"He is come to open the purple testament of bleeding war"
America's #1 health "expert", Dr Tony Fauci, was on CNN's State of the Union this morning and got another of those leading questions from resistance member Jake Tapper. Tapper asked " if restrictive measures put in place earlier by the government would have saved more lives amid the pandemic?" To which our own Dr Strangelove replied "I mean, obviously, you could logically say, that if you had a process that was ongoing, and you started mitigation earlier, you could have saved lives." "Obviously, no one is going to deny that."
No shit? There was a lot of bait on that hook Tony and you swallowed it hook, line and sinker. Are you really that stupid or do you really want to let them position you against the President?
Our very own "Dr Strangelove."
Moments later Ms DeAnna Lorraine posted a tweet calling for Fauci's resignation. The President used it to make an example of the media's attempt to blame him for the current suffering:
"If the Fake News Opposition Party is pushing, with all their might, the fact that President Trump “ignored early warnings about the threat,” then why did Media & Dems viciously criticize me when I instituted a Travel Ban on China? They said “early & not necessary.” Corrupt Media!.. ....President Trump tweeted
Most recently I questioned why it was that Dr Fauci praised the WHO's Director-General, Dr Tedros Adhanom after Adhanom had backed up all of China's lies about the virus. Nobody here on NT could offer any explanation, though it was clear that some attempted to defend Dr Fauci and the WHO!
Dr Fauci is the senior member and the leader of the President's medical task force. It was Fauci who once referred to the recently six million unemployed as well as all those now out of business as "inconvenienced." It would seem that he's not alone. A few of our members on NT are all too smug about watching much of the country suffer. They don't really want to treat the infected with drugs already being tried with a degree of success by doctors worldwide. No, they would rather sit back and wait a year until a vaccine is finally developed and approved. We need every arrow in the quiver and we need to get the country moving again, even if it's one section at a time.
There is no doubt the pandemic is a serious matter, but Dr Fauci is entirely focused on the health aspects of the current crisis. The good doctor admitted earlier that he made a mistake in accepting the information China gave. He also has been all too often manipulated by the left wing media. At this point he is doing more harm than good.
I'm with Ms Lorraine....It's time for Fauci to go!
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I'll take the elected leaders over the "experts."
Then maybe you should call your plumber next time you need a colonoscopy.
I appreciate the concern.
You can't be serious.
Some folks are going off the deep end Sister. Saddest part is they do so willingly.
We have known for some time that Trumpism is a cult, and of course sometimes there will be more blatant evidence of it than we will care to see.
How wrong have these experts been so far? Almost 7 million have lost their jobs!
Correction: Its more like 17 million and the longer the government imposed lockdowns go on, the more people will lose their jobs!
You mean Trump's hand picked experts?
WTF do Medical experts have to do with Job loss? I know of NO medical expert that has signed an Executive order, whether local or federal. Nor do I know of any who have laid off or furloughed workers.
Yea, they stroke Fauci but Trump has always done the 'good cop, bad cop' routine and this time it's health against economy - he's playing optimist. Fauci has a credible presence and it would be foolish to bus him.
Fauci is kind of like the kid you knew growing up, who always wanted to be liked and kept getting into dilemmas.
???????
You've never met people who desperately wanted to be liked?
Here is what can happen: An activist, masquerading as a reporter, asks a question which pits Fauci against the man who appointed him. Fauci eagerly goes along, oblivious to the grotesque politics involved.
That’s what makes him an innocent, of sorts. I have a soft spot for the kid who got his books dumped at the bus stop every day.
Let me point out that you are putting your faith in a dating service employee (with no college or formal training) to tell you who is or isn't qualified to make medical assessments that are directly related to their field of study.
I'm with Ms Lorraine....It's time for Fauci to go!
Yup, and you put your faith in people with college educations. And one of the things learned in college is how to get away with a lot of stuff that the uneducated can't get away with.
The experts have failed us on this.
It's time to admit it.
Your imagination has gotten the better of you.
Thank you Squiggy, as you recognize Fauci has only one goal, and that is to defeat this virus. Trump, needs to save the economy, he thinks, to possibly be re-elected, and our LIVES be DAMNED. Yes, i believe Fauci is innocent in this and just answered a question with a truthful answer. Hell, we all should have known if we tightened up sooner, the spread would have been reduced, and lives saved. WTF, anybody that speaks the truth, or obeys the LAW, Trump FIRES if it makes him look bad.
What the hell kind of leader is that ?
We all know Fauci is Good smart trusted Scientist, that we Need right now. It would be STUPID to fire him, but we are talking Trump, so who knows.
And i helped out a lot of those kids whose books got smacked down, they were good people who probably did much better than the jocks and the popular crowd later in life. I was in classes with this group, and still remain friends with some to this day.
I think I'll let that one stand on its own.
They feel as the 'educated' have looked down on them, and i would agree. My crowd most of my life were hard working blue collar lower middle class. I employed many over the years, and they and i were viewed as lesser than many of the educated white collar crowd. As i look and act very blue collar and do not dress to impress, i too am often at first disregarded, until we chat, and if i want, i'll show many They are the ones closer to retarded, cause i can be a dik that way, and a thousand other ways, but who's counting ?
So i understand why many dislike and distrust many of the snobbish look down their nose at us folk, but then i watch them get used by ones so much worse, and led totally astray. Take climate change for instance. Now many don't believe in science, thus so much confusion with this pandemic, imho
Their parents didn't have enough cash to score on SATs.
For today at least, your're ok, IG.
if only i could stop time...
i'm just like people on the right, with different opinions.
I believe almost all i debate around here are GOOD, but misguided people.
I hang with a crowd that the vast majority were Trump supporters, and choose not to go there much with them, as they are my friends. Thus why i com here to anonymously vent to you guys, who i do also consider friends, just ones i can argue with more, and if i don't wish to, i won't and don't.
But we're all Americans here, and i believe we have to come together like we always do, to defeat our common enemy.
A country is far more easily conquered, whence divided, and i much rather see US ALL KICK THIS VIRUS'S ASS,
but it's going to take Americans working Together, to do it!
Have a good day Squiggy,
i've got to go get blown
away and saturated in order to try and earn a few FUN tickets,
You good posters behave, and don't do anything i would, unless you wish to earn your own 'fun' tickets!
Then the educated need to stand up and admit when they were wrong! Dr Fauci complains about getting bad info from China, but he willingly accepted it knowing China's history.
I'm sure that it never occurred to you that Fauci merely told the TRUTH. Can't have that can we?
Sure. Almost anything you can imagine is "possible." But is it likely that restrictive measures would have been supported substantially earlier than they were actually implemented? Doubtful. Even today, a handful of states have very little in the way of restrictions.
Where I live, we went from Monday 1st week: teachers directed to submit plans for remote teaching by Monday 2nd week, to schools being closed on Thursday 1st week (amid much debate) for a planned two weeks, then a month, then the rest of the year. Courts went from being closed for three days to two weeks to a month in a couple of days. We went from people considering less time with groups through various stages to almost total lockdown in a matter of days. Had you put forth those ideas just a week earlier, people would have thought you were nuts.
What we think we need to do is distinct to each town or state and evolved quickly as the virus spread. And if we're talking about national restrictions, there is honestly a limit to what the national government can say about it. It really hasn't been the feds that shut everybody down. Our system of governance doesn't work that way. It has really been more on mayors, county supervisors, and governors than the president or Congress.
As it should be, but when there is a lock down just across the river, and not on this side of that river, both sides of that river are going to be spreading virus. This has to be taken into account.
The way this spreads via asymptomatic people, and given its presence everywhere in the world, it looks like all the lock downs were later than we probably would have preferred.
I just watched the news here and it was announced that the New York Times is doing a series about the ignoring of the earlier times that knowledge of the spread of the virus became known, the delay of acknowledging its seriousness, and doing what was necessary to manage it. Is there any comment about that? (I do not have access to the New York Times). Although China's methods to control the spread of the virus may appear to many draconian, I can say from experience that they were effective and I believe necessary.
"...may appear to many draconian..."
Americans aren't going to give up freedoms without a stack of bodies as a consequence. The current disparities of restrictions in different states might reflect flawed perceptions but have some legitimate grounding with respect to population density - NYC's problem.
"'NYC's problem"
That's real nice. They ARE American Citizens you know, But
i'll agree, draconian measures wouldn't fly here, yet all we needed was the damn truth, instead of Trump's sugarcoating, also known as more LIES! To turn down the WHO OFFERED TESTS???? To wait so long to order masks and ventilators ? To not even acknowledge it was out of control till two months in ?
We had plenty of time as we were 1 to 2 months behind Europe and China, and WE DIDN'T take it serious enough, and i think so many didn't due to Trumps words. As he downplayed and flat out contradicted what our EXPERTS knew was coming.
He was, and still IS, too worried about the economy and his damn election.
if we attempt to go back too soon, we will be double fckd, as we'll have to start all over from scratch.
He should of taken it serious in January, shut everything down uniformly for 3 weeks, and we'd be back to having to be cautious, but working.
WHERE are the damn tests ??
Trump said anybody that needs a test can get one a month ago.
Total Bullshit !
Tell US the Truth, and don't rush US back,
it will blow up in his, and all of our faces.
Be a leader for ONCE Trump.
American lives and our economic standing and status totally Depend upon it.
LIVES FIRST, as that is the ONLY Way, the economy comes back.
NYC’ s problem is population density - not orangeman or any other bullshit imaginary excuse.
Yep, and there are people in some parts of the country that will say that NYC is 1000 miles away and not their concern. Just as some people will look at LA and say that's not my concern as I'm in Mississippi. Or some people in NYC who will say that problems in Kansas City are not their problems. That is both human nature and the ideal behind this country where individuals should be responsible for themselves. Kansas City doesn't like it when NYC tries to tell them how to live either.
do you realize this pandemic started THOUSANDS OF MILES FROM NEW YORK ?
it spreads rapidly and without regard to what state you are in.
If it is anywhere in the US, it could be anywhere ELSE in the US, with one quick flight if Trump gets his way, so keep on keeping on with that moronic outlook, we'll all get far !
Of course I do. What does any of that have to do with what I posted? People are people and won't change their world view that quickly.
I apologize if i misinterpreted your post, as i realize how density effects the spread, but it can spread ANYWHERE and fast, and without regard to some liberal or conservative leaning majorities in these various states. We are ALL AMERICANS round here, except for Buzz that i know of, but he's rooting for US All, and we all need to be AMERICANS FIRST, as we take on something that could potentially kill more of US than any of our World Wars.
We need to realize we all have a responsible part to play in halting this spread and minimizing risk to our first responders, medical community, elderly, and pre- disposed.
We can't rush back to our old way of life, if that hasn't already changed for good.
Trump SHOULD NOT FIRE Fauci,
there is enough mistrust with him and his confusing blabber.
WE NEED THE EXPERT SCIENTIST, that almost all seem to trust.
Squiggy,
The first hot spot in NY wasn't in the city. It was New Rochelle. It is anywhere where one or two people with the virus gather with a lot of other people and this virus goes to work.
What the New York Times did was to lie about the coverage provided by Fox News,
Example:
(I do not have access to the New York Times)
Your'e not missing anything.
Although China's methods to control the spread of the virus may appear to many draconian
I suppose some would be repulsed at the idea of nailing people into their own homes for a few months.
The surprise is, Vic, that although many democrasies are fining and/or arresting those who breach the quarantine, such as the UK, France, Israel, etc. China did not do so, but what they did was lockdown Hubei Province and its Capital Wuhan, with travel restrictions. China didn't HAVE to arrest or fine people, because the people were smart enough to do what was required voluntarily, and by doing so, things are now almost back to normal.
Buzz, I don't blame you for standing up for China the country. All I can tell you is that isn't what happened.
Really? Then tell me what you think did happen?
Of course some people are ALWAYS repulsed no matter WHAT happens, but people were not NAILED into their homes - I do know that there were police on the streets that suggested to those who were not out to buy necessities that they should go home, and IMO that was the right thing to do.
He is come?
cum now, they must have spelled it wrong.
.
Believe if Trump fires "cum"(besides it being a miracle, no pornstars are gonna be impregnated)/ Fuicci , Trumps' feeble credibility amongst only his base already, will be significantly Further diminished.
Everyone seems to know and trust him, as his calm steady demeanor and obvious scientific expertise, has a calming effect.
People, as do i, just feel they can trust him.
People, even his base, are learning, especially during pandemic, how Trumps LIES that they could overlook, are far more dangerous and serious now.
American lives have been lost due to Trumps decisions/indecisions/LIES.
The entire GOP, that allowed this frickn liar in chief, to first be elected, then to remain in office after it was so obvious he was helped and accepted help from Putin, and then attempted to get the Ukraine pres to throw his rival Biden under the bus or not receive his desperately needed military aid.
They ALL have blood on their hands as far as i'm concerned, as they ALL knew Trump was not up to task.
I heard there is a new news story which claims that Mitch McConnell has told people he thinks Trump is an idiot.
Having seen the story yet but I will be looking for it this morning.
if he doesn't
HE'S AN IDIOT!
All the more reason to spread it around!
Adam Schiff would be so proud!
A leader of the resistance!
Mitch McConnell would be an idiot for not thinking Trump is an idiot.
yea, what she said
McConnell calling Trump an idiot is an example of pot/kettle.
The title was taken from Shakespeare's "Richard II"
I think it is - He is to come.
I gave the Quote as written.
The cartoon in the OP article, presumably written by Vic since there is no source link, is dripping with far right anti-government hysteria, including the finale of "666" which adds the evangelistic religious paranoia touch. I'm kind of shocked that Vic thinks Newstalkers is the kind of community that accepts this kind of conspiracy booshwa.
As Buzz noted, the New York Times came out over the weekend with massive reporting that the Trump administration ignored warning after warning since the beginning of January . There will be no way to get around this reckoning.
The writer of the article wants to impose some sort of "deep state" conclusion onto this, as if Trump is being persecuted by his enemies with a coronavirus crisis.
When will this insanity end?
NT accepted 3 years of lies about "Russian Collusion" and the daily disgusting trashing of an American President. I think NT can tolerate a bit of my opinion.
As Buzz noted, the New York Times came out over the weekend with massive reporting that the Trump administration ignored warning after warning since the beginning of January . There will be no way to get around this reckoning.
The same paper that told us he was a Russian agent?
The writer of the article wants to impose some sort of "deep state" conclusion onto this, as if Trump is being persecuted by his enemies with a coronavirus crisis.
I used 3 facts that nobody here has been able to lay a glove on.
When will this insanity end?
I'm afraid that for some it may continue for a lifetime.
Everyone knows what happened. For political reasons, Trump ignored the warnings because he was afraid attention to the virus would hurt the stock market, and thus maybe damage his chance of re-election. Trump is a lifelong conman and pathological liar and malignant narcissist. He's not someone you want around in a crisis.
Gee, I thought he stopped all flights into the country from China by the end of January? Wasn't he called a "racist" by all the haters for it?
Then again, this article was about Dr Fauci.....
Fauci is not a Trumpster, and has zero requirement or inclination to be personally subservient to Trump. Fauci's sole role in this is to inform the American people about the medical implications of the coronavirus pandemic.
Thus far he hasn't done an amazing job. As far as it being his "role" - The President was the one who chose him for that role. Dr Fauci needs to be a little more cognizant of the politics of the left wing press. Thus far he's been like cake in that regard.
"he's been like cake..."
cause unlike Trump,
he ANSWERS the damn QUESTIONS ! ??????????????
WTF Vic !
And 199 were indicted with many part of Trumps inner circle in something that was
ABSOLUTELY NO FCKN HOAX
.
Because many LIED like Trump or HID from testifying like Trump,
there was not the overwhelming amount of evidence, (In the scumbag GOP Senate and Congress) to impeach Trump, certainly doesn't suddenly make an investigation that found so many GUILTY, a frckn hoax.
Then the day after Muellers reluctant testimony, he's on the phone with a quid pro quo with the Ukraine President ???
then he FIRES everybody who obeyed the LAW and brought it forward!
WTF people ?????
I wish he would SHOOT somebody on Fifth Avenue,
but i don't condone suicide, even for Trump who i do truly detest, but i also feel sorry for him, as there is NO DOUBT in my mind, he is mentally challenged and is so insecure he feels he MUST act certain ways, as in always, in HIS and NO OTHER INTEREST.
.
How you and your crew can't see this is mind boggling, but i see it in most of my crowd, but even they, are coming around and admitting he's a LYING Clown.
.
The sooner your gang realize this, the better for EVERYONE!
Damn people, accept your mistake and lets move on and save this damn country, cause with Trump at the Helm, we're like the Titanic in Antartica with a wasted Captain Morgan with MORE than a little Captain in him, as he's more like Giligan on a three hour whore tour hitting the professor(Fucai) with Skippers hat cause he dares speak the truth and answers questions.
If he fires the Scientist who IS an EXPERT on this pandemic, and trusted by about EVERYONE (except the conspiracy minded that have had another deep state LIE shoved into their shallow depths) who is able to process a critical thinking process, he will even alienate some of his die hard base.
His WORDS are out there for ALL to see.
HE downplayed and LIED about this pandemic, and there IS NO DENYING THAT.
It turned out to be a hoax and an attempted coup by members of the intelligence community and they got caught!
Damn people
No, don't damn the American people, Damn the left!
no, i won't damn the people cause i'd be
"Damn the left" behind.
I'd like US ALL to get through this, and you don't FIRE THE TOP EXPERT because he stated an OBVIOUS TRUTH.
How many were indicted for collusion with Russia? Answer zip, zero, none, nada. They entrapped Flynn; the FBI investigators falsified documents against Flynn and others; they nailed them for anything but the very damn thing they were investigating! So yes it is a fucking hoax! Based on a political hit job dossier paid for by none other than the Hillary Clinton campaign, and sent to all levels of the government by Obama administration lackeys.
Many lied like the FBI on their FISA requests, Comey, Tapper, etc. Where is your damn fucking outrage over that? But, Trruuummmppppp! Fuck Trump. Trump doesn't excuse the Democrats, Obama Administration, Clinton Campaign, or the federal government from their blatant disregard for rule of law.
Here is what the fuck! No evidence outside of TDS addle minded nonsense. The Democrats were so desperate to impeach that they didn't even bother to follow basic rules in the House; and couldn't be bothered to take administration officials to court to compel testimony! Then Pelosi made a grand show of signing the impeachment papers- all the while crying crocodile tears of regret to the media. Of course she then sat on those papers instead of forwarding them to the Senate- trying desperately to negotiate an automatic impeachment. So tell us were you outraged when the Democrats admitted Clinton was guilty as sin; but still voted to acquit him in the Senate? The Democrats are full of hypocrisy.
More crocodile tears. Must be difficult to feign that much concern.
In other words a typical politician; who just made the mistake of having an R behind his name.
Biden or bust. He is as pure as the yellow snow. Just look at everything he did for his son Hunter, no wait don't. Just look at the allegations from the Democratic women he has sexually harassed, no wait don't. Look at him not being able to remember simple facts about anything, no wait don't. Look at his moronic choices for VP, no wait- really, really, really, don't look at that. Most of all you in Michigan that have had to put up with Whitless' bullshit.
Trump or Biden, once again the two Establishment parties have given us a shit choice. Sorry, some of us will not be rewarding the Dems for the 3 plus years of utter bullshit and abuse of law they have put us through.
Those so called experts chose to believe China's fucking lies. WHO and the CDC were late on the draw calling this a Pandemic. No excusing China or the experts dumbfuckery. Bashing Trump does not remove their fucking failure to do their damn jobs; nor China from covering it up. There is no denying that.
But Trruuummmppppp!!!!!
That is all the left has. Not one damn workable idea, or how they will improve one damn thing. They are not Trump. That is more than enough in their books.
Sorry, we've covered all of that, so you have my condolences,
stay safe.
It was not a total travel ban. Over 40,000 people from China still came here.
Where/what are they ? I looked but clearly missed them. Are gloves needed ?
After the ban? From China? Please show us...
I'm sorry to hear it.
I knew it, Fasci is a member in good standing of the ''deep state''....
He just wants all of us to like him.
How long will he stay if certain parts of the country are reopened on May 1?
You may get your wish Vic, although it will be to the detriment of the nation
Trump Retweets Fire Anthony Fauci
Dr Fauci serves at the pleasure of the President, not the other way around. In the end all the decisions have to be made by only one man - the one we elected.
I wouldnt trust Trump to walk my dog.
So you keep telling us. If you don't mind, I'd like to return to the article. Dr Fauci & co have chosen a very costly road to defeat the pandemic in America. I do think it may be time to focus on parts of the country which can be opened up. I have a few other thoughts on how that should happen. I doubt many in New York or Illinois would like them very much.
Fauci provides Trump with a reality check so his head must be lopped off lest too many people believe him.
Fauci allows himself to be manipulated by the haters. Every recommendation Fauci has made to the President, has been acted upon. So does Fauci get the blame if things go wrong?
So no responsibility to the fucking governors, CDC, WHO, or Chinese government.
TDS at it's best.
Yeah because Morons like Pelosi and AOC said forget the virus go out have a good time, hug a chinaman. And another dipshit Democrat De Blasio called it a cold and to go out and ride the subway, hit the bars then go to the gym the next day. But unfortunately the TDS sufferers want to blame President Trump for their bad choices, typical democrats.
Small chloroquine study stopped after irregular heart beats detected in subjects
A small Brazilian study on the effects of the anti-malaria drug chloroquine, which is similar to the drug that President Trump has touted as a possible "game changer" in treating the coronavirus, was abruptly halted because some patients taking high doses have developed irregular heart rates generating "safety hazards."
The findings were revealed in a study funded by the Brazilian state of Amazonas and published on Saturday in medRxiv, an online server for medical articles, The New York Times first reported .
Chloroquine is similar to hydroxychloroquine, the drug Trump has repeatedly touted. Health experts have insisted that not enough is known about either drug to determine its efficacy in combatting COVID-19.
The Brazilian study included 81 hospitalized patients, with about half being given a dose of 50 milligrams of chloroquine twice daily for five days. The other participants were prescribed a dose of 600 milligrams for 10 days.
Patients taking higher doses experienced heart arrhythmias, or improper beating of the heart, within three days, according to the study. Eleven patients died by the sixth day of treatment and caused the research on high-dosages to end.
"Preliminary findings suggest that the higher CQ dosage (10-day regimen) should not be recommended for COVID-19 treatment because of its potential safety hazards," the study's abstract said . "Such results forced us to prematurely halt patient recruitment to this arm.
Oh, that's the drug the left hates! And the story you posted was generated by the New York Times. I don't know how the drug is administered in Brazil, but it has had stellar results in treating the Coronavirus elsewhere:
In the US, several state pharmacy boards reported that some doctors and dentists were writing prescriptions for hydroxychloroquine and a related drug, chloroquine , to themselves, family members, and staff.
On 28 March 2020, the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) issued an emergency use authorization (EUA) to allow hydroxychloroquine sulfate and chloroquine phosphate products donated to the Strategic National Stockpile (SNS) to be distributed and used for certain people who are hospitalized with COVID-19. [43] [44]
From what I have read, even if the drug is declared safe, its impact on the course of the disease is minimal.
You are hyping a miracle cure that will most likely bring no miracles. It is highly irresponsible.
We really don't know what the impact will be, except that it has shown great promise in treating the virus. A vaccine is a long way off. Why would you have people dying of the virus have no options?
You are hyping a miracle cure that will most likely bring no miracles.
The drug is bad because Trump endorsed it. Everybody gets it, John.
I have said all along that people who have their doctor prescribe it should take the drug if they want to. I hope it helps a lot of people.
That is different from your view, which is that hyrdroxycholroquine is a miracle drug which is in itself all the reassurance we need to reopen the economy.
but Trump recommended it and said it's safe ?
That’s what makes him an innocent, of sorts. I have a soft spot for the kid who got his books dumped at the bus stop every day.
Fauci 's not telling the whole story here. He was telling the American people it was okay for healthy people to go on cruise ships in March. This is just the typical "CYA" for history that everyone engages in. Fauci owes it to the country to be honest about what he was saying in February in March, it's all out there for anyone who cares to see.
Sure, in a perfect world, Trump could have cut of all travel from China and Europe at the first sign of the outbreak. He could have quarentined NY and stopped all domestic travel to and from the city in early March, when De Blasio and his experts were telling people the virus couldn't be transmitted easily between humans. Hindsight's always 20/20. Moreover, while while those actions might have slowed the spread, at what cost and were they even poltically possible? I think reading War and Peace and his ruminations on "the great man" fallacy of history would probbaly benefit many who think the orange man has the power to control how a country of 335 million respond to an unknown virus.
The dirty little secret the NYT and other liberal organizations don't want to talk about is they were publishing articles downplaying the threat of the virus at the time when massive intervnetion might have done the most to stop the spread of the virus. So the Times forgets what it published and forgets wat De Blasio and his experts were telling New Yorkers in March and like good little Stalinists, have gone back and pieced together a new narrative, where everyone but Trump knew to take drastic measures in February, and if only bad man had done what they didn't want hime to do at the time, the virus would never have existed.
The truth is that even with New York, it looks like we are going to keep the pandemic death toll to the equivalent of a bad seasonal flue (80,000 died in 2018), That's an incredible accomplishment given the numbers the experts were throwing around just a month ago. But context isn't what readers of the Times want. They need the simple narrative of "orange man bad." Of course our response wasn't perfect. But it's been much better than the experts thought was possible.
Please show us. And while you find that information, remember that he was depending on the WHO, who I never trusted. They were more interested in stopping panic, than studying the pathogen.
Both Trump and De Blasio were too cavalier about the situation. At some point, Sean, "The buck stops here", and these two have to own that.
Oh, come on Sean. A quick check disproves that:
There is enough blame to go around.
First of all, our mortality rate, if held to current standards will be more like 120,000, since really this only hit epidemic level 1.5 months ago. Second, no one knows what this virus can or will do. We are all just guessing.
I agree, but that is because of social distancing. Human nature is such that even loosen up a bit and we could be right back to where we were. We have to come online very carefully.
Again, I hate to ruin your narrative of NYT leftie bad, but I think the above article kind of does that.
And while I agree that our response wasn't perfect, and it is better than we thought, the fact that the President wants to bring back the economy without those vital exposure tests, which he claimed he claims we don't need on a widespread basis, while less than 1% of the US population has been tested is just nuts. We have hot spots all over the country and at least the first 10 states with hotspots should be tested.
Now no one is saying that 325 million people need to be tested, but come on.. how about how many does he think he needs to be tested, and who should he defer to in making this decision?
While you and Sean debate what Dr Fauci should take responsibility for, I'd like you to take a look back at the first two comments here. Your thoughts would be much appreciated.
Can you please give me the comment numbers you would like me to look at. Thank you.
Can you please be more specific about the "blame game" you are talking about, because from what I have heard from both Gov. Cuomo and President Trump is mostly good relations.
#1 and #1.1 (as in the first two)
The mortality rate for confirmed cases is about 3% in the US.
There are roughly 200 million adults in America. Without any mitigation or containment the virus would spread until appx. 2 of 3 people had it, which becomes the onset point for "herd immunity" (more or less) . 2/3 of 200 million is 132 million. Thats is roughly how many would contract the virus. We multiply that by .8 which removes from the equation the 20% who are asymptomatic (not confirmed) and thus not used for the death rate, and we end up with 105.6 million confirmed cases in the US without mitigation or containment. 3% of that is 3,170,000 dead people from the virus in the US if nothing had been done.
I don't know where you get your stats, but obviously not from your beloved "expert", Dr Fauci:
"On Thursday Dr. Fauci co-authored a report on the coronavirus in the New England Journal of Medicine .
The report, entitled “Covid-19 — Navigating the Uncharted”, was co-authored by Anthony S. Fauci, M.D., H. Clifford Lane, M.D., and Robert R. Redfield, M.D.
Here’s a direct quote from that report:
The last time I looked the death rate in the US was very close give or take to 3%. That is of confirmed cases meaning people who were sick enough to get tested. I had read that 20% of all victims are asymptomatic.
The herd immunity level is said to be 66% or so. Which means that without mitigation the infection rate would sooner or later rise to that level. That is roughly 130-140 million Americans.
You agree so far?
The missing link is how many of those 130 million would not report the illness because they didnt know they had it.
We also have to consider the number of people who would die unreported, and that would not be an insignificant number.
The death count would have been devastating.
Which is what? There were models , not by me, which predicted 2 million dead if mitigation was not done.
Vic wants to drown these predictions in the bathtub, in order to claim that no mitigation or containment was needed. Obviously Fauci does not agree.
You people are as bad as Trump.
Why is everyone dumping on Dr. Anthony Fauci? Dr. Fauci is not an intelligence expert, is not a economic expert, and is not a political expert. Dr. Fauci's expertise is limited to managing bureaucratic response to health issues. Dr. Fauci seems very competent within the narrow confines of his expertise.
Dr. Fauci is only pointing out that hindsight is always better at understanding a crisis than foresight. Is Jake Tapper seeking God rather than answers? Is Jake Tapper is asking why God wasn't in charge?
Yes, the media is engaged in a cover up. Rep. Adam Schiff is chairman of the House intelligence committee. Adam Schiff would have been apprised of the early warnings, too. Congress receives intelligence briefings and intelligence assessments. Warnings from the intelligence agencies aren't only for the President; Congress receives those warnings, too. Rep. Adam Schiff was too involved in managing the public spectacle of impeachment to be bothered with warnings from intelligence agencies. What did Adam Schiff know and when did he know it?
Are we to believe that Speaker Nancy Pelosi was clueless about the warnings from China? Are we to believe that Mitch McConnell, Chuck Schumer, and Kevin McCarthy had no idea that the intelligence agencies had prepared an assessment concerning a SARS outbreak in Hubei Province, China?
If thine eye offends thee, pluck it out. The news media are turning a blind eye to what transpired; they have plucked out their eyes. And that isn't hindsight. Jake Tapper doesn't want answers to serious questions. And Jake Tapper doesn't really want God put in charge. Tapper is trying to pluck out his own eyes.
I suppose it depends on if you are interpreting his remarks to read that his recommendations weren't followed or a general statement about hindsight. He's not very clear.
What is unclear? Dr. Fauci stated "I mean, obviously, you could logically say, that if you had a process that was ongoing, and you started mitigation earlier, you could have saved lives."
Dr. Fauci is simply saying that if we had an organized process for dealing with pandemics then we could save lives. An example of such an organized process would be fire management in the United States. The United States invests a lot of resources into maintaining an organized response to wildfires, commercial fires, and residential fires. There are Federal, state, and local fire authorities whose responsibility is to respond to fires and control spread and damage caused by fires. But that organized process to respond to fires does not prevent fires; fires still occur.
The organized process of fire management really does reduce the overall number and severity of fires. But as we have seen, that organized process doesn't prevent severe fires; the organized process has limitations. An arsonist can overwhelm the organized process of fire management.
President Joe would have done it right by letting everyone else run the show. Isn't that what President Joe is doing now?
Would President Joe have trusted China or not? Would President Joe have closed the borders sooner? Would President Joe have called out the military to enforce quarantine? Would President Joe have required everyone in the country be tested? Would President Joe have sacrificed the country to save New York? What would President Joe have done differently?
Naturally President Joe would have done it right because President Joe can do no wrong. That's the advantage of doing nothing.
Rather than Keep Dr Quick in place in Beijing, the CDC trusted two Chinese nationals that she trained.
Dr. Quick is still employed by the CDC in Washington DC but the CDC refuses to say where or grant access to her by journalists.
Yes an organized process has limitations. Merging three NSC 'agencies' to streamline them, obviously did not work or backfired spectacularly.
Wasn't that why Dr. Quick was posted to Beijing? And how would Dr. Quick, posted in Beijing, have obtained first hand knowledge of what was happening in Wuhan? Are we to believe the Chinese government would have informed Dr. Quick while suppressing information for everyone else?
National Security Council - the White House
"the Council's function has been to advise and assist the President on national security and foreign policies. The Council also serves as the President's principal arm for coordinating these policies among various government agencies.
The NSC is chaired by the President. Its regular attendees (both statutory and non-statutory) are the Vice President, the Secretary of State, the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Defense, and the Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs. The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff is the statutory military advisor to the Council, and the Director of National Intelligence is the intelligence advisor. The Chief of Staff to the President, Counsel to the President, and the Assistant to the President for Economic Policy are invited to attend any NSC meeting. The Attorney General and the Director of the Office of Management and Budget are invited to attend meetings pertaining to their responsibilities. The heads of other executive departments and agencies, as well as other senior officials, are invited to attend meetings of the NSC when appropriate.
The National Security Council was established by the National Security Act of 1947 (PL 235 - 61 Stat. 496; U.S.C. 402), amended by the National Security Act Amendments of 1949 (63 Stat. 579; 50 U.S.C. 401 et seq.). Later in 1949, as part of the Reorganization Plan, the Council was placed in the Executive Office of the President."
Where in the mandate for the National Security Council are the responsibilities and requirements to advise the President on domestic policy and internal affairs of the United States? What is the National Security Council's authority to recommend actions by Federal government toward state governments or citizens of the United States?
What, exactly, is the role of the National Security Council in the Federal government's response to a pandemic?
Perhaps the name of the Directorate for Global health Security and Biodefense (2014-2018) gave the current POTUS and recent NSC Director Bolton a false sense of security?
In the Navy, it's referred to as the tip of the spear.
But that spear is pointed outward. The Navy doesn't involved itself in the internal affairs of the United States. That's the Coast Guard's authority and responsibility.
The NSC does not have the authority or responsibility to advise the President on domestic policy or internal affairs of the United States. How would maintaining a pandemic panel under the umbrella of the NSC have improved the Federal government's response to the pandemic?
In this situation, that NSC spear would have been pointless. Whether or not a pandemic panel was in place within the NSC would have changed nothing because the Federal response to the pandemic required exerting authority over state governments and citizens of the United States which is outside the NSC mandate.
It was an analogy, now your deflecting?
Now your just being obtuse or argumentative for arguments sake China, Coronovirus, Liberia, Ebola, MERS are all external issues that could become domestic or internal issues in a matter of hours or a declaration by the POTUS.
Seriously. Do you think the NSC doesn't consider the Russian, the Iranian nuclear issues the same way. Are the nuclear issues outside of the "mandate" until the radioactive snow starts falling?
So, addressing a flaw in the analogy is now a deflection? If thine eye offends thee, pluck it out.
I asked what role the NSC plays in the Federal government's response to a pandemic. A flawed analogy isn't an answer to that direct (and not hypothetical) question.
You started off, way back when with this.
I agreed, but pointed out the that NSC streamlined itself, with Trump describing it as cost cutting of people just sitting around, and Bolton said it was a typically "bloated" agency.
The NSC gathers information on all threats internal and external to the country and the POTUS is the chairman. The NSC is the tip of the spear in gathering information and reporting it to the President.
The NSC role is to inform the POTUS of all threats to the country.
Now there are several possibilities at large.
The NSC failed that resposibility and did not report to the President.
The President dropped the ball and ignored them or decided he knew better.
Or some twisted blend of the two which includes the President not seeing Navarro's memos from November & December.
.
Asking what role the NSC plays "in response" to the pandemic
is as obvious as the old overly complicated grade school jokes
asking where did they bury the survivors of an airplane disaster.
.
The response to the pandemic belongs to the Chairman alone.
There were some who called this out after being briefed
like Cotton and Alexander
Senator Tom Cotton sent a letter to HHS Secretary Azar on January 22 to consider banning travel between China and the United States and spoke to President Trump on January 23. The Trump administration restricted travel between China and the United States on January 31, eight days after Cotton spoke with Trump. That doesn't seem to be a particularly slow response.
Senators Lamar Alexander and Richard Burr authored the Pandemic and All-Hazards Preparedness Act (PAHPA), passed in 2006 while George W. Bush was in office. I have found no information indicating that either Senators Alexander or Burr were attempting to advise President Trump before the administration began responding to the spreading outbreak in China.
And those Senators don't indicate that the House of Representatives was paying attention. The question remains, what did Adam Schiff know and when did he know it?
Keep in mind that the World Health Organization arranged to send an investigative team (including CDC experts) on January 28. The WHO did not declare a public health emergency of international concern until January 30. And the Trump administration restricted travel between China and the United States on January 31. That doesn't indicate a slow response by the Trump administration, either.
The WHO did not declare a pandemic until March 11. The Trump administration restricted travel between Europe and the United States on the same day. That doesn't indicate a slow response by the Trump administration.
The Trump administration hasn't responded slower than the World Health Organization. And if the WHO, whose expertise includes monitoring worldwide pandemics, was slow to react then why should we expect the Trump administration to react faster?
Scapegoating Trump doesn't answer the question: what did Congressional leadership know and when did they know it? Why was the public spectacle of impeachment so very much more important than preparing for the pandemic?
President Trump could have been removed from office on February 6. And we are to believe that would have improved the government's response to the pandemic?
Plucking out our eyes to avoid the scrutiny of hindsight would be unwise. What did Adam Schiff know and when did he know it?
KA-BOOM!
As CHAIR of the House Intelligence Committee, Schiff should have informed President Trump in JANUARY 2020 of any and all dangerous foreign intelligence.
Schiff knew, but his hatred for Trump completely consumed him. Thousands of Americans have suffered and died due to Schiff while he was jerking off trying to impeach Trump.
Impeachment was over in the house last year, Senate got it this year, but didn't do shit to take their attention off anything. If they can't multi task they don't deserve the jobs. Of course it doesn't help Trump or gop that even after impeachment they didn't do jack. And didn't stop Trump from lying about it (because half of them were lying or too stupid). Are conservatives that challenged they can't deal with more than one thing at a time? Except that doesn't explain the golfing and rallies.
i'll be back with you, as we see eye to eye while on different levels of the plane
and fancy everything bagel i'll smear with cream cheese to compliment my future wine,
oh how different can ones understanding of events be interpreted when there is actually only one true reality, that so many on the right can't quite admit.
I've got more chores at the moment but i will be back to chat as the twisting and convaluting of actuality, is quite interesting.
golfing and rallies"
that were frequent and numerous directly after the impeachment vote.
Trump himself stated impeachment DID NOT Affect his extremely obvious delayed , denied, disastrous, determinedly derelicted detrimental dealings with the dilema Trump dodged and deliberately down played for the first TWO DAMN MONTHS of the KNOWN PANDEMIC that WE ALL SAW coming, but none with ALL of the DETAILS as Did Trump.
I didn't need a perfect handling, just possibly an honest one were American lives were put ahead of this 'mans' never ending childish hurt feelings and inadequate dealings with
ANYTHING PRESIDENTIAL!
He is the WORSE LEADER the USA has ever elected,
by far.
false,
asz eye lashes
flickering you the finger
licking the bowling ball of icing
eye C U frosting on every cake U
bake in your E z passed out wake and bake oven with the 100 watt the hell r u talking b out Mr. Smith, cause if you're Jonesing for my perceptional take on things, there's know
Pateling wear this could go...
How do you expect anyone to take you seriously after making such a stupid comment? Donald Trump himself wouldn't take you seriously.
This is the most embarrassing period in American political history. What are the moderates and independents waiting for to denounce this man?