouldn't your case, at least produce a heartbeat, before resting it...?

  

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.1.13  Sparty On  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.12    last year

And just for iggy .... i haiku:

One would not expect

you to detect a heartbeat

not on this topic

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The lesser you know

The more peaceful your life is

Ignorance is bliss

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.1.15  Gsquared  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.13    last year
i haiku

In the mind of Trump

Ignorance is the order

Deflect and control

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.1.16  Kathleen  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.8    last year

We stirred them up... jrSmiley_10_smiley_image.gif

Now they are coming out of the woodwork.

I will keep my views regardless of other people’s politics on this forum.  (That’s to everyone whether you agree or not.) 

Its called ‘ Free Speech’. 

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
8.1.17  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.5    last year

Funny... the US auto industry did terribly under Obama / Biden. 

My husband and I were laid off more time (among many others in the same field) under Obama / Biden than "W" and Trump... and I think they're all assholes personally.

 
 
 
Sunshine
PhD Guide
8.1.18  Sunshine  replied to  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka) @8.1.17    last year
Funny... the US auto industry did terribly under Obama / Biden. 

Shhhh..not suppposed tell people about the real world.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.19  igknorantzrulz  replied to  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka) @8.1.17    last year
Funny

do you recall, they were going out of business till Obama and Biden bailed them out ? This also bailed out all of the supporting parts industries thatwete also going under.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.20  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.7    last year
Lol! I think we know what is and what’s not... 

i agree , that is hilarious.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
8.1.21  Texan1211  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.19    last year

Out of business?

Where did THAT come from?

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.1.22  Gsquared  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.19    last year

In fact, Republicans at the time were willing to let the American auto companies go bankrupt.

 
 
 
Sean Treacy
Professor Expert
8.1.23  Sean Treacy  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.19    last year
were going out of business till Obama and Biden bailed them out ? This also bailed out all of the supporting parts industries thatwete also going under.

George Bush did that.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
8.1.24  Texan1211  replied to  Gsquared @8.1.22    last year

Thank God Bush rescued the auto companies, eh?

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.1.25  Dulay  replied to  Texan1211 @8.1.21    last year
Out of business? Where did THAT come from?

History. 

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
8.1.26  Texan1211  replied to  Dulay @8.1.25    last year

Must be some revisionist history.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.1.27  Dulay  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.7    last year

Based on your comments, no. 

That was before the Trump's pandemic debacle. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.1.28  Dulay  replied to  Texan1211 @8.1.26    last year

Nope, very recent American history. 

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.1.29  Kathleen  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.20    last year

[Deleted]

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
8.1.30  Texan1211  replied to  Dulay @8.1.28    last year

Okay, recently revised American history.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.31  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.29    last year

As R U

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.1.32  Dulay  replied to  Texan1211 @8.1.30    last year

Juvenile. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.1.33  Sparty On  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.16    last year

Yep but it’s SOSDD for that crew.    Professional online agitators that go WAY back.

The system here just makes it tougher on them to play their little reindeer games and boy howdy do they hate that.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
8.1.34  Tessylo  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.29    last year

It takes smarts and a sharp wit to appreciate Iggy.  

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
8.1.35  Tessylo  replied to    last year

tRump has already destroyed the economy, what the hell are you talking about?

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
8.1.36  Tessylo  replied to  Sparty On @8.1.8    last year
The funny part is some people here actually believe they are changing peoples minds with their lies, propaganda and disinformation.

 
 
 
Tessylo
Professor Principal
8.1.37  Tessylo  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.16    last year
"We stirred them up."

You did no such thing. 

 
 
 
Raven Wing
Professor Principal
8.1.38  Raven Wing  replied to  Tessylo @8.1.34    last year
It takes smarts and a sharp wit to appreciate Iggy.  

Agreed. Iggy is in fact a very intelligent and sincere person. Too many people sell him short because of the fun and jesting way he writes his comments. Too many people just shine him off. But, if they take the time to really pay attention to what he is saying, he is truly very knowledgeable and astute.

And I for one really enjoy conversing with him. jrSmiley_79_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.1.39  Kathleen  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.31    last year

I was a bit harsh with my comment to you.

Apologies.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.41  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Kathleen @8.1.39    last year

Accepted, and no sweat Deer

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
8.1.42  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.19    last year

Ford Motor Company took no such bail out. And when Chrysler couldn't pay the bill back [because business wasn't any better... because "loaning" big corporations money doesn't do any good when the auto industry still hasn't recovered], Fiat merged with Chrysler and paid off their loans to the feds. GM lost a lot in growth, but they're big enough (global) that they were able to recover and pay their bills. Until Fiat merged with Chrysler they weren't global.

I'm guessing you think that giving / loaning people boat loads of money will somehow help them when in reality, it just makes people want more. I'm also guessing that you don't work in the automotive industry to know the reality of how that bailout affected the entire industry. Those bailouts helped FOMOCO open up a new plant in Mexico for the Fiesta and Fusion production lines. You want to know what helped the US auto industry more than anything else? Trump's extreme increase in taxes on import / export of cars and car parts. That helped prevent Ford Motor Company from expanding operations in Mexico and forcing them to reopen a recently shut down plant in Flatrock, MI.

Oh... and GM opened more operations in the city of Detroit again. Ford also expanded engineering in Dearborn-Detroit area. They don't want to pay the exorbitant taxes on continuing their operations outside the US.

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
8.1.43  Texan1211  replied to  Dulay @8.1.32    last year

Just trying to make you happy!

jrSmiley_15_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.1.44  Dulay  replied to  Texan1211 @8.1.43    last year

Try 'adulting' instead...

 
 
 
Texan1211
Professor Principal
8.1.45  Texan1211  replied to  Dulay @8.1.44    last year

I did, you didn't seem pleased......

jrSmiley_15_smiley_image.gif

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.1.46  igknorantzrulz  replied to  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka) @8.1.42    last year
'm guessing you think that giving / loaning people boat loads of money will somehow help them

Oh...and U, would B guessin WRONG

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
8.1.47  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.1.46    last year

On that part, okay. That's why it would be called a guess. Apparently, the other part, I was right on.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.1.48  Dulay  replied to  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka) @8.1.42    last year
Ford Motor Company took no such bail out. I'm guessing you think that giving / loaning people boat loads of money will somehow help them when in reality, it just makes people want more.

The reason that Ford didn't need bail out money is because they had ALREADY been loaned 'boat loads of money' prior to the credit market drying up. 

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
8.1.49  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  Dulay @8.1.48    last year

That wasn't even the main point of the entire comment. And that still wasn't a government bailout.

 
 
 
MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)
Sophomore Principal
8.1.50  MsAubrey (aka Ahyoka)  replied to  Dulay @8.1.48    last year

And did you know that Bill Ford and Mark Fields took a massive paycut? While, yes they laid off all of the contract staff and yes, that's all they seem to hire anymore, but you still have to give them credit for opting for a paycut themselves too. Not all owners / CEOs will do something like that.

 
 
 
arkpdx
Masters Participates
8.1.52  arkpdx  replied to  JBB @8.1    last year

No the Democrats hold the pattent on that. Remember how they said the Republicans will throw grandma off a cliff, they will starve your kids, they wanted dirty air and water. In 2016 Trump was going to immediately crash the economy (for three years his economy far surpassed Obama's), the unemployment rate would skyrocket but instead it dropped to the lowest rate in decades. Black, Hispanic and women's unemployment rates hit historic lows. Trump was to have us at war within months of taking office. None of that but happened 

Nope it is the. Democrats that are the fear mongers and Chicken Littles 

 
 
 
pat wilson
Professor Guide
8.2  pat wilson  replied to  Kathleen @8    last year

That's a tad melodramatic.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.2.1  Kathleen  replied to  pat wilson @8.2    last year

I don’t think so... 

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
8.2.2  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  pat wilson @8.2    last year
That's a tad melodramatic.

Of course it is. The bullshit narrative they keep scaring their conservative kids with that "We will be taxed to death" is just pure hyperbolic nonsense. And the stock market did fantastic under our last two Democrat Presidents so it's pure partisan fantasy to believe it would be worse off under Biden. So really, it wasn't just a "tad melodramatic", it was chock full of partisan lies, the same ones they trot out every election cycle.

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.2.3  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @8.2.2    last year

and the same ones their ignorant base, buy into every election 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3  Gsquared  replied to  Kathleen @8    last year

The stock market will do what it always does.  Sometimes it will go up and sometimes it will go down. 

You will survive whatever taxes you may have to pay, and derive benefit living in our society from paying your share.

The "media" will play the same role it always plays, and we expect it to play, challenging authority. 

FBI statistics show violent crimes and property crimes have decreased significantly from their height in the 1990s despite mistaken public perception to the contrary.  President Biden will not cause crime to get worse. 

Biden does not "plan" on closing the country, but if the pandemic gets even worse, terrible as it is now, reasonable and necessary action may be required based on the best science available.  Wishing the virus away, or pretending it is going to disappear because some miracle is just around the corner, has led to over 178,000 American deaths so far.  

Chin up!

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.3.1  Kathleen  replied to  Gsquared @8.3    last year

If he becomes president, I want to see how he does with the economy and crime. 

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.3.2  Sparty On  replied to  Gsquared @8.3    last year
The "media" will play the same role it always plays, and we expect it to play, challenging authority. 

Challenging authority?   They don't that unless it's against their preferred narratives.  

For the most part the mass media today is a joke.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.3  Gsquared  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.1    last year

Biden will "do" with the failed Trump economy the same way the Obama/Biden administration overcame the dire Bush recession, successfully.

As for crime, that is generally a problem dealt with locally.  In fact, Trump wants to cut $465.8 million from the budget for the federal Office of Justice Programs which provides grants to local communities for public safety issues.  Biden supports increased funding for local police forces as well as deploying more psychologists and social workers in police work.

Don't be swayed by Trump's propaganda and lies.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.4  Gsquared  replied to  Sparty On @8.3.2    last year

If you only watch Fox News you would think the media is a joke.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.3.5  Kathleen  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.4    last year

I have noticed lately that Fox will allow more point of views and they are much more balanced. CNN and MSNBC is the big joke. They are certainly not balanced, at least Fox will give the left a chance to voice an opinion. CNN and MSNBC does nothing but constantly attack. Fox will do some of that, but nowhere near what CNN and MSNBC does.  They are awful.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.3.6  Kathleen  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.3    last year

I think it may be you that is being swayed here. I am not getting a good feeling about Biden at all. He has been in politics for a long time and with all that time, I am not impressed with anything he has done. 

 
 
 
Perrie Halpern R.A.
Professor Principal
8.3.7  Perrie Halpern R.A.  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.5    last year

Honestly Kathleen, I don't like any of them. I think they all really don't allow for the other perspective properly. If they allow the other side to speak, it is only to try and take it down later. 

When I want to watch the news, I watch a major network (even they are not so great) or the BBC. They have no vested interest in our politics. 

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.3.8  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.4    last year

If you only watch Fox News you would think the media is a joke.

if you only watch FOX, damn sure the media is a JOKE

 
 
 
Sparty On
PhD Principal
8.3.9  Sparty On  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.4    last year

For the most part real journalism is dead is this country.   Replaced with a form of partisan based newspeak.

It's a total joke.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.3.10  Kathleen  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @8.3.7    last year

I felt the same way 2 years ago. Then after I really started watching them and comparing them, I do see some people on Fox give the left some talking points. I am not talking about some of the people at night on Fox, I am talking about daytime. The other two, they are terrible. 

I like Chris Wallace and Harris Faulkner. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.11  Dulay  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.5    last year
I have noticed lately that Fox will allow more point of views and they are much more balanced.

The first two nights of the DNC the list of Fox guests was:

Donald Trump Jr.,

Kellyanne Conway, 

Sarah Sanders 

Erin Perrine.

Can you name a Democratic guest? 

CNN and MSNBC is the big joke. They are certainly not balanced, at least Fox will give the left a chance to voice an opinion.

When?

You know that Trump had a twitter fit when Fox dared to interview a Democratic Senator right? 

You know that CNN and MSNBC actually have conservative anchors and contributors right?

CNN and MSNBC does nothing but constantly attack.

Both CNN and MSNBC are carrying the FULL RNC every night. 

Fox carried one hour of the DNC each night. During his show, Hannity cut into speeches and attacked them in real time. The only thing he played without vitriol was the moment of silence for George Floyd. 

Fox will do some of that, but nowhere near what CNN and MSNBC does.  They are awful.

How would you know? Do you watch either CNN or MSNBC anywhere near as much as you do Fox, or at all for that matter? 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.12  Gsquared  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.5    last year

Well, that's interesting because less than 5 minutes ago MSNBC finished another interview with Mick Mulvaney, one of Trump's  former chiefs of staff and a long time ultra-conservarive Republican congressman.  Both CNN and MSNBC feature Republicans on a daily basis, some Trump supporters, and some not.  That is a fact.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.13  Gsquared  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.6    last year

I can't help it if you are impressed by Biden or you are not impressed by Biden.  He is a man who has dedicated his life to public service with a record of accomplishment.

Trump, in his business and political careers, has done nothing but wreak havoc and destruction, from his bankruptcies, and failed and fraudulent business and so-called charitable activities, to undermining our vital alliances, cozying up to dictators and his wholesale onslaught against our Constition, our most valued institutions and the American way of life.

The choice is stark and very clear.  Trump has to go... and then he can get back to work on his real interest, his long-desired Trump Tower Moscow project.

 
 
 
Dismayed Patriot
Professor Participates
8.3.14  Dismayed Patriot  replied to  Dulay @8.3.11    last year
You know that CNN and MSNBC actually have conservative anchors and contributors right?

The large number of Republicans or former-Republicans who appear on MSNBC have simply been labeled RINO's or traitors by the RNC.

Nicole Wallace, Joe Scarborough, Michael Steele, Steve Schmidt, George Will and many more Republicans or former Republicans who are regularly on MSNBC have all been targets of conservative Republican backlash since speaking their minds.

At Fox, if you don't always agree with the conservative Republican talking points, or if you even make rational arguments on Fox like Shep Smith did, whether you were a lifelong Republican or not, you are vilified, labeled a RINO and forced out.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
8.3.15  Trout Giggles  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @8.3.14    last year

Whatever happened to Shep Smith? He was the one beam of sunlight on Fox

 
 
 
igknorantzrulz
Masters Participates
8.3.16  igknorantzrulz  replied to  Trout Giggles @8.3.15    last year

He allegedly quit, as he couldn't deal with the LYING at Fox, or was fired, for questioning that LYING.

 
 
 
Trout Giggles
Professor Principal
8.3.17  Trout Giggles  replied to  igknorantzrulz @8.3.16    last year

I thought he quit but I don't know what happened to him after that

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.18  Dulay  replied to  Dismayed Patriot @8.3.14    last year

George Will should have been the one that made them stop and think but alas, that didn't seem to  happen. 

What cracks me up is that in articles that talk about the political leaning of Cable news anchors, they actually scrap the bottom of the barrel and claim Tucker Carlson is a Democrat. If there EVER was a proper use of the term DINO, Tucker Carlson meets it. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.19  Dulay  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.13    last year
Trump has to go... and then he can get back to work on his real interest, his long-desired Trump Tower Moscow project.

He can work on that from 'Club Fed'. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.20  Dulay  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.12    last year

The wife is home sick and in control of the remote so I know that MSNBC's Stephanie Ruhle did an interview with Rep. Kevin Brady this morning too. He insisted that the USPS crisis is fake. I laughed out loud and then went to start some ribs in the crock pot. Too humid to be outside...

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.21  Gsquared  replied to  Dulay @8.3.20    last year

I hope she feels better soon.

MSNBC interviews both pro and anti-Trump Republicans every day.  During the Democratic convention, one of the CNN regulars was Scott Jennings, a long time Republican.

It's hot and humid here, too.  I'm staying indoors except to go out and get the mail from our mailbox tonight after it cools down...

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.22  Dulay  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.21    last year

I've spent 3 days tearing off and putting up new poly on one of my greenhouses and working only in the AM has doubled the time it's taking. Almost done, a couple early hours tomorrow should do it. 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.23  Gsquared  replied to  Dulay @8.3.22    last year

Nice.  We have been trying to figure out a spot where we can have a green house.  We want it for orchids.   And you have more than one!  I'm jealous of that.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.24  Gsquared  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.6    last year

Yes, I am swayed by facts.  Conservatives too often base their opinions on their feelings, and the facts be damned.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.25  Dulay  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.23    last year

A lean to, attached to the house is good for orchids since it's easier to heat and control the humidity, especially if you get all 4 seasons of weather. 

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.26  Gsquared  replied to  Dulay @8.3.25    last year

A lean to is one option we have thought about.  My wife would like it a lot.  We do have room to possibly put in a small green house, maybe up to 10x10 or so, but that would really be more than we need.  I'm in L.A.  As a native, I can tell our seaons apart even though most people seem to think we only have one.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.3.27  Kathleen  replied to  Dulay @8.3.11    last year

Still demanding answers I see.....  

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.28  Dulay  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.26    last year

Well then the lean to let's you keep it cooler via a louvered vent that will opened and closed with a thermostat controlling it. I designed one for some old friends, now gone, some years now and one of them practically lived in it. It had a wall with a trickle waterfall for Bromeliads. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.29  Dulay  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.27    last year
Still demanding answers I see.....

Still unwilling and unable to back up your comments or participate in a cogent conversation I see.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.30  Gsquared  replied to  Dulay @8.3.28    last year

Sounds interesting.  Thanks!  I was thinking of trying to grow bromeliads again.

We have a good-sized garden window in our kitchen that orchids love.  We had some very nice ones blooming there recently.

Are your greenhouses just for flowers?

 
 
 
Raven Wing
Professor Principal
8.3.31  Raven Wing  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.30    last year
I was thinking of trying to grow Bromeliads again.

I grew Bromeliads to put on some of the wood burl clocks I made when they were all the fad. While the Bromeliads only bloom once, they do live for a good while. And before they die, they will produce clones of the original plant. I wrote up an instruction page on how to care for the plant, and how to replace the original plant with the new pup. I gave a copy of the instruction page to each person who bought one of the clocks with a Bromeliad. That way they would know what to expect with the plants and how to care for them after they took them home.

 
 
 
Kathleen
Professor Principal
8.3.33  Kathleen  replied to  Dulay @8.3.29    last year

You seem to have forgotten our earlier conversation. May I repeat, I do not like engaging with rude people.

 
 
 
Gsquared
Junior Principal
8.3.34  Gsquared  replied to  Raven Wing @8.3.31    last year

That's great.  I have a beautiful photo of bromeliads taken at a nursery that I might post on Creative Arts this week.  You will like it.

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.35  Dulay  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.30    last year
Are your greenhouses just for flowers?

No, mostly food and especially culinary and medicinal herbs. 

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.36  Dulay  replied to  Kathleen @8.3.33    last year
You seem to have forgotten our earlier conversation.

Which one? The one where you demanded answers to ever changing questions or the one where you refused to answer ONE question? 

May I repeat, I do not like engaging with rude people.

I do not like engaging with hypocrites but alas...

 
 
 
Dulay
Professor Principal
8.3.37  Dulay  replied to  Dulay @8.3.35    last year

I do however have a giant prized Hoya and different colors of bougainvillea in them in the summer. They fill my master bath in the winter. I give away the cuttings and divisions in the fall. I've had the Hoya for over 2 decades. 

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
8.3.38  Buzz of the Orient  replied to  Perrie Halpern R.A. @8.3.7    last year

When I was the editor-in-chief of my university newspaper back in 1957-58, it won the award both years for being the best weekly campus newspaper in Canada.  Our model back then was The Christian Science Monitor - both for format and content.  The CSM back then won the award in America for the most UNBIASED news media in the USA.  These days it leans left, but these days that award is no longer given, and I think it's pretty obvious why it isn't. 

 
 
 
arkpdx
Masters Participates
8.3.39  arkpdx  replied to  Gsquared @8.3.4    last year

Not true except for MSNBC and CNN and a few newspapers

 
 
 
Buzz of the Orient
Professor Principal
9  Buzz of the Orient    last year

So, both sides now.  This was not unexpected.   What effect if will have is negligible.  He won't convert other Democrats.

 
 
 
The Magic 8 Ball
Masters Guide
9.1  The Magic 8 Ball  replied to  Buzz of the Orient @9    last year
What effect if will have is negligible

im not sure the point is this guy will change anyone's minds - people will do that themselves.

vernon jones is just another example of the ever shrinking democrat party.


Epic. Listen to 8 minutes of Democrat's calling into C-SPAN stating they are fed up and voting for
@r